Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

stickguy · May 2015

Could have hit it accidentally. Or sometimes the software grabs a post.

dino001 · May 2015

Yeah, I remember, I hit a flag once by accident. When pages load, they have an annoying habit of shifting around until final content is loaded. I constantly hit something I don't intend to, because I want to start something, but the page did not yet fully loaded.

carnaught · May 2015

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!

Probably a mistake. Don't go anywhere. We enjoy your posts!

driver100 · May 2015

suydam said:
Wasn't there just news about GM investing over $5 billion in US plants?

General Motors plans to spend $5.4 billion to improve its U.S. factories during the next three years, creating about 650 new jobs.

$5.4 billion to create 650 jobs!

At the same time, in December, the company announced plans to invest $5 billion to modernize and expand its four factories in Mexico. In March, the company said it would spend $350 million on its Ramos Arzipe assembly plant so it can build the compact Chevrolet Cruze, which also is made at GM’s factory in Lordstown, Ohio, east of Cleveland.

As Mike said, companies will do what they have to, in order to please the stock holders and to make a profit. It would have been nice if the U.S. and Canadian governments had put some rules in place on the money loaned. The government saved these companies.....only to see them move production to other countries, not a great way to get repaid for our investment.

driver100 · May 2015

carnaught said:

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!
Probably a mistake. Don't go anywhere. We enjoy your posts!

I do too, and I wouldn't leave because of one person - especially one who won't identify themself.

It could be a mistake, as Dino said, the page sometimes bounces around until loaded. Maybe they meant to do an lol or a "quote".

roadburner · May 2015

Heck, a flagged post is a badge of honor in my book...

robr2 · May 2015

driver100 said:

suydam said:
Wasn't there just news about GM investing over $5 billion in US plants?
General Motors plans to spend $5.4 billion to improve its U.S. factories during the next three years, creating about 650 new jobs.

$5.4 billion to create 650 jobs!

At the same time, in December, the company announced plans to invest $5 billion to modernize and expand its four factories in Mexico. In March, the company said it would spend $350 million on its Ramos Arzipe assembly plant so it can build the compact Chevrolet Cruze, which also is made at GM’s factory in Lordstown, Ohio, east of Cleveland.

As Mike said, companies will do what they have to, in order to please the stock holders and to make a profit. It would have been nice if the U.S. and Canadian governments had put some rules in place on the money loaned. The government saved these companies.....only to see them move production to other countries, not a great way to get repaid for our investment.

Keep in mind the $5.4 billion isn't being used to create 650 jobs. Most of it is being used to upgrade plants in order to manufacture new product and install new technology. It's part of the normal business plant upgrades that is required in the manufacturing business.

$1 billion of that is to upgrade the large SUV plant in Texas that would add 589 of the 650 jobs.

ray80 · May 2015

roadburner said:
Heck, a flagged post is a badge of honor in my book...

Yes indeed, everyone needs at least one or your not posting enough

( I have mine)

isellhondas · May 2015

Mike, don't leave because of someone flagging you!

I have one too given by a "cranky old man" who disappeared right after he threw a few flags
on the field.

thebean · May 2015

The $5.4B spend by GM should have a lot of equipment in it, but sadly I bet more than half of that will be spent overseas for machines. :@

I have several friends (and I'm this way also) that refuse to purchase a car built in Mexico. Don't think the quality is there. JMHO

roadburner · May 2015

isellhondas said:
Mike, don't leave because of someone flagging you!

I have one too given by a "cranky old man" who disappeared right after he threw a few flags
on the field.

I remember that guy- a real jackass.

driver100 · May 2015

roadburner said:
Heck, a flagged post is a badge of honor in my book...

I like that comment. When we had our book business a major publisher tried to sue us out of existance. I went to a supplier for some advice, since he had been through a similar experience.

He said the bad news is the publisher in question (Penguin) is so big even if you win you will probably lose a lot of money defending yourself, the good news is you are important enough that you are a thorn in their side.

That made me feel better!

driver100 · May 2015

robr2 said:

driver100 said:

suydam said:
Wasn't there just news about GM investing over $5 billion in US plants?
General Motors plans to spend $5.4 billion to improve its U.S. factories during the next three years, creating about 650 new jobs.

$5.4 billion to create 650 jobs!

At the same time, in December, the company announced plans to invest $5 billion to modernize and expand its four factories in Mexico. In March, the company said it would spend $350 million on its Ramos Arzipe assembly plant so it can build the compact Chevrolet Cruze, which also is made at GM’s factory in Lordstown, Ohio, east of Cleveland.

As Mike said, companies will do what they have to, in order to please the stock holders and to make a profit. It would have been nice if the U.S. and Canadian governments had put some rules in place on the money loaned. The government saved these companies.....only to see them move production to other countries, not a great way to get repaid for our investment.

Keep in mind the $5.4 billion isn't being used to create 650 jobs. Most of it is being used to upgrade plants in order to manufacture new product and install new technology. It's part of the normal business plant upgrades that is required in the manufacturing business.

$1 billion of that is to upgrade the large SUV plant in Texas that would add 589 of the 650 jobs.

That's fair enough and I am not saying that GM sending more jobs to Mexico is necessarily wrong. I am just questioning why governments gave them money to bail them out with no guaranties. I also wonder what kind of jobs young people will have in the near future. Those good paying mid level jobs are disappearing....either your in top management, or your in a low level job. Our society can only absorb so many lawyers and chiropractors (seems to be one on every block, 2 on every block in Florida).

Occassionally I still see those bumper stickers that said Buy American or None of Us Will Have Jobs....it's getting harder and harder to do that.

About buying a car made in Mexico. I would do it if I really wanted that particular car, but, I would prefer to buy a car made somewhere else. Sometimes getting the cheapest made isn't always the best value.

houdini1 · May 2015

roadburner said:

isellhondas said:
Mike, don't leave because of someone flagging you!

I have one too given by a "cranky old man" who disappeared right after he threw a few flags
on the field.
I remember that guy- a real jackass.

Yeah, I think I got a flag that time also. Same guy. If you are brave enough to flag someone and accuse them of abuse, you should be brave enough to explain why.

fezo · May 2015

roadburner said:
Heck, a flagged post is a badge of honor in my book...

Must. Not. Speak.

explorerx4 · May 2015

Hey fezo, I just noticed your avatar. You like quite a bit different from the cover picture on your CD that I have.
You do look good!

houdini1 · May 2015

explorerx4 said:
Hey fezo, I just noticed your avatar. You like quite a bit different from the cover picture on your CD that I have.
You do look good!

Is fezo on the right or left ?

Sandman6472 · May 2015

Maybe it's me, but how does one flag someone...and what does that mean anyways??? Just don't get it???

The Sandman

driver100 · May 2015

sandman_6472 said:
Maybe it's me, but how does one flag someone...and what does that mean anyways??? Just don't get it???

The Sandman

Sandman....you left a lot of blank space after your post........someone might complain that you are wasting cyberspace. If they thought that was bad they will flag you....right at the bottom of your post on the left side is the word "flag", and they press that for some reason.

I hope I don't get flagged for this. I think there should be a way to appeal or at least be able to find out who and why you were flagged......there is just too much that can go wrong.

Someone would have to post a very offensive post for me to flag it (has never happened), but, if I did, I would certainly state why and sign it. The flag Mike got makes no sense, he hasn't posted anything anyone could possibly find offensive, in fact, his posts are helpful and informative....quite the opposite!

Maybe someone thought a "flag" was a good thing!

nyccarguy · May 2015

start saving @fezo - http://mashable.com/2015/05/01/tesla-used-online/

driver100 · May 2015

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!

One more thought Mike:

If you give in to terrorists (you can substitute trolls for terrorist) you lose.

Terrorists (and trolls) are bully's who like to play games with you.....don't give in to them.

Don't let them win!

driver100 · May 2015

nyccarguy said:
start saving @fezo - http://mashable.com/2015/05/01/tesla-used-online/

Interesting! So, you save $12k buying a used Tesla, but if someone can afford $63k you would think they would go for a new one at $75k. That's my thinking, but, many people like to save and feel that $12k saved is a much better deal.

abacomike · May 2015

driver100 said:

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!
One more thought Mike:

If you give in to terrorists (you can substitute trolls for terrorist) you lose.

Terrorists (and trolls) are bully's who like to play games with you.....don't give in to them.

Don't let them win!

Driver, the reason I was (am) so upset is that what I posted was not that controversial. Everyone knows that US Corporate Taxes are one of the highest in the world. Everyone knows large corporate entities keep billions and billions of dollars "off shore"! I didn't post anything that would warrant an ABUSE check. There is just someone who obviously doesn't like "me" or "what I say"! I agree with you - I can't let anyone cause me to refrain from posting on this site. If it happens again, I will ask one of the hosts to determine who gave the abuse check and let them take care of it.

Michaell · May 2015

abacomike said:

driver100 said:

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!
One more thought Mike:

If you give in to terrorists (you can substitute trolls for terrorist) you lose.

Terrorists (and trolls) are bully's who like to play games with you.....don't give in to them.

Don't let them win!

Driver, the reason I was (am) so upset is that what I posted was not that controversial. Everyone knows that US Corporate Taxes are one of the highest in the world. Everyone knows large corporate entities keep billions and billions of dollars "off shore"! I didn't post anything that would warrant an ABUSE check. There is just someone who obviously doesn't like "me" or "what I say"! I agree with you - I can't let anyone cause me to refrain from posting on this site. If it happens again, I will ask one of the hosts to determine who gave the abuse check and let them take care of it.

Mike - glad to see you're back. And, it doesn't matter what you post, there may always be someone who takes offense to it. They have the right to flag it; and you have the right to respond however you see fit. But, if you decide to stop posting because of it, then we might as well shut the forums down altogether.

And yes, should it happen again, let the hosts look into it.

Back to our regularly scheduled programming.

bwia · May 2015

Mike, I was flagged last year (perhaps inadvertently) by a sage and regular poster. My post was inoffensive so I asked our nicest of hosts Kirstie to remove my post as well as the flag, and she did.
By the way, I don't remember how I did it, but I am pretty sure you can see who flagged you.

thebean · May 2015

abacomike · May 2015

bwia said:

Mike, I was flagged last year (perhaps inadvertently) by a sage and regular poster. My post was inoffensive so I asked our nicest of hosts Kirstie to remove my post as well as the flag, and she did. By the way, I don't remember how I did it, but I am pretty sure you can see who flagged you.

@michaell
@stever
@kirstie_b_host

No, it doesn't allow me to look it up. Stever/michaell/Kirstie etc, can you help me out and find out who gave me an abuse/flag check?

suydam · May 2015

It's pretty hard to find established topics here. Why would "Mid Sized Sedans" be found in "Hyundai"?? "Help Me Choose" and "To Fix Up or Trade Up" aren't in any generally listed set either. I'm not surprised that people just start their own topics. If there were a list of general topics that cover common questions and comments it would be so much easier to navigate and less duplication.

stickguy · May 2015

asking questions in an ongoing topic doesn't bother me, if people don't realize there is another place. easy enough to link them over.

Some boards have standing policies to avoid certain topics. Toilets, Fridges, all fine. But the have strict "no politics" and/or "no religion" rules. For easy to imagine obvious reasons! Generally the better boards (like this one) do a good job of self-policing.

roadburner · May 2015

What really gets under my skin are the "one and done" idiots. They usually post an extremely negative opinion of a car or brand and are never heard from again. I think some of them are the so-called "guerrilla marketers' who are paid to ding a specific brand. I have noticed that these trolls virtually never reply if you respond to their tirade.

Michaell · May 2015

suydam said:

It's pretty hard to find established topics here. Why would "Mid Sized Sedans" be found in "Hyundai"?? "Help Me Choose" and "To Fix Up or Trade Up" aren't in any generally listed set either. I'm not surprised that people just start their own topics. If there were a list of general topics that cover common questions and comments it would be so much easier to navigate and less duplication.

Good point. And easy enough for us to update the tags so they are more generic

fezo · May 2015

Still a little steep but I may suddenly be in the market. The Mazda is throwing off horrific noises , not accelerating as it should and has a blinking CEL. Left it over the mechanics. Codes show random misfires and a clogged cat. Now I put tat clutch in some months ago but if this is going to be pricey I may decide to punt. If I do that the options are all over the map - from making do with something I can pay cash for to looking new if I can finance comfortably. In the types of things I like new that I could think about we might be talking about an Imprezza wagon. A fair bit cheaper to the Mazda 3 hatch with the 2.5 manual. We'll see.

Michaell · May 2015

fezo said:

Still a little steep but I may suddenly be in the market. The Mazda is throwing off horrific noises , not accelerating as it should and has a blinking CEL. Left it over the mechanics. Codes show random misfires and a clogged cat. Now I put tat clutch in some months ago but if this is going to be pricey I may decide to punt. If I do that the options are all over the map - from making do with something I can pay cash for to looking new if I can finance comfortably. In the types of things I like new that I could think about we might be talking about an Imprezza wagon. A fair bit cheaper to the Mazda 3 hatch with the 2.5 manual. We'll see.

That would be a good choice - the Impreza can be had for low $20's decently equipped.

stever · May 2015

How about a four off?

Best Luxury SUV/Crossover for $600/mo. or less? 36/15k, $0 down

(Even the responses to the "one-offs" help those who are searching the net for suggestions and find them, so there's that.)

suydam · May 2015

"I may suddenly be in the market." That's what happened to me a couple of months ago with my '04 Vibe. We went with "comfortably finance new" but a leftover '14 model.

driver100 · May 2015

driver100 said:

sandman_6472 said:
Maybe it's me, but how does one flag someone...and what does that mean anyways??? Just don't get it???

The Sandman
Sandman....you left a lot of blank space after your post........someone might complain that you are wasting cyberspace. If they thought that was bad they will flag you....right at the bottom of your post on the left side is the word "flag", and they press that for some reason.

I hope I don't get flagged for this. I think there should be a way to appeal or at least be able to find out who and why you were flagged......there is just too much that can go wrong.

Someone would have to post a very offensive post for me to flag it (has never happened), but, if I did, I would certainly state why and sign it. The flag Mike got makes no sense, he hasn't posted anything anyone could possibly find offensive, in fact, his posts are helpful and informative....quite the opposite!

Maybe someone thought a "flag" was a good thing!

Mike, I can't think of anything you have said that should have been flagged. It is easy to hit the flag button instead of the quote button, or it is a spineless troll who won't even say why he disagrees with what was said, and doesn't know how to make his point.

driver100 · May 2015

fezo said:
Still a little steep but I may suddenly be in the market. The Mazda is throwing off horrific noises , not accelerating as it should and has a blinking CEL. Left it over the mechanics. Codes show random misfires and a clogged cat. Now I put tat clutch in some months ago but if this is going to be pricey I may decide to punt. If I do that the options are all over the map - from making do with something I can pay cash for to looking new if I can finance comfortably. In the types of things I like new that I could think about we might be talking about an Imprezza wagon. A fair bit cheaper to the Mazda 3 hatch with the 2.5 manual. We'll see.

Out of curiosity could you try this fezo....it would help me confirm if my intuition is right or not?

Take the cost of your Mazda, the trade in value, and let us know how much it cost to drive it per year...add in repairs if you can.

See how much a new Imprezza or other fine car would be.......see how much it would cost to drive for 3 years, when it will be worth half, and for say 5 or 6 years...take off another 15% for depreciation per year.

I figure it costs maybe $2000 a year to drive a car that still has a warranty on it (depending on the cost of the car), but for that money you get a very reliable car that you can keep for many years, and not have to worry about something going wrong.......which leads me to my next post.....................

driver100 · May 2015

Remember the SIL has a kid who is an accountant...just passed all his exams and is doing well. He drives the 20 year old Volvo that needed $4000 worth of work about a year ago, and then it broke down on the highway...got towed in and needed a motor that cost $2000.

I thought at the time the grandson should lease a car. He's got a good job, it will probably cost less. It may improve his career possibilities if his boss sees him driving a new car instead of a 20 year old Volvo. Less chance of being late for work because the car won't start. Might look better if he has to see a client or take a boss with him to a clients location, if he has a new car.

The 20 year old Volvo started to act up again on the highway. Motor revs when it shouldn't on the highway. For all the repairs.....$6000 in less than 2 years, he could have leased a new car and been paying it down and at least he would own something of some value....instead of a few tons of metal ready to go at any moment.

verdugo · May 2015

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!

~~Your post was gone by the time I logged in. What was it about?~~

Never mind. I read your follow up comment. I don't think you said anything that could offend somebody. If they don't agree, that's fine, but they shouldn't get "offended."

explorerx4 · May 2015

@driver100,
My accountant drives a 15 year old Civic. Perfect!

Michaell · May 2015

verdugo said:

abacomike said:
I guess someone flagged me for abuse on my previous post. I hate cowards who flag anonymously. Bye all, it's been nice knowing all of you!
~~Your post was gone by the time I logged in. What was it about?~~

Never mind. I read your follow up comment. I don't think you said anything that could offend somebody. If they don't agree, that's fine, but they shouldn't get "offended."

That's your opinion. Obviously, the person who flagged the post had their opinion - and it was different.

We've had these difference of opinions before, and we've all survived. Perhaps we need to do that here.

ab348 · May 2015

Michaell said:

That's your opinion. Obviously, the person who flagged the post had their opinion - and it was different.

We've had these difference of opinions before, and we've all survived. Perhaps we need to do that here.

A couple of points:

Flagging a post takes a couple of distinct keystrokes, the first to flag it, then to indicate whether it is being flagged for spam or abuse. So I doubt it happened accidentally.

Second point: Mike's post was flagged as "abuse". I take abuse to mean someone calling someone names, posting porn, whatever. I don't think what Mike posted falls into that category. It seems unfair to him for that to stand.

abacomike · May 2015

@Michaell

So, what you are saying is that if we disagree with a post, we should just "flag" it as abuse, then! I was told that a "flag" is for language abuse or abusive phrasing or abuse of another poster. If we start "flagging" posters for mere disagreements, we'll end up with hundreds of flags.

I believe the "flag" should be used only by hosts who feel the specific poster was abusive in some way.

abacomike · May 2015

ab348 said:

That's your opinion. Obviously, the person who flagged the post had their opinion - and it was different. We've had these difference of opinions before, and we've all survived. Perhaps we need to do that here.
A couple of points: Flagging a post takes a couple of distinct keystrokes, the first to flag it, then to indicate whether it is being flagged for spam or abuse. So I doubt it happened accidentally. Second point: Mike's post was flagged as "abuse". I take abuse to mean someone calling someone names, posting porn, whatever. I don't think what Mike posted falls into that category. It seems unfair to him for that to stand.

Thank you "ab". You hit the nail on the head with your description. I feel Edmunds need to change that format - it should be used for ABUSE, not a difference of opinion. When you get flagged, it shows up as ABUSE in your profile. That is not right and is non-sensical in my opinion.

jayrider · May 2015

driver100 said:

fezo said:
Still a little steep but I may suddenly be in the market. The Mazda is throwing off horrific noises , not accelerating as it should and has a blinking CEL. Left it over the mechanics. Codes show random misfires and a clogged cat. Now I put tat clutch in some months ago but if this is going to be pricey I may decide to punt. If I do that the options are all over the map - from making do with something I can pay cash for to looking new if I can finance comfortably. In the types of things I like new that I could think about we might be talking about an Imprezza wagon. A fair bit cheaper to the Mazda 3 hatch with the 2.5 manual. We'll see.
Out of curiosity could you try this fezo....it would help me confirm if my intuition is right or not?

Take the cost of your Mazda, the trade in value, and let us know how much it cost to drive it per year...add in repairs if you can.

See how much a new Imprezza or other fine car would be.......see how much it would cost to drive for 3 years, when it will be worth half, and for say 5 or 6 years...take off another 15% for depreciation per year.

I figure it costs maybe $2000 a year to drive a car that still has a warranty on it (depending on the cost of the car), but for that money you get a very reliable car that you can keep for many years, and not have to worry about something going wrong.......which leads me to my next post.....................

I should flag you for making too much sense.

fezo · May 2015

Driver - I can figure these things out. I've had long experience with insanely reliable and cheap used cars. In my overall experience they actually have been more reliable than the new ones which is admittedly unusual.

If I think I can realistically pull off a 3 or Imprezza without burying us I'll likely do that.

fezo · May 2015

As long as I only need to go for two minutes, American Pharo would be a nice ride.

abacomike · May 2015

The Velocity Channel aired two great segments this evening. The first segment at 8:00 PM EDT showed the step-by-step production of the Corvette Stingray. The second segment (currently airing) shows the step-by-step production of the hand-made Bugatti coupe - 16 cylinder 1200 hp engine. They said it takes 3-weeks to hand-produce the engine. The body is all carbon fiber filament.

If you get Velocity, give the last 15 minutes a look see - definitely an amazing vehicle.

Mr_Shiftright · May 2015

It's interesting you bring up the idea of some craftsman spending countless hours to build a special car. Whenever I see one of these crashed on YouTube it kind of makes me ill to realize all the human effort that was wiped out by some celebrity. I would practically bow down to an engine that takes 3 weeks to build.

abacomike · May 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:

It's interesting you bring up the idea of some craftsman spending countless hours to build a special car. Whenever I see one of these crashed on YouTube it kind of makes me ill to realize all the human effort that was wiped out by some celebrity. I would practically bow down to an engine that takes 3 weeks to build.

On top of that (seeing a video of a masterpiece destroyed by some inept driver), Bugatti builds only 48 of these cars per year in a building that is smaller in size than the average grocery market. Unbelievable. The most expensive production car made and the fastest.

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