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Putting Money Into An Older Car
How much money is too much money to invest in an
older car? We started this conversation in the News
& Views conference and we're continuing it here!
carlady/host
older car? We started this conversation in the News
& Views conference and we're continuing it here!
carlady/host
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The problem is this: whenever I start the car, regardless of the ambient temperature (whether it's 50 degress or 80), and even if it's only been sitting for 10 minutes since I last drove it, the idle shoots up to 2000 rpm, where it stays for the first 5 minutes or so of my drive. Then it suddenly drops down to about 500 rpm.
The owner of the shop keeps saying this is because it's got an automatic choke, and it's supposed to do that, to keep the car from stalling. Well, I have driven a lot of cars with automatic chokes, and I have NEVER encountered one that did this. I have never experienced such a high initial idle, and always before the initial idle has been higher when it's colder out, lower whan it's hotter, and the idle always gradually dropped as the cars warmed up. This is the way my Honda used to be.
Now, when I'm trying to back out of my parking space or maneuver in parking lots, I'm always having to fight the engine with the brake, since taking my foot off the gas has no effect due to the high idle. Not only does it feel wrong, sound wrong, and have me a little worried about my engine, it's noticeably impacting my gas mileage.
Is this actually normal behavior for a carbeurator? Should I insist on a new rebuilt one? Should I just accept that this is the way my car will be from now on? I've already taken the car back 5 times, and they've supposedly made adjustments every time, but there's never been an improvement.
Please help me decide how to proceed. Thank you very much!
Anyway, ask for a replacement. Write them a letter and use the words "dangerous" and "safety" and "lives of little children"...this should get a response. If not, contact the Consumer Affairs Bureau of your local district Attorney and ask them for advice on how to mediate this conflict.
Also, give the shop every chance to make things right. Be patient with them until you can't get any more satisfaction. They have a hard job, too, and I'm sure they're not trying to cheat you...they probably just don't know what's wrong either...
This may help: Remove the air cleaner housing and familiarize yourself with the vacuum connections to the carb base and intake manifold. Move these tubes around a bit; if you see a broken or rotted tube, replace it. (Be careful to get the correct size.) If they tubing appears to be OK, do the following:
If it was necessary to disconnect any tubing to remove the air cleaner (which is the case on many cars) plug the end of the open tube(s). Now start the engine, and while it is still in the fast-idle mode, gently move the the appropriate tubes to and fro. If the engine dies, gets distinctly rough, or speeds up, you have located the culprit. If rubber deterioration is not the problem (you may not be able to see it), the device at the other end of tube is very suspect. Let us know what you find.
>accelator pedal is stuck up which when pressed
>tightly, comes back and starts behaving properly.
This sounds like the same problem I had a few months ago. When I took my car in for its checkup, they told me it was probably goo that had accumulated around the accelerator pedal shaft. They cleaned off the goo, and I haven't had the problem since.
I was surprised, because it only happened firs thing in the morning. You'd think a sticky goo would affect it all day. But anyway, have a mechanic clean it the next time you have a tuneup.
Too, use Siena's suggestion to verify that the throttle as well as the pedal linkage are not binding.
I'd say you're gettin your money's worth out of the car. A small investment in maintenance seems fair.
If you scrimp on this, at best you'd be trying to sell the car years from now with a $40K overdue belt change. At worst,...too unpleasant to think about.
I'd like to drive this thing for another 3 years/60K miles. What should I expect in terms of major repairs? Any engine work or Transmission work? It's a 2.2 Liter 4 cylinder with manual transmission.
I don't mind a few repairs, but I'll be reluctant to put a thousand or more at one time. Your thoughts are appreciated
Talk to me in 3 yrs. I might make you an offer.
You should make it okay, I think, but you'd be on the outer limits with a 4-banger. I'd suggest that you do a major transmission service, reduce your oil changes to every 3,000 miles, flush the cooling and brake systems and redo the belts and hoses...that would be a couple hundred bucks well spent to get you through the next 60K. Also, you're probably ready for shocks.
Bye for now,
Rick D.
nearing the end of their lives. Struts, etc. Thanks in advance.
Look on the sedans board for a topic about this car. You could also start one.
However, the advice for any used car is pretty much the same: have a mechanic check out all the major systems. Personally, I think engine compression is about the most important, but they'll look for any other components that look shaky.
You mention struts. I'd just drive it and check out the ride, and do the bumper-bounce test and look for oil leaks on the struts. Simple stuff; don't even need a mechanic for that. Also, you gotta plan on replacing them if you're gonna keep it for awhile or if the originals are still on there. Just part of the regular maintenance.
I'd check the rocker panels carefully for rust, listen while driving for squeeks, etc.
I highly recommend running a check on the VIN.
If you're really ambitious you could saunter down to a local Buick dealer or 2, tell the service manager that you're looking at an '88 Park Ave and ask if he/she can think off-hand of any major weaknesses in it.
The car finally developed the infamous GM steering ``morning sickness'' at about 90K. This is a $500+ item if it hasn't already been done. There was an extended warranty on it, but that's long gone by now.
You can expect the power window supports to fail. I understand this is pretty common. It costs about $60 to fix, unless you've got window tinting, which will get scratched badly and need to be replaced.
I started having trouble keeping the front wheels aligned toward the end. Never did replace the ball joints, but would have had to do something had the wreck not happened.
The powertrain was great - no problems whatsoever. I think it's a great engine/transmission.
The Accord continually runs great. However brakes and suspension are weak points and expensive to upgrade.
When I look at monthly car payments on a new vehicle, repair costs to these vehicles do not seem that great. When I want to go on a long trip I just rent.
These are good cars but I think asking it to run for 3-4 years with no hassles is a lot to ask of a 15 year old car with over 100,000 miles on it and perhaps not the best of care by your description.
Weakest link in Hondas back then was probably head gasket problems and i suspect that if you run up a lot of miles quickly you're going to have to deal with that around 125K.
Get the car checked out before you buy it. Have a compression test taken and if it's not really good, pass on the car. Otherwise, make sure it's safe, with good brakes and tight steering, and no major oil or water leaks. Have your mechanic test the clutch, too, as this is another expensive item.
good luck with it,
The limited edition T-Birds were never big sellers, were they?
I called on the Minn. car-as I suspected, there is some rust on the bottom of the doors (Minn. is a tough place for cars). May I ask how you found it? I've been checking the auto classifieds-none of their search engines will handle the "FILA", so I spend a lot of time looking at other T-Birds. Can you point me toward some dry-climate cars?
Thanks Much!
Used is what I have now, so junk yard is not an option.
Any ideas? I'm told 84 LeSabre is a match, but I'm not real convinced.
GM will not decide when I trade!!!!!!!!!
shiftright
i plan to buy a 91 isuzu amigo which has done 112 k.it is a 2wd and the 2.3 liter engine.All i want from this vehicle is a trouble free performance for 2 yrs.i do not want to spend on it .i would be junking it after my graduation in 2 years.what are the problems that plague this vehicle.I need jus a relaible trnsportation.I am getting it for ard 2000.is the price rite.lemme know
vish
Who knows? If it's manual and on the original clutch it's probably time for clutch to go($500-
$700). Watch for oil consumption. There nothing you can do about it within means, just don't let level fall too low and ruin the engine. Have somebody checked steering components - sometimes it's a life saving pecaution. Last car I bought for $2000 had all current inspections and gravely loose sleeves in the steering.
Sounds like you should take the car somewhere else for a second opinion. Does the mechanic claim that all four CV "booties" are leaking? Oh, really? That's not too likely. And how bad an oil pan leak? Did he try to tighten the bolts that hold it? If it's just a drip,so what? Let it be?
And did he pull the rear wheels off to inspect the wheel cylinders? How does he know what the leak is? Is the muffler hole a pinhole or a bad leak? If a pinhole, what about a good slab of high-temp epoxy for 6 months extra use? If a bad leak, have you shopped other muffler specialty shops?
I think you could square this car away for a lot less than estimated, after all, the miles aren't that much, the car should have lots of life left in it.
I am willing to put in the money to fix it ($1000+) because I am not in a place to be purchasing something newer, and the car has otherwise been remarkably reliable (I bought it used in '96 with 33K mi.).
My mechanic and other knowledgeable people have said the Honda trannie should have lasted much longer (150,000 mi.) Does anyone else have different information about the typical lifespan of a transmission in such a car? Or is my situation just an anomaly? I welcome any information. Thanks!
You might consider a good used transmission if you could find one with 50-60K on it, since a new transmission may well outlast your car...but only if there is a considerabl savings.
However, even if you do ALL of those repairs, it is STILL much cheaper than buying a new car. If you want to save money, it is MUCH cheaper to repair your current car than it is to buy a new Honda Accord.
A new Accord will cost you about $430/month if you get a 48-month loan. Do you honestly think you will spend $6,000 to repair your Accord in the next year?
If you want a new car because of extra options, features THEN it's worth it to just get the new car, but it's not economical to do so as long as your current car functions safely.
Used engines are good, but you have to keep the labor costs down...what often happens is that during an engine installation it is very tempting (and even smart) to replace hoses, belts, do a tune up, new clutch, oil, filters, steam clean, maybe overhaul the starter and alternator, new water pump...you see what I mean....you can still run up a big bill, so that's why I'm suggesting you honestly evaluate what the foundation is like under your car...if it feels and looks tired, then it's time to let it go..... a decent, clean used car these days will cost you around $6,000, so see if that's in your budget, too.
check the blue book value and then subtract the cost of a new engine. Then go out and buy your self another newer dependable car and CHANGE YOUR FLUIDS ON TIME!!!!!!! An engine that is ready to blow up(not to mention that its a Toyota with only 96K) before the body is rusted out is just plain bad judgement on your part. That car should have gone to 200k easily. Please dont take too much offense to what I'm saying but its in your best interest to make sure that your vehicle is maintained. And it could save your life as well as the lives of others on the road. If your engine was maintained that poorly, I dont even want to imagine the condition of your brakes and brake fluid. I obtained my current car from a person just like yourself. A 1991 VW Golf with just 57K on a virtually brand new (garage kept) car. I paid
$500 for the car because the owner NEVER changed her oil. Remember, you are female but you are NOT
helpless.
I have a 1990 Subaru Legacy LS with all the options. It's been a great car - I'm the original owner. It has 114,000 miles on it. New brakes about a year ago, A/C repaired 2 years ago, new clutch 8 months ago, and it still has the original exhaust system (that amazes me). The doors and windows are still tight, the car handles pretty well (the shocks are probably worn, but it still feels good), sunroof doesn't leak, interior is in good shape.
I have not had any major problems until now - the "viscous coupler" inside the tranny is seizing after driving for a while (30 - 45 minutes), causing all 4 wheels to turn at the same rate. This is not a problem until I make a sharp turn, and then the inside wheels "bounce" or skid around the turn, kind of like an old 4WD pickup would do. I have talked to a dealer about fixing it, and it would cost about $2,000 to fix it with a new part. Another independent shop thinks they might be able to get a used part, but I don't know the cost of that.
There is also a wheel bearing noise coming from one of the back wheels. I don't know how much that might cost.
The question: is it worth fixing, or should I sell it for parts? I have been told it is not a saftey issue to keep driving it as it, but it is a pain in the neck to drive it in the current condition, especially in town. How many miles do people usually get from 1990 Subarus? If I can expect another 100 K out of it, I will probably bite the bullet and fix it, otherwise who knows?
BTW, the book value is about 3,000 for trade-in, 4,500 retail.
Thanks in advance for any advice, anyone.
Besides the fact that your car is "running fine", my recommendation is influenced by the fact that you "dread the car shopping business."