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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

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Comments

  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    The reviews on the 4Runner are not that flattering. C&D ranked them 7th out of 8 SUVs tested. Touareg was 3rd. Towing is almost a joke with the 4Runner. And when is Toyota going to get with the times and dump that 5 speed transmission? MT says time to dump outdated drive train. Do something about mediocre interior.

    Drive both and you would never be satisfied with the 4Runner.
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    gagrice said:

    The reviews on the 4Runner are not that flattering. C&D ranked them 7th out of 8 SUVs tested. Touareg was 3rd. Towing is almost a joke with the 4Runner. And when is Toyota going to get with the times and dump that 5 speed transmission? MT says time to dump outdated drive train. Do something about mediocre interior.

    Drive both and you would never be satisfied with the 4Runner.

    Agreed,
    but it is the most genuine off roader ever made , barring the Land Cruiser. People don't buy it for its aesthetics and beauty. IT is bought by those who want ruggedness and longetivity. There are many 20 year old 4Runners still running in the USA then any other SUV.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited November 2015
    >It also would have sold more than 4 M units world wide in 15 years.

    Global cumulative sales for the Prius nameplate, when the Prius liftback is included, add up to 5,264,307 units through July 2015. Sales started in Japan in '97. Total Toyota hybrid sales are around 8 million. (Wikipedia)

    The Scion brand has been around since '04 and I bet it hasn't sold 1 million cumulatively (176k in '06, 68k in '13). That's the losing model model.

    Chattanooga is now making 85% of all Passats, and annual production numbers are pushing 600,000.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    stever said:

    >It also would have sold more than 4 M units world wide in 15 years.

    Global cumulative sales for the Prius nameplate, when the Prius liftback is included, add up to 5,264,307 units through July 2015. Sales started in Japan in '97. Total Toyota hybrid sales are around 8 million. (Wikipedia)

    The Scion brand has been around since '04 and I bet it hasn't sold 1 million cumulatively (176k in '06, 68k in '13). That's the losing model model.

    Chattanooga is now making 85% of all Passats, and annual production numbers are pushing 600,000.

    Toyota, 18 years later STILL does not break out how much they make per Prius car.

    For all you diesel haters that think I am ANTI gas hybrid, I considered the 2003/2004, putting app 400 miles on a 2004 Prius demonstrator.. @ that time it was $7,000 more than the diesel (best deals on both). Combined with getting 43/44 mpg Prius,50 mpg VW J TDI, and liking the TDI's highway performance, the numbers were a no brainer in the commute slough.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited November 2015
    Some companies keep their numbers pretty close. I don't know that GM "confirms" all those reports that they make $17,000 in profit on every Suburban they sell.

    Rumor is that Toyota makes $3,100 US on every Prius sold. (PriusChat)

    Mr. Lutz claims that the Volt was close to breaking even back in 2012. (Forbes)
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    carboy21 said:

    gagrice said:

    carboy21 said:

    II am so glad I got rid of that gas hog. And it has Nothing on the Touareg TDI but a bit bigger. The VW is faster, handles better, stops faster, more comfortable, and averages 11 MPG more over the last 26,000 miles. And it cost a couple thousand less to buy.

    Touareg is smaller then a 4Runner, and no comparison to Sequoia. Apples to Oranges comparison between Seqouia and Touareg. You might be better off comparing it with a real SUV like 4Runner.


    Funny you mention that. Grand daughter that bought our Sequoia, got rid of her 4Runner. Says the Seqouia is much nicer. She loves the Sequoia except the little things that break and the 15-16 MPG. Her 4Runner used the same amount of gas.

    The comparison is for a vehicle that is great to travel cross country in. The ONLY advantage to the Seqouia was more room to haul STUFF. Having to buy gas every 300 miles vs 600 was a pain. After 36,000 miles in the Sequoia and 26,000 miles in the Touareg TDI the winner is very clear. Not a chance I would buy another Toyota. I do have a long history with Toyota. Buying a new Toyota Land Cruiser in 1964. That vehicle had more problems than any new vehicle I have ever owned. Valves and timing gear 3 times each in 50k miles.

    I swore I would never buy another until we settled on the 2007 Sequoia. Not likely to buy another Toyota in my lifetime. By the way the 4Runner is butt ugly.
    Talking of personal anecdotal experiences, I have a 1999 Toyota 4Runner with 260 k odd miles on the clock. Never gave me any trouble, Just routine maintenance and fluid changes. Just this year after trouble free 250k miles, I pro-actively refurbished it with a new radiator, shocks and coils and lower and upper ball joints to give it a further new lease of life as I intend to run it to the ground over next 5 years :)
    Lucky you, this is what my son's 4Runner looked like at 130k miles. Not even close to the VW 12 year rust warranty.


  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    stever said:

    Some companies keep their numbers pretty close. I don't know that GM "confirms" all those reports that they make $17,000 in profit on every Suburban they sell.

    Rumor is that Toyota makes $3,100 US on every Prius sold. (PriusChat)

    Mr. Lutz claims that the Volt was close to breaking even back in 2012. (Forbes)

    More VW & diesel advantages ! You were just confirming that I made a good choice back in 2003/2004 buying the 2003 VW Jetta TDI. Given the posted article on Prius battery replacement, I would have been really bummed, IF I had to spend $5,000 to get a new battery. (depending on warranty @ 100 k/ 150 k)

    If the rumors are true that Prius makes $3,100 per unit and VW makes approximately $850 per unit .... There is no doubt in my mind that the VW diesel was, is, remains the better choice.

    I am not sure how GM's number have nexus with Toyota's numbers?
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    gagrice said:

    carboy21 said:

    gagrice said:

    carboy21 said:

    II am so glad I got rid of that gas hog. And it has Nothing on the Touareg TDI but a bit bigger. The VW is faster, handles better, stops faster, more comfortable, and averages 11 MPG more over the last 26,000 miles. And it cost a couple thousand less to buy.

    Touareg is smaller then a 4Runner, and no comparison to Sequoia. Apples to Oranges comparison between Seqouia and Touareg. You might be better off comparing it with a real SUV like 4Runner.


    Funny you mention that. Grand daughter that bought our Sequoia, got rid of her 4Runner. Says the Seqouia is much nicer. She loves the Sequoia except the little things that break and the 15-16 MPG. Her 4Runner used the same amount of gas.

    The comparison is for a vehicle that is great to travel cross country in. The ONLY advantage to the Seqouia was more room to haul STUFF. Having to buy gas every 300 miles vs 600 was a pain. After 36,000 miles in the Sequoia and 26,000 miles in the Touareg TDI the winner is very clear. Not a chance I would buy another Toyota. I do have a long history with Toyota. Buying a new Toyota Land Cruiser in 1964. That vehicle had more problems than any new vehicle I have ever owned. Valves and timing gear 3 times each in 50k miles.

    I swore I would never buy another until we settled on the 2007 Sequoia. Not likely to buy another Toyota in my lifetime. By the way the 4Runner is butt ugly.
    Talking of personal anecdotal experiences, I have a 1999 Toyota 4Runner with 260 k odd miles on the clock. Never gave me any trouble, Just routine maintenance and fluid changes. Just this year after trouble free 250k miles, I pro-actively refurbished it with a new radiator, shocks and coils and lower and upper ball joints to give it a further new lease of life as I intend to run it to the ground over next 5 years :)
    Lucky you, this is what my son's 4Runner looked like at 130k miles. Not even close to the VW 12 year rust warranty.


    Relative to the VW Touareg TDI (like mileage) , the TLC's are/were far fussier!

    IF I were to F/F to what I know today (about the two brands), I am not so sure I would chose Toyota again. (even if they had diesel models)
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    edited November 2015
    gagrice said:
    II am so glad I got rid of that gas hog. And it has Nothing on the Touareg TDI but a bit bigger. The VW is faster, handles better, stops faster, more comfortable, and averages 11 MPG more over the last 26,000 miles. And it cost a couple thousand less to buy. Touareg is smaller then a 4Runner, and no comparison to Sequoia. Apples to Oranges comparison between Seqouia and Touareg. You might be better off comparing it with a real SUV like 4Runner.
    Funny you mention that. Grand daughter that bought our Sequoia, got rid of her 4Runner. Says the Seqouia is much nicer. She loves the Sequoia except the little things that break and the 15-16 MPG. Her 4Runner used the same amount of gas. The comparison is for a vehicle that is great to travel cross country in. The ONLY advantage to the Seqouia was more room to haul STUFF. Having to buy gas every 300 miles vs 600 was a pain. After 36,000 miles in the Sequoia and 26,000 miles in the Touareg TDI the winner is very clear. Not a chance I would buy another Toyota. I do have a long history with Toyota. Buying a new Toyota Land Cruiser in 1964. That vehicle had more problems than any new vehicle I have ever owned. Valves and timing gear 3 times each in 50k miles. I swore I would never buy another until we settled on the 2007 Sequoia. Not likely to buy another Toyota in my lifetime. By the way the 4Runner is butt ugly.
    Talking of personal anecdotal experiences, I have a 1999 Toyota 4Runner with 260 k odd miles on the clock. Never gave me any trouble, Just routine maintenance and fluid changes. Just this year after trouble free 250k miles, I pro-actively refurbished it with a new radiator, shocks and coils and lower and upper ball joints to give it a further new lease of life as I intend to run it to the ground over next 5 years :)
    Lucky you, this is what my son's 4Runner looked like at 130k miles. Not even close to the VW 12 year rust warranty.
    Looks like he never took his car to a car wash after a winters worth of road salt . Happens when you just love german carsv and ignore all others  ! LOL
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited November 2015
    ruking1 said:

    If the rumors are true that Prius makes $3,100 per unit and VW makes approximately $850 per unit .... There is no doubt in my mind that the VW diesel was, is, remains the better choice.

    Well, if that's your reasoning, you would have done much better buying a car where the manufacturer loses $1,000 every time it makes one. :D

    Actually, by the time the smoke clears, it may be several thousand that VW loses on every 2.0l TDI sold in the US. So yeah, you done good, lol.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Yes. BUT....$7,000 more vs $7,000 LESS!? Don't even need a cheap calculator for that one !? :D;)B) Or am I just being PC?

    The anti-diesel folks amongst us MIGHT need use a calculator for the 43 mpg versus 50 mpg over 180,000 miles .

    Thank you ! IF VW is able to weather this fiasco well, which I think they will, diesels will offer even better value for at least another 10 years, after all is settled UP, & things settle down.
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    edited November 2015

    I was never fond of the "rich people are stupid" argument. If everyone and his pet monkey has been copying BMW this last decade (and they have), then BMW must have something that the other automakers wish to emulate. One has to admit that the "driving dynamics" have improved quite a bit in both American and Japanese cars, and I think the Germans deserve credit for inspiring that.

    Actually the "Germans " have responded to the onslaught of Japanese and Korean mass market cars by coming out it with copycat "diluted" German engineered 3 series BMWs and C series MB and A3 series Audis. I am not even going to mention the X1,X2,X3 , X5 BMWs and the GLA GLC and GLK series SUV by MB.These are expensive overrated poor cousins of the original German cars made exclusively to compete with the "Mass Market" Japanese :)

    "Driving Dynamics" and the "Ultimate Driving Machine "., is a over used cliche by the Germans ;)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Indeed that can be true! A lot of folks are really OK with poorer quality! The Germans are just giving the customers what they " want" That is one reason why homework is important. It does beg the question do Japanese, Korean, US OEM's build better (like model ) cars for European markets?

    That was one reason why I bought the 2009 VW Jetta TDI! The 2010 was the first of the DE-contented versions. The 2014 MB 250 BT is made for the American markets, but still made in Germany. Now what that means in comparison is difficult to contrast.

    One real glaring example is the Chevrolet Cruze diesel : costs about $8000 more then a gas Cruze ! There's a whole discussion on the points, but I will go into I only if folks want to.

    Slow news diesel day ! Only caught a - minus 3% move on the downside on "some chicken little " type articles published about VW TDI's.

    Yes, a lot of car journalism mimics wine tasting prose! "Fruity with a good nose" to use a bad example. But yet either to both can be good from the sublime to rip roaring comedy!
  • eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    gagrice, EPA says that VW cheated with the Touareg TDI. VW denies but why would anyone believe VW at this point?
    So.... If you are given the choice of getting recall applied, lowering NOX emissions and lowering MPG, will you get the recall applied to your vehicle? (Sounds like there won't be any choice in some states, but if you have the choice, what would you do?)
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    They may be de-contented to compete in the American market but they are still very distinctly German cars. How does one copy oneself? I do agree though that BMWs have become a bit softer and for most Americans that's probably a good thing. What you are seeing is not a marked degradation of German driving dynamics but rather everyone else having caught up. Buicks, after all, no longer drive like Buicks.

    carboy21 said:

    I was never fond of the "rich people are stupid" argument. If everyone and his pet monkey has been copying BMW this last decade (and they have), then BMW must have something that the other automakers wish to emulate. One has to admit that the "driving dynamics" have improved quite a bit in both American and Japanese cars, and I think the Germans deserve credit for inspiring that.

    Actually the "Germans " have responded to the onslaught of Japanese and Korean mass market cars by coming out it with copycat "diluted" German engineered 3 series BMWs and C series MB and A3 series Audis. I am not even going to mention the X1,X2,X3 , X5 BMWs and the GLA GLC and GLK series SUV by MB.These are expensive overrated poor cousins of the original German cars made exclusively to compete with the "Mass Market" Japanese :)

    "Driving Dynamics" and the "Ultimate Driving Machine "., is a over used cliche by the Germans ;)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015

    They may be de-contented to compete in the American market but they are still very distinctly German cars. How does one copy oneself? I do agree though that BMWs have become a bit softer and for most Americans that's probably a good thing. What you are seeing is not a marked degradation of German driving dynamics but rather everyone else having caught up. Buicks, after all, no longer drive like Buicks.



    carboy21 said:

    I was never fond of the "rich people are stupid" argument. If everyone and his pet monkey has been copying BMW this last decade (and they have), then BMW must have something that the other automakers wish to emulate. One has to admit that the "driving dynamics" have improved quite a bit in both American and Japanese cars, and I think the Germans deserve credit for inspiring that.

    Actually the "Germans " have responded to the onslaught of Japanese and Korean mass market cars by coming out it with copycat "diluted" German engineered 3 series BMWs and C series MB and A3 series Audis. I am not even going to mention the X1,X2,X3 , X5 BMWs and the GLA GLC and GLK series SUV by MB.These are expensive overrated poor cousins of the original German cars made exclusively to compete with the "Mass Market" Japanese :)

    "Driving Dynamics" and the "Ultimate Driving Machine "., is a over used cliche by the Germans ;)
    That part is true also ! Bean counters, no matter the language are involved almost integrally down to the tiniest detail!

    So for example on the 2012 VW Touareg TDI, one would expect a ZF 8 speed A/T ! Instead it is an " AISIN" 8 speed automatic transmission. I would daresay/swag it's probably cheaper and better than the ZF?
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    ruking1 said:

    Indeed that can be true! A lot of folks are really OK with poorer quality! The Germans are just giving the customers what they " want" That is one reason why homework is important. It does beg the question do Japanese, Korean, US OEM's build better (like model ) cars for European markets?

    That was one reason why I bought the 2009 VW Jetta TDI! The 2010 was the first of the DE-contented versions. The 2014 MB 250 BT is made for the American markets, but still made in Germany. Now what that means in comparison is difficult to contrast.

    One real glaring example is the Chevrolet Cruze diesel : costs about $8000 more then a gas Cruze ! There's a whole discussion on the points, but I will go into I only if folks want to.

    Slow news diesel day ! Only caught a - minus 3% move on the downside on "some chicken little " type articles published about VW TDI's.

    Yes, a lot of car journalism mimics wine tasting prose! "Fruity with a good nose" to use a bad example. But yet either to both can be good from the sublime to rip roaring comedy!

    I have lived in the UK for 6 years and can safely say that the Ford and GM have the UP contented versions of the American counterparts. One of the reason being that the UK Pound is far stronger then the US $ and there is more profit per car in UK for the US carmakers. Same applies to the BMW , MB and Audi . Even in rest of the Europe, cars are speced much highr then the American counterparts. Does not apply to top of the range BMW and MB which are of course only made in Germany.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Thanks for the 6 year perspective. I also noticed that European used cars ( in Europe) are cheaper than ( European) used cars in America ! Too bad we can not get the European versions here @ reduced prices also.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    elias said:

    gagrice, EPA says that VW cheated with the Touareg TDI. VW denies but why would anyone believe VW at this point?
    So.... If you are given the choice of getting recall applied, lowering NOX emissions and lowering MPG, will you get the recall applied to your vehicle? (Sounds like there won't be any choice in some states, but if you have the choice, what would you do?)

    I have a 2013 Touareg TDI. That has not been mentioned yet, as an offender. If it does get caught up in the web of deceit, I would take a wait and see attitude. I just did my two year smog which it passed. So will not be hit up again until 2017 licensing. I think it is very premature to think it would make much difference in the power. The vehicle has far more power than I will ever need.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    elias said:

    gagrice, EPA says that VW cheated with the Touareg TDI. VW denies but why would anyone believe VW at this point?
    So.... If you are given the choice of getting recall applied, lowering NOX emissions and lowering MPG, will you get the recall applied to your vehicle? (Sounds like there won't be any choice in some states, but if you have the choice, what would you do?)

    EPA/CARB have machine gunned their credibility also.
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,327
    edited November 2015
    On most, if not all, long term reliability comparisons, Toyota is always at or near the top and VW is always near the bottom. That also is the case with my personal experience. Just saying.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    edited November 2015
    And there's always those nagging VW electrical gremlins. I know that even buying a Scion product of the Toyota family the car will be well-made and also hold it's resale value exceedingly well.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Gagrice and I are (just) saying that is not true in (our) realities ! Keep in mind we (I actually) have had 8 Toyota's, (5 TLC's). So one could accuse me of being a brand fan boy. So if anything I have more interest overlooking Toyota's faults.

    In comparison, that's three VW diesel's and one Mercedes-Benz diesel: all with far less diesel miles. I will continue to say, until it becomes not true , aka changes, that the Toyota gas Land Cruiser's are much more fussy.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    carboy21 says: Looks like he never took his car to a car wash after a winters worth of road salt . Happens when you just love german carsv and ignore all others ! LOL

    He bought it that way. He was on a very small budget and needed a 4 wheel drive where he was living in AK. Yes it was probably used and abused. Not uncommon in AK. Still a 6 year old vehicle should NOT be rusted through. He kept it a few years and bought a used 2002 Yukon. He likes it much better than the 4Runner. It is now 13 years old with 10 years on AK salted roads and NO rust. Toyota has rust issues. So much for their great reliability.

    On Friday, Toyota Motor Sales USA Inc. was slammed with a class action lawsuit alleging that its popular truck model, the Toyota Tacoma, suffers from a defect making that model particularly vulnerable to rust.
    “Toyota USA has long known that the frames on its Tacoma vehicles lack adequate rust corrosion protection,” the Toyota Tacoma class action lawsuit says. “Despite this knowledge, Toyota USA failed to disclose the existence of this defect to plaintiff and other class members at the time of sale.”



  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Yes, so what you're saying actually has been known to me for easily 45 years! The answers are actually fairly simple. Toyota does not want to spend more $$'s to buy materials that are more rust resistant, one being galvanize steel, like VW uses!
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    I am sure I can find many rusted cars of all brands at the scrapyards :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    carboy21 said:

    I am sure I can find many rusted cars of all brands at the scrapyards :)

    I didn't say rustproof did I ? So yes a no brainer!

    Most folks do not care for their vehicles like they should. That is another reason why I like to evaluate a car on 12 years/180,000 miles. IF one can get it to those parameters, it's easy to get it to 24 years & @ 360,000 miles. Most people, as you would agree, probably do not think in those terms, let alone do the minimum maintenance needed.

    So for another example, we had change the SHOCKS on a 1994 TLC.@ app 21 years/ 250,000 miles. The shocks made by an OEM supplier, sold under its own brand name, cost $207, shpd to my door. Naturally, I could DIY, or pay shop time.

    The funny part is I may have changed the shocks way too early. Crazy you say? Well, one clue, with more than 4 variables: all tire sets have gone 90,000 miles. We changed the last set a tad early because one tire developed a bubble. That of course is probably not the shocks fault.
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,327
    edited November 2015
    Here is a pic of my 2003 Tacoma. I bought it for $10,000. in 2010 and sold it for $10,500. in 2014. It had 156,000 miles on it. The picture was taken right before I sold it. No rust. While I had it I just did oil and filter changes. Also put on new timing chain, water pump, set of tires, and brakes when I first bought it.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    edited November 2015
    Sometimes, but maybe not always. US cars are often spec'd less, but they also are often much cheaper. There are also lower spec variants in Euroland and Blighty not found in NA - can't get a manual cloth interior 4cyl E or 5er in Murka, but they are common in Europe. What gets me most is that Euro rental cars are usually spec'd much higher than US rental cars. Diesel rental cars in NA are virtually unknown, too.

    The pound is valuable partly because it has a legacy from the past where it 240 pence. It has gradually lost value over time, especially since being floated. I think it was at about $2.50 at the time of decimalization, now maybe $1.55 today/
    carboy21 said:



    I have lived in the UK for 6 years and can safely say that the Ford and GM have the UP contented versions of the American counterparts. One of the reason being that the UK Pound is far stronger then the US $ and there is more profit per car in UK for the US carmakers. Same applies to the BMW , MB and Audi . Even in rest of the Europe, cars are speced much highr then the American counterparts. Does not apply to top of the range BMW and MB which are of course only made in Germany.

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited November 2015
    Like most of the things nowadays products are primarily link to cost/s in whatever the market/s will bear, want etc. So there are more shades of gray, rather than either or.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    "Volkswagen AG said Tuesday that another 800,000 vehicles have overstated fuel efficiency – and that could cost the automaker another $2.2 billion.

    Most of the vehicles are diesel, but not all. VW said carbon dioxide levels “and thus the fuel consumption figures for some models were set too low during the CO2 certification process. The majority of the vehicles concerned have diesel engines.”

    VW admits to new problem in 800,000 cars
    (Detroit News)
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    "The United Nations climate change chief said on Tuesday she was "delighted" by the Volkswagen emissions cheating scandal because the company will now hasten manufacturing of electric and hybrid cars, speeding a global shift away from fossil fuels.

    Christiana Figueres, executive secretary of the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change, noted that Europe's largest carmaker has said it will expand production of electric and hybrid cars and said that was a silver lining to its cheating on diesel emissions tests."

    U.N. official 'delighted' at VW scandal, sees clean car 'revolution' (thefiscaltimes.com)

    Figueres is from Costa Rica.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Germany at least made diesel cars fun to drive, you have to give them that.
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    edited November 2015
    stever said:
    "The United Nations climate change chief said on Tuesday she was "delighted" by the Volkswagen emissions cheating scandal because the company will now hasten manufacturing of electric and hybrid cars, speeding a global shift away from fossill fuels.
    Figueres is from Costa Rica.
    Have they discovered Lithium ore in CR ?
    ;)
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    edited November 2015
    Cool, a coddled born at the top career public sector official with no engineering or hard scientific background is "delighted". People such as this are responsible for a lot of the headaches we enjoy today. And of course she also praises the most favored "partner".

    Interesting bio

  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Maybe VW should have hired more people from Swarthmore and the London School of Economics instead of Winterkorn (Ph. D in Metal Research and Metal Physics) or Ferdinand Piëch (mechanical engineering)?

    Of course, dieselgate has been blamed on software engineers. Oops, current CEO Müller studied computer engineering science.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Costa Rica does rank as one of the top environmentally conscious nations on earth---but not as high as Iceland and Switzerland.
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    Sometimes, but maybe not always. US cars are often spec'd less, but they also are often much cheaper. There are also lower spec variants in Euroland and Blighty not found in NA - can't get a manual cloth interior 4cyl E or 5er in Murka, but they are common in Europe. What gets me most is that Euro rental cars are usually spec'd much higher than US rental cars. Diesel rental cars in NA are virtually unknown, too.

    USA is a highly competitive and price sensitive market . So cars are priced and speced according to what the market can take. Same applies to rental cars. US rental rates are dirt cheap most times for mass market cars. Where in Europe can you rent a mid-size car for 25$ a day ?
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    edited November 2015
    Wow-does V-Dub now need ta raise diesel and ghastly powered car prices? They're taking a huge hit on the debit side of the ledger with all these charges against them.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    edited November 2015
    Costa Rica does rank as one of the top environmentally conscious nations on earth---but not as high as Iceland and Switzerland.
    You betcha !

    Only  industry they have is miles of lovely beaches . 
    Warren Buffet can buy the whole damn " country "  without breaking sweat :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    carboy21 said:


    stever said:

    "The United Nations climate change chief said on Tuesday she was "delighted" by the Volkswagen emissions cheating scandal because the company will now hasten manufacturing of electric and hybrid cars, speeding a global shift away from fossill fuels.
    Figueres is from Costa Rica.

    Have they discovered Lithuim ore in CR ?
    ;)

    Yep ! ( code for HELL NO! ) When asked to take one for the team, it's called NIMBY!
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    I don't know if I want a person with a degree in social anthropology doing anything with powertrain management. More rich bleeding heart SJWs at work, they've done so much for us all.

    Delighted...ugh.
    stever said:

    Maybe VW should have hired more people from Swarthmore and the London School of Economics instead of Winterkorn (Ph. D in Metal Research and Metal Physics) or Ferdinand Piëch (mechanical engineering)?

    Of course, dieselgate has been blamed on software engineers. Oops, current CEO Müller studied computer engineering science.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    edited November 2015
    Good one! I wonder what she thinks about the huge pollution caused by the materials necessary in electrics in hybrid. I suspect the answer is "no comment". I smell another one with a 20000 sq ft house and a private jet lecturing about being wasteful.
    ruking1 said:


    Have they discovered Lithuim ore in CR ?
    ;)

    Yep ! ( code for HELL NO! ) When asked to take one for the team, it's called NIMBY!

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    I think Europe is price sensitive too, at least outside of the company car racket. I also suspect the equipment level on the average car is still more in the US - at least on MB/BMW. A huge amount that is standard in NA is optional in Europe, and has been for a few decades. It was very apparent starting in the 80s.

    Of course, that US rental midsizer will also be a fleet-specific (minimal) spec if not a fleet specific model. I can usually rent a luxury car much cheaper in Europe than in the US too, so that evens out.
    carboy21 said:


    USA is a highly competitive and price sensitive market . So cars are priced and speced according to what the market can take. Same applies to rental cars. US rental rates are dirt cheap most times for mass market cars. Where in Europe can you rent a mid-size car for 25$ a day ?

  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    fintail said:

    Cool, a coddled born at the top career public sector official with no engineering or hard scientific background is "delighted". People such as this are responsible for a lot of the headaches we enjoy today. And of course she also praises the most favored "partner".

    Interesting bio

    I found that interesting as well. CR like Norway are blessed with lots of fast running rivers to exploit hydro power. Then Norway would be just another poor country if not for oil. Easy to be a self righteous politician when you have it all to start with. I wonder if her vehicle fleet was EV if CR would be able to handle the load?

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/30/truth-behind-costa-rica-renewable-energy-reservoirs-climate-change
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    "Porsche Cars North America, Inc. today decided, in view of the unexpected U.S. EPA notice received yesterday, to voluntarily discontinue sales of model year 2014 through 2016 Porsche Cayenne Diesel vehicles until further notice. We are working intensively to resolve this matter as soon as possible. Customers may continue to operate their vehicles normally."

    Porsche Cars North America Statement Regarding Voluntary Stop Sale of Porsche Cayenne Diesel Vehicles (prnewswire.com)
  • carboy21carboy21 Member Posts: 760
    Touareg and Q7 next ?
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    carboy21 said:
    Touareg and Q7 next ?
     Plus the A6 and the A7

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    yeah but he couldn't buy Switzerland :)
    carboy21 said:



    Costa Rica does rank as one of the top environmentally conscious nations on earth---but not as high as Iceland and Switzerland.

    You betcha !

    Only  industry they have is miles of lovely beaches . 
    Warren Buffet can buy the whole damn " country "  without breaking sweat :)

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!"
    stever said:

    "Porsche Cars North America, Inc. today decided, in view of the unexpected U.S. EPA notice received yesterday, to voluntarily discontinue sales of model year 2014 through 2016 Porsche Cayenne Diesel vehicles until further notice. We are working intensively to resolve this matter as soon as possible. Customers may continue to operate their vehicles normally."

    Porsche Cars North America Statement Regarding Voluntary Stop Sale of Porsche Cayenne Diesel Vehicles (prnewswire.com)

This discussion has been closed.