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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

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  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    qbrozen said:

    Warning: the BMS will void your warranty. Unless the dealers have started offering it, which would shock me.

    I had the BMS stage 1 on my 320 and never had an issue, I'm not worrying about the JB4.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    stickguy said:

    sounds like the car I would look at later in the year (the service loaner lease part). What did the before tax payment end up being on that?

    I rolled some negative cash from the 320 into this new car, the value of the 320 was falling, and wasn't going to get better.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 22,269
    edited June 27

    qbrozen said:

    Warning: the BMS will void your warranty. Unless the dealers have started offering it, which would shock me.

    I had the BMS stage 1 on my 320 and never had an issue, I'm not worrying about the JB4.
    Question is if it will void your warranty. And the answer is yes. At least as far as damage that may be related to it, such as the entire drivetrain.

    The BS about it being "undetectable" is just that. That was proven to me firsthand by my service advisor.

    '17 F150 Crew 2.7; '67 Coronet R/T; '14 Town&Country Limited; '09 LR2 HSE. 44-car history and counting!

  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,260
    qbrozen said:

    qbrozen said:

    Warning: the BMS will void your warranty. Unless the dealers have started offering it, which would shock me.

    I had the BMS stage 1 on my 320 and never had an issue, I'm not worrying about the JB4.
    Question is if it will void your warranty. And the answer is yes. At least as far as damage that may be related to it, such as the entire drivetrain.

    The BS about it being "undetectable" is just that. That was proven to me firsthand by my service advisor.
    The trick is finding a dealership and service advisers that ignore a TD1 flagging.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 22,269
    Mine was good about it and helped me get things fixed but he did say if the engine blows, for example, there isn't much they can do because corporate will inspect the computer and find out.

    '17 F150 Crew 2.7; '67 Coronet R/T; '14 Town&Country Limited; '09 LR2 HSE. 44-car history and counting!

  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    qbrozen said:



    Question is if it will void your warranty. And the answer is yes. At least as far as damage that may be related to it, such as the entire drivetrain.

    The BS about it being "undetectable" is just that. That was proven to me firsthand by my service advisor.

    There is always a change but my 320 and Ricks 328 hasn't had an issue, I don't plan on pushing more than the tune.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    Boy did this forum die....
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 66,625
    Along with the sedan...

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  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 61,475
    In the interest of reviving this thread, I pose a hypothetical.

    In 2-3 years I could be in the market for a CPO ELLPS - what do you recommend?

    Audi A4
    BMW 3-series
    MB C-class
    Something else?

    Figure I'd be looking at 2017 or 2018 MY.

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    2016 VW Jetta 1.4T SE / 2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 22,269
    edited October 15
    Q50
    S60

    '17 F150 Crew 2.7; '67 Coronet R/T; '14 Town&Country Limited; '09 LR2 HSE. 44-car history and counting!

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 10,389
    Michaell said:

    In the interest of reviving this thread, I pose a hypothetical.

    In 2-3 years I could be in the market for a CPO ELLPS - what do you recommend?

    Audi A4
    BMW 3-series
    MB C-class
    Something else?

    Figure I'd be looking at 2017 or 2018 MY.

    Drive them all and buy what YOU like. I want a RWD, car, so that biases my choices

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport / 2014 M235i / 1999 Wrangler / 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2016 i3 REX/2009 Cooper Clubman Son's: 2009 328i

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 25,710
    C class is really really nice.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 61,475
    stickguy said:

    C class is really really nice.

    Yeah, I've been admiring them lately.

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  • carnaughtcarnaught 'zonaPosts: 2,366
    edited October 15
    You pretty much can’t go wrong with all of the above. The only thing I have against a 3-Series is that they haven’t changed much, and the interior has remained essentially the same through the years. Still wouldn’t throw it out of bed for eating crackers. It’s all personal choice.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    carnaught said:

    You pretty much can’t go wrong with all of the above. The only thing I have against a 3-Series is that they haven’t changed much, and the interior has remained essentially the same through the years. Still wouldn’t throw it out of bed for eating crackers. It’s all personal choice.

    Your statement is completely wrong, The 3 series has changed where it was needed, with the new B46 engine I feel it is a lot more fun to drive as the torque is lower in the rev band. The small changes to the interior and iDrive software has been an improvement.
  • carnaughtcarnaught 'zonaPosts: 2,366
    edited October 16
    @flightnurse, no doubt that the 3-Series BMW’s are being improved. With regard to my expressed opinion, I’m talking about looks. I know you’re BMW guy; no offense intended.
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 4,615
    I just bought 2018 430i Gran Coupe. Keen eye would see subtle difference with the 330 sedan, but from a distance they both look similar. BMW has made a decent progress in addressing my largest complaint, i.e. steering wheel and suspension feel. It's not quite as heavy as my previous 2018 328, but it got to the area where it's no longer Buick. The interior is improved, the stitched plastic dashboard cover is a nice touch. One thing that feels really old and tired, are the speedometer and odometer. Almost the same as they were 10 years ago, which were almost the same as those 10 years prior that. I even joke that those BMW designers obsess about their engine, transmission and everything else, then three weeks before launch they suddenly realize that they need a new dashboard, so they stick the old one, again.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    carnaught said:

    @flightnurse, no doubt that the 3-Series BMW’s are being improved. With regard to my expressed opinion, I’m talking about looks. I know you’re BMW guy; no offense intended.

    When it comes to looks, you can tell BMW is playing it safe, the look is evolution and bold and in your face like what Acura had done to the TL, I think the BMW is a handsome sedan. I'm not 100% sold on the new C class but like the looks of the A4.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 2,077
    dino001 said:

    I just bought 2018 430i Gran Coupe. Keen eye would see subtle difference with the 330 sedan, but from a distance they both look similar. BMW has made a decent progress in addressing my largest complaint, i.e. steering wheel and suspension feel. It's not quite as heavy as my previous 2018 328, but it got to the area where it's no longer Buick. The interior is improved, the stitched plastic dashboard cover is a nice touch. One thing that feels really old and tired, are the speedometer and odometer. Almost the same as they were 10 years ago, which were almost the same as those 10 years prior that. I even joke that those BMW designers obsess about their engine, transmission and everything else, then three weeks before launch they suddenly realize that they need a new dashboard, so they stick the old one, again.

    Congrats on the 430, so you went with the 8 Spd auto, how you like it? I'm still leaning towards a 440 GC next.
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 4,615
    edited October 16
    I went with auto, cause there wasn't anything else available with GC. When I was preparing to change from my wagon, I made peace with AT as my next transmissions already some time ago. I decided that the form factor (body type) with equipment and color were more important than the transmission. The transmission is alright - very responsive, efficient, seamless. It isn't manual, but it will do.

    I thought I wanted 435, then 440 GC all that time until I spent some good time with the 430/330, got to play with the sport/sport+ modes and became convinced to keep the money, both in the purchase and at the pump. For me it's good enough. I think I'm already past the "got to have the horses" stage. There is minimum I want/need, of course, probably higher than the market average, but 430 is quite enough.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • pensfan83pensfan83 PennsylvaniaPosts: 352
    Aside from a 3 year stint with the Fusion I've had a manual for the better part of the last 15 years, granted not as long as some here but long enough that was very accustomed to the enjoyment of rowing my own gears. I lucked out in 2014 when it came to the A4 however this time my dealer had no manual A4's in stock and no immediate plans to order any, my salesman said they sell on average less than 4-5 per year and most times they sit waiting for a buyers like folks on this board, who are becoming rarer by the day. Like @dino001 I resigned myself to the fact the next car was going to be an auto, which opened up many more options because finding a manual entry level luxury car is like finding hen's teeth. It did also open up another vehicle for my wife to drive, who was confined to her Altima the last 3 years.
    2018 Acura TLX A-Spec SH-AWD, 2014 Nissan Altima 3.5SL
  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 10,389
    edited October 16
    I've come to the point where I prefer manuals in cars that really need one- those with engines that need to be wound out to make significant power, like my Club Sport. With engines that make peak torque from 1300-4500 rpm-such as the N55 and B58-I prefer theZF 8HP; it shifts quickly, rev matches, and has a true manual mode.
    That said, I'm not all that enamored by the DCTs in the M cars; if I was going to replace my M235i; I'd go with an M240i if I wanted two pedals and an M2 if I wanted three...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport / 2014 M235i / 1999 Wrangler / 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2016 i3 REX/2009 Cooper Clubman Son's: 2009 328i

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 57,839
    That's my feeling. If you don't need to work the stick, then don't buy the stick.

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  • laurasdadalaurasdada Posts: 3,101
    Michaell, since shopping is free and fun, and you never know which dealer will have free food!, why not visit your local Jag dealer too, and check out the XE? Good driving from what I've read, interior may not be up to snuff (more performance than lux). But, only you can decide what floats your boat.

    Re: BMW, its Motor Works, not Style Works (roughly translated).

    '13 Jaguar XF, possibly my favorite of all the cars I've owned. But, my '09 Jag XK was a beauty, as was my '05 Acura TL, '88 Acura Integra, '84 Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo & '78 VW Scirocco (my first!). And, of course, the '92 Nissan Sentra SE-R and '95 Saab 900s I bought for the ex... Ok, I like a lot of the cars in my life.

  • ab348ab348 Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, CanadaPosts: 6,555

    Michaell, since shopping is free and fun, and you never know which dealer will have free food!

    That is something that sadly has gone away here in recent years. There was one GM dealer in particular that always had free food on offer. It changed ownership and that is now gone.

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6, 1968 Oldsmobile Cutlass S Holiday Coupe

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 25,710
    we looked at a used Jag XF (2013) Wednesday. Wife was not impressed by the interior (I found the seats fantastic, her less so, but mostly because is was that odd orange color). But the part she found oddest was when I finally figured out how to put the AC on, and the vents rotated open and close. Just seems like a solution to a problem that did not exist, and one more thing to break (expensively).

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,260

    I've come to the point where I prefer manuals in cars that really need one- those with engines that need to be wound out to make significant power, like my Club Sport. With engines that make peak torque from 1300-4500 rpm-such as the N55 and B58-I prefer theZF 8HP; it shifts quickly, rev matches, and has a true manual mode.
    That said, I'm not all that enamored by the DCTs in the M cars; if I was going to replace my M235i; I'd go with an M240i if I wanted two pedals and an M2 if I wanted three...

    I don't have any experience with BMW's DCT's. I heard the early ones a long time ago were lackluster to put it nicely, but I thought they had made vast improvements? What would be your "complaint" list on the current crop of the latest and greatest DCT's from BMW?
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 10,389
    They are okay onde you are on the move, but they are a bit laggy at low speeds and when shifting from forward to reverse.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport / 2014 M235i / 1999 Wrangler / 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2016 i3 REX/2009 Cooper Clubman Son's: 2009 328i

  • john4545john4545 Posts: 40
    Mazda6 handling vs BMW 330 . Does Mazda6 have a leg to stand on?? Love to see the 6 in a manual? I thought the 17 Mazda's handling was superb
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,260
    john4545 said:

    Mazda6 handling vs BMW 330 . Does Mazda6 have a leg to stand on?? Love to see the 6 in a manual? I thought the 17 Mazda's handling was superb

    I'd imagine if the Mazda 6 was given an upgraded wheel/tire size it would hang as long as horsepower was previously agreed to not be used.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
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