Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

nyccarguy · June 2018

"the sales kid didn't know the difference in the tranny's" Good thing too, otherwise things could have really gotten wacky.

Family forums. Let's keep things G rated here please!

stickguy · June 2018

The Sentra is a pretty good looking compact. And the turbo 6 speed combo, along with the suspension and tire upgrades, should improve on the weak spots. And if you like it, all that really matters.

graphicguy · June 2018

OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.

qbrozen · June 2018

@iluvmysephia1
what the heck is an "OBII canister"??
I hope someone didn't sell you that one time along with headlight fluid and exhaust realignment.

fintail · June 2018

Iluv, if you are set on a Sentra, try to get a sportier one with the nicer wheels etc, less of a rental car look.

Speaking of vacuums, about 10 years ago I bought a Hoover Widepath something or other, I chose it because it was supposedly heavy duty, used by people who clean for a living. It is bagless, but somewhat heavy and definitely not flashy. A decade later, and it still works like new, and it wasn't terribly expensive. When I was a kid, my mom bought an expensive Panasonic vacuum (I think because our neighbor owned the local store), she got about 20 years out of it. My grandma still has a 50s era Kirby, but I think it is too heavy for her to use much anymore. There are still quality products out there.

tjc78 · June 2018

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.

Appliances can really suck these days... I put in all Kenmore stuff in 2010. Fridge is made by LG, DW by Whirlpool, Range by ??, and Microwave by ??..

Every single one has some sort of thing going on. Ice Maker in the Fridge is iffy (has to be reset every few weeks and sometimes drips inside freezer), Microwave turntable works when it wants to, DW front panel seems loose. They all function and look new, but I'm so leary.

I think in the next two - three years I'll just bite the bullet and replace it all before it all goes haywire.

houdini1 · June 2018

qbrozen said:
@iluvmysephia1
what the heck is an "OBII canister"??
I hope someone didn't sell you that one time along with headlight fluid and exhaust realignment.

I think it is the ozone canister and freshens the stale air in your tires from time to time.

houdini1 · June 2018

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.

I don't know much about dishwashers, but I know a lot of jokes about vinegar and water !!

suydam · June 2018

That is really a pain when an expensive item goes bad. I’ve had a Bosch for two years now and I really like it. It has a good reputation, but so did Kitchenaid. I had a Kitchenaid previously. It had a faulty wiring problem, replaced under warranty. Still working fine when we moved. The Bosch is quieter, a big plus in a tiny condo.
Unless you spring for a service contract (which I don’t), you do wind up getting hosed if an expensive part fails. Touchscreens seem to be tricky on lots of appliances. At least a new one should be quieter and more energy efficient.

berri · June 2018

I think the China factor has kind of changed the equation with appliances. They are not usually cost effective to repair and tend to not last as long as they used to, so I don't go after the premium priced ones anymore since they have just become disposable as well.

henryn · June 2018

I don’t use a dishwasher, or perhaps I should say I am my own dishwasher. When I bought this house in 2011, there was a dishwasher, and I did try it. The front seal is bad, it leaks, so I just made it into storage for my pots and pans. Living alone, and not being much of a cook, there aren’t that many dirty dishes anyway.

Back in 2011 when I bought the house, I needed a stove, refrigerator, washer and dryer. I purchased everything used, from individuals, off Craigslist. The dryer and the stove have been perfect, I have made two small repairs to the washing machine, and paid for one repair to the refrigerator. I found a guy on Craigslist who does not have a storefront, works out of an old van, and repairs appliances. He came over the same day, took about 15 minutes to replace one small part on the refrigerator, and I paid him $110 in cash. He’s happy, I’m happy, and the refrigerator is still humming along more than 3 years later.

The same with my garage door. I “bumped it” with the truck about 4 years ago (don’t ask). I talked to two guys from Angie’s list, they wanted about $850 without an opener, $1200 with. I found a guy on Craigslist, he and his 2 brothers (I think they were brothers) showed up and installed a new garage door and opener (same brand name as the more expensive quotes), for $800 in cash. I had to use the translation software on my computer for part of the negotiations, but I’m happy, they’re happy, life marches on.

stickguy · June 2018

Darn. I have a kitchen aid DW too. At least a top rack is easier than electronics. Ours was really pricey because we got panel ready. Nor sure I would bother with that again, at twice the price. Certainly not since I hope to move in near future. Not thinking the ROI will be there. Though I do have the panel.

Fixing the broken part hopefully is easy. Eventually will get around to it. Until then, constant reminders to wife to be careful yanking the rack out. She’s the one that broke it in the first place

stickguy · June 2018

We replaced the range this year, and fridge maybe 2 years ago. So only DW left in the kitchen that is older.

oldfarmer50 · June 2018

explorerx4 said:
Decided to put the truck in the garage so the plumber doesn't see it.
I had to turn it a bit to the left so the fridge could open.
I'm ok him seeing the 'Old Man Gray' Fusion.
You can just see the windshield frame of the Mustang in the center of the lower side window opening.

Were you afraid that if he saw your expensive truck that his price would go up?

Last year when I had a plumber over fixing a pipe he noticed the Mustang right away. Fortunately he had already quoted a price.

graphicguy · June 2018

Not going to offer any other comment other than I totally support Harley Davidson and will do what I can (as a non-Harley owner) to make certain they are viable in the midst of the attacks they’re now suffering.

As a motorcycle lover, particularly American made motorcycles, I hope they can weather this assault without having to compromise their integrity.

imidazol97 · June 2018

It's easy to get parts for my appliances. I can go to Whirlpool.com and fuss around on the page and they will have a manual that shows the parts, IIRC. I search for those parts numbers on the internet to find if anyone is selling them cheaper than the whirlpool approved parts house which links you to repairclinic.com in Canton, MI. I assume other brands have similar access as well.

As to Kitchenaid same applies. Made by Whirlpool. The cable with the corrosion may be available at repairclinic.com or other parts houses. Repair Clinic has a $9.95 delivery charge.

@graphicguy
Try cleaning the corrosion with Dawn detergent ro remove greasy residue, then vinegar. See if the connection works then. Since washing with water (bicarbonate of soda may have helped a little), caused the connector contacts to lose other links, that may the whole source of your problem.

I bought extra door shelves for my Whirlpool on Amazon.

Searching the net may give you repair manuals telling how to take some appliances apart. There is a service diagnostic computer run. This blog entry on applianceblog.com mentions it. If you can search for your model number and find the service manual or a web site with the procedure and diagnostic codes, that might help. Soft of like troubleshooting a computer by the number of beeps when it would try to start up as an indication of what was not getting read correctly in old days.

https://www.kitchenaidparts.com/

https://www.repairclinic.com/UserManual/ffa437db24404318a693f64084009cba/KitchenAid-Dishwasher-Repair-Manual-KUDC02IRBL1-KUDC02IRWH1-KUDI02CRBL1-KUDI02CRBS1-KUDI02CRWH1-KUDI02FRBL1-KUDI02FRSS1-KUDI02FRWH1-KUDI02IRBL1-KUDI02IRBS1

The diagnostic procedure has to be run after parts replacement to "register" the parts with the main control computer. The guy on applianceblog.com sometimes links to a repair manual that service techs use.

The information for the diagnostic codes and procedure may be in the parts diagram that's in your dishwasher. Likely it's behind the lower panel that covers the bottom area after installation. Taped to it. Has parts blow up and then current part numbers and diag for the serviceguy.

https://www.applianceblog.com/mainforums/threads/65691-KUDC10FXSS5-control-panel-not-working

snakeweasel · June 2018

fintail said:

Iluv, if you are set on a Sentra, try to get a sportier one with the nicer wheels etc, less of a rental car look. Speaking of vacuums, about 10 years ago I bought a Hoover Widepath something or other, I chose it because it was supposedly heavy duty, used by people who clean for a living. It is bagless, but somewhat heavy and definitely not flashy. A decade later, and it still works like new, and it wasn't terribly expensive. When I was a kid, my mom bought an expensive Panasonic vacuum (I think because our neighbor owned the local store), she got about 20 years out of it. My grandma still has a 50s era Kirby, but I think it is too heavy for her to use much anymore. There are still quality products out there.

We bought a Kirby, spent a lot of money for it but 20 years later it's still going strong. it's a good rug sucker.

coldinohio · June 2018

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.

we replaced KA with 800 series bosch last month; 40dB quiet is new bosch so huge difference. wifey wanted fancy 3rd rack so went with 800 series vs 500. no issues so far; got it at local appliance store as ~$50 more than Best bye and the local store repair depart is excellent... if you want to spend >$1500 on a DW would get a Miele-- all German; bosch is German designed with most parts /assembly in US ...there is a car analogy there....

henryn · June 2018

snakeweasel said:

We bought a Kirby, spent a lot of money for it but 20 years later it's still going strong. it's a good rug sucker.

I might have sold you that Kirby!

No, 20 years is not long enough. I sold Kirby vacuum cleaners door-to-door for a few months while I was in college, back around 1971. So more like 47 years, not 20. They were good products, I just wasn't much of a salesman, never was.

iluvmysephia1 · June 2018

what the heck is an "OBII canister"??
I hope someone didn't sell you that one time along with headlight fluid and exhaust realignment.

Nah. I meant an OBDII. Credit for being ~~somewhat~~ close on that?

And no, never need an OBDII replaced in any of my rigs. I'm thinking plugs, plug wires and an oil change. My air filter's probably dirty, too, as I'm living in a hot and dusty environment over here.

28firefighter · June 2018

Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?

snakeweasel · June 2018

henryn said:

We bought a Kirby, spent a lot of money for it but 20 years later it's still going strong. it's a good rug sucker.
I might have sold you that Kirby! No, 20 years is not long enough. I sold Kirby vacuum cleaners door-to-door for a few months while I was in college, back around 1971. So more like 47 years, not 20. They were good products, I just wasn't much of a salesman, never was.

I sold vacuums in college too, I was pretty good at it. I just didn't like their business model so I didn't stay long, but I made some good money at it while I lasted.

stickguy · June 2018

Thanks for link to parts. First I need to take it apart, and figure out what needs replacing.

henryn · June 2018

28firefighter said:
Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?

Not properly torqued, or not even put back on at all.

That damage sounds a bit excessive. I would believe the wheel and the tire, maybe the hub and the rotor. Maybe.

stickguy · June 2018

28firefighter said:
Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?

Odd. Either that, or they put one on to hold the wheel, and forgot the rest. Either way, the installer screwed up and is lucky only the car damaged and nobody got hurt.

28firefighter · June 2018

The drive home was at an average speed 70 mph on roads that are in less than stellar shape. The extent of the damage is not surprising in the least.

henryn · June 2018

28firefighter said:
The drive home was at an average speed 70 mph on roads that are in less than stellar shape. The extent of the damage is not surprising in the least.

Back 40 years ago I had a similar experience. It was a rear wheel, and the only real damage was to the wheel. Of course, I noticed the vibration rather quickly and pulled over. The holes for the lug bolts were wallowed out a bit, no other damage.

pensfan83 · June 2018

snakeweasel said:
We bought a Kirby, spent a lot of money for it but 20 years later it's still going strong. it's a good rug sucker.

Up until about a year ago our primary vacuum was a Kirby hailing from the mid-80's. It was my paternal grandmother's and I inherited it after she died. It's held up remarkably well needing nothing more than a maintenance check/cleaning every few years. It's a heavy, bulky thing though so it's been relegated to basement duty and we picked up a Shark vacuum for the rest of the house since it's lighter and compatible with tile and hardwood.

oldfarmer50 · June 2018

fintail said:
I forget, are you working at an auction or rental fleet?

Idrive is the name of the infotaimment system. On a prior gen 7er I rented in Germany, the buttons to disable the lane nannies etc are at lower left, near the headlight switch.

oldfarmer50 said:

I had the pleasure of driving a 2018 BMW 740i with 800 miles on the clock. What a marvelous car. It took me 5 minutes to get it in gear and only then after the car told me how. (I could almost hear a stern German voice scolding my ineptitude). Another 10 minutes to tune the radio and I was off.

The only down side was some sort of lane minder nanny that vibrated when you got close to the lines on the side of the road. It went off constantly on the narrow roads I was driving. Very annoying and I couldn't figure out how to turn it off.

I transport for Enterprise like Sandy does for Hertz. I get to drive a plethora of cars and receive pay to sleep half the time.

graphicguy · June 2018

coldinohio said:

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.
we replaced KA with 800 series bosch last month; 40dB quiet is new bosch so huge difference. wifey wanted fancy 3rd rack so went with 800 series vs 500. no issues so far; got it at local appliance store as ~$50 more than Best bye and the local store repair depart is excellent... if you want to spend >$1500 on a DW would get a Miele-- all German; bosch is German designed with most parts /assembly in US ...there is a car analogy there....

Thanks for the first hand experience. Don't think I want to drop $1,500, or even $1,000 on a dishwasher. I'll look at the model you suggested. I hear the Bosch's don't dry very well. What is you experience?

I walk into an appliance store and see rows of boxes which mostly look identical. How old was your KA?

jmonroe · June 2018

28firefighter said:
Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?

You have probably heard me say this in here before. I NEVER leave a lot that has touched my wheels, like a PA inspection station or tire place without checking all 5 lug nuts on all 4 wheels. I have found lug nuts over tightened a couple of times and marched back into the desk at tire shops and complained. One time the guy said something like, "why are you checking them. Do you have a torque wrench or what"? My response was, "no I don't have a torque wrench and I don't think you guys have one either".

Years ago, back in my working days, A fellow worker laughed when I told him what I do when someone touches my wheels. He said I should deal with a more reputable inspection stations and tire shops. About 10 years later when I returned as a consultant, another fellow employee told me that this guy was coming down a ramp, about to merge onto an interstate, just after getting his car inspected, when his car started shaking violently like you described. I guess his inspection mechanic wasn't as good as he thought he was. So far, I'm as good at checking lug nuts as I ever was.

It only takes a couple minutes, if that, to check the lug nuts so I ALWAYS check them. Learning how to change a flat tire when I was a kid has come in handy in more ways than just changing a flat tire.

Good to hear that no one was injured.

FWIW, I've also passed my paranoia onto my sons.

jmonroe

roadburner · June 2018

iluvmysephia1 said:

what the heck is an "OBII canister"?? I hope someone didn't sell you that one time along with headlight fluid and exhaust realignment. Nah. I meant an OBDII. Credit for being ~~somewhat~~ close on that? And no, never need an OBDII replaced in any of my rigs. I'm thinking plugs, plug wires and an oil change. My air filter's probably dirty, too, as I'm living in a hot and dusty environment over here.

FYI, OBDII is an emissions control standard- not a replacement part.

roadburner · June 2018

jmonroe said:

Folks, I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen). Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership. On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car. I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?
You have probably heard me say this in here before. I NEVER leave a lot that has touched my wheels, like a PA inspection station or tire place without checking all 5 lug nuts on all 4 wheels. I have found lug nuts over tightened a couple of times and marched back into the desk at tire shops and complained. One time the guy said something like, "why are you checking them. Do you have a torque wrench or what"? My response was, "no I don't have a torque wrench and I don't think you guys have one either". Years ago, back in my working days, A fellow worker laughed when I told him what I do when someone touches my wheels. He said I should deal with a more reputable inspection stations and tire shops. About 10 years later when I returned as a consultant, another fellow employee told me that this guy was coming down a ramp, about to merge onto an interstate, just after getting his car inspected, when his car started shaking violently like you described. I guess his inspection mechanic wasn't as good as he thought he was. So far, I'm as good at checking lug nuts as I ever was. It only takes a couple minutes, if that, to check the lug nuts so I ALWAYS check them. Learning how to change a flat tire when I was a kid has come in handy in more ways than just changing a flat tire. Good to hear that no one was injured. FWIW, I've also passed my paranoia onto my sons. jmonroe

Whatever you do ,DO NOT repost that comment in the “Tales From Under the Hood” topic unless you want a lecture about how professional technicians NEVER make mistakes...

Mr_Shiftright · June 2018

suydam said:

imidazol97 said:
The debate on whether electric cars are more enegy efficient over the life of the vehicle, building, using, and disposal.

A study has found electric vehicles manufactured by Tesla are no better for the environment than diesel or petrol-fueled cars.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-5880609/Tesla-electric-cars-not-greener-petrol-ones-according-UK-data.html

According to the article, that’s in the UK, and it’s because the UK gets half of its electricity from coal and gas.

U.S. gets about 63% of its electricity from fossil fuels, 20% from nukes and 17% from renewables.

henryn · June 2018

jmonroe said:

You have probably heard me say this in here before. I NEVER leave a lot that has touched my wheels, like a PA inspection station or tire place without checking all 5 lug nuts on all 4 wheels. I have found lug nuts over tightened a couple of times and marched back into the desk at tire shops and complained. One time the guy said something like, "why are you checking them. Do you have a torque wrench or what"? My response was, "no I don't have a torque wrench and I don't think you guys have one either".

jmonroe

Okay, I'll bite. Exactly how do you check the torque on a lug nut without a torque wrench?

Granted, it's easy to see if they left off any of the lug nuts. But checking the torque? Do you take your lug wrench, loosen, and re-tighten?

I could use that method to tell if they were really loose, or way too tight, but anything in between ...

Mr_Shiftright · June 2018

graphicguy said:
I saw the news about Harley moving manufacturing out of the U.S.

I'm sad to hear this given their long and storied history here. And, it's so unnecessary, but their hand was forced.

The motorcycle industry as a whole as been in a slump, and this just makes it worse for Harley. . Current American trade policy is incoherent.

oldfarmer50 · June 2018

iluvmysephia1 said:
https://youtu.be/NtdiE3V8a78

This may be an acquired taste - it has taken a while to take it all in and pine after it. Mrs.iluvmysephia1 is willing to appease my car tastes if I choose to take my Boeing pension payment in a year and 2 months from now - save the payments up for a year and just go pay cash for my new ta me car.

She listens to Dave Ramsey and he's all about paying cash for everything. Hey, ta just get the Mrs. talking about new ta us car purchases is making real progress. I have researched pretty well on the Nissan - I can wait a year for perhaps an '18 Nissan Sentra model - a Turbo-charged 6-speed model would already have the sweet wheels on it - or a base S model I could dress up with wheels and save the $4,000 it would cost me extra. It's just that the Turbo model has the foglights and several different cool touches to it that I would definitely dig. I can wait 14 months - perhaps drive to Albuquerque or El Paso to Viva Nissan - the Nissan branch of Viva Kia that we traded in the '08 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS for.

Heck, I don't know if any of you on here remember how I used to promote Kia's, Hyundai's and Daewoo-Chevy's on here pretty much fully completely. I've gone Korean and now Japanese now.

And I learned to drive stick on a '66 VW Fastback that I loved dearly. I got in two accidents in that car - one a lady rushing to a pottery class in Perrinville, WA, brushed the side of Dad's VW Fastback. Her fault and she admitted it. The next accident was fully my fault. I tried a donut and acceleration in an inch and a half of Washington state snow. Dumb, goofy move. We hit a boulder and ruined the front end of Dad's '66 VW Fastback. He had it towed to a shop and they fixed it all up real well. Dad never said a word about it to me!

I really like the Sentra in red but silver or white is probably what I'll get. The gunmetal grey would also work, as is in the Sentra front view of the post of mine above. It's all about the Nissan Sentra now. It's just which color, which model and which dealership I choose ta deal with. And the timing - I bought the 2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS on a Saturday afternoon in March of 2007. I had already decided to deal for it - I called them and they said that they had a 5-speed '08 Lancer GTS on their lot selling for $18,995. I said "great - I'll come up and buy it."

I got there and it was a CVT automatic - the sales kid didn't know the difference in the tranny's! I still bought the CVT Lancer GTS. It ended up paying off during a Jan. 2011 move from Elko, NV, to Kellogg, ID, as far as convenience goes. I drove the Mrs. and our stuff in the '15 U-Haul truck and our son drove our '08 Lancer GTS - he can drive an automatic tranny but not a stick - he ended up doing a complete 180 degree turn on westbound Highway 90 heading west out of Montana on Lookout Pass into eastern Idaho. Luckily the approaching semitruck from behind him also going westbound came to a stop in the icy snow and waited for him ta turn around and point westward again! Oh the automobile stories!!! New automobile quality just gets better and better!

Nothing wrong with the looks of the Sentra. I still prefer the Altima but until it's my money, you get to chose. My SIL had two Sentras, a 2000 that got t-boned and a 2012 which she was going to sell but decided to take to Florida with her instead. Liked it that much.

On the financing if you will take a hit on your pension by receiving it early might I suggest taking out a low interest credit union loan for say 60 months and then when your pension matures pay the note off quickly. My CU is still at 2.59% for 60 months.

coldinohio · June 2018

graphicguy said:

coldinohio said:

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.
we replaced KA with 800 series bosch last month; 40dB quiet is new bosch so huge difference. wifey wanted fancy 3rd rack so went with 800 series vs 500. no issues so far; got it at local appliance store as ~$50 more than Best bye and the local store repair depart is excellent... if you want to spend >$1500 on a DW would get a Miele-- all German; bosch is German designed with most parts /assembly in US ...there is a car analogy there....
Thanks for the first hand experience. Don't think I want to drop $1,500, or even $1,000 on a dishwasher. I'll look at the model you suggested. I hear the Bosch's don't dry very well. What is you experience?

I walk into an appliance store and see rows of boxes which mostly look identical. How old was your KA?

i would look at a 500 series; Bosch do not dry well as not real dry cycle as i understand, but we run ours in evening and open it overnight so dishes are dry in AM; as quiet, does not interrupt conversations, etc.

KA was 10 years, worked OK but need two new racks and fixing the dispensor...

an older appliance guy at lowes said he preferred Bosch or KA to others; Bosch has > 50% US market and has better parts availability than KA; the independent we used service all brands and suggest Miele or Bosch

good luck

how is ASpec ?

iluvmysephia1 · June 2018

Nothing wrong with the looks of the Sentra. I still prefer the Altima but until it's my money, you get to chose. My SIL had two Sentras, a 2000 that got t-boned and a 2012 which she was going to sell but decided to take to Florida with her instead. Liked it that much.

On the financing if you will take a hit on your pension by receiving it early might I suggest taking out a low interest credit union loan for say 60 months and then when your pension matures pay the note off quickly. My CU is still at 2.59% for 60 months.

Thank you, oldfarmer50, yeah, since I have time to consider several car options as well as payment methods, I will take that into consideration. We're just lately starting to talk about when I should start drawing the Boeing pension, so there's room for improvement in there for our purchase plan. I am still thinking I want a new or newer car, but I do have an online Kia friend from Michigan whose Mom had a Kia Spectra, probably 2002 era or so, that she drove for over 600,000 miles. I kid you not. I can ask him the Spectra MY. I'm telling you guys, Kia makes a solid rig. I may not need another car, we shall see.

I'm not gonna lunge at anything too quickly.

oldfarmer50 · June 2018

28firefighter said:
Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?

Had the same thing happen after a Midas Muffler brake job years ago. Luckly? It was both front wheels and so noticeable that I stopped soon after pulling out. Hand tightened everything and then limped back to the store where the manager shrugged it off as "not that bad". Urge to kill was immense because of the attitude.

Unfortunately, unless the wheel fell of or caused some damage to the car there's not much you can do legally. Back when it happened to me there was no Yelp or other social media to trash a bad business. Flame the heck out of this place and email him to tell him why.

EDIT: didn't read down to where you mentioned damage. In this case I would have the person's repair facility document the damage in writing and with pictures. Submit the bill to the offending store and sue in small claims if they won't pony up. After you get the money then burn them on social media.

iluvmysephia1 · June 2018

FYI, OBDII is an emissions control standard- not a replacement part.

roadburner - thanks for that. I have lots of room for improvement when it comes to new (er) car mechanicals!

jmonroe · June 2018

graphicguy said:
OK.....chalk this one up to “I think I’m smarter than I really am”.

Several months ago, my fridge went on the brink. Fix or kick it out the door was my decision. I decided on a new one, given the old one needed an expensive part (compressor), but really wasn’t that old.

Now, it’s the dishwasher’s turn. I bought it 8 years ago, and at the time, was one of the best I could find....Kitchenaid, all stainless, touch panel controls. Not cheap (I think $800 at the time).

Fast forward to today, the touch panel is getting glitchy. Called Kitchenaid support (there’s irony in that statement). They said to clean the touch panel with 50-50 mix of vinegar and water. Done....5 times. Still no help.

Finally, thinking I am not going to eat the cost of a new dishwasher, I call a repair service.....$189 flat fee for any problem, plus parts. OK.....new touch panel is around $200 + $189 = $389. Yowza. Repair guy tells me this particular touch panel for Kitchenaid dishwashers (and presumably for any dishwasher by Whirlpool that uses it) has been problematic and I probably will be replacing it again in a few years. Harrumph.

I decide, after looking at YouTube videos, I can do this myself. Two screws to remove the top of the dishwasher to get to the touch panel. 8 more srews to remove the front stainless panel to get to the “plug” for the touch panel. Easy-peezy!

Not so fast. Removed the front panel and it’s clear there’s more to the problem than just the touch panel. There’s corrosion around the connector.. I take out the touchpad, clean the corrosion with baking soda and water, put it back together. Now, it doesn’t work at all. And, I have no idea what caused the corrosion.

Long and short of this, I’m tired of fooling with it. I could spend $400 to have a pro do it, but I still am faced with a panel that will probably fail sooner than later.

OK, new one is what I’m looking for. Lowes and Best Buy are offering free installation on their Bosch dishwashers. I’m not doing Kitchenaid, again.

Who out there knows anything about the reliability and performance of Bosch Dishwashers. Consumer reports likes them, but the end user reviews about them aren’t inspiring.

To make a looong story short, we had a Kenmore with a touch panel stop working when it was about 3 months out of warranty. We got it when we did the kitchen upgrade in January of 2010. I called the Sears main service number and they said since I refused the extended warranty plan I was on my own. I then called a local a local appliance place that sells and services appliances. I talked to the service guy and he agreed that it was either the touch panel or control module. He goes onto say that if I buy the part that isn't bad, I can't return. He said he has the advantage that I don't have because if he puts in the part that isn't bad he just puts in the other one and the problem is solved. He then says, "if I had to bet, I'd say it's the touch panel". Then he says, "try this. Get you wife's hair dryer and wave it back and forth across the entire touch panel for a few minutes, being sure not to melt the panel. This will drive out any moisture in there if that is the problem. It's worked for me several times. It's worth a try". Being the inquisitive type I said, "how does the moisture get out"? He said the same way it got in there". Guess what? It worked and when Mrs. j got home I showed her my handy work. I told her all I have to do is do this whenever it acts up.

Fortunately, I never had to do it again. The appliance dept. manager at the Sears store where we bought the DW agreed to replace it at full price including tax towards another DW of our choosing. Decided not to get another touch panel job so we got a Samsung with real buttons. No button failures yet but the main pump had to be replaced a second time within a month of the first try. This was about 5 years ago.

In my opinion, dishwashers are the least reliable appliances to have but since I ain't gonna wash dishes, I buy them. When we got the Samsung, I bought an extended warranty and it paid off with the pump replacements. It bugged the hell out of me to buy it but like I said it has paid for itself and I will probably buy another warranty for the next DW too.

Do like the service guy I talked to suggested. Get out a hair dryer and try it. It can't hurt. You can't break it twice.

jmonroe

28firefighter · June 2018

Update: Dealer is not denying fault so far and they're agreeing to pay for all damage. For the time being I'm going to leave the specifics of who/what/where/brand etc.

graphicguy · June 2018

JM...thanks! Just tried the hair dryer on the touch panel. Still no go.

Appreciate the advice, though!

jmonroe · June 2018

roadburner said:

jmonroe said:

Folks,

I need some car expertise here - I'll share the whole story after I hear your thoughts (I'm looking at you @jmonroe and @qbrozen).

Person picks up a nail in the tire of their SUV. Dealer patches it temporarily, but tells person that it won't last and they need to replace the tire. No problem - person orders tire and picks it up at Tire Rack distribution center and then takes it to a local dealer for the vehicle brand and has it installed. About 50 miles later on the way home, vehicle starts shaking violently and is so unstable person pulls over. Vehicle is flatbed to the person's preferred and local dealership.

On arrival, is informed that 4 of 5 lugs are missing, the wheel, tire, hub, front brakes, and front suspension are trashed and that person is lucky the wheel didn't fly off the car.

I'm thinking the lugs weren't properly torqued and vibrated right out. What am I missing?
You have probably heard me say this in here before. I NEVER leave a lot that has touched my wheels, like a PA inspection station or tire place without checking all 5 lug nuts on all 4 wheels. I have found lug nuts over tightened a couple of times and marched back into the desk at tire shops and complained. One time the guy said something like, "why are you checking them. Do you have a torque wrench or what"? My response was, "no I don't have a torque wrench and I don't think you guys have one either".

Years ago, back in my working days, A fellow worker laughed when I told him what I do when someone touches my wheels. He said I should deal with a more reputable inspection stations and tire shops. About 10 years later when I returned as a consultant, another fellow employee told me that this guy was coming down a ramp, about to merge onto an interstate, just after getting his car inspected, when his car started shaking violently like you described. I guess his inspection mechanic wasn't as good as he thought he was. So far, I'm as good at checking lug nuts as I ever was.

It only takes a couple minutes, if that, to check the lug nuts so I ALWAYS check them. Learning how to change a flat tire when I was a kid has come in handy in more ways than just changing a flat tire.

Good to hear that no one was injured.

FWIW, I've also passed my paranoia onto my sons.

jmonroe

Whatever you do ,DO NOT repost that comment in the “Tales From Under the Hood” topic unless you want a lecture about how professional technicians NEVER make mistakes...

Don't worry, I won't do that. I learned my lesson after you set me up a few years ago about telling a story over there to the mastermind @thecardoc3. Like I said to you before, after learning my lesson, "I OWE YOU FOR THAT". :@

jmonroe

imidazol97 · June 2018

roadburner said:

Whatever you do ,DO NOT repost that comment in the “Tales From Under the Hood” topic unless you want a lecture about how professional technicians NEVER make mistakes...

LOL

houdini1 · June 2018

graphicguy said:
Not going to offer any other comment other than I totally support Harley Davidson and will do what I can (as a non-Harley owner) to make certain they are viable in the midst of the attacks they’re now suffering.

As a motorcycle lover, particularly American made motorcycles, I hope they can weather this assault without having to compromise their integrity.

Long before tariff negotiations were an issue, HD had already announced that they were closing their mfg. operation in Kansas City. Now we know where they are relocating. I just look at it as a business decision to help them survive. Certainly can't blame them for that.

stickguy · June 2018

28, this was at a franchised new car dealer? Not just a tire chain?

28firefighter · June 2018

stickguy said:
28, this was at a franchised new car dealer? Not just a tire chain?

Yes.

suydam · June 2018

Re Bosch and drying —
I also run the dishwasher overnight most of the time. On the few occasions I’ve run it in daytime, as long as I wait for the dry cycle to finish, it’s fine.

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