I spotted a NEW (insert make/model) today!

tlong · December 2018

The other day I saw a mint Mercury Grand Marquis. Driven by an old lady. From the appearance and license plate number, I'd guess it was late 80s-early 90's vintage. I'll be it had at least 20K miles on it...

fintail · December 2018

Don't know where to put this, but as the Lambo Uterus is now a real thing, this is worth a laugh:

berri · December 2018

They lowered the roofline for a new streamlined design

texases · December 2018

There was a recent article (on Jalopnik?) about how Pontiac was just ahead of their time, given the current CUV craze.

kyfdx · December 2018

texases said:
There was a recent article (on Jalopnik?) about how Pontiac was just ahead of their time, given the current CUV craze.

I'm in total agreement with that.

stickguy · December 2018

same as AMC. The Eagle would have saved the company if it came out 20-30 years later. Look what the outback did for subaru.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Spotted a Lexus LC500. Very impressive car from all angles....except the front. It was parked so I gave it a good lookover for a few minutes, from all angles. Loved the sculpted body panels and tried to adjust to the front grille but I couldn't get myself to accept it as "part of the whole".

boomchek · December 2018

Oh cmon, the Urus is a good design. Probably the best looking out of most of the luxury SUVs. The Bentayga and Levante for example are not elegant designs at all.

Betayga proportions look weird and the Levante could pass off as a generic $30k modern SUV.

fintail · December 2018

I am not sure how one sees out of the Urus, but I also strongly doubt the target demographic cares, or usually looks before reversing or turning to begin with. All of these super-priced new age SUVs are dull in their own way, or maybe I am just jaded against who will end up behind the wheel of them in my neighborhood.

Saw a NSX last night, the RLX of supercars.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

stickguy said:
same as AMC. The Eagle would have saved the company if it came out 20-30 years later. Look what the outback did for subaru.

AMC didn't survive long enough to develop the Eagle (which needed a LOT of development). Even the early Subarus were pretty rough pieces of work, but by the 1990s they were functionally a lot better. Then Subaru could finally afford a Styling Department in the early 2000s.

texases · December 2018

Given the links to the Cayenne, I'd sure want to compare the two before springing for the extra $$$ Urus.

fintail · December 2018

Stopped by the MB dealer while out and about in the fintail. A couple of interesting things - first, a new S coupe with a white interior and steering wheel. Still a striking design at 5 years old:

And a new style CLS 53 in a matte finish that I thought was a fad that passed. MSRP barely shy of 100K:

Funny thing, I was out looking at the used cars, and a salesman came up to me and chatted, while he was looking for a car in inventory. He remembered what I drove, but I don't recall dealing with him before. Maybe they are waiting for me, yeah, that's right. He also said they can negotiate on lease residuals.

qbrozen · December 2018

fintail said:

Stopped by the MB dealer while out and about in the fintail. A couple of interesting things - first, a new S coupe with a white interior and steering wheel. Still a striking design at 5 years old: And a new style CLS 53 in a matte finish that I thought was a fad that passed. MSRP barely shy of 100K: Funny thing, I was out looking at the used cars, and a salesman came up to me and chatted, while he was looking for a car in inventory. He remembered what I drove, but I don't recall dealing with him before. Maybe they are waiting for me, yeah, that's right. He also said they can negotiate on lease residuals.

I'd run away from a salesman who claimed that. Or I'd challenge him to do so. Would depend on how much time I felt like wasting.

fintail · December 2018

He named the car, he had the info in his head somehow, and I didn't drive there in that car, rather, in the fintail.

Another fun thing there, the receptionist who always seems to be there always remembers my name.

qbrozen said:

I'd run away from a salesman who claimed that. Or I'd challenge him to do so. Would depend on how much time I felt like wasting.

laurasdada · December 2018

A used S Coupe is on my radar. But, it is so large...

bhill2 · December 2018

fintail said:
Stopped by the MB dealer while out and about in the fintail. A couple of interesting things - first, a new S coupe with a white interior and steering wheel. Still a striking design at 5 years old:

And a new style CLS 53 in a matte finish that I thought was a fad that passed. MSRP barely shy of 100K:

Funny thing, I was out looking at the used cars, and a salesman came up to me and chatted, while he was looking for a car in inventory. He remembered what I drove, but I don't recall dealing with him before. Maybe they are waiting for me, yeah, that's right. He also said they can negotiate on lease residuals.

Hmmm, I want that CLS drivetrain in an E-Class sedan. So I’m looking at maybe $85K similarly equipped?

fintail · December 2018

I suspect that's about right. It'll base over 70 I think, and you know how options are on these (even my Bluetec has 14K in options, and it isn't a full load). That engine interests me a lot too, maybe it would be fun to have a new I6 to go with my old one.

I have noticed early run S coupes are depreciating almost down to my level. But at that price I start looking at G-wagens too, and that's something maybe better left alone.

bhill2 said:

Hmmm, I want that CLS drivetrain in an E-Class sedan. So I’m looking at maybe $85K similarly equipped?

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Aside from the new G-wagons, which are considerably improved, I have to say, having examined an older one closely, that they are about the most ineptly designed vehicle built in the last 25 years--right up there with the Hummer and the Chevy SSR. I would have expected something more than exposed door hinges and glued-on lights for that kind of money. M-B must still be laughing.

fintail · December 2018

G-wagen (until 2018) is a 1979 design, it was old 25 years ago

It's a utility vehicle with a luxury pretense, rather than the other way around.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Well I'll give it credit for very little pretense then. At least it's for real in the dirt, but my god, what a mess it is for the $$$.

Fortunately M-B really cleaned it up for 2019. Not sure it's still worth the money but at least now you can present yourself as the owner without too much embarrassment at having paid the full MSRP.

fintail · December 2018

The fun thing about the G (especially for MB, as the margins have to be yuuuuge) is that value is exactly 0% of the reason to buy one. The target market doesn't care about it, so MB doesn't have to offer it. I've heard you can't find the new model on lots - all sold. Maybe some discounts to be had on old ones. MBs of all model will generally carry at least a 10% discount from MSRP just by some moderate negotiating.

They don't depreciate insanely fast, either.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Wellll......I dunno about that. I would grant that the power of advertising and image are considerable in keeping the buyer somewhat deluded, but people with that kind of money aren't stupid. I think they know perfectly well that the G has been a primitive, gutless, clumsy, spartan "image". Perhaps it's the exclusivity and the "look".

fintail · December 2018

This is the new Belle Epoque. Plenty of people with that kind of money didn't really do jack for it, and many rich people are stupid, monied via the lucky birth club and the breaks and connections that come with it. Many of the target demographic fall into that category. These things are barely advertised at all - they are a known entity without it.

As it has only officially been offered with a V8 and for some time the base model has been well over 400 hp, I don't know about the gutless - clumsy and spartan are part of that image. It doesn't need to be a roadholder when it will only cruise from a gated mcmansion orchard to a gallery mall or club. It's definitely the look, but I don't think they are exclusive - if you want one, your local dealer will gladly order you one today.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

The older ones were pretty gutless, with 2.4L diesels, or sometimes 2.8L gas. It got better engines in 1990.

fintail · December 2018

We never received those through official channels, they were meant for utilitarian work. The first official US model G-Wagen was not until MY 2002, the rest are private imports or Europa cars. Those small engine cars also usually had no power accessories, likely no AC, cloth or vinyl interior, etc. It was not originally designed as a luxury vehicle - that's part of the appeal for some.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

They were incredibly backward all the way up to 2018--for that kind of $$$, you could buy so much more. Benz seemed almost cynical about it, as in "you really want one of these things Americans? OK, here...we'll glue some extra stuff on it, and reverse-engineer some clunky updates...now go away".

fintail · December 2018

Like was mentioned, people who buy these aren't seeking value, aren't being rational. It's a show off splurge. 90% image is what sells it, and will continue to sell it.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

I was reading about this prank where a TV production company bought up some cheap shoes from Payless and reboxed them with a phony "upscale brand name" and sold them to people at outrageous prices---the buyers were totally convinced that the shoes were in fact some kind of hand-made imported artisan shoe.

So yeah, they were buying the box the shoes came in. They had no discernment as to the quality of the object of their desire.

fintail · December 2018

Not sure if those shoes are apples to apples with a G-Wagen. The G is not a cheap product pretending to be expensive. It would be pricey even without bling and leather. It is a high quality old fashioned utility vehicle decked out with fancy bits and a price pumped up to a huge margin.

I suspect it would be easier/less painful to run a G to 150K miles than say a Range Rover of the same price point.

berri · December 2018

I actually saw one on the road today. Meh

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

The new ones are cleaned up a bit but there are sure a lot better ways to spend your money than on a new car that already looks like an old one.

fintail · December 2018

I still have yet to see a new style G on the road in person. If my local dealer had any, they sold. This will continue to be a cash cow.

Many aspects of value are subjective. Some want that traditional look, it says "I have money to throw away, the amount of taxes I dodge/evade are more than your salary". It is worth it to someone, or MB wouldn't make them

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Doug DeMuro's review on the 2017 AMG version is pretty amusing. He also reviewed the 2019 and he is a bit kinder:

2017 AMG G-Wagon Review

fintail · December 2018

A G65 is indeed pretty wacky. It's all about showing off, and the profit margins have to be huge even if volume is low.

berri · December 2018

After going to the store, I just figured out where the MB G Wagon came from: they bred a Jeep and a Brink's truck

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Or an Isuzu Trooper with a file cabinet?

berri · December 2018

I think the G wagon I saw had one of those side opening doors, so maybe a refrigerator instead of a file cabinet. If it was a conventional or hatch door, then a garage.

fintail · December 2018

G opens from the side, so it is a fridge.

The door handle/latch operation on those is immensely satisfying too, like an old car.

berri · December 2018

You know, as Wally Cleaver on Leave It To Beaver says, "we're just giving you the business" and "immensely satisfying" has a Madman 50's advertising sound as well

fintail · December 2018

The door action on a G-wagen reminds me of the fintail - a very nice solid click when you close it. Modern cars feel hollow in comparison.

tlong · December 2018

I've often wondered what people from the 1800s, when machinery was heavy iron, would think of all of today's mechanical and even non-mechanical items? I suspect they'd be amazed by things like carbon fiber and even plastic. And aluminum. Everything is immensely lighter than in those days.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Jules Verne's space rocket was made out of aluminum, in the story Journey to the Moon (1865), and the engine the Wright Brothers used was made out of aluminum (1903). Aluminum electrical wires were being used in the late 1800s.

kyfdx · December 2018

Aluminum electrical wires were being used in the late 1800s.

Yikes! That didn't work out so well.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

Why not? Aluminum gives better conductivity per weight than copper.

stickguy · December 2018

But those pesky fires.

kyfdx · December 2018

Mr_Shiftright said:
Why not? Aluminum gives better conductivity per weight than copper.

1 mile from my house:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beverly_Hills_Supper_Club_fire

Mr_Shiftright · December 2018

As a metal, it was "discovered" in 1825. At one time, it cost more per weight than gold.

tjc78 · December 2018

Aluminum is still widely used as electrical wire. Most homes large feed from the pole is aluminum.

Buggest problem with aluminum was electrolysis resulting from splicing it into copper or using the wrong terminations.

Thinner gauge also also can get brittle over time.

sda · December 2018

I was 18 when that happened and remember the news stories. Simply horrible and sad.

explorerx4 · December 2018

Saw a second generation Leaf, looked like a normal 4 door hatchback.

I spotted a NEW (insert make/model) today!

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