New CR-V, cold weather, runs rich, gas in oil, multiple complaints

berri · May 2018

I believe the CRV uses the same, or very similar turbo engine as the new Accord. The CRV came out first, so I wonder if there will soon be new Accord owners with similar problems?

Michaell · May 2018

berri said:

I believe the CRV uses the same, or very similar turbo engine as the new Accord. The CRV came out first, so I wonder if there will soon be new Accord owners with similar problems?

And the Civic also uses the 1.5T engine; has for a couple of years. No issues there?

berri · May 2018

Just very surprising to me that Honda has a potentially serious engine issue. Heck, they have been in the racing business and now jet aviation.

M_T_W5 · August 2018

The 2018 has same problem. I travel at least 10 to 20 miles usually and longer highway trips. Oil to the top of the dipstick. Do Not Buy this vehicle till Honda addresses the problem. Lots of used ones out there from 2017 as customers dump them.Put a hold on sales like they did in China.

GRN_MN · September 2018

M_T_W5 said:
The 2018 has same problem. I travel at least 10 to 20 miles usually and longer highway trips. Oil to the top of the dipstick. Do Not Buy this vehicle till Honda addresses the problem. Lots of used ones out there from 2017 as customers dump them.Put a hold on sales like they did in China.

Around where I live, there are very few used models on lots that are not LX models. Seems in my neck of the woods people aren't bringing them back to Honda dealers for trade, anyway. Most of the EX/Touring models that are used from '17 and '18 are from one dealer who kept title on them (presumably used as loaner cars for folks as most of these types of cars are).

wbad · September 2018

Hope for a quick honest opinion from those following closely. Just signed today on a 2018 crv lx with 2.4 engine, to take delivery on Saturday. Went with LX cause I wanted nothing to do with the 1.5T and the major problem. We are in a cold climate Buffalo.. I keep cars for atleast 7 years so reliability is huge for me.

Is the 2.4 engine having problems too?? Getting really nervous cause I thought I just read there were reports of it happening with the 2.4 too.

We really need to do something soon and liked the crv way better than rav4...but Im second guessing this purchase.... Spending alot of money, last thing I want to worry about is getting oil changed once a month.

Bottom line... Should we bail out of this deal???Didnt put anything down and we are taking care of financing ourselves so not paying til Saturday...

Help us decide please

mrnorthland · October 2018

For the purpose of adding a voice to this serious topic *Honda Earth Dreams 1.5 Turbo Engine Oil Dilution Issue) and hopefully getting American Honda (The company) to do something –here is my story: Purchased a new Honda 2017 CR-V EX-L end of April 2017 and experienced (first) strong fuel smell (inside and outside of cabin) Feb. 2018. My first (of two) engine stalls occurred on March 2018. Per recommendation of American Honda the service tech replaced the fuel injectors and changed oil. When I picked up 4 days later the service tech admitted the root issue was not fixed and recommend I work with Honda "The company". I then proceeded to opened a case and worked for several months attempting to obtain answer(s) from Honda (via my case manager). A date was set to meet with a Honda service representative (@ Honda dealer in May 2018. The Honda service rep thought American Honda working on problem and would have a solution. * * * Update Last week --end of Sept. 2018 (7 months later and 7 oil changes later I was told by two independent mechanics they smelled fuel in oil (again...) by way of the dip stick. Couple of days ago a Honda service tech told me this is a known problem with no known fix.
Honda Canada Acknowledges the Issue Posted August 25 2018:
http://www.hondaproblems.com/trends/crv-oil-contamination/
Bogleheads blog on Oil Dilution and Honda:
http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=244271

wasp09 · October 2018

Regarding the recall in China, the revised one went through on May 16. It is called the "engine oil gate" instance in China:

http://news.m.yiche.com/hao/wenzhang/782581?_ad0.2988819812890142

Dongfeng Honda provides life time warranty for main engine components. Dongfeng Honda will replace engine if damaged by excessive gas in oil. It also gives each owner a gift card (~$100) and a free service.

On July 9, Dongfeng Honda extended the recall to 1.5T Civics manufactured between 2015-12-15 and 2018-05-17.

There were complaints about the recall did not stop dilution:

http://www.sohu.com/a/235990048_452983

We have to wait for winter to tell the improvement if any.

stickguy · October 2018

And I had the CR-V on the short list for my wife's next car. I think I will be taking it off for the time being!

interesting that have not heard (well, yet) about issues with the 2.0T, which is the same basic engine.

Qwunk12 · October 2018

Ive been seeing this on the internet, after ive bout a 2017 crv 1.5t. I live in Houston TX. So not much cold weather. I checked my oil and its does have a gasoline smell to it. So its not just localized to cold weather, it is an inherent defect with this engine. A good band aid for it for now would be to use a little bit heavier oil so when it gets diluted it wont suffer,with a lower viscosity.

berri · October 2018

Saw in today's Automotive News daily email that Honda expects to release a fix next month.

mrnorthland · October 2018

I'm exploring filing a claim (Minnesota Lemon Law) by contacting the National Center for Dispute Settlement (NCDC). Discussing with a representative yesterday and citing the Oct. 5th Consumer Reports article it sure would appear we have a chance of getting a good portion of our costs/expenses back (seven documented oil changes in last seven months with no fix to root issue). Any one else already been down this path/ journey?
Friday Oct. 5th Consumer Report:
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-repair-maintenance/honda-cr-v-affected-by-engine-trouble/

mrnorthland · October 2018

Wow - As I having been dealing with American Honda oil dilution issue since early March 2018--engine stalled out twice in one day, it is refreshing to see this story break loose. Thank you Consumer reports--Oct 5th article! Also check out Bogleheads Financial forum (for late breaking news);
http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=244271
Also grateful to Honda dealer(s) for being honest since day one and telling me this is a problem and to contact American Honda (the company). This includes sales, service tech and dealer service representative. Contacting Honda customer service - 800-999-1009 (case manager) has been a huge exercise in frustration--case was closed last spring with verbiage "this is American Honda's Position".

Reality_Check · October 2018

Honda has been researching this issue for last 6 months.
This tells me two things: (1) There is no *easy* fix for this problem (2) The Honda fix will be a band-aid.

Buyer beware.

PF_Flyer · October 2018

I've read that Honda hopes to have a fix for this in November. There was a recall in China earlier this year for "similar "oil-fuel mixtures" that reportedly involved updating fuel injector software. Whether that leads to anything happening here, I guess we'll see

rexyooper · November 2018

Honda will be implementing 'N60' service fix starting in December 2018 for CR-V owners in 5 states. Being that I'm not in one of the 5 states (but living in a city that is in Michigan's UP and north of 90% of the five states) I will not be getting my CR-V engine fixed anytime soon enough. I was a big fan of Honda before this issue but their response has been dishonest in my opinion. I was told by Honda to pursue my consumer rights if I was unhappy about their complete lack of response. I had such higher expectations of Honda. It's just a numbers game for them. I'll most likely be looking into filing for lemon law. Last oil change had seriously high levels. I sent sample in for analysis. Dealer has been great....American Honda, not so much.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2018/honda-cr-v-oil-dilution-fix.shtml?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20181031-honda-news

Honda will start in December 2018 with 2017-2018 Honda CR-Vs in Maine, Minnesota, North Dakota, South Dakota and Wisconsin by installing software updates for the transmission and engine control units, changing the engine oil and in some cases the air conditioning control units will be replaced.

CR-V customers in these 16 states will be contacted after Honda has enough replacement parts, likely a few months from now: Alaska, Connecticut, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, Nebraska, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island and Vermont

berri · November 2018

I wonder if we're going to see more issues with other small, turbo charged engines down the road and whether Honda really has a fix, or just a temporary patch with crossed fingers?

Farhan123 · November 2018

I have 2018 Honda CRV and I live in Oklahoma. My car has started throwing fuel smell from the air vent inside the car since last couple of months. My car has 16000 miles right now when the car was new I didn't felt this issue but now I checked the gas is getting mixed with oil and I'm getting the smell of gas inside the cabin. I am going to contact Honda customer care now.

berri · November 2018

Suddenly its 1974; Turbos are becoming commonplace now as Emissions controls were then. The results weren't pretty initially.

StephenColorado · November 2018

Owner of 2017 CRV with the 1.5L turbo. Same problem here....high oil levels, gas in oil, and ongoing problems with gas fumes in passenger compartment. I commute about 40 miles each way 5 days a week---I still smell the gas fumes, so the problem is not confined to just short commutes. I am at 30K miles. Question: if I surpass 36K miles will this ongoing problem no longer be covered under the warranty or is it considered an engine/drivetrain problem that is covered under the longer warranty for that? I have already reported the problem to the dealer and had them document the high gas levels in the oil ( one week ago ).
Should I limit driving the car now to keep it from reaching 36K miles, or is this not an issue?
Thanks

thecardoc3 · November 2018

StephenColorado said:
Owner of 2017 CRV with the 1.5L turbo. Same problem here....high oil levels, gas in oil, and ongoing problems with gas fumes in passenger compartment. I commute about 40 miles each way 5 days a week------------------Should I limit driving the car now to keep it from reaching 36K miles, or is this not an issue?
Thanks

With that kind of a commute it seems very unlikely that this is a cold engine operation issue. There is more than one way for fuel to be getting into the oil, a leaking high pressure pump can also dilute the oil.

stickguy · November 2018

it should be covered under powertrain. But if you have a problem already documented, that they are unable to fix, they should not be able to deny coverage because you hit the miles limit. Key is to keep complaining, and make them document, in detail and in writing, and keep a copy of everything. most likely the lawsuits and bad publicity will end up having them extend the warranty on this issue anyway.

HondaOwner5150 · November 2018

I wanted to add to this forum to report that this problem is more prevalent than claimed. The problem in my honda developed within 2,000 miles. Stalling, lurching, fuel in oil. No fix for Kansas or Missouri currently slated.

However, Honda must recognize that this is a real problem. It is widespread. I'm documenting everything with the dealer and will enact the lemon law if this is not repaired within 4 efforts as stipulated under law. As the first occurrence happened within a month of ownership, I would expect that Honda must fix this within the next few months.

Advice to all: DON'T BUY A HONDA UNTIL THIS PROBLEM IS ADDRESSED.

berri · November 2018

I think Honda needs to offer the normal bulletproof 4 banger on all lines. The turbo seems not ready for prime time. It is really sad given that otherwise the new CRV is a great vehicle.

edv3 · November 2018

Hello, I live in warm CA. My 2017 CRV with the 2.4 liter engine has a gas smell on the oil filler cap. Bought in Oct 2017, has 1900 miles on it. In all my 60 years I’ve never heard of gas in oil problems. My Genesis oil cap with 51k on it smells like oil, period. I’m hearing in some circles that this issue is not an issue and it’s related or caused by not allowing the engine to warm up sufficiently. This does not sound right to me. If Honda knows about this, I’ve yet to get a letter from them. My wife is crushed over this as she likes the CRV but now questions it’s future reliability. Maybe?

stickguy · November 2018

have there been any issues reported on the other models that use a version of it? Plenty of the 1.5s in Civics and now Accords. Plus the 2.0T version.

Hondaguru90 · November 2018

The oil dilution that is happening with the 2017-2018 Honda Crv with 1.5t (ex and above) is happening in most direct injection engines and should only be a concern if the oil dilution is over 2.5%, which if you smell fuel then that's most likely the case. This is actually a common occurrence in direct injection engines which will have a very small amount of fuel travel down the cylinder wall and into the crankcase and mixes in with the oil when the vehicle is turned off. . For the owners that have this problem try letting your CRV warm up before driving and its a good idea to drive the vehicle a little harder than normal (accelerate harder, I recommend this in any direct injection engine), that will cause the fuel to vaporize and get directed back to the cylinder through the pcv and intake manifold and gets burned off. Another great thing to do with your CRV is to get in the habit of starting your CRV with remote start before driving, it will allow the CRV to run for ten to twenty minutes which allows the engine to get to normal operating temperatures before driving. I would not be too concerned with this issue unless your smelling fuel or having higher oil levels. If this occurs just get your oil changed and ask your service advisor at your local Honda dealer to refer to Honda's service bulletins which has a fix for this issue.

I can assure you Honda has a fix for this issue on the very few vehicles that are having this problem. Honda has great integrity as a company and I can say with confidence that if this was a serious issue to have major concern with that the company would issue a recall. This is only occurring to a very small fraction of CRV's sold in the US, Honda will start to offer a nation wide fix for this issue and will start in some of the northern states first.

The fix will involve a software update to engine and transmission,oil change and in certain cases the a/c control unit will be replaced. The updates will allow the engine to warm up faster, improving fuel combustion and reducing the potential for abnormal oil dilution.
AGAIN VERY SMALL AMOUNTS OF FUEL GOING INTO THE CRANKCASE IS A NORMAL ASPECT OF DIRECT INJECTION ENGINES NOT JUST HONDA'S.

.

berri · November 2018

Consumers Report just had an article talking about turbos and direct injection engine complications and teething issues in general. I hope the Honda software patch will work, but I'm a little leery that it is that simple. Otherwise, the new CRV is hard to beat for a small crossover.

Vesh · January 2019

In my last visit (November 2018), the Honda service center said that they fixed the problem. I checked the oil level after 15 days, but had the same problem: oil level rise too high. I spoke to the Honda customer center and explained them that the problem has not been solved. It is very frustrating to hear that they cannot do anything now. Only the solution they told me is to drive the vehicle long enough. It is very ridiculous that how they can say that I need to drive my vehicle for long enough distance, while I need only 7 miles to commute everyday. I am very disappointing still they have not fixed the problem and leaving everything upon customers. I have no idea what I need to do next. I don't want to change the oil in every 20 days. Please advise!!!!!

stickguy · January 2019

if I was in your situation I would be filing with a lemon law lawyer. And telling Honda corporate that you are starting that process and give them the chance to buy it back first.

berri · January 2019

RAV4 is still using a non turbo, non direct injection 4 banger IIRC

stickguy · January 2019

yes, the newly redesigned RAV has the 2.4l engine out of the Camry.

berri · January 2019

I own an older CRV and really like how they stretched the new one, but don't think I'd touch one right now. Honda seems to be having a year of various issues with several models including the Odyssey. What did they do, put some Ivy league finance MBA in charge???

Bdgrfan · February 2019

We have a 2018 CRV in Wisconsin with the same issue. Initially the engine had 7.5 quarts of the oil/gas mixture when I changed it at 1500 miles. That is when I found out there is a problem with this engine. Honda did an update to the CRV but I was told this was not yet a recall. So now after 5 oil changes in the first 3000 miles there is a quart of gas that mixes with the oil. The engine only takes 3.7 quarts so a quart is a lot. Honda Service tells me there is nothing else they can do and recommended we seek mediation through Honda. Some customer service........the cost of oil changes and vacation time taken for service is adding up. Now they won't even change the oil. I have yet to hear from anyone that this much gas mixing with the oil is a good thing.

stickguy · February 2019

sorry to hear your story. Guess they haven't implemented a real fix yet. I would be notifying Honda corporate that I wanted to be bought out, and next step was a lemon law attorney. So give them the chance to fix the problem before getting pulled into that hassle. No guarantee they won't want to fight anyway of course.

I can't believe they have the nerve to ask you to pay for the oil changes either.

andyman1970 · February 2019

Seriously considering a 2019 - this is the most comprehensive position I've found in my limited digging:

https://www.consumerreports.org/car-repair-maintenance/honda-cr-v-affected-by-engine-trouble/

andyman1970 · February 2019

I realize the 17 and 18 model years are impacted, but I'd be curious if there's commonality on the VIN number (e.g. do all of the impacted vehicles start with "5" for the VIN).

berri · February 2019

Until a formal fix is announced by Honda, I'd be leery that it is resolved on the 19's either.

andyman1970 · February 2019

I tend to agree with you, but in the meantime there's nothing wrong with using this situation to negotiate a compelling OTD price on a shiny new EX-L

I personally would love to see a TSB with defined impact and scope of VINs impacted.

stickguy · February 2019

it seems debatable that they have really figured out the true root cause, and a definitive fix. So far, the update sounds more like a bandaid to try and hide the symptoms. But, maybe they really have resolved it. Sometimes the real fix is redesigned parts going forward, but if significant enough changes, might not be practical to retrofit.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2019

I would think reprogramming could fix this, since it seems related to temperature and driving distances--but you know how it goes---you can reprogram to fix one set of circumstances, and by doing so, mess up another set.

andyman1970 · February 2019

Allusions to a software solutions as the fix. I work in IT for my career - that's industry code for "gee don't know (or maybe even care) to determine root cause - but we will find a fix for it". It's more than enough for me to consider alternative options.

stickguy · February 2019

That’s like if your seat heaters burst into flames and immolate the car, the solution is to unplug them.

jimm70 · February 2019

Now there is a “service bulletin” which covers all 2017 and 2018 CRVs.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1axlDuGlYEPoRITKir13P1xfRsWiPcsFz/view

andyman1970 · February 2019

A prior post alludes to the 2019s having the "fix" applied in advance of sale. It is unclear if this TSB is the true fix. What's also missing within the TSB is a precise statement of the root issue. The TSB (BTW thanks for sharing) above does a good job of describing some symptoms, but unsure if they are directly related. Watching software version and release dates is key here, as well as understanding the best mainstream version of the corrective software.

Swansong04 · March 2019

stickguy said:
Might be taking this off my list now. Wonder if the same issue is impacting the 2.0t motor they will be using in the new design RDX?

Old post but we own a new 2019 Acura RDX we bought back in August . and guess what we are having the same Issue . fuel in our oil been back to Acura and 3 occasion and they are not helping us at all.. they say they have never head of it. Got a hold of Acura Canada same lame answer from them. Never heard of this problem. the car now has 15000km and has had three oil changes. dipstick reads high and the card smells like gas inside every time you go to drive it.. I am so frustrated !! I feel lost in it all..

stickguy · March 2019

thanks for posting. Bad for you, so hopefully you get it resolved. I won't be in the market again for almost 3 years, and the wife loved the RDX, but if there is even a whiff of an issue still at that point, it won't be happening.

Odd that it only seems to be reported on the CUVs. there have been a ton of Civics and Accords rolled out with these engines too.

northwinds · March 2019

Problem still exists in the 2019 CRV. Dealer's service techs took a look and said there was nothing they could do. Only the first week of ownership. Really disappointed. This is my wife's 5th CRV (her first car was a Civic) as a loyal Honda owner ... it may be her last.

stickguy · March 2019

If I got stuck with one of these, it definitely would be.

kyfdx · March 2019

I would start the lemon law process.

New CR-V, cold weather, runs rich, gas in oil, multiple complaints

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