Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

ab348 · January 2019

omarman said:

Maybe art like a rat fink poster brought to "life."

Crate engine, call GM Performance, plop down your credit card and that gets delivered. It does look like they had to massage the firewall to get it to fit.

Sandman6472 · January 2019

What I wouldn't give to have those old cars back. The '59 Corvette, the '63 Riviera, the '67 and '69 Toronado's. Or my mom's '60,'62, & '64 Sedan de Villes, the '66 Lincoln Continental, '68 Eldorado, the '70 Caddy convertible or the '72 Lincoln Continental coupe. After those years my brother got my dad to buy a souped up "72 Torino GT coupe while I voted for the Pontiac GTO. That Ford was the worst breaking down on me ten minutes after I took it home from the dealership, though I never made it. Towed back and put me in a new Mustang that some of the Dolphin players used. He ended up taking it to college with him and he kept it till 1977.
After that, the folks shared one vehicle as they lived on the golf course and bought a golf cart. They started buying Pontiacs with a '75 Grand Prix, a '78 Bonneville Brougham, '79 diesel Pontiac Parisienne, an '81 Pontiac Parisienne, and then multiple Mercury Grand Marquis's '85 till 2003, all white with the 1/2 blue vinyl top and the fake wheel on the back. After my dad passed in '86, her friend in the business kept her in those Mercury's until she passed. I was in a few of them and hated to be seen in them really.
Since I was born in 1954, the first vehicle I was aware of was our '57 Chrysler station wagon, not sure of the name but Windsor comes to mind. My grandpa owned a Dodge store so he got his daughter that beautiful blue station wagon. But remember my love affair with the car began in that '57 Chrysler.
My other grandpa loved Chrysler Imperials and got a new one every other year starting in like 1958. He bought my grandma a '58 Plymouth Fury as memory recalls but she was so scared to drive it, he sold it maybe a year later. I do remember playing in it and pretending to drive. And I'd always stand up in the car for some reason, that feeling of forward motion just made me love all cars that much more. I could also name every car on the road and back then, they changed every year.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

ab348 said:
I'm having a hard time thinking of a '66 Chevy II restomod being a work of art. It's not like a Coddington custom.

I guess I meant the "art" of the craftsmanship, not that it itself is a work of Art, capital "A".

For instance, if you took a random person who had no idea of the value of things, and you showed them two objects---a hand-built wooden ship model from the 1800s, or a plastic one from a gift shop in Disneyland, they'd probably realize that the wooden model is worth a lot more.

ab348 · January 2019

I would submit that restoring a car to original condition, where unavailable parts need to be rebuilt and restored, is a lot more artful than ordering a bunch of stuff, bolting it on, and then dropping $50,000 on paint and interior.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

Well.....certainly debatable either way. I really depends on what you do to it, and what kind of car it is in the first place. Besides, the market is driven by what people want to see/buy, not what might be the most tasteful or respectful.

These days, people want to drive their classic cars frequently and go on long tours, etc., or they want something different to bring to shows. Sitting in a lawn chair in a long row of 75 identical '57 Chevys isn't all that exciting.

carnaught · January 2019

@Sandman6472, some very cool cars back in the day.

stickguy · January 2019

not that I am likely to have the money any time soon to do it, but if I finally get some sort of classic (ok, old bomber) I definitely want it to be driveable in normal use. So a "restomod" of some sort probably. In my case, that would be basic suspension, brakes (disks), etc. Probably a crate motor with modern electronics, new rad, better seats. Keeping the look the same.

roadburner · January 2019

I wouldn't mind having a 66-67 Riviera GS or Toronado in the garage. Aside from those, the only late '60-early '70s cars I would really like to own are some of the musclescars and ponycars of that era- think: Chevelle SS396, GSX, GTO, Rallye 350, Z/28, Boss 302, Mach 1, Road Runner/Super Bee, AAR Cuda...

qbrozen · January 2019

I think that Chevy II is a rare instance where you could build it yourself for less than the $200k that bought it (plus buyer's premium!).

graphicguy · January 2019

roadburner said:
I wouldn't mind having a 66-67 Riviera GS or Toronado in the garage. Aside from those, the only late '60-early '70s cars I would really like to own are some of the musclescars and ponycars of that era- think: Chevelle SS396, GSX, GTO, Rallye 350, Z/28, Boss 302, Mach 1, Road Runner/Super Bee, AAR Cuda...

Oh man.....Mach 1, Super Bee, Chevelle SS 396 w/cowl induction, late ‘60s Charger with a 440....in that order!!!!!!

ab348 · January 2019

stickguy said:
not that I am likely to have the money any time soon to do it, but if I finally get some sort of classic (ok, old bomber) I definitely want it to be driveable in normal use. So a "restomod" of some sort probably. In my case, that would be basic suspension, brakes (disks), etc. Probably a crate motor with modern electronics, new rad, better seats. Keeping the look the same.

In that case you don’t have a classic car.

sda · January 2019

I wouldn’t mind a 4-4-2.

mjfloyd1 · January 2019

I’d love a superbird

corvette · January 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:
Besides, the market is driven by what people want to see/buy, not what might be the most tasteful or respectful.

That's one of the points that one of the law firm marketing gurus makes - it goes something like "you're going fishing. Does the worm taste good to you? No! But it tastes good to the fish."

cdnpinhead · January 2019

There are many fish these days. I'm not included in the demo that is so desired, mostly because there's not much that I crave anymore. I have most of what I want and know where to get the rest -- a dead loss for those who advertise. I record nearly everything on TV and zip through the ads. I may as well not exist.

qbrozen · January 2019

There are many that I love, but HemiCuda has always been at the top of my list.
Others include SC/Rambler, W30 442, tripower GTO, Swinger 340, and many others. Not necessarily in any order, although Rambler and GTO are probably the 2 following the hemicuda

roadburner · January 2019

The Cutlass SX was cool, kind of a luxury musclecar.

roadburner · January 2019

I think I must be the only guy around here enamored with the Saleen Parnelli Jones and Dan Gurney Edition Mustangs. Another very low mile PJ Mustang just went through BaT for just $31k. I told my bride that if a nice Gurney car turns up for $35k or less it is mine...

qbrozen · January 2019

Eh, can get a used 2018 for that much that outperforms and is more comfy.

ab348 · January 2019

roadburner said:
The Cutlass SX was cool, kind of a luxury musclecar.

My buddy who moved to the boonies has two of those, both ‘71s, a hardtop and a convertible.

stickguy · January 2019

but the older one has a unique style.

qbrozen · January 2019

stickguy said:
but the older one has a unique style.

stickers and hood pins are easy to add. Don't get me wrong. Its not that I don't dig it. I just couldn't talk myself into paying a premium for it.

I have a neighbor with a bright yellow mustang of that generation that is heavily modded. Sounds AWFUL. I can hear supercharger whine but also an exhaust full of marbles. But, aside from that, I'm definitely not a big fan of the looks of that gen. I think the plastic headlight covers bother me most, followed by the overly square taillights.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

ab348 said:

stickguy said:
not that I am likely to have the money any time soon to do it, but if I finally get some sort of classic (ok, old bomber) I definitely want it to be driveable in normal use. So a "restomod" of some sort probably. In my case, that would be basic suspension, brakes (disks), etc. Probably a crate motor with modern electronics, new rad, better seats. Keeping the look the same.
In that case you don’t have a classic car.

To the vast majority of observers, you do.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

corvette said:

Mr_Shiftright said:
Besides, the market is driven by what people want to see/buy, not what might be the most tasteful or respectful.
That's one of the points that one of the law firm marketing gurus makes - it goes something like "you're going fishing. Does the worm taste good to you? No! But it tastes good to the fish."

Oh, I like that!

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

qbrozen said:
Eh, can get a used 2018 for that much that outperforms and is more comfy.

"comfy"?? You blaspheme.

stickguy · January 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

ab348 said:

stickguy said:
not that I am likely to have the money any time soon to do it, but if I finally get some sort of classic (ok, old bomber) I definitely want it to be driveable in normal use. So a "restomod" of some sort probably. In my case, that would be basic suspension, brakes (disks), etc. Probably a crate motor with modern electronics, new rad, better seats. Keeping the look the same.
In that case you don’t have a classic car.
To the vast majority of observers, you do.

I think you do too. Just a usable version! Hey, back in the day, it was normal to do constant upgrades to your muscle cars. Even dealers (Mr. Norm!) did it before the sale. No, not exactly as new, but that is what museums are for. I spent enough years driving cars with drum brakes and bias ply tires when I had to. I would rather not do it now.

stickguy · January 2019

QB, nice list of cars. I prefer the smaller size cars myself. I love the S/C rambler. a Z28 Camaro or a Boss 302 Mustang (I also prefer small blocks and something passing for handling, over a big block beast). The 340 Dart/Duster would be great too. A Nova SS would work.

fintail · January 2019

I replied to the salesguy email, and received a response that I could buy out the car now for the residual plus remaining payments. I laughed out loud.

28firefighter · January 2019

fintail said:

I replied to the salesguy email, and received a response that I could buy out the car now for the residual plus remaining payments. I laughed out loud.

I could have told you that. MBFS doesn’t discount residual and AutoNation sure isn’t interested in helping.

ab348 · January 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

To the vast majority of observers, you do.

Those are the same people who think a Genesis is a Benz.

stickguy · January 2019

fintail said:
I replied to the salesguy email, and received a response that I could buy out the car now for the residual plus remaining payments. I laughed out loud.

you could have done that 2 years ago.

stickguy · January 2019

ab348 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

To the vast majority of observers, you do.
Those are the same people who think a Genesis is a Benz.

well, where is the line? You have an old car. Have you upgraded anything at all? Modern tires, shocks, Electronic ignition?

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

stickguy said:

ab348 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

To the vast majority of observers, you do.
Those are the same people who think a Genesis is a Benz.
well, where is the line? You have an old car. Have you upgraded anything at all? Modern tires, shocks, Electronic ignition?

I would think the "line" is the body. So if you plop a 1959 Corvette body on a 2018 Corvette chassis and running gear and interior (or parts thereof), then yes, it's still a "classic Corvette".

But it's not an "original" classic Corvette. It's a resto-mod, or custom.

And if you make it a 4-door Corvette with landau bars and a Rolls Royce grille, then, ok, it's not a classic anything.

BUT....it could be a "neoclassic".

stickguy · January 2019

I would disagree about dropping a body shell on a modern chassis. That seems too far! I was just thinking of the original car, with upgrades to keep up with modern times.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2019

Well if that old/modern Corvette drove past, 99.9% of everyone would think it was a '59 Corvette, because it looks like one. Perception is reality in this case I think.

fintail · January 2019

Funny as I have received a different story numerous times when asking salespeople. But I think you may be right.

That gives me an option list - try to buy it back when it is processed as a lease return, lease another car, buy a (likely used) car. I'll have a punch this year no matter what - my birthday is in May, which is when this all wraps up, might make a good present to myself.

28firefighter said:

I could have told you that. MBFS doesn’t discount residual and AutoNation sure isn’t interested in helping.

fintail · January 2019

I could have done that the day after I signed the lease. Kind of a funny thing to reply with. I replied again, telling him that the residual will be at least 5K over real market value, and if they are firm on it, I'll be making a different move. I might not patronize the same dealer either, as their pricing can be inconsistent.

stickguy said:

you could have done that 2 years ago.

omarman · January 2019

ab348 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

To the vast majority of observers, you do.
Those are the same people who think a Genesis is a Benz.

Nuh uh. It's a Bentley.

roadburner · January 2019

qbrozen said:
Eh, can get a used 2018 for that much that outperforms and is more comfy.

A 2018 won't outperform it by much, if at all- at least according to a contemporary Motor Trend test:

"Compared with a production Shelby GT500, the Gurney Mustang kicks out 35 fewer horsepower. But you'd hardly know it by the stopwatch. The Gurney rockets to 60 mph in just 4.3 seconds (same as the last GT500 we tested) and trips the quarter-mile lights in 12.9 seconds at 111.3 mph (compared with 12.6 seconds at 114.2 mph for the Shelby). Braking performance is actually better than the GT500's: the Gurney stops in just 108 feet, versus 118 for the factory Ford. And thanks to its Racecraft underpinnings and grippy Corsas, the Gurney trumps the GT500 on handling power, running our exclusive Figure 8 test in just 25.5 seconds (versus 25.9 for the GT500) and wringing out 0.96 g of maximum lateral grip (compared with 0.89 g for the Shelby)."

And there's the added bonus of almost never seeing yourself coming and going(a trait I like about both my Club Sport and my 2 Series)

qbrozen · January 2019

The ‘18 Stang bests 4 secs to 60 and rips the 1/4 mile in 11.9.

ab348 · January 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

well, where is the line? You have an old car. Have you upgraded anything at all? Modern tires, shocks, Electronic ignition?

I would think the "line" is the body. So if you plop a 1959 Corvette body on a 2018 Corvette chassis and running gear and interior (or parts thereof), then yes, it's still a "classic Corvette".

Funny you mention that. There is one of those locally. A C1 on a C4 or C5 chassis. People who spot that think of it as a curiosity, not a classic. I suppose it might impress non-car people who don’t know any better. If I owned it I doubt I’d get much satisfaction from that.

As for my car, it has white-letter radials. That’s all.

tbirdmarco · January 2019

Went to see the new blazer yesterday is the best interior GM has made today.

tbirdmarco · January 2019

I have bin injoying all Else that’s been going on in here the past two days been looking haven’t made a comment though Type your comment

xwesx · January 2019

stickguy said:
not that I am likely to have the money any time soon to do it, but if I finally get some sort of classic (ok, old bomber) I definitely want it to be driveable in normal use. So a "restomod" of some sort probably. In my case, that would be basic suspension, brakes (disks), etc. Probably a crate motor with modern electronics, new rad, better seats. Keeping the look the same.

Ya, very true. I saw in the description on that '63 Corvette.... it said "custom tires." Really? Ouch.... that would probably be wickedly painful if you need to ever replace them!

mjfloyd1 · January 2019

Red wall (red line) tires

nyccarguy · January 2019

fintail said:
I replied to the salesguy email, and received a response that I could buy out the car now for the residual plus remaining payments. I laughed out loud.

Instead of laughing at the guy you should have "made an appointment" to come down to see him about 1/2 hour before they close, then call 5 minutes before and say you are stuck in traffic.

ab348 · January 2019

I have never heard of "custom tires". I suspect that phrase is just another bit o B-J sales hype.

roadburner · January 2019

qbrozen said:
The ‘18 Stang bests 4 secs to 60 and rips the 1/4 mile in 11.9.

The automatic will, but not the stick- from the CD test of a 2018:

"In testing, our six-speed manual transmission (a 10-speed automatic is optional) matched the zero-to-60-mph time of the outgoing car at 4.3 seconds but opened 0.3-second and 3-mph gaps through the quarter-mile with a 12.6-second run at 115 mph. "

mjfloyd1 · January 2019

ab348 said:

I have never heard of "custom tires". I suspect that phrase is just another bit o B-J sales hype.

Red wall tires

roadburner · January 2019

Coker replicas; hardly "custom."

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