Midsize Sedans 2.0

sda · July 2019

cski said:

andres3 said:

stickguy said:
hopefully they keep at least 1 smaller/midsize sedan. Make the Focus a little bigger, and split the difference?
ISN'T THAT WHAT ACURA DID? combining the TL and TSX to make the TLX. I don't think they are setting the world on fire with that strategy. I'm not sure who is buying the RLX.
I haven't been sure about Acura's their marketing for years. How about a new Integra???, instead of the VERY Civic looking ILX, Which basically IS a Luxed/Up Honda Civic. I would buy the better looking (IMO) Civic Sport, or the Si, which are on the low end price wise, and the Si with the wing looks like Darth Vader's earth vehicle. Is Honda withholding the Integra nameplate for some reason? My girlfriend had a 94, loaded with wing and Stock with premium sound and tinted windows. Compared to my car,it really was like the commercial where it was a rollercoaster ride. She loved driving my brute-force '87 Z24 with my newly installed 3.1 liter V6 with 190 HP in my mechanics tune, and a Getrag 5 speed manual. Considering the 87 Cavalier Z24 weighed very little, it would spin through third gear with my 225/60/14!!! Falken tires and racing clutch due to my insatiable urge to drive fast.Ok, back to the subject...
The Lexus sells wayyy more volume due to the ES350, and the RLX mostly. I have to say that the Lexus lineup is looking good, if not derivative of the same design they have been making for years. My favorite was always the IS350, with a zero to 60 in 4.8 to 5.1 seconds, depending on the car and the aggressiveness of the driver. However, the ES350, stock....did zero to 60 in 5.8 to 6.2 (depending on which mag and reviewer).

Anyway, I still have my 2012 Kia Optima EX. It has a new engine, new struts,tires...all under warranty (and new brake pads that I paid $20 to install.

I also replaced the rear tint, now at 20% due to bubbling on the rear with the rear defroster being the culprit for causing bubbles in the tint. It got so bad I could barely see out of it. There was a Maaco shop next door at the Springfield, VA Fullerton Rd. location, and I had some pretty bad front end trim where the clear coat came off, etc. They took care of ALL of it....and it was a good bit of work, for $100. It no, after 7 years, makes it look brand new.
Sorry I dont post much-Chris

Was the engine replaced because of the manufacturing issue that was discovered where metal shavings in the engine would eventually cause the engine to fail, or was it a different issue? How many miles on it when it was replaced?

[Deleted User] · July 2019

roadburner said:
The only Ford I've actually considered owning is a Mustang GT with the Performance Package- so the death of Ford's other cars is a non-issue for me.
Well, I could see having a Fiesta ST for a work beater, but that's it...

I hope you don't need the backseat's for, um, people. Not even an inch available for legs...which most folk have, last time I checked. LOL.

I have wanted a Mustang GT 5.0 FOREVER, but having my three kids safely and comfortably seated has always come first, and killed buying it...until very soon. They are all over 14, so I really don't need the back seat pretty soon, as my girls go their own way. They are 14, 16, and 18.

nyccarguy · July 2019

@cski

It has a new engine

You need to go into further detail. Did you experience any symptoms?

[Deleted User] · July 2019

benjaminh said:
The most luxurious car I ever owned was a 1988 Oldsmobile 98, which we bought when it was ten years old. It was pretty much a one-owner car (the original owner had passed it on to his daughter, who was in med school) and it was in very good condition. Outside it looked a lot like this one below, while inside it looked like the image below too—except in blue. Yes, it was the Cadillac of Oldsmobiles, and really close to that in terms of luxury. The fabrics for those couch-like seats were actually as soft and comfortable as they looked. I'm ashamed to say it, but I actually liked touching that upholstery. For the 1985 model year, the Olds 98 was massively downsized on the outside, and lost c.900 lbs of weight, but interior room was similar to the barge-like 1984 model. My 1988 Olds 98 was still a big car, especially compared to a 1988 Accord. But now that my wife and I are considering maybe someday getting a 2018 Honda Accord Hybrid, which seems kinda big, I realized with a shock that in fact it's about the same size as a 1988 Olds 98....

Hey Ben, these cars were everywhere back in the day. My wifes Best Friend had the 89 Buick Electra, with the standard 3.8 liter V6, transverse front drive. It had the red "Rich Corinthian Vinyl" interior. The only problem with some of those cars were the ceramic timing chain sprocket, and therefore timing chain failure.

tjc78 · July 2019

ceramic timing chain sprocket

GM wasn't the only one who failed with those. Ford had them on the late 70's - mid 80's 302.

tonyg2016 · July 2019

Was the engine replaced because of the manufacturing issue that was discovered where metal shavings in the engine would eventually cause the engine to fail, or was it a different issue? How many miles on it when it was replaced?

engine failures on 2011-2014 sonatas and optimas are well documented except for the root cause. Initial cover story was the BS "metal shavings" scenario which was supposedly corrected in mid 2012. Engine recall extends all the way to 2014 with an increase in the warranty to 120k miles (Sonata) and unlimited miles (optima).

The newer version (2015-2018) are also affected but to a lesser extent. They have updated PCM software to detect engine knocking and put the car into "limp mode" before a major failure happens (at an inopportune time)

https://www.hyundai-forums.com/yf-2011-2014-sonata-i45/

To their credit, they have been replacing engines that are over the 120k miles, but that is because of the NHTSA and the class action lawsuits. Kia has been treating their customers much better than hyundai.

I own a 2011 Sonata GLS with low miles (47k) and am hoping i don't win the engine lottery; but even well-maintained engines are failing.

benjaminh · July 2019

Engine failure? That seems very strange these days.

But it makes me glad I own an Acura.

benjaminh · July 2019

cski said:
....Anyway, I still have my 2012 Kia Optima EX. It has a new engine, new struts,tires...all under warranty....

Welcome back!

Thank goodness for your warranty. What a headache.

roadburner · July 2019

cski said:

roadburner said:
The only Ford I've actually considered owning is a Mustang GT with the Performance Package- so the death of Ford's other cars is a non-issue for me.
Well, I could see having a Fiesta ST for a work beater, but that's it...
I hope you don't need the backseat's for, um, people. Not even an inch available for legs...which most folk have, last time I checked. LOL.

I have wanted a Mustang GT 5.0 FOREVER, but having my three kids safely and comfortably seated has always come first, and killed buying it...until very soon. They are all over 14, so I really don't need the back seat pretty soon, as my girls go their own way. They are 14, 16, and 18.

We chose to have one child- kept us out of Minivan Purgatory and also let me own cars with only "occasional" rear seats.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

benjaminh said:
Engine failure? That seems very strange these days.

But it makes me glad I own an Acura.

Hey Ben, It turns out that my "bad strut is making that noise" on a ride along with an "Experienced tech".
It was replaced, and did restore part of the ride, but the klunk klunk klank klunk noize over rough pavement, potholes, undulations..was the SWAY BAR END LINKS!!!!! Both front end links were thoroughly shot, and I had to research it myself and found it was a VERY well known issue, the parts are $30 a pair on ebay auto, and any shade tree mechanic can do it. Now, finally, after a year of disgust, my car is running PERFECTLY. It should be easy. The ODO only has 68,750 now, at 7 years old. Oh, the extended warranty paid for itself after the struts ($800) and the end links (astonishingly expensive $730) I am $320 ahead. Plus with no deductible! that was a good move at the time of purchase. To acknowledge other posts..I have no idea what really killed my engine, but I am glad it was replaced for free, and Kia owned up to it.
BTW, I had a rental for an astonishing 4.5 MONTHS. I got the same one last time. Enterprise rep asked me "do you want your Altima back"? Answer Really? for keeps? Yes! Absolutely. I have made a terrible car buying mistake!!! Can we trade?
He said: "no".

[Deleted User] · August 2019

Wanna trade for a gorgeous

sda said:

cski said:

andres3 said:

stickguy said:
hopefully they keep at least 1 smaller/midsize sedan. Make the Focus a little bigger, and split the difference?
ISN'T THAT WHAT ACURA DID? combining the TL and TSX to make the TLX. I don't think they are setting the world on fire with that strategy. I'm not sure who is buying the RLX.
I haven't been sure about Acura's their marketing for years. How about a new Integra???, instead of the VERY Civic looking ILX, Which basically IS a Luxed/Up Honda Civic. I would buy the better looking (IMO) Civic Sport, or the Si, which are on the low end price wise, and the Si with the wing looks like Darth Vader's earth vehicle. Is Honda withholding the Integra nameplate for some reason? My girlfriend had a 94, loaded with wing and Stock with premium sound and tinted windows. Compared to my car,it really was like the commercial where it was a rollercoaster ride. She loved driving my brute-force '87 Z24 with my newly installed 3.1 liter V6 with 190 HP in my mechanics tune, and a Getrag 5 speed manual. Considering the 87 Cavalier Z24 weighed very little, it would spin through third gear with my 225/60/14!!! Falken tires and racing clutch due to my insatiable urge to drive fast.Ok, back to the subject...
The Lexus sells wayyy more volume due to the ES350, and the RLX mostly. I have to say that the Lexus lineup is looking good, if not derivative of the same design they have been making for years. My favorite was always the IS350, with a zero to 60 in 4.8 to 5.1 seconds, depending on the car and the aggressiveness of the driver. However, the ES350, stock....did zero to 60 in 5.8 to 6.2 (depending on which mag and reviewer).

Anyway, I still have my 2012 Kia Optima EX. It has a new engine, new struts,tires...all under warranty (and new brake pads that I paid $20 to install.

I also replaced the rear tint, now at 20% due to bubbling on the rear with the rear defroster being the culprit for causing bubbles in the tint. It got so bad I could barely see out of it. There was a Maaco shop next door at the Springfield, VA Fullerton Rd. location, and I had some pretty bad front end trim where the clear coat came off, etc. They took care of ALL of it....and it was a good bit of work, for $100. It no, after 7 years, makes it look brand new.
Sorry I dont post much-Chris
Was the engine replaced because of the manufacturing issue that was discovered where metal shavings in the engine would eventually cause the engine to fail, or was it a different issue? How many miles on it when it was replaced?

Yes, it was the metal shavings. There was no warning. She just shut down...Luckily on my street. I pushed it in a visitors spot.

BTW: My rental SV Altima had a great stock stereo, GREAT gas mileage, and peppy pickup. I got used to the CVT VERY quickly. I did not get the ergonomics quickly, but hell, as soon as I retrieved my USB thumb drive I was happy just to find bass and treble adjustments, and phone pairing should have been a little easier for an '18.
It feels....more rubbery than mine. The steering is stiff compared to mine, but the ride absorbs everything you can throw at it. I really liked the car. But the styling should make it a favorite with CIA agents...legendary bland in grey with...more gray inside. I would LOVE to drive the "19, which looks surprisingly similar to the front end of my car. I vote it the first attractive Altima of all time!!!

[Deleted User] · August 2019

sda said:

berri said:
One of the hits against CVT was longevity. I'm assuming that has been resolved by now?
Good question. At 80k, the CVT is functioning fine. I spoke with a Service Tech and he said to do CVT fluid changes every 30-40k, which I have done. I have one of those lifetime drivetrain extended warranties that came with the car when I bought it. I don't want to test it and am hoping it is worth more than the paper it is printed on.

Sometimes those lifetime drivetrain warranties do not pay for all of the labor, or have a deductible. I heard this secondhand but maybe the fine print is worth checking into.
BTW, I have never heard of CVT fluid changes. There used to be lube jobs, but almost all cars have sealed ball joints that cant be lubed. If I am supposed to change the grease in the CVT no one has mentioned it at the dealer: and I have been at the dealer more than I would have liked to.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:
Some analysts think all this is part of a bigger and more ominous trend--that we are reaching, or have reached "peak car"--and that cars sales will never exceed present day numbers again.

Two of my daughters have no interest in driving, and are unlicensed at 16 and 19. However, my 14 year old cant wait, and have encouraged practice (on private property). I am no longer scared to death with her, but she did nick a bail of hay.

sda · August 2019

cski said:

sda said:

berri said:
One of the hits against CVT was longevity. I'm assuming that has been resolved by now?
Good question. At 80k, the CVT is functioning fine. I spoke with a Service Tech and he said to do CVT fluid changes every 30-40k, which I have done. I have one of those lifetime drivetrain extended warranties that came with the car when I bought it. I don't want to test it and am hoping it is worth more than the paper it is printed on.
Sometimes those lifetime drivetrain warranties do not pay for all of the labor, or have a deductible. I heard this secondhand but maybe the fine print is worth checking into.
BTW, I have never heard of CVT fluid changes. There used to be lube jobs, but almost all cars have sealed ball joints that cant be lubed. If I am supposed to change the grease in the CVT no one has mentioned it at the dealer: and I have been at the dealer more than I would have liked to.

I'm at 90k now and all is well. The CVT in the Accord maybe one of the last non-sealed units. It has a dipstick and the dealer can do a drain and fill or full exchange.

thebean · August 2019

So @sda, how many times did you change the fluid in your Accord? I ask because my ‘15 Accord has 31,000 miles and I’m wondering how much longer I have before I need to do that service. Thanks.

sda · August 2019

I did the first at 40k, pretty much all highway miles. I had a 45 mile commute each way. The second was done just over 70k. Both were drain and fill, i.e. not full exchange done at the Honda dealer.

thebean · August 2019

Great info @sda. Thanks very much for the quick reply. 👍

sda · August 2019

thebean said:
Great info @sda. Thanks very much for the quick reply. 👍

Glad to help. Hard to believe in a month I will have had the Accord 6 years, the longest I’ve owned any car. It still looks great and drives wonderfully. It’s been a joy to own. Only regular maintenance, oil changes every 5k, one battery, replacement tires at 60k, starter at 77k (sigh), original brake pads which still have good thickness and rotors, cabin and air filters, wiper blades. I still enjoy driving it.

stickguy · August 2019

next month (3 weeks!) the RDX turns 7. Not quite our record, but getting close. I think I had my 626 for 8 years, same for the Odyssey.

explorerx4 · August 2019

Not a mid size sedan, but in 2 days we will have had our Mustang 28 years.

roadburner · August 2019

Last May marked 17 years of Wrangler ownership; November will make 24 years I've owned the Club Sport.

tjc78 · August 2019

Amazing. I think the longest car I owned was my 99 S10. I had it about 7 years before giving it to my SIL so she could proceed to run it into the ground (and a pole, and another car.....)

[Deleted User] · August 2019

sda said:

cski said:

sda said:

berri said:
One of the hits against CVT was longevity. I'm assuming that has been resolved by now?
Good question. At 80k, the CVT is functioning fine. I spoke with a Service Tech and he said to do CVT fluid changes every 30-40k, which I have done. I have one of those lifetime drivetrain extended warranties that came with the car when I bought it. I don't want to test it and am hoping it is worth more than the paper it is printed on.
Sometimes those lifetime drivetrain warranties do not pay for all of the labor, or have a deductible. I heard this secondhand but maybe the fine print is worth checking into.
BTW, I have never heard of CVT fluid changes. There used to be lube jobs, but almost all cars have sealed ball joints that cant be lubed. If I am supposed to change the grease in the CVT no one has mentioned it at the dealer: and I have been at the dealer more than I would have liked to.
I'm at 90k now and all is well. The CVT in the Accord maybe one of the last non-sealed units. It has a dipstick and the dealer can do a drain and fill or full exchange.

My 6 speed auto in the Optima was pressure purged and refilled via a fluid input bolt on the trans and a drain bolt on the other end. That is the only way to service it. There is no dipstick (other than me) and the units that do break are swapped out, not repaired. I wonder where all the broken tranny's go? Some poor bloke in Korea is probably lashed 10 times if his Q/C employee number is on it.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

stickguy said:
next month (3 weeks!) the RDX turns 7. Not quite our record, but getting close. I think I had my 626 for 8 years, same for the Odyssey.

I am at 7 years also. I think I know what was really is wrong with my last 2.4 liter engine. One of the grinding sounds was audible this morning when I started the new motor after sitting for 3 days. I don't drive everyday, and I asked for synthetic oil only in the new motor at the dealer, but so far the first fill, and the first change, have both been normal oil. They said they "forgot". Fine, I will take it to the nice people at Exline. They will make sure things get done properly. The manual doesn't say anything about using synthetic oil on the 2.4, but is standard on the turbo.

I think because the car sits for three days a week causes all the oil to return to the pan, leaving my moving parts unprotected for over 2 seconds at startup. So, can you (stickguy) or any of you recommend something like "Slick 50" or equivalent, and is Mobile 1 still the best synth oil?
I am not going to let this engine suffer any more than it has to while in traffic jams. I need the internal parts coated with a microfilm of protection like teflon or whatever is best as a new engine sealer thats super slippery....etc, etc. I cant let it suffer the same fate. When I heard that startup grind noise this morning I was furious. Please help.

ab348 · August 2019

I think pretty much any synthetic oil is going to be super-slippery. My old Cutlass sits for days/weeks at a time and I never hear any odd noises when I start it. I use Castrol Edge synthetic and have for a number of years.

benjaminh · August 2019

The Savage Geese guy does a detailed review of the Accord 2.0 turbo with 6-speed manual. As he says, manuals are almost gone, and so this is a rare car. He mostly really likes it, but says the suspension is not as sporty as it could be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2vX-IVlwGs

[Deleted User] · August 2019

sda said:
I did the first at 40k, pretty much all highway miles. I had a 45 mile commute each way. The second was done just over 70k. Both were drain and fill, i.e. not full exchange done at the Honda dealer.

Yeah...the last job I had with a 45 mile commute each way, I bought a Mazda Protege LX with a 5 speed, 2.0l, sunroof, and nice wheels. I was starting to burn up the clutch (it was 45 miles into the mountains..wich have lots more snow).
Yeah..snow and ice also = prodigious burnouts with me. I finally gave it to my neice, bought my "99 Grand Cherokee V8. New the finance guy, who knew it WAS a little old lady's truck, but she barely changed the oil in time.So, we agreed on $7500 with the Chrysler Service Contract 2200 miles after I bought it; the Service Contract paid out $7185 ( I paid $1200 for the contract). Never had any prob except for rear driving lights/brake lights. Prob is water in the bulb contact. Scrape contact back to brass. Dry contact. Replace bulb.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

sda said:

cski said:

sda said:

berri said:
One of the hits against CVT was longevity. I'm assuming that has been resolved by now?
Good question. At 80k, the CVT is functioning fine. I spoke with a Service Tech and he said to do CVT fluid changes every 30-40k, which I have done. I have one of those lifetime drivetrain extended warranties that came with the car when I bought it. I don't want to test it and am hoping it is worth more than the paper it is printed on.
Sometimes those lifetime drivetrain warranties do not pay for all of the labor, or have a deductible. I heard this secondhand but maybe the fine print is worth checking into.
BTW, I have never heard of CVT fluid changes. There used to be lube jobs, but almost all cars have sealed ball joints that cant be lubed. If I am supposed to change the grease in the CVT no one has mentioned it at the dealer: and I have been at the dealer more than I would have liked to.
I'm at 90k now and all is well. The CVT in the Accord maybe one of the last non-sealed units. It has a dipstick and the dealer can do a drain and fill or full exchange.

The dipstck is usually me.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

stickguy said:
next month (3 weeks!) the RDX turns 7. Not quite our record, but getting close. I think I had my 626 for 8 years, same for the Odyssey.

I went to buy a Mazda 6. The handling is grezt, but there was no place for driving on a quick 2 lane road....my car was ultimately more powerful. (185 Mazda vs. 200 Kia) both interiors offered BMW style of utilizing a wrapround dash with all important guages aimed at the driver. They are equally sharp looking. Mine was aging in style though.

[Deleted User] · August 2019

explorerx4 said:
Not a mid size sedan, but in 2 days we will have had our Mustang 28 years.

Congrats@ Come on....give us Year, What kind of Mustang (base v6, 289, 302? 427 cobra jet, 351w or 351d or my favorite 5.0 in the 87- 94 as 95 -98 was years of 4.6 Now the new 4cyl turbo has 320 hp and 350 lb ft.
300 hp V6 (base model)
437 hp Coyote V8 GT model.

benjaminh · August 2019

cski said:

stickguy said:
next month (3 weeks!) the RDX turns 7. Not quite our record, but getting close. I think I had my 626 for 8 years, same for the Odyssey.
I went to buy a Mazda 6. The handling is grezt, but there was no place for driving on a quick 2 lane road....my car was ultimately more powerful. (185 Mazda vs. 200 Kia) both interiors offered BMW style of utilizing a wrapround dash with all important guages aimed at the driver. They are equally sharp looking. Mine was aging in style though.

You might consider test driving an Acura TLX, either the 4-cylinder or the V-6. The lease incentives on the TLX are really good. And if you want to buy, you can "lease to buy," which is what I'm probably doing.

tjc78 · August 2019

cski said:

explorerx4 said:
Not a mid size sedan, but in 2 days we will have had our Mustang 28 years.
Congrats@ Come on....give us Year, What kind of Mustang (base v6, 289, 302? 427 cobra jet, 351w or 351d or my favorite 5.0 in the 87- 94 as 95 -98 was years of 4.6 Now the new 4cyl turbo has 320 hp and 350 lb ft.
300 hp V6 (base model)
437 hp Coyote V8 GT model.

LOL.. doing the math would get you in the right generation.

andres3 · August 2019

Returned the Kia Optima Lease today. Total non-event! (had a pre-inspect).

Test drove an S6 with 65,000 miles.. Drove like new, but not as sporty as an S4.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

nyccarguy said:
@cski

It has a new engine

You need to go into further detail. Did you experience any symptoms?

It's stopped running due to a factory defect. The defect was oil flow vs friction. There were no symptoms prior to the engine shutting off. It was running normally, with good temp and name brand fuel. Then, it shut off. No noise, no shudder. It stopped dead and that was it.
The one thing I always hated about the 2.4 liter engine is that when it started after sitting for 2 days, it sounded like something was scraping inside- like the valves had no oil whatsoever, but only briefly. Dealer said it was normal Direct Injection startup. Sounded like B.S. to me. There were copious amounts of metal shavings in the oil pan on the original engine, so the engine ate itself. On the new engine, with the addition of Mobile 1 oil and filter, plus a friction modifier, it no longer makes the nasty noise during start up.
I no longer hear the valves tapping. It starts like a Honda it runs like a Honda and it's quite a bit quicker than the previous motor DOA with 68,500 mi. Also, I only use premium unleaded on the new motor all the time now. The new engine only has 2500 miles on it and I'm way better off. Again there was no warning on the old motor. It just stopped. There were metal shavings in the oil pan galore. The engine literally ate itself alive. So no more free oil changes at the dealer. I use my own guys at:
Exline Automotive, Fullerton Rd.
Springfield, VA. 22153.
They also took care of my LED headlight conversion, and dialed in the suspension.They treat me fair, been in business for 30 years. Nuff said.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

sda said:

cski said:

andres3 said:

stickguy said:
hopefully they keep at least 1 smaller/midsize sedan. Make the Focus a little bigger, and split the difference?
ISN'T THAT WHAT ACURA DID? combining the TL and TSX to make the TLX. I don't think they are setting the world on fire with that strategy. I'm not sure who is buying the RLX.
I haven't been sure about Acura's their marketing for years. How about a new Integra???, instead of the VERY Civic looking ILX, Which basically IS a Luxed/Up Honda Civic. I would buy the better looking (IMO) Civic Sport, or the Si, which are on the low end price wise, and the Si with the wing looks like Darth Vader's earth vehicle. Is Honda withholding the Integra nameplate for some reason? My girlfriend had a 94, loaded with wing and Stock with premium sound and tinted windows. Compared to my car,it really was like the commercial where it was a rollercoaster ride. She loved driving my brute-force '87 Z24 with my newly installed 3.1 liter V6 with 190 HP in my mechanics tune, and a Getrag 5 speed manual. Considering the 87 Cavalier Z24 weighed very little, it would spin through third gear with my 225/60/14!!! Falken tires and racing clutch due to my insatiable urge to drive fast.Ok, back to the subject...
The Lexus sells wayyy more volume due to the ES350, and the RLX mostly. I have to say that the Lexus lineup is looking good, if not derivative of the same design they have been making for years. My favorite was always the IS350, with a zero to 60 in 4.8 to 5.1 seconds, depending on the car and the aggressiveness of the driver. However, the ES350, stock....did zero to 60 in 5.8 to 6.2 (depending on which mag and reviewer).

Anyway, I still have my 2012 Kia Optima EX. It has a new engine, new struts,tires...all under warranty (and new brake pads that I paid $20 to install.

I also replaced the rear tint, now at 20% due to bubbling on the rear with the rear defroster being the culprit for causing bubbles in the tint. It got so bad I could barely see out of it. There was a Maaco shop next door at the Springfield, VA Fullerton Rd. location, and I had some pretty bad front end trim where the clear coat came off, etc. They took care of ALL of it....and it was a good bit of work, for $100. It no, after 7 years, makes it look brand new.
Sorry I dont post much-Chris
Was the engine replaced because of the manufacturing issue that was discovered where metal shavings in the engine would eventually cause the engine to fail, or was it a different issue? How many miles on it when it was replaced?

Yes...metal shavings. This all happens during startup because of those free oil changes with Korean oil and filters.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

tonyg2016 said:

Was the engine replaced because of the manufacturing issue that was discovered where metal shavings in the engine would eventually cause the engine to fail, or was it a different issue? How many miles on it when it was replaced?

engine failures on 2011-2014 sonatas and optimas are well documented except for the root cause. Initial cover story was the BS "metal shavings" scenario which was supposedly corrected in mid 2012. Engine recall extends all the way to 2014 with an increase in the warranty to 120k miles (Sonata) and unlimited miles (optima).

The newer version (2015-2018) are also affected but to a lesser extent. They have updated PCM software to detect engine knocking and put the car into "limp mode" before a major failure happens (at an inopportune time)

https://www.hyundai-forums.com/yf-2011-2014-sonata-i45/

To their credit, they have been replacing engines that are over the 120k miles, but that is because of the NHTSA and the class action lawsuits. Kia has been treating their customers much better than hyundai.

I own a 2011 Sonata GLS with low miles (47k) and am hoping i don't win the engine lottery; but even well-maintained engines are failing.

Yes..my 12 optima ex 2.4 was killed due to cheap dealer oil and filters.
There is no oil in the pistons and up top for the first 2 seconds during startup. I used to get the free oil change and filter...and that cheap [non-permissible content removed] oil killed the engine. I have a new engine, and only use mobile 1 and a friction modifier like molly, but more advanced. No more scraping noises and valve noises at startup. With the addition of premium 93 or 94 octane fuel, the difference is amazing.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

ab348 said:
I think pretty much any synthetic oil is going to be super-slippery. My old Cutlass sits for days/weeks at a time and I never hear any odd noises when I start it. I use Castrol Edge synthetic and have for a number of years.

Bingo!

stickguy · October 2019

the oil stuff is certainly a good idea, but the high octane fuel on that engine is not going to do anything that RUG top tier won't do.

sda · October 2019

My sister bought a 2011 Sonata Sport for her sons to drive at college. So far it has been an ok car. Does the engine have to fail for it to be replaced? I think it has around 100k.

stickguy · October 2019

I don't think they do it proactively. maybe if it is making bad noises and they pull the pan?

it also isn't a guarantee it happens. Plenty of people will never have a problem even at higher miles.

Kinda like the Honda V6 AT issues. some people swear they all die early. I had 175K on mine when I sold it and it was doing fine.

nyccarguy · October 2019

I’m glad Hyundai/Kia are stepping up and doing “the right thing” even with engines past the 120K mile mark. This is all the more reason to consider leasing. In 3 years, just give it back and get a new one. You can get a very healthy discount along with generous incentives & cheap money to make up for the lousy residual values most of these mid sized sedans have.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

cski said:

sda said:

berri said:
One of the hits against CVT was longevity. I'm assuming that has been resolved by now?
Good question. At 80k, the CVT is functioning fine. I spoke with a Service Tech and he said to do CVT fluid changes every 30-40k, which I have done. I have one of those lifetime drivetrain extended warranties that came with the car when I bought it. I don't want to test it and am hoping it is worth more than the paper it is printed on.
Sometimes those lifetime drivetrain warranties do not pay for all of the labor, or have a deductible. I heard this secondhand but maybe the fine print is worth checking into.
BTW, I have never heard of CVT fluid changes. There used to be lube jobs, but almost all cars have sealed ball joints that cant be lubed. If I am supposed to change the grease in the CVT no one has mentioned it at the dealer: and I have been at the dealer more than I would have liked to.

Most of the bushings in todays cars are polyurethane, and are super durable. By the time they fail, the car would probably have over 150k. Rubber bushings are what gave cars that "road feel" that car magazine testers go on and on about. Look, I dont like being super-isolated from the outside road...but I do want to listen to the stereo at a volume less than 60 on the highway. Oh...speaking of speakers...when my Kicker 6.75" door speakers were installed, Worst Buy failed to reinstall these recycled cardboard "cups"....or even tell me my car came with them. Probably because the magnets on the Jickers were too big for the cones to slip over them. That explains the lack of bass that resonates all over the inner panels...but never reaches my ears. With a 250 watt RMS Kicker amp just for the interior speakers (a separate mono sub amp runs the umm....sub. (master of the obvious here) have any of you tried to add them yourself or know anything about them? I want to enjoy the system I paid for...and without those "bass cones" only my 10" dual sub box provides any satisfying power.
Car is running great...turns 8 years old on December 23rd.
Last thing on engine. MOBILE ONE ONLY and a synthetic pnly filter.
+ a friction modifier: kind of like teflon...but is thin enough not to vpid the manufactures warranty...like Slick 50 did 25 years ago.

[Deleted User] · October 2019

Oh, I hear mid size sedans are becoming less and less popular. I don't understand. I don't want to live in a wold w/o Honda Accords!!! Why do people want to buy the same platform...made unneccessary tall and heavy? Then use the same engine in this "big, fat and awkwardly taller vehicle; which causes it to suck". But my fellow wayward Americans seem to be thrilled with them. Ask about their 0 to 60 times on threir new vehicle; and you know it's slow when the man says "Its really peppy". Code name for "gutless" (which is what my72 Olds 305 2 barrell was.) However, back then a 396 big block with a 750 CFM 4 barrel on a high rise intake manifold and headers could easily fix that. Not so much today. The 396 with a turbo 400 trans was longer than many of these modern Slightly Ugly Vehicles. (trying to think of more accurate acronyms for them).

I am never ever ever buying a fake SUV. I love cars, not quasi AWD upsize sedan platforms; where the builders seem to blow air into into the carbon fiber bags instead of the other way around...then shoved in an autoclave at 10° above absolute zero. I DONT UNDERSTAND "SUPER SLOW UTILITY VEHICLE PEOPLE" (hybrid of course just to slow it down some more).
Lastly...if you own a single family home, just have 2 decent cars and a 10 year old, $5,000 pickup for your home upkeep.

If you need seating for 8...maybe start thinking about looking into reading materials on "I may need theapy if "God help me if I have to change another diaper or my wife says- "oh this would be sooooooooo cute for little Timmy" I will jump out the nearest window above the "Sport Activity Vehicle" I hate and aim for it as I fall.

stickguy · October 2019

Lots of reason. Easier to get in and out when not low to the ground. Better visibility. Roads are terrible so bigger sidewalls. The carrying capacity of a wagon back. More comfortable back seat.

Those are just the functional reasons. Especially if only have one vehicle.

Of course style and image counts. Otherwise people would drive the wagon version of sedans like they used to!

roadburner · October 2019

I could possibly be talked into an X3 M40i or X3 M Competition, but I still prefer a smaller coupe that can beat most challengers at the Stoplight Grand Prix.

tjc78 · October 2019

I’m certainly not an SUV fan... but I’ll say I use the utility of ours quite frequently.

Before I was married with kids I always had a sedan and an older pickup (S10) for house projects.

If I had my way I’d get the wife a small car to go back and forth to the train and then an older 4 door pickup for trips with the kids and hauling stuff. She just happens to like driving an SUV so that’s why we have one.

stickguy · October 2019

there is no way my wife is going back to a sedan. And we definitely are going to keep 1 utility vehicle in the fleet.

kyfdx · October 2019

Made that mistake once. Put my wife in an Infiniti sedan lease, after her first X3. After 18 months, sold my son’s car and let him drive the Infiniti, and put her back in another X3. It just wasn’t worth listening to that, any more.

stickguy · October 2019

I already had to flip out of the Elantra sport because my wife was whining about it being too low, too uncomfortable. She seemed OK with the TLX at least. Though probably would have preferred an CUV of some sort, at least if she was going to drive it on a regular basis.

next one for sure!

tjc78 · October 2019

With us having the second home, I see no way not to have a Ute of some kind. There is always something to haul a back and forth. Next one we get I'm going to have a hitch and bike rack installed. Kid's are going to want their bikes at home and down the shore. Even with as big as the Enclave is it gets tight wit the bikes in there and our gear for the weekend.

Midsize Sedans 2.0

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