Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

nyccarguy · October 2020

stickguy said:
which dealer? there is one N. NJ dealer that is on my "won't ever go there again" list!

I think Park Avenue Acura

stickguy · October 2020

oh. never shopped there. So no worries!

My guess at this point, the local guy (same place I got the new RDX) will get to agree to match an actual legit deal elsewhere.

though kind of pointless shopping right now, if not doing anything until November, in case the numbers change.

tjc78 · October 2020

I saw the guy on LH which is what made me think of the MDX.

@stickguy
I can technically pull the trigger now. We close on the 30th and the ten day re-pull is all done and we are cleared to close.

Is the Pilot that much bigger? When I last sat in the MDX it didn't seem that much smaller than the Enclave which is basically the same size as the Pilot.

qbrozen · October 2020

tifighter said:

xwesx said:
Yeah, I have no issues with the design. I think they stuck with the Hummer physique while pushing a strong "post-modern" vibe. It is a bit of a farce that pretty much every feature they touted in the intro video is available only on the extremely-limited-production and top-of-the-line intro series. 1000 vehicles... all reserved within minutes of the reveal. The next-highest-trim level has none of that.... it's just a ho-hum electric truck.
An $80K Hummer base truck with 250 miles range due in 2024.
vs
A $70K Cybertruck range topper with 500 miles due end of 2021.

GM has some work to do.

I'll believe it when it actually happens. If a 500-mile 2.9s $70k truck comes to fruition, that's fantastic. Too bad I can't stand looking at it, though.

stickguy · October 2020

I didn't think there was a material difference between the MDX and Pilot. But never really compared. Both seemed big to me, compared to an RDX.

stickguy · October 2020

tjc78 said:
I saw the guy on LH which is what made me think of the MDX.

@stickguy
I can technically pull the trigger now. We close on the 30th and the ten day re-pull is all done and we are cleared to close.

Is the Pilot that much bigger? When I last sat in the MDX it didn't seem that much smaller than the Enclave which is basically the same size as the Pilot.

I am just skittish about doing anything right before a closing. Though could make the deal with them taking the Buick off your hands, and eating the last payment and dispo fee! Hey, never hurts to ask. Though not sure used car prices are still so over inflated now.

pensfan83 · October 2020

nyccarguy said:

tjc78 said:

28firefighter said:
My experience helping my friend a few weeks back was that the local dealer had an ungodly amount of MDX tech inventory - something like 70+.

Their initial response to our offer was that we were using the wrong MF for the sale price (probably didn't love that we asked for a 4k+ dealer discount before incentives) which now makes more sense given what @michaell said above about the two different programs. We just said we'd take the offer to another local dealer who also had like 80 of them and they caved.

Given the price points other 3 row SUVs are hitting right now, the outgoing MDX would be my top choice. Hardly a penalty box even though it is an older design.
Thanks! Waiting on a quote now to see what they come back with.

I’m thinking $500 with just first month OOP is possible for an SH-AWD Tech.

I also just looked at the Advance again. It’s really not captains chairs. It’s a 40/20/40 bench. So access to third row is the same and you lose a seat.
There's a dealer in Northern, NJ who posts on LH. He's no fee (as he's an Acura salesman).

I agree with the others that even though the current MDX is dated, it is a strong value especially if you are going to lease. I wish it would work for me space wise. I'd probably ditch the Pilot and lease an MDX in a second.

He was helpful when I reached out with some general questions. He provided info that made me adjust my expectations and align my offers with the market.

tjc78 · October 2020

Yeah, I don't think I will unless it's a deal I can't refuse and I've cleared it with the mortgage guy.

Way back when we started all this I mentioned needing to replace the Enclave and may need to do that while in the process of the loan. They said UW wouldn't have a problem with that as long as the payment was similar.

I'm betting that the November deals on any 2020's won't be much different. If anything residuals will drop a bit and the other #s will compensate for it.

kyfdx · October 2020

tjc78 said:
Yeah, I don't think I will unless it's a deal I can't refuse and I've cleared it with the mortgage guy.

Way back when we started all this I mentioned needing to replace the Enclave and may need to do that while in the process of the loan. They said UW wouldn't have a problem with that as long as the payment was similar.

I'm betting that the November deals on any 2020's won't be much different. If anything residuals will drop a bit and the other #s will compensate for it.

Acura programs run though 11/02

au1994 · October 2020

tjc78 said:
Yeah, I don't think I will unless it's a deal I can't refuse and I've cleared it with the mortgage guy.

Way back when we started all this I mentioned needing to replace the Enclave and may need to do that while in the process of the loan. They said UW wouldn't have a problem with that as long as the payment was similar.

I'm betting that the November deals on any 2020's won't be much different. If anything residuals will drop a bit and the other #s will compensate for it.

If you have made it through underwriting you should be fine. They have already pulled credit of course. Our refi took so long they had to pull credit again which I was not happy about. In the interim we had bought a Peloton and used their free money to finance. It did not show up on the new report when they pulled it. It wouldn’t have skewed anything but just shows you the lag.

nyccarguy · October 2020

tjc78 said:
I saw the guy on LH which is what made me think of the MDX.

@stickguy
I can technically pull the trigger now. We close on the 30th and the ten day re-pull is all done and we are cleared to close.

Is the Pilot that much bigger? When I last sat in the MDX it didn't seem that much smaller than the Enclave which is basically the same size as the Pilot.

For us, the biggest difference was the room in the 3rd row and behind the 3rd row. In other 3 row SUVs that we sat in/test drove, the 2nd row slides back and butts right up against the 3rd row. In our Pilot, there is still some 3rd row leg room if the 2nd row is pushed all the way back. Usually 1 of the 3 kids is back there and we slide the 2nd row up to give whoever is in the 3rd row more leg room. Even when we slide the 2nd row forward, the kids in the 2nd row don't complain about leg room.

Behind the 3rd row, the Pilot just has a few more inches of cargo space that makes a big difference for us. 26 Payments to go. December will be 3 years. Might as well ride it out.

greg128 · October 2020

Saw this on GMC website. Tons of hype but still looks pretty impressive. I predict this will be very popular with rich people.

https://www.gmc.com/electric-truck/hummer-ev?ppc=MICROSOFT_700000002006759_71700000062252447_58700006395572184_p57775174121&gclid=741e35606b9b1678c2fd6af0fc20c312&gclsrc=3p.ds&&d_src=3876784&d_adsrc=4568612&d_campaign=71700000062252447&d_site=MICROSOFT&d_adgroup=58700006395572184&d_keyword=2022+hummer&gclick=&msclkid=741e35606b9b1678c2fd6af0fc20c312

ab348 · October 2020

11,500 lb-ft of torque just boggles the mind.

Michaell · October 2020

ab348 said:
11,500 lb-ft of torque just boggles the mind.

So, if they halved the power, would they have doubled the range?

Is there even a relationship between the two? Still learning about EVs.

tifighter · October 2020

ab348 said:
11,500 lb-ft of torque just boggles the mind.

That's at the wheel. Which means about 1000 lb-ft of torque the way everyone else measures it - at the motor. Including GM on all of their other products.

tjc78 · October 2020

Quote in on the MDX tech.

$548 36/10K. With just first OOP. Sketchy details but said MF was .00225 which is marked up from @Michaell ‘s numbers above.

Michaell · October 2020

tjc78 said:
Quote in on the MDX tech.

$548 36/10K. With just first OOP. Sketchy details but said MF was .00225 which is marked up from @Michaell ‘s numbers above.

Not exactly.

You get the .00215 if:

1. You are a returning Acura customer, or
2. You make one security deposit (which we recommend)

That's still a strong quote, but there might be room to move.

tjc78 · October 2020

D’oh! Just called them out on marking it up! Lol.

Michaell · October 2020

tjc78 said:
D’oh! Just called them out on marking it up! Lol.

Oops - that's what happens when you try to negotiate in real time with information you get from this thread.

Michaell · October 2020

Michaell said:

tjc78 said:
D’oh! Just called them out on marking it up! Lol.
Oops - that's what happens when you try to negotiate in real time with information you get from this thread.

And, really - why mark up the MF by only .00010 - that isn't worth it to the dealer.

Gotta do it like the Land Rover dealers do - markups of .00100 are commonly reported.

28firefighter · October 2020

You don’t qualify for loyalty, so that hurts. But conquest is $1500 and you’d qualify for that.

What’s your tax, doc fee, and registration rate?

Michaell · October 2020

On an unrelated note, does anyone have a recommendation for an iPhone holder for the Outback? I'd like to get one for the wife, but not sure if I should get one that mounts to the vent, or the WeatherTech one that fits in the cup holder.

tjc78 · October 2020

28firefighter said:
You don’t qualify for loyalty, so that hurts. But conquest is $1500 and you’d qualify for that.

What’s your tax, doc fee, and registration rate?

We are 6.625% and the other fees are usually another $650 or so. The dealers never give all the numbers and since I’m not decided I’m not going to push.

I have another Acura quote in as well.

Once I decide is when I demand a breakdown to see where I can cut down a bit.

All in all first pencil at $548 for a 53K MSRP isn’t too bad.

tjc78 · October 2020

Michaell said:

tjc78 said:
D’oh! Just called them out on marking it up! Lol.
Oops - that's what happens when you try to negotiate in real time with information you get from this thread.

Don’t even sweat it! This group is like having 20 wingmen on call. Appreciate it all!

cdnpinhead · October 2020

tifighter said:
That's at the wheel. Which means about 1000 lb-ft of torque the way everyone else measures it - at the motor. Including GM on all of their other products.

I figured that must be the case, given that a 650 hp Cummins diesel generates ~2050 lb-ft.

corvette · October 2020

Michaell said:
On an unrelated note, does anyone have a recommendation for an iPhone holder for the Outback? I'd like to get one for the wife, but not sure if I should get one that mounts to the vent, or the WeatherTech one that fits in the cup holder.

Vent mount if the vent puts it in a good location. I have a Kenu (I think) that has worked well. Don’t use one in the Tundra since it has CarPlay.

28firefighter · October 2020

It isn't a bad first pencil including conquest - 6.X% discount. I think you can push for 8%.

au1994 · October 2020

tjc78 said:
Quote in on the MDX tech.

$548 36/10K. With just first OOP. Sketchy details but said MF was .00225 which is marked up from @Michaell ‘s numbers above.

Pretty strong opening bid on their part. How much of a discount in addition to the incentives?

Edit- saw the other posts. Heck, getting it to a 1% lease looks doable. Take it and run.

au1994 · October 2020

Michaell said:
On an unrelated note, does anyone have a recommendation for an iPhone holder for the Outback? I'd like to get one for the wife, but not sure if I should get one that mounts to the vent, or the WeatherTech one that fits in the cup holder.

Be careful of the cup holder one. I bought one for the wife in the X1 and it didn’t fit as the cup holders are somewhat under the dash.

I have a Vava off of Amazon. Magnetic to the phone and Command like strips to attach to the dash.

Michaell · October 2020

au1994 said:

Michaell said:
On an unrelated note, does anyone have a recommendation for an iPhone holder for the Outback? I'd like to get one for the wife, but not sure if I should get one that mounts to the vent, or the WeatherTech one that fits in the cup holder.
Be careful of the cup holder one. I bought one for the wife in the X1 and it didn’t fit as the cup holders are somewhat under the dash.

I have a Vava off of Amazon. Magnetic to the phone and Command like strips to attach to the dash.

The cupholders in the Subaru are next to the gear shift.

xwesx · October 2020

tifighter said:

stickguy said:
wonder how fast that 500 mile range drops towing anything near the towing capacity. and sounds like fun trying to pull a truck with a big trailer into a supercharger!
Pull-through truck specific stalls are coming to superchargers next year. As for towing range, well, we don't know, but I'd rather start out with 500 miles than 250.

Yes, so true!

I'm not sure how many of the rest of you checked the information on the website, but, really, the only vehicle in the range that is even remotely worth the buy-in price is the limited edition. Granted, that one is hella-expensive (like $115K), though I'm guessing that the crazy roof and suspension features are what push it there.

Honestly, if they had a trim that had all the practical stuff (Battery, anyone?!) and left the silly shock-factor features at the factory, that would be a winner, for me. As far as a direct comparison to the Cybertruck, if I was *really* in the market, it would take a fair bit of desperation for me to finally relent and go with the Tesla. Lots of cool features, but, frankly, it's a clown car.

stickguy · October 2020

tjc78 said:
Yeah, I don't think I will unless it's a deal I can't refuse and I've cleared it with the mortgage guy.

Way back when we started all this I mentioned needing to replace the Enclave and may need to do that while in the process of the loan. They said UW wouldn't have a problem with that as long as the payment was similar.

I'm betting that the November deals on any 2020's won't be much different. If anything residuals will drop a bit and the other #s will compensate for it.

I guess technically you could make the deal this week, and just pick it up on Halloween.

stickguy · October 2020

I think the vent or something that sticks on the dash makes more sense. Otherwise you are having to look down to see it. Better to be up in line of sight.

roadburner · October 2020

mjfloyd1 said:

roadburner said:

stickguy said:
Here’s one for RB. a club sport to go with his club sport.

https://carsandbids.com/auctions/92RqJAox/2019-bmw-m4-cs
An M2 CS has just arrived...
Is this one a keeper?

Not mine- just the last hurrah for this generation of the 2 Series.

fintail · October 2020

Sounds like more non-GAAP accounting

tifighter said:

That's at the wheel. Which means about 1000 lb-ft of torque the way everyone else measures it - at the motor. Including GM on all of their other products.

stickguy · October 2020

nice review on the new Elantra N line (the successor to my old Elantra Sport). Sounds like they addressed the few issues I had with it. Too bad he didn't get to drive the manual, but I will say that the Hyundai 7 speed DSG was a sweet match to the 1.6t engine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOkt0xg_DOI

fintail · October 2020

Wow that DLO fail, an entire fake window, I wonder who signed off on that. Pet peeve.

Sandman6472 · October 2020

Just watched the video of the 2021 Elantra N-Line and really liked it! Not sure if the length will work for my parking situation, but will definitely give it a try once it comes to our marketplace. Was obvious how much the reviewer liked the car and think Hyundai did a nice job with it's overall look, both inside and out. Looks killer in red and assuming it'll also come in black & white and hopefully a gray color. Only negative for me is that it's a sedan and I prefer a hatchback to be honest but hopefully, Hyundai will make it in a hatch also. Looks to be a more grown up vehicle now and they did a great job shrinking the Sonata. Also was impressed with the projected miles per gallon, as it seems to be more on the economical side while driving more on the sporty side. A very good combination if his figures play out here in the real world. Am hoping that it'll cost somewhere around the $25K point or even less. I would definitely go with the auto tranny if I did indeed purchase one. And like most Hyundai/Kia products, am assuming it'll be "cheap to keep", something I'd like going forward if possible. Depending on how it drives and the cost, could definitely see me buying one as my next vehicle!
Good job Hyundai!!!

Sandman6472 · October 2020

Rained all day today so it was a bit of a chore driving at work. I had to drive the 13-pack right around lunchtime, but glad I did. While at PBI getting two vehicles to bring to an office in Lantana, the other two got into a slight accident while one was backing up. It didn't hurt the paint but it left a nice dimple in the sheet metal. Naturally, there were forms to fill out and it took a good hour to get that all done. But accidents do happen, just part of the game I suspect. We eventually got another vehicle and dropped both off at the location that needed them. Was just glad that I wasn't involved to be honest. I'm sure that after a certain amount of these fender benders, Enterprise would have no choice but to let the multiple offender go. No one likes to fire someone or get fired, but depending on how many vehicles get damaged, management has no other choice than to sever ties with that person. I do remember someone I worked with as an independent contractor who also got hired by Hertz, getting fired because he had a bunch of small fender benders. Guess they felt that he was too great a risk and had to say good bye once and for all.
I know these kind of things are sometimes unavoidable but I try very hard to be as careful as I can so not to have one. I did have one at Hertz, minor though it was, I still had to fill out paperwork and then go for a drug test. Doubt they do the drug testing anymore, but back then, it was mandatory. And with all the rain today, we saw a multitude of accidents all over South Florida!

qbrozen · October 2020

fintail said:
Wow that DLO fail, an entire fake window, I wonder who signed off on that. Pet peeve.

Huh?

stickguy · October 2020

Fin doesn't like plastic filler pieces. I think that one looks fine, though I agree with the reviewer, putting in a small window would have been nice.

stickguy · October 2020

Sandy, it is probably about 175-178" long. Last I heard, they were dropping the Elantra GT (the shorter hatchback version) so I doubt that it will be reintroduced with this model design. If you want something like that, need to look at a Kona or Seltos.

MPG on the 1.6t/DSG powertrain was good. I regularly got 30 local, and could easily break 40 on a highway run, and it was still very quick when you felt like going fast. and ran on RUG.

ab348 · October 2020

Sandman6472 said:
Just watched the video of the 2021 Elantra N-Line and really liked it! Not sure if the length will work for my parking situation, but will definitely give it a try once it comes to our marketplace.

This would be a terrible car for you, Sandy. It is 184" long so I don't know if it even fits in your garage. Early reviews are also mentioning difficulty getting in and out, which is an unusual thing to mention so there must be an issue there beyond it just being low. 18" wheels on a sport suspension equals a harsh ride more than likely as well. It isn't coming in a hatchback so forget about that too. Sorry to rain on your parade.

stickguy · October 2020

ride was not cushy, but the handling made up for it. But it is definitely tuned toward the sporty side. But far from harsh. It's a small sedan, and unfortunately style over easy of accessibility is the rule these days.

I am curious to test one out though.

184"? Really? I did not think it grew that much.

ab348 · October 2020

stickguy said:
ride was not cushy, but the handling made up for it. But it is definitely tuned toward the sporty side. But far from harsh.

Until the new one gets driven, any assessment of ride quality is at best a guess. Given this is a N-line model and not the previous sporty iteration, I would guess it is stiffer.

stickguy · October 2020

the N line is the old sport with a new name. The real hot rod is the N model, and that is not out yet.

Hyundai is just as confusing with names as Caddy is, with their V type, and V, which were totally different cars! I guess BMW does the same thing with M cars, and Msport trim packages.

qbrozen · October 2020

stickguy said:
Fin doesn't like plastic filler pieces. I think that one looks fine, though I agree with the reviewer, putting in a small window would have been nice.

I thought MAYBE he was referring to that. But DLO? That's what threw me.

ab348 · October 2020

qbrozen said:

I thought MAYBE he was referring to that. But DLO? That's what threw me.

DLO is shorthand for "daylight opening". I had to look it up the first time I encountered the term.

xwesx · October 2020

That @fintail.... he is WAY too hip for this crowd!

fintail · October 2020

DLO Fail DLO = Daylight Opening, failing when black filler panels or complete fake windows are used to complete a window line. Lazy design IMO.

qbrozen said:

Huh?

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