Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
And something uncommon then and now, this Concord in a nice color, some options (slotted mags!). MSRP $4555, which also seems low, but I know these cars were sold as value propositions:
Been a while since I've seen one of those, the later ones with the rear quarter window will always be Gary's dad's (Al) car in 'Weird Science':
I remember the tires that came with the F-41 suspension on '77 full-size Chevys were a pinstripe whitewall. I like that. In fact, my new '93 Caprice Classic with F-41 had a pinstripe whitewall.
My best high-school buddy got a '76 Nova strippo coupe while his car was being repaired in a body shop. The Nova was new or close to it. It had plaid cloth seating which looked horrible, but we both thought it was comfortable and the cloth actually felt like a blanket.
I know I like Studebakers, which were the kings of hanging onto a design, but I can't see one of those later AMC's without thinking "1970 Hornet".
Engel was a protege of George Walker, the designer who became Ford's first styling VP in 1955. When he retired, Engel did not get the call to succeed him, that job going to Gene Bordinat. He was discontented and Walker apparently recommended him to Chrysler, who were looking to replace Virgil Exner.
In some profiles about stylists of that era I've seen references to Engel being gruff and crude, but in others I've read that he was a great boss, so who knows. I suspect most of the auto company design chiefs back then had pretty big egos. I thought this note he left behind on a design was pretty cool (though spelling apparently wasn't a strength):
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
You've heard me say many times that Bill Mitchell grew up in my little hometown and would return back. Supposedly he was a terrible boss and a big drinker. I always remember reading him saying that designing a small car "...was like tailoring a dwarf".
I believe the '75 Seville and '77 Caprice were two of his last designs. When we got our '77 Impala coupe in Nov. '76, I remember a bag boy at the A&P (remember when they'd actually carry your groceries out to your car?) said "That looks like a Seville!". I think mostly only in the large rounded wheel openings and otherwise simple proportions.
My favorite Chrysler, besides Imperial, is the '65 300-L. We talked about this before though, but I thought GM's interior studios had it all over everybody else in that time period. I think a lot of that though is whatever you were used to.
However, one thing I never realized before...I always thought 1974 was a worse year than '75, when it came to auto sales. I'd always thought '73 was a record year, but then the oil embargo knocked the market down for '74, and then '75-76 were recovery years, with things really taking off again in '77. But, looking at sales figures, it looks like it got bad in '74, and then even worse in '75.
As a whole, Chevy fell from 2.334M to 1.756M, from '74-75. In '73 they were around 2.580M. So, the market tightening up in general was probably responsible for part of that drop. If Chevy hadn't redesigned the Nova, it might have fell even worse!
It also looks like 1974 was the Nova's best sales year, ever, despite the oil embargo. So, maybe between the high prices, fuel shortages, and all this "end of the world" scaremongering that was going on back then, a lot of people rushed out and bought them? That might have pulled a lot of sales forward...people who would have otherwise waited a year or two to buy a car, suddenly decided it was time for something more economical, and ASAP. Another factor was probably the Ford Granada. It was a pretty hot item when it hit the market for '75.
Here's where I'm getting some of these stats from:
Annual auto production: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Automobile_Production_Figures
Nova production: https://www.novaresource.org/production.htm
Some of those Wikipedia numbers appear off, though. I don't know about 73/74/75, specifically, but for as long as I can remember, the accepted figures for '57 DeSotos was around 117,500, and around 124,000 for Chrysler. But this site lists around 126K for DeSoto and 122K for Chrysler. But then, I see a lot of numbers that are correct, so who knows? But, it probably still serves well as a rough guide.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
The smallest V8? A 350, which was called out on the front fenders.
Probably not great in '74, or so it would seem.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
For example, with the Nova in '74, the breakdown was:
80,633 hatchbacks
210,984 coupes
98,920 4-door sedans.
But, with, say, the Valiant, the breakdown was:
277,409 Dusters (includes the 360)
127,430 4-door sedans
54,244 hardtop coupes
The disparity wasn't as bad with the Maverick:
139,818 2-doors
137,728 4-doors
23,502 Grabbers
I wonder, with the Maverick, if people got turned off by the 2-door being so much smaller than the 4-door, that many of them just went with the 4-door, perceiving it to be a better value? The 2-door was $2790 and the 4-door was $2824.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
My first Dart, a '69 with a 225 slant six, usually got around 15-18 mpg in local driving, and could get 22-23 out on the highway without too much trouble. But, I guess a few years of emissions strangulation, and increased weight from those crash bumpers and such, took their toll.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYGI0jerISk
Speaking of Novas, remember Mama Harper's car:
It was a lemon in the show, and I remember the engine sounded clattery. Fred Willard was excellent as the sleazy used car salesman.
Funny, I will say that in the 22 mos. we owned ours, it was the worst-assembled new Chevy we ever owned. People were often surprised at the low sticker price ($2,625 at the bottom, with optional floor shift, AM radio, Rally Wheels, whitewalls, Exterior Decor Group (body side moldings and bright metal trim around the side windows)). One of the car mags had a Nova review in '72, which our Chevy dealer handed us, about how the Nova's workmanship was better than other compacts and that the Nova "...came across as honest as Iowa on Sunday morning".
Ours made a grinding noise between 2nd and 3rd every so often--Dad could anticipate when it would happen--some ring was missing in the trans. Visible fit and finish was not good. It had a dent in the left side roof gutter which was painted over--no way to fix. (We saw that before Dad bought it). It chirped like a bird when cold and the fix was some GM oil additive. It leaked water in the trunk around the new-for-'73 taillights, and also leaked on the driver's floor and inside the roll-down rear quarter windows (dealer could adjust those).
It was built in Ypsilanti, MI.
But, that Nova looked like a repaint to me. I guess it could still have been "born blue", and just been repainted its original color?
Another thing that I thought was amusing about that episode, was that they actually did manage to squeeze six people into that Nova! Mama, Aunt Fran, Vint, Naomi, and Buzz and Sonya. So, I guess if nothing else, that was a testament to the Nova's seating capability. I'm sure the actors would not have been comfortable squeezed in there for any long period of time, though.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
The '68-72 had sort of a cheap look to me, while the '73-74 seemed a bit more upscale looking. Or, more realistically, pretentious I guess. But, to be fair, the Maverick was cheap as well, and so was the Dart and Valiant. I think part of it might just be that if you get used to one company's version of "cheap", you simply prefer it to the competition.
Those, really, were the start of 'badge engineering' at GM, although Ford was doing it at the same time (Maverick/Comet, for example). Same at Mopar with Duster/Demon.
I could handle the 2.5 mph rear bumper on the '73 Nova, but that 5 mph rear bumper on the '74 just burned my eyes.
Today, I could handle a '73 Nova Custom coupe with the Exterior Decor Group, Rally Wheels, whitewalls, and V8, but I never see them as-built.
I rather got tired of seeing the '68-72 Nova, as it seemed they were everywhere for a long time, but now, I like the '68 best of those years as it's the last year that said "Chevy II" on them, LOL.
My favorite Nova ever would be the '75 LN, with 350 ("5.7 Liter"), optional wheel opening moldings, and Turbine wheels.
Less money upfront, and more money for power. I've ridden in some crazy Novas. It's a wonder I lived through it.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I can't remember Pontiac's rationale for getting the Ventura II, except that they were trying to expand and become all things to all buyers, rather than focusing on being a sporty car a step up from Chevy. But with the Omega and the Apollo, I think the rationale was that the 6-cyl engines were dropped from the Cutlass and Century, leaving a 350 as the smallest engine, so their dealers wanted a car that could still capture some of the low-end market that wanted a Buick or Olds, but only wanted a 6-cyl. So, those cars were sort of thrown together on the quick.
And something more typically 1978, also nicely optioned (even mentioned AC), MSRP $5156:
For the pre-75 Novas etc, I always preferred the 68-72 as well, for the muscle car image. A good friend in high school had a green on green 69 Nova sedan, originally bought by his great grandfather and used as a hand me down car by his family for years. It was a 307/2 speed, I recall it would hold 1st gear until what seemed like 55 mph under hard acceleration, which alarmed me. Those cars seem to be bigger than a Maverick or Dart/Valiant to my eyes, which makes them seem more upmarket.
I like the '77-78 Riviera, but I don't love it. It's a very nice LeSabre but not a Riv, LOL. You could hardly go wrong with one at the time.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
I don't remember GM ever putting buckets in a four-door until the 1973 Cutlass Salon and Grand Am. I wonder if that test car was a one-off or something.
I had thought the Sky Roof was offered only on coupes but I found a brochure for the '72 Nova Sky Top online and it mentions nothing about being available only on the coupe.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
To me, they look a lot smaller than those dimensions suggest. But, those protruding 5 mph bumpers were often good at really inflating the length, but without making the car really look any bigger.
Terrible. Sarcasm off.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Either that or the 1974 GTO...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive
In '73 at least, the Nova was priced low IMHO. I routinely saw new Vegas that didn't look too loaded to me with stickers higher than our Nova's was.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
Yeah, the 250 six was nothing to write home about.
We talked about this a few months back, but at the time the '75 Monza 2+2 came out, I was infatuated. And it was months before our dealer got their first one. I still like the '75 styling in and out the best, although a couple or three years of mechanical improvements made those later cars better, particularly with the V8.
I gotta say though, when I look at that pic, there's definitely a 'football' quality to the shape and that isn't real beautiful now, LOL.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
A boyhood friend of mine drove a medium green metallic '70 Dart Swinger, vinyl top, slant six, automatic. It was a nice car and he beat on it. His last name was "Barr" and he used to say it had "Torture Barr" suspension, LOL.
Let's jump ahead to December 1986, as I am too young to remember 1978. First, a new style Mazda 323, no MSRP but I suspect it was maybe in the 7-8K range:
Then the progenitor of the Geo Metro, a 3cyl Sprint, had several options. MSRP $6601:
And in the showcase, a fairly loaded Sunbird GT convertible, again no stated MSRP, but maybe around 15K then:
I liked those 323s as they were used as rally cars, and the Sunbird has pop up headlights and a very period paint scheme, so it is cool. The Sprint, well, it is blue. Those were a common sight in high school parking lots when I was a student, now virtually extinct even here (but I still see first gen Geo Metros around, I think they have a cult behind them).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I was mistaken, the Ventura was to be an SD edition not SJ. I found this in the May 72 edition of MT. I think if Pontiac had the funding they could have made more of this. They just used existing parts, Not sure if the SD edition was ever produced. Interesting to see the performance comparison to the MB and also how contemporary vehicles just crush older cars in performance and fuel economy.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav