I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

uplanderguy · October 2022

I've been to Henry Ford (although it's been 30 years) but I'd enjoy the Packard Proving Grounds.

I've been a few times on the Studebaker Proving Ground (singular) 15 miles west of South Bend, but it's not a museum. Navistar owns it now, but they've allowed our national club to drive Studes around a few times on the three-mile oval during the national meets, which was wonderful fun...a high point of the meets for me. I remember reading that Packard's oval was 2.5 miles, but it's gone now, is that right? I seem to remember seeing/reading somewhere once, that that part was being made into a subdivision of homes, but I remember being able to faintly see where the oval was in an overhead photo.

andre1969 · October 2022

I really want to get a good look at this local Caribbean one day, to see if it's a '55 or '56. Either way, looks like an extremely rare car. 276 of them for '56 and 500 for '55. I googled 1955 Caribbean, and one that was white/pink/black (or very dark gray) popped up...

I wonder if you could get that pink in '56 as well, or if they changed the pink to red that year? I wonder, could you pretty much mix and match colors any way you wanted on the Caribbean, or did they limit the choices? I do think the '56 looks a bit better...I like that forward thrust of the fender peaks, and the area around the headlights looks like it was darkened to give it a nice contrast.

Jumping topics, I've heard that the '57 Ford was horribly built, and has been described as "all the quality of a '57 Plymouth, but none of the style." However, the ones I see at car shows actually look like they're fairly well-built. Tight, even body gaps and such, and areas such as under the hood, and the inner fender area look pretty well-braced up. But, apparently they were still pretty loose and sloppy, as they did a few tricks such as the fake hood scoop and the creases in the roof for '58, to make it more rigid.

Oddly, the smaller Ford-based Edsel Ranger and Pacer didn't get the roofline creases that the '58 Fords did. So I wonder if that made them more jiggly than an equivalent Ford, or if they beefed up the structure in some other fashion?

Also, when a car gets restored, they're often put back together better than when they left the factory, so that might partly explain why the Fords I've seen look so good. But, I've seen plenty of '57-58 Plymouths (they actually improved them somewhat for '59) that have been restored, and they still look sloppier to me, with uneven panels, bigger gaps, etc.

I've mentioned the '57 Ford Fairlane 500 4-door hardtop my Grandparents had. They never had any issues with it that I know of, at least nothing to make them swear off Ford. And one of my uncles said he remembered the car well, and used to drive it sometimes, and thought it was a really nice car.

One of my great-uncles once had a '58 Ford. He said it was a piece of junk, and had the transmission fail at an early age. But then Granddad told me the truth...he had gotten it stuck in the snow, and rocked it out, and that probably ruined it.

uplanderguy · October 2022

Not many people seem to like the '58 Ford, but I do. I largely credit that to my favorite, widowed-young aunt in our town having one well into the mid-sixties, maybe a bit later.

At Hershey probably a decade or more ago, I saw a '57 Fairlane 500 two-door sedan, red and black, with the thin door pillars covered in bright metal. Very handsome, despite the bug eyes we've talked about here before. Believe it or not, other than maybe a Dusk Pearl Nomad, I have zero interest in a '57 Chevy. I like the '55 and '56 much, much better.

A Packard friend of mine said once about the '56 Chevy taillights, and I had to agree--'you have all this chrome stuff going on all over the place, then just a small round taillight lens up near the top.' I sort-of felt similar about '58 Plymouth taillights compared to '57. That fin was supposed to have a lens alllll the way up!

andre1969 · October 2022

Actually, the '58 Ford is my most favorite, among the '57/58/59 batch. The only detail I don't care for is the taillights. But yeah, most people seem to either like the '57 for being the most "pure" or the '59, for that formalled up, Thunderbird-inspired look. I do like the '59 from the front, but from the rear, it looks to me like two totally different cars got stuck together, at the color break...

And, with the way the fins flair out, it makes the upper part look like it belongs on a larger car, yet the big taillights make the lower part look smaller than it really is, and throw a narrow track into the mix, and it just makes for a car that looks top-heavy and tipsy.

With the '55 Chevy, I've heard people say that the front-end can be polarizing. Some people like that Ferrari-esque grille, while others just prefer a full-width grille. I fall into the second camp there, which is probably why I prefer the '56. But with the '55, it's hard to describe, but there's still just something about the way the headlights hang, for lack of a better word, and the turn signals underneath, that make it look a bit droopy to me. A '57 will still catch my eye, if it's a color I find attractive. Or, oddly, a 4-door hardtop.

Chrysler messed up a few taillights for '58, in my opinion. I think the Dodge and DeSoto are still okay, but Plymouth took a cost-cutting route, with those tiny round taillights, and only a single backup light mounded in the center of the bumper. Chrysler still had tall taillights, but they were shrunken, and didn't fill out the fin anymore. I guess it was change for the sake of change.

uplanderguy · October 2022

BTW, that Caribbean from my hometown still exists, in the Netherlands. I saw it in 1997 in Kernersville, NC, long story. Still had the new-car paperwork from Greenville. By that time it was on Packard wire wheels. It was sold in 2004 at Amelia Island for $48K. While the ad must not be online anymore, as I couldn't pull it up, I remember the text including "sold at East Coast dealer, Carl E. Filer Co.". Yeah, small-town Greenville, PA is really "east coast", LOL.

uplanderguy · October 2022

I never liked the '59 Ford at all. There is a sales video for the '64 Avanti which shows one passing a low-line '59 Ford four-door sedan in Chicago. The cars couldn't be more disparate for only five years apart, like the styling of one or the other or not. It's actually jarring!

I like the '56, '57, 58, 60, and 61. I wish they'd have done a '62 Starliner.

sda · October 2022

Dad is convinced he burned up the transmission in his 59 Catalina by pulling a U-Haul from St Petersburg to Baltimore and back in 64-65. We lived in a duplex in Baltimore for about 6 months while dad was managing the construction of a bridge. Soon after we returned to St Pete dad found the floors had rusted in the Catalina as well as having transmission issues which prompted dad to trade it in 65 for a 63 Olds Dynamic 88.

uplanderguy · October 2022

The secondary and tertiary colors on the '56 Caribbean were different from '55. The pink was a red for '56. There was a combination with a pastel green in the center and black at the bottom. I like that.

roadburner · October 2022

I never liked the '59 Ford; the '57 was my favorite.

fintail · October 2022

I recall being a little disappointed when my dad told me the hood scoop on the 58 isn't functional. I recall plenty of 59s seemed to be around in the PNW well into the 80s, they come to mind when I think of Moses Lake. Of course, of that era I like the 60 most, although none offend me.

Speaking of the Caribbean, I know I have posted this before, spotted at a small town car show several years ago, but not in the show, just parked nearby. It had a little patina, either a lightly restored original or an aging restoration:

uplanderguy · October 2022

The torsion-level suspension was quite an innovation on those Packards at the time, and I like the rarity of the cars, although looking at all these pics, the styling was pretty heavy-handed, outside and in IMHO. But, it was a luxury car in the mid-fifties I guess! Aesthetically I'd rather have a Mark II.

A friend of mine was showing off the load-levelling feature of the suspension in his '56 Caribbean Hardtop in about the mid'90's. He jumped on the bumper, and the rear end went up....then wouldn't come down. It was quite a comical visual, him driving away with it like that.

sda · October 2022

Self leveling and adaptive suspensions, though nice in theory and modern systems work well, still tend to be problematic as the vehicle ages. Some much worse than others and can be very expensive to repair.

andre1969 · October 2022

My 2000 Park Ave had some kind of special, expensive rear suspension, but I forget what it was called. All I know is that it was one of several things that kind of failed at once on that car, and prompted me to retire it. Towards the end, it was bouncing around worse than Cannon's Mark IV in a high-speed chase!

Back seat passengers either thought it was fun, like a ride at a shady, fly-by-night carnival, or vomit-inducing!

tjc78 · October 2022

I was very lucky. My 04 Grand Marquis was on its original rear air suspension at 13 years old and 100K. Probably helped that no one ever sat in the back and nothing much was ever carried in the trunk.

If the bags went I would have replaced them since in it was a nice to have especially on something that big.

imidazol97 · October 2022

andre1969 said:
My 2000 Park Ave had some kind of special, expensive rear suspension, but I forget what it was called. All I know is that it was one of several things that kind of failed at once on that car, and prompted me to retire it. Towards the end, it was bouncing around worse than Cannon's Mark IV in a high-speed chase!

Back seat passengers either thought it was fun, like a ride at a shady, fly-by-night carnival, or vomit-inducing!

I don't know if Buick had electronically controlled struts on front and shocks on rear in certain high models in 2000 or not. The rear load-leveling had pumps that sometimes acted up but were fixable or more likely had problems with the arm that rotated to tell the pump the height of the rear and if it needed to add more air.
The rubber hoses carrying the air sometimes deteriorated--they did on my 1999. But the expensive load-leveling shocks that were OEM replacements could be replaced with Monroe 822 model, which had air connectors and worked just fine, and cost about half or third the OEM rears. I did that on my 2003 leSabre.
I learned a lot from following the Pontiac Bonneville forums where the owners were more do-it-yourself types and posted their findings compared to the Buick owners at that time.

imidazol97 · October 2022

I took pictures of some great well-preserved Chrysler products at a show. I went back because I had seen them 3 years ago at the last show at the dealership that has the cars. All but the first one are part of a collection kept inside a building. I should have tried to read the mileage on the odometers. I believe they were bought new and put away.

I have pics of Chryslers too, but first

Some Desotos (pictures can be enlarged to really big size)

uplanderguy · October 2022

I always thought '55-56 Chryslers and DeSotos looked chubby. That green and white one looks sharp to me though. The '61 300 is interesting to me especially.

What year is that salmon-colored 300, do you know?

imidazol97 · October 2022

uplanderguy said:
I always thought '55-56 Chryslers and DeSotos looked chubby. That green and white one looks sharp to me though. The '61 300 is interesting to me especially.

What year is that salmon-colored 300, do you know?

I think this is the interior of the green/white Desoto. Back when
interior colors were colors, not just black and dark grey/almost black interiors.

andre1969 · October 2022

That 300 is a 1957. The '58 had shrunken taillights, with thicker chrome surrounds.

I think the '55 Chryslers and DeSotos look a little droopy in the rear. And the way the DeSoto's two-toning drops away accentuates that effect. I think the tailfins for '56 were definitely an improvement.

I think one reason the '55-56 models might look a bit chunky, is that the way the rear quarters bulge a bit, it makes me think a bit of the older days when they still used bolt-on rear fenders. Also, the hood is raised just a bit, in relation to the fenders, whereas most cars by '55 were flatter in that respect.

But, on the plus side, I liked how the rear wheel openings were fairly large. If they were the typical skirted look of the era, the cars probably would have looked a lot fatter. Interesting, that Chrysler/DeSoto, and Buick, went with those open rear wheel wells for a couple years. But, I guess the trend toward that skirted look was too compelling, and they gave in eventually and succumbed to it.

I think the best looking of that '55-56 batch is the '56 DeSoto Fireflite (and Adventurer) I like the clean, lightweight looking mesh grille, and the body-colored headlight bezels that have a bit of forward thrust to them. The chrome ones that they used in '55, and on the cheaper '56 models, gave the cars a bit of that bug-eyed look. I think the '56 New Yorker looks really nice, too.

imidazol97 · October 2022

Chryslers. We've got Chrysler pictures.
There are two different RED Chrysler 300's. The adjacent car on their right is
different and the wheel covers look a little different.

I may have other views of a few of these that I didn't post, but if someone
wants a particular one, I'll look through the folder. I did not take pictures of
one car front and back: I went row by row, so front and back may be separated.
I may have missed a car or two from the museum collection.

I wish I had looked at odometers. I believe these are mostly stored-when-new
vehicles.

#1

#2

#3

#4

#5

#6

#7

#8

#9

#10

uplanderguy · October 2022

That is quite the assortment of Mopars!

imidazol97 · October 2022

Dodge

imidazol97 · October 2022

I realize now I missed a lot of Dodge Challengers, and maybe pickup trucks that may be owned
by the "museum." I'll have to ask about access to the museum buildings sometime. I doubt
it's public. I saw inside one building 3 or 4 years ago because the doors were open during the show.

This was a chilly day. The light was not as bright as I'd like to have for pictures, but the
overcast prevented the shadows from direct sunlight along with the hot, bright
areas that can ruin a good picture. The overcast caused a color
shift, though, with the grey/blue color of the light through the clouds.

My Sony H5 camera is about 15 years old, but still very versatile and sharp
despite having a small light sensor plate in it compared to later 35 mm replacement
cameras.

explorerx4 · October 2022

I saw one of those Lil Red Wagon trucks the other day.

ab348 · October 2022

imidazol97 said:

#1

In the mid-90s a member of the local antique car club had a Chrysler of this vintage and in these colors, but a 4-door. In pictures these somehow manage to look relatively compact but seeing his in person, the thing was huge and tank-like. I would not want to have it run into my vehicle.

andre1969 · October 2022

I think the pics came out just fine, Imidazol. Thanks for sharing them! And yeah, often a cloudy day does make it easier to take pics. Whenever I go to a show, on a nice day, I'm constantly making sure I try to take a pic on the sunny side of the car! But then, when it's late in the day, I try to make sure that my shadow doesn't get cast on the car. Usually not a big problem during the summer, but when you get later in the season (such as now), or, some of those earlier April car shows, it can be more of an issue.

andre1969 · October 2022

For what seemed like ages, there used to be a '56 Chrysler Windsor parked at the curb, along a busy street about 5-6 miles from my house. It was on the way to my grandparents' house, and also one of the routes I'd take when I went to/from college, depending on traffic, so I used to see it fairly often. It was a hardtop coupe, faded red, and really rusty. It was there long enough that it had become a landmark, almost. But then, one day in the early 90's, I drove past, and saw it had been rear-ended. It looked like there was a seam in the quarter panel that ripped open, and the fin was pointing upward at an obscene angle, while the lower part was caved in and pushed forward underneath.

And then I drove past again and it was gone. The end of an era. I also remember a '70-71 midsized Ford that also seemed like it lived at the curb on that same street, but going in the opposite direction. I think it might have been one of those 1970.5 Falcons, because it was a 2-door, and I'm remembering it as being pillared, a style the Fairlane/Torino weren't offering by then.

Unfortunately this one sat, just beyond an intersection, where drivers would often have to pass a car waiting to turn left, on the right, and then get back over. I remember thinking it was only a matter of time before that one got hit and sadly, it happened eventually.

fintail · October 2022

That interior really looks like leather.

Some of these cars need some whitewall cleaning

imidazol97 said:

uplanderguy said:
I always thought '55-56 Chryslers and DeSotos looked chubby. That green and white one looks sharp to me though. The '61 300 is interesting to me especially.

What year is that salmon-colored 300, do you know?
I think this is the interior of the green/white Desoto. Back when
interior colors were colors, not just black and dark grey/almost black interiors.

texases · October 2022

Yep!

andre1969 · October 2022

That '56 DeSoto Fireflite definitely has leather, but something about it just doesn't look right to me. I've seen them where they have a mixture of leather and cloth, but I've never seen one that appears to be full leather, like this one.

I'm accustomed to seeing the interiors more like this...

I believe the bolster strip on the front of the seat, as well as the inserts in the backrests, are leather, although the side trim is vinyl. But then the rest of it is fabric.

For some reason though, I seem to remember seeing '56 Fireflites with armrests that were more integrated, rather than bolt-on. Unless, it was a New Yorker I actually saw, and my memory's just getting fuzzy. Guess it's also possible the car I'm thinking of was restored and got some New Yorker parts thrown in during the resto?

uplanderguy · October 2022

"Bleche White"--when I was a young rube, my buddy and I always called it "blecchhhh (like 'bleck') white". Thought we were being witty.

In the mid or late '70's, there was a '55 or '56 Chrysler wagon, red and white, sitting outside a local transmission shop in my hometown. It was there at least a couple years. The wagon really looks portly in that body style!

I used to watch the show "One Day At A Time" largely to see Valerie Bertinelli then (hubba hubba!). Pat Harrington was funny too, although Bonnie Franklin as the mom was obnoxious IMHO. But I'm pretty sure the opening of the show, showed them arriving in their new, life-without-Dad-in-Indianapolis in a '55 or '56 Chrysler wagon. I'm going to have to see if I can find it on youtube.

Found it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDSRGnS7l3A

stickguy · October 2022

She was cute but it always upset me to see the intro being running into the back of the other guys Volvo 164

andre1969 · October 2022

"One Day at a Time" comes on Antenna TV in the evenings. I'll watch it every once in awhile, but it can be painful sometimes. It's not always that funny, or even interesting, and sometimes there's just way too much yelling. "Maude" can get that way sometimes as well, too much yelling, and sometimes the plot lines got a bit TOO disturbing. For instance, there was one where Walter had a serious drinking problem, and gave Maude a black eye.

That '56 Chrysler wagon is a New Yorker Town & Country...about $4500 base price, brand new. Actually a few bucks more than a 300B!

uplanderguy · October 2022

Yeah, a lot of shows of that era got pretty preachy too.

uplanderguy · October 2022

When I was in Hershey last week, right after the show, my buddy and I ate pizza at a place near our hotel (Best Western Plus on Eisenhower in H'burg), just on the other side of the road and up a bit. I cannot recall the name of the place but the pizza was excellent, as was the Yuengling pint I had. Only drawback was that Yuengling encouraged me to discuss politics at the gentle baiting of my friend--which I normally never do. He and I are of mostly (not totally) opposite political tacks and I wish I wouldn't have. But all's fine. In fact, we have a room reserved for next year.

Anyway, the pizza place had the left side of a 1956 Plymouth on one wall, and the left side of a 1956 Dodge on another. From real cars. No Chrysler or DeSoto though.

andre1969 · October 2022

Well, I'll see your Yuengling and raise you a Chick Fil A! That's where we ate lunch when we were at Hershey that day. Heck, every other place, you practically had to take out a second mortgage!

Glad you're coming back next year...we'll have to have a reunion! Also, if you happen to find yourself with nothing else to do when the events come up, we always try to hit Spring Carlisle, Fall Carlisle, and the Ford/GM/Mopar shows. I always have a car at the GM and Mopar shows. Lemko was joking that he should buy a Ford product, so we could have something to put in that show! I have a feeling Carlisle might be a bit far for you, for just a day trip though.

uplanderguy · October 2022

We saw Chick-Fil-A when we pulled in, but I didn't learn exactly where it was until I later was looking for bottled water (sold out at the carny places down at our end), and saw it was a short walk over the hill straight from where we and the Riviera were located. I wished I would've grabbed a bite there, instead of the absolutely revolting cold, gray burger, fries and drink that cost me $20 down at our end!

Yeah, that whole area precludes a day trip, but now that I'm retired, a reasonable hotel isn't out of the question for me. Although, 'reasonable' might just be out-of-the-question as I know the area jacks prices up for those big meets!

uplanderguy · October 2022

Posted on a Kent, OH FB page. George Gifford Buick in 1964; cars lined up for the Memorial Day parade. The building is still there and is our attorney's office. The staff still parks in the service dept. at the back of this pic.
May be an image of car and outdoors

I love pics like this. I can hardly believe I was alive, and even aware, when this pic was taken, LOL.

uplanderguy · October 2022

There is a thing or two that is making me think that first Electra is a '63 instead of '64. Can anybody confirm?

texases · October 2022

Definitely a '63.

andre1969 · October 2022

Speaking of Buicks from that era, the other day on the way home from work I spotted this '61...

I mean, I actually see it every time I drive past there, but have gotten so used to it that some days I notice it and some days I don't.

This google screen shot is from July 2022, but that car's been at that gas station for years. It shows up in the same spot on google going back to 2019, and in 2018 it's tucked around on the side of the building.

texases · October 2022

On the way to work this morning - not sure I'd call it a 'classic', but a '90-ish Civic wagon (the tall one), all done up in a 'woody'-style wrap. Rare enough that I can't find any on google.

uplanderguy · October 2022

Navy blue 1964 Corvair Monza Club Coupe, great condition visibly, clean whitewalls of proper width, correct factory full wheel covers. Sitting at the end row of a parking lot at Giant Eagle supermarket in Stow, OH, near us. I've seen it repeatedly so I assume it's an employee's car.

I'm fond of Corvairs, but would have to have a '65-69.

fintail · October 2022

On the road today: ~1915 Model T with a speedster body which may or not be of the period, ~50 Chevy truck, Subaru Justy

stickguy · October 2022

last weekend, a 1st gen NSX out on the highway.

uplanderguy · October 2022

This happened to a friend's Seville while I was at Hershey. The car was running and he was working on the exhaust and a leaky fuel injector set the underhood area on fire. His fire extinguisher didn't work (!) and he closed the hood, backed it out of his building, called his VFD, and moved his other cars and waited while the VFD appeared. The car is totalled. He lives a good hour from where I grew up, but told me he was surprised that the tow-away truck came from Greenville, PA.

I'm a big fan of those cars for timeless styling/domestic-style luxury/packaging, but he's gunshy to get another. Thinking of a '91 or '92 Allante now. Those cars didn't do much for me at the time but in hindsight I like the simple styling.

His '98 Mark VIII is in the background.

andre1969 · October 2022

That's a shame about your buddy's Seville. Glad he was able to think fast enough to shut the hood and get it out of the garage before it did even more damage. And, most importantly, at least HE didn't get hurt!

I guess that's a wakeup call for me to check my fire extinguisher. Maybe get a new one at this point...maybe even a couple, since I have multiple cars.

andre1969 · October 2022

On a somewhat automotive-related note, I looked out the kitchen window, and saw the two semi-feral cats we have hanging around stalking something in the backyard. I saw it hop, and thought it was a frog or a toad. I went out there with the intent of rescuing it. But then I saw it was a mouse. I'm not normally one to see an animal suffer, but then I started getting a mental image of that thing chewing on the wiring of my DeSoto and having babies in a nest of seat fabric and carpet chewings. So, I said meh, let the cats earn their keep!

sda · October 2022

uplanderguy said:
This happened to a friend's Seville while I was at Hershey. The car was running and he was working on the exhaust and a leaky fuel injector set the underhood area on fire. His fire extinguisher didn't work (!) and he closed the hood, backed it out of his building, called his VFD, and moved his other cars and waited while the VFD appeared. The car is totalled. He lives a good hour from where I grew up, but told me he was surprised that the tow-away truck came from Greenville, PA.

I'm a big fan of those cars for timeless styling/domestic-style luxury/packaging, but he's gunshy to get another. Thinking of a '91 or '92 Allante now. Those cars didn't do much for me at the time but in hindsight I like the simple styling.

His '98 Mark VIII is in the background.

That’s a shame. Is that the one with the light green cloth interior?

uplanderguy · October 2022

That’s a shame. Is that the one with the light green cloth interior?

Yep. You've got a good memory.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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