Mazda Protege Maintenance and Repair

mazdafun · July 2002

Lots of service departments are like that. The one at a local Mazda dealership was very sloppy for a while (used to be OK). They once even didn't apologize for a sloppy job they did of replacing the wheel bearings on my '89 323 (preventive...no sign of wear)...they forgot to replace some grease seals or something because grease just kept pouring out from the hubs. I figured a little would be normal due to excess grease, but it just kept coming out for several days. They found out the grease seals were missing. Did I get an apology for the inept job? No, I just got a bill.

I've noticed they've improved of late. Must be Mazda NA responding to poor consumer feedback (including mine). I hope that trend continues. Great cars won't continue to sell if people find keeping them is hard (now, that is one good point about my wife's Saturn, she's usually very happy with their service department).

grannynet · July 2002

I have had my car for 5 years no problems. All of the sudden my car starting vibrating bad when I would come to a stop. I had a new motor mount installed. The vibrations would not stop and I found out I needed new brakes. The vibration is getting worse and now today when I was slowing down to stop I was turning to the left to park and there was a popping sound. Please Help. Thanks

protege_fan · July 2002

Do the vibrations only occur when you press on the brake pedal? Sounds like you could have warped rotors if that's the case...or possible alignment issues, or tire balancing issues. Also, when's the last time your tires were rotated?

Are the vibrations associated with the engine idle?

Where did it sound like the popping sound came from? The engine bay? Behind you?

I hope we can help you out!

alcan · July 2002

If the problem is a rough, vibrating idle, inspect all the air intake ducting between the mass air flow sensor and the throttle body for any splits, cracks, or other damage which would allow the engine to receive unmetered air.

grannynet · July 2002

Thanks so much for your help. The vibration only happens when I am at a full stop with my foot on the brake. It reminds me when the idoling is set too high. The popping came from the front of the car as I was turning the wheel to park. Thanks

mazdafun · July 2002

That happens to me sometimes. The pad can stick a little, if conditions are right (hot, humid) since they have an organic base.

So far as rough vibrating at idle, if you have an automatic transmission, they should also check the torque converter (sounds like you do). My 89 323 vibrates much harder when idling at a stop than when moving. I suspect the torque converter, but it's not so bad I need to fix it. However, the vibration is stronger than before I had them adjust the AT to fix a rough 1-2 shift.

ashutoshsm · July 2002

The Protege's (atleast 95-98) CV boots are notorious for their short life (is 5-7 years too short?). Anyway - the popping noise is occuring because your CV joint grease-holders and dust-protectors (the boots) have torn over time, and are letting mud into the joint, and letting the grease escape - leading to joint damage. (This is how I understood it - I'm sure I'll be corrected if any of that was inaccurate)

Have someone look under your car, or do it yourself - if the joints are badly damaged, a replacement is usually smarter. The various options are ...
1. Putting on joints that are pre-cut so they slid on with minimal labour, and just reinsertion of grease - cheap, but (obvisouly) not very long-lasting
2. Having the axle taken apart and the grease and boots replaced, and putting it back together - parts cost will be around 25 per axle, and labour is around an hour and a half (IIRC)
3. Taking the axle apart, and replacing the entire CV joint with a remanufactured (12-24 month warranty) one with grease, and boots - labour cost is the SAME as above, and parts will cost $40-50 more per axle (the joint being extra over option 2)

I went with option 3 on both my joints, when I ripped my CV boots and damaged the axles (heard popping many weeks later) by unjudiciously driving up Pike's Peak in Colorado - dirt road, lots of rocks and debris! Total cost was around $250 IIRC.

The whole thing was explained to my by a very good and well-recommended mechanic, and I confirmed it on the internet (yeah yeah - "If its on the internet, its true!")

Of course, its possible it might be something else - perhaps a steering issue or something - make sure its diagnosed accurately, instead of just throwing parts at it and hoping the problem disappears!

apollo_11 · July 2002

Several weeks ago I was complaining about the
blink overdrive light om my 2000 ES.

Well, one day the light started flashing again
and wouldn't reset. The transmission started to
exhibit delayed/erratic shifts.

I took it in to the local Mazda service dept... They needed to replace the transmission (it took one week) and was covered under warranty.

Now it drives just wonderfully. Hopefully that
transmission problem was a fluke and not a design
problem (hate to see automatic tranny problems like Mazda's 626 several years ago!)

protege_fan · July 2002

IIRC, ProtegeXtwo had the same problem with his wife's 2000 ES. It too was fixed by a tranny replacement and was a warranty fix.

I haven't seen a recall or anything like that though....hopefully those were just two isolated incedents.

alternator · July 2002

There don't seem to be any Technical Service Bulletins ever isssued regarding 2000 Protege ES transmissions. That is a good sign isn't it?

chikoo · July 2002

ur guess is as good as mine.

2002protegelx · July 2002

Hey Everyone,

As you know, I've been trying to figure out what was causing the severe engine vibrations on my 2002 Protege LX .

It is a high frequency vibration that is at its worst at around 3,000 RPMs on the freeway. The vibration is definitely coming from the engine and not from the wheel or suspension.

I believe my Protege has either defective or improperly installed engine mounts that are not doing their job by filtering out some of the vibrations before they reach inside the cabin.

The funny thing is that the engine feels fine at idle.

My Protege has an automatic transmission. Could that have anything to do with it?

The Mazda service department was no help. They said severe engine vibrations was considered "Normal" for the Protege. If that is true, then Mazda is making some terrible quality cars. I've driven Dodge Neons with less engine vibration. And those things were crude as hell!

Is there a test or any other way for me find out if the engine mounts are the cause of my vibration problems?

Thanks!

protege_fan · July 2002

Does it only happen while in motion? You could put the car in neutral, apply parking brake, and then have somebody rev the engine to 3000 rpm to check.

It's probably while in motion though...the engine moves quite a lot more when you're moving rather than just revving the engine while stationary (according to some I've talked to in regards to intake fitment).

boggse · July 2002

If the Dealer is unhelpful, try another one, or if that is not an option, call Mazda North America at 1-800-222-5500. They REALLY like to know when one of their dealers is not helping since it makes Mazda look bad. That should fix any problems with the dealer. Of course, you could just threaten to call. Proteges should be vibration free. Having an AT shouldn't make a difference.

chikoo · August 2002

I have a suggestion:

Check out the amount of transmission fluid in your AT. make sure it is less than the uppermost line when HOT.

I had engine resonance problem at around 3100 RPM which magically vanished after I reduced the AT amount to somewhere between the two lines on the dipstick when HOT viz. after driving 15 miles or so.

Could work for you.

Note:
The Protege engine has one of its mount on the firewall(unique?) which makes you feel everything the engine is doing. I can feel tiny "happy" vibrations when revving which actually increase the pleasure of driving.
But like in your case, if the engine is not stable during revving, that also would be passed on to you.

maltb · August 2002

Try to get a test drive in another Protege. That should tell you whether or not yours in unique.

sd1228 · August 2002

I own Mazda Protege' 95 with 115K miles and looking for a good independent repair shop/mechanic for the same in Austin Texas metro area . Any recommendations ??
(I have a major service coming up including
timing belt , water pump replacement)

kgilmore · August 2002

The seat belt warning light and alarm on my '94 Protege LX (97,000) come on intermittently when I am driving with all of the shoulder and lap belts properly engaged (it has automatic shoulder belts). The alarm and light seem to reset themselves when I give a quick tug on the shoulder belt. Until recently the problem happened so rarely that I never thought about it, but now it is going off constantly and driving me nuts. The dealer says that they need to do a diagnostic to determine the problem (which is $80) and that it sounded like a $250 computer sensor for the belts. Has anyone encountered this problem and found a way to fix it that is less than $325+?

sgtglok · August 2002

We just bought 2002 LX for my mom and since she was away for a week, I took the car and drove it for 5 days to work. Although I am not used to small cars and 4 cyl. engines (I drive an SUV), I found LX responsive and the engine pretty quite when going over 50 mph. It revvs healthy (for 130hp v4) when accelerating and at over 3500 rpms, and I didn't feel any vibrations. Definetely, either take the mechanic for a drive at highway speeds or just check with different dealership.

altair4 · August 2002

My 92 does the same thing. I took it to the dealer a long time ago and frankly can't recall wht they wanted to do, but do recall that it cost a lot more (couple hundred bux?) than I wanted to spend. It was a "replace" situation, not a "repair or adjust."

Here's what I found...the sensor in the shoulder belt reel at the center console has developed a "sweet" spot which causes the buzzer to sound. In fact, if I gently pull on the belt and find the spot, I can get the buzzer to sound continually. The only cheap advice I have for you is to move your seat slightly forward or back to get the sensor off that sweet spot. If that doesn't work for you, I think you're off to visit the dealer. Luckily for me, the sweet spot in our car is at my wife's seating position, not mine. :->

Good luck.

the_big_h · August 2002

Proteges have an INLINE 4 cylinder engine....

Just about ALL modern 4 cylinder engines are of INLINE configuration....

sgtglok · August 2002

I stand corrected - i4, not v4. Small, in other words!

gregmc3 · August 2002

I recently purchased a '99 Protege LX, it is a high mileage car (108,000) one owner but has been very well cared for. I have records of all oil, trans fluid changes, plug changes, tire rotations, brakes etc. The only problem is that when I hit a bump, I hear a clunk or thud from the front end. The front motor mount rubber has seperated from the inner sleeve but the clunk sounds like it is coming from the struts. Struts are not leaking but the rubber boots are in bad shape. CV boots are not torn and I don't hear clicking while turning so I don't think that is the problem. The clunk is more pronounced when going straight instead of turning. Any other places to look? Thanks for suggestions.

alcan · August 2002

I'd start by correcting obvious defects such as the engine mount. The clunk is probably a worn upper strut mount. At 108,000 miles the struts are tired anyway. Consider replacing them and the mounts.

mbs7 · August 2002

My 99LX has been a good car so far. It now has 50,000 miles on it and runs great. The only problem, and it is an annoying one, is the pinging when I accelerate. I know we've gone around and around with this issue, but I want to give an update.

I tried running premium gas (92 octane here in Calif) and it helped. The pinging was almost completely gone. I was still able to make it ping by accelerating just so, but for the most part it was gone. However, the 92 gas made the car idle rough. Not wanting to continually run 92 in my car, combined with the high CA gas prices, I have switched back to 87 and 89. In short, I've made no real progress.

The pinging doesn't really bother me per se, but if it ends up shortening my engine's life, I will be angry. Mostly I try to accelerate slowly enough to avoid the pinging. But sometimes, like uphill, it is unavoidable. I have it on record that I brought this up twice with my dealer, so if I suffer a serious failure, they are going to hear from me.

I like my dealer, but even the most likeable dealers are still fairly annoying. First time at dealer:

Me: I think the engine is pinging.
Dealer: Computer says no pinging detected.

Second time at dealer (note the sound is identical to the first visit):

Me: I think the engine is pinging.
Dealer (after mechanic test drives car): It is pinging. You have a bad air flow sensor and you need an injector cleaning job.
Me: Ok. Whatever it takes to make it stop.
(Later that day)
Me: Here's my money.

To this day, it STILL PINGS!

Mike

mdaffron · August 2002

Isn't there a recall campaign or TSB or something out there on the MAF sensors on '99s? Your service manager should be able to enter your VIN and find any recalls or TSBs applicable to your car.

Meade

maltb · August 2002

I remember posting up there somewhere that you need to have the PCM replaced. I can understand that you may be hesitant to take advice off the web, but why post that you are still having probs if you aren't willing to entertain the advice you get off here?

dsm6 · August 2002

I'm puzzled by the dealer's comments for the first time you brought the car in: the computer says no pinging detected. I thought part of the issue was that this year Pro (among others) doesn't have knock sensors. If so, then how could the computer detect pinging even if it were there?

boggse · August 2002

Well, if the Pro didn't have a knock sensor, then the computer wouldn't detect the pinging, hence the dealer was correct in his statement. ;-)

jeffy729 · August 2002

Hello everyone. This is my first posting and after reviewing several pages of comments from other Protege owners I thought I fill you in on my experiences over the last three years and 50K miles of my 99 LX.

1. It began pinging almost immediately after I bought it on 87 octane. I gave up on the dealer (no problems found, no "computer codes", etc...) 89 octane has taken care of it!

2. The MAF Sensor failed at 24K miles. It ran rough and hesitated before the "check engine" light came on and stayed on long enough for the technician to find the "code". I understand there may be a recall of sorts?

3. The Speed Control Sensor (something that relays vehicle speed to the transmission so it knows what it should do) died at 36K miles. It decided to downshift to second cruising at 70 miles an hour! Scared the crap out of me (it is an automatic). The check engine light blinked on and off and it ran rough and shifted badly all the way to the dealer.

4. The alternator went out at 48K (just made the warranty!). The charging light blinked on an off and the car had no power at all, ran rough, idled very low, etc... Turns out the alternator was actually overcharging and it was freaking the computer out!

Now it's 52K miles down the road and it's running fine. Hopefully all the electrical bugs are taken care of since it's now out of warranty. It's always been fine mechanically speaking. Hopefully my experiences might be of use to someone. Don't be shy about seeing the dealer if your Protege is running rough at a young age! If one can't find the problem, see another dealer (the quality of technicians varies a lot!).

boggse · August 2002

The warranty work you had done at 48K miles is warranteed for 12 months/12,000 miles, in case they didn't tell you.

kaiserhead · August 2002

The mass airflow sensor and alternator should be under warrenty due to recall issued by Mazda. If the dealer charged you for this work, you should contact Mazda ASAP. I have the same pinging with regular 87 fuel. Like you, I switched to 89, no problem since I like to use better fuel anyway.

jeffy729 · August 2002

Thanks guys. Yeah, my electrical problems were under warranty (once the repair was under way Mazda was great about porviding loaner cars). I chalked the problems up to first year redesign "bugs". Every consumer magazine raves about the Protege being one of the most reliable small cars (Consumer Reports ranks it ahead of Corolla and Civic a bit now). I like the car otherwise and just purchased a 2002 LX this past week (I love all the improvements made in the past three years!). It's great!

kbui · August 2002

Has anybody tried to install an aftermarket tachometer onto a 5-sp DX? I wish Mazda would include it in the list of standard equipment.

FWIW, I like to buy the basic trim line (5-sp, manual windows, manual locks, etc) - fewer things to break down. And if/when they do break down, they are relatively easier to fix than all the "power" stuff. I also try to do all of the work myself.
I'm currently driving a '89 626 (5-sp, all manual) with 200000+ miles... Still runs like a charm. And I am still on my first clutch.
Thanks for any info.

dinu01 · August 2002

Please post your question on the main PRO sedan board. Many knowledgeable people visit that board.

Thanks,
Dinu

gandalf17 · August 2002

I've seen a lot of posts in here regarding folks using premium fuel (higher than 87 octane) in their Protege's. Please note that the Protege engine and compression ratio's is not designed to burn premium fuel over a long period of time. You are actually creating more carbon build-up in the combustion chamber and will decrease the efficiency of your engine over several years.

I would suggest that if your new car has a pinging problem, then you should take it into the dealer and make them fix it under warranty. That's why you have a warranty and that's why they have a service department. If you don't receive satisfaction, keep escalating until you do. If you experience knocking in a fuel injected vehicle, it is simply because the engine computer and or air flow sensors are not regulating the mix of air and gas properly and you have a bad combustion taking place.

For all those using premium fuel, please read the following very carefully as it may help....

What Octane Rating of Gasoline Should I Use?WHAT OCTANE RATING OF GASOLINE
SHOULD I USE?
WHAT IS OCTANE RATING?I THOUGHT GASOLINE WITH HIGHER OCTANE REDUCED ENGINE
KNOCK?WHAT IF I PREFER TO USE GASOLINES WITH HIGHER OCTANE RATINGS?
DOESN'T HIGHER OCTANE GASOLINE HAVE MORE CLEANING ADDITIVES THAT ARE GOOD
FOR MY ENGINE?REFORMULATED GASOLINE Other References

The type of gasoline to use is one of the most misunderstood areas of vehicle
ownership. I am going to offer some ideas that I hope will save you a few bucks
on gasoline.
The first rule of thumb is that higher octane gasoline is not necessarily better
for your vehicle.
WHAT IS OCTANE RATING?
Octane, by definition, is the resistance to burn or detonation. The higher the
rating, the slower the burn when ignited during the compression burn cycle of
the piston. The higher octane allows for better control of burning for high
compression engines. So we want to match the correct octane rating of the
gasoline to the engine design to ensure complete burning of the gasoline by the
engine for maximum fuel economy and clean emissions.
I THOUGHT GASOLINE WITH HIGHER OCTANE REDUCED ENGINE KNOCK?
It did in older engines using carburetors to regulate air/gas mix They cannot as
accurately regulate the air/fuel mix going into the engine as a computerized
fuel injector. Carburetors need adjustment, as a part of regular maintenance, to
keep the air/fuel mix as accurate as possible. So many times, these adjustments
were not made regularly causing too much fuel to be mixed with the air. When
this happened the gasoline would not burn completely soaking into carbon
deposits. This would cause a premature ignition of the gasoline due to the
intense heat in the engine cylinder creating "engine knock." When this happened,
people would change to the higher octane/slower burning gasoline to resist the
premature burn, thus minimizing the knocking problem. And it worked. Good
solution.
However, since the middle to late 80s, engines are designed to use fuel
injectors with computers to accurately control the air/fuel mix under all types
of temperature and environment concerns. However the accuracy of the fuel
injectors and computers is based on using the recommended gasoline for that
engine.
Most cars are designed to burn regular unleaded fuels with an octane rating of
87. If the vehicle needs a higher octane rating of 89-93, there is documentation
in the owners manual, as well as possibly under the fuel gauge and by the fuel
fill hole. Usually you will see this rating for high performance engines only.
WHAT IF I PREFER TO USE GASOLINE WITH HIGHER OCTANE RATINGS?
You can, but there are no real benefits, other than the gasoline manufacturers
making more money off of you. When you use a fuel with a higher octane rating
than your vehicle requires, you can send this unburned fuel into the emissions
system. It can also collect in the catalytic converter. When you over stress
any system, it can malfunction or not do what it was designed to do properly.
In the early 90's, an early warning symptom was a rotten egg smell from the
tailpipe. Easy fix, go back to using regular 87 octane gasoline. The rude odor
usually disappears after several tanks of gasoline.
DOESN'T HIGHER OCTANE GASOLINE HAVE MORE CLEANING ADDITIVES THAT ARE GOOD FOR MY
ENGINE?
No. Government regulations require that all gasoline contain basically the same
amount of additives to clean the injectors and valves. The only differences are
the type to help create the different octane ratings. All gasoline burns at the
same rate, it is the additives that create the different octane ratings for the
different types of engines.
REFORMULATED GASOLINE
In some major cities with air pollution problems, reformulated gasoline is
required. It is an oxygenated fuel, that burns really clean but can slightly
lower fuel economy and engine performance. If your engine is really dirty with
carbon deposits, it will also cause pinging or pre-mature burn. In these types
of situations, you may want to consider stepping up to the next grade of
gasoline.
The bottom line is to use the type of gasoline recommended for your engine. In
some cases, like towing, or other stresses on the engine, you may find a higher
octane fuel helpful.
NOTE: I do not proclaim to be an expert in these matters, but am only presenting
an overview of what I have discovered in my work in this industry with the
different auto manufacturers.
Copyright, 1997, J. Daniel Emmanuel
Other References

American Petroleum InstituteHydrocarbon Online
Gasoline and Your Engine
a detailed described of how gasoline is burned in an engine. Government
Info on Reformulated Gasoline
Reformulated Gasoline Q & A
by ChevronThe Lowdown on High Octane Gasoline
Federal Trade Commission

maltb · August 2002

from your post:
In some major cities with air pollution problems, reformulated gasoline is
required. It is an oxygenated fuel, that burns really clean but can slightly lower fuel economy and engine performance. If your engine is really dirty with carbon deposits, it will also cause pinging or pre-mature burn. In these types of situations, you may want to consider stepping up to the next grade of gasoline.

Goes against what you said.

When you use a fuel with a higher octane rating than your vehicle requires, you can send this unburned fuel into the emissions system.

Via the O2 sensor, the control module will quickly compensate for that, but you may end up with worse performance, not necessarily damage though.

mdaffron · August 2002

All you had to do was post the link ...

http://theserviceadvisor.com/octane.htm

Meade

gandalf17 · August 2002

Yes, that part does run counter and thank-you for clarifying. Mind you, to me, a loss in performance is "damage".

We don't have this reformulated fuel here in Canada, so I am not familiar with it at all. I am curious though whether that is a reason some folks with relatively new Protege's are encountering difficulties with knocking. All things considered, jumping up to a higher octane in such circumstances doesn't seem like the most beneficial fix. If you know what i mean...

gandalf17 · August 2002

Look hosehead, i would have posted the link if I had it, eh...... It was saved as a text form on my automotive files in my desktop. Now shove off, eh.

dinu01 · August 2002

87 on regular at $0.67/l

Later peeps!

mdaffron · August 2002

Post 1188 -- I think you meant to direct it to maltb. I didn't post that stuff about reformulated gas.

I posted the part about using the link instead of the text. And all you have to do is visit the bookmarks page on that other place to find it.

Meade

gandalf17 · August 2002

However, if truth be told, I always get you and Maltb mixed up. *snicker*

mdaffron · August 2002

Please don't set him off again.

Meade

dsm6 · August 2002

Here's a simple way to tell them apart: one is knowledgeable, the other is full of hot air. You get to pick which is which. ;-)

mdaffron · August 2002

I will not get sucked into the same crap that went on yesterday in the Honda Accord vs. Mazda6 discussion. And if you're too late to go see, forget about it. We all mutually agreed to delete everything that happened. So I'll just have to keep you all in suspense forever on that one -- but you missed a good -- er -- "debate."

Darren -- I hope you come to a MAPP sometime. I'll make sure you pay double.

Oh, and here's your token smiley-face to make it all grinny and giggly and friendly too:

";-)"

Meade

gandalf17 · August 2002

Surely you and maltb are like everyone here.... all rational, calm beings.... Oh, yeah, well, never mind. *big snicker*

More topic related, have any Canadian owners of the 1.8L Pro, received a recall notice for the ignition coil? So far, it seems only the US owners have received the oficial recall notice, which is odd because all the Pro's were built in the same factory.

cpo · August 2002

Considering purchasing a new Protege now with ideas for my daughter to take it over when she goes to college in a couple years. Seems like a reasonable choice, given the car's reliability rating given it by Edmunds. Or is it?

chikoo · August 2002

go with it!

mazdafun · August 2002

Very reliable. Fun and practical too. You can stuff it with lots of junk, which will prove very handy for your daughter at school.

Depending on the trim level, you may want to consider changing out the tires. The Bridgestone RE-92 Portenzas (and Firestone FR-680s) have a reputation for poor wet traction. Try Dunlop SP Sport A2s or Michelin X-Ones. The former is more of an all-season performance-type tire. The latter is more of a touring-type all-season (gives up some handling for quieter and softer ride). I have both tires (Dunlops on my '99 Protege LX and Michelins on my '89 323LX), and both are excellent on wet roads, with the X-Ones having a little more lateral grip when cornering on wet roads.

Mazda Protege Maintenance and Repair

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