Subaru Impreza Outback Sport & TS

bluesubie · September 2002

Where they automatics?
If so, it could be that you didn't get the automatic sport mode to engage. It engages automatically with two consecutive rapid accelerations (or something like that).

Occasionally my wife can accelerate her Outback quicker than I can. The auto takes getting used to.

Or it could be the AWD shifting. When you hit the gas, the AWD shifts power to the rear. Gas may also be a factor. I experimented with about six major brands before I found one I was happy with.

Also, what was the mileage? Subaru's shouldn't need a tune-up until 15,000 miles.

-Dennis

orangelebaron · September 2002

Yes... they were automatics. One new and the other with 7500 miles. I'd like to test an Outback or Forester to see if they do that too.

Automatic sport mode? You don't use a button? You hit the gas twice? Interesting.

subearu · September 2002

that 'power' mode was activated just by pressing the gas pedal quickly once, not twice.

This is from http://www.subaru.com Outback 'Features & Specs' page:

"4-speed electronically controlled automatic with overdrive. Automatic power mode engages with rapid use of the accelerator pedal."

-Brian

paisan · September 2002

Power mode is activated based on the rate at which you stomp on the gas. Pre-95/96 models actually had a light that would tell you when power mode was engaged. Essentially it holds the engine til redline before shifting. I have such a light on my XT6 and my SVX.

-mike

thel · October 2002

We've been looking into a new car for the wife with AWD or 4WD for winter weather and room enough to haul around our 1 year old and her stuff. She drove the whole time so I could get the back-seat experience. I have to say, the OBS is tiny in the back! My daughter was in her car seat and the salesman was in the passenger seat in front of her. My daughter was happily resting her feet on the head rest of the front seat! Keep in mind, she's only about 20 months old. It was also cramped to get her into her seat through the tiny little back door.

It's too bad, I really wanted to like the car. It seemed peppy enough, and handled well. The AWD technology was impressive. Aside from the useless cupholder I had no complaints other than the puny back seat area. I suppose you could move the front seat forward a bit, but for long-legged people to be comfortable, you have to move the seat so far back that my 1 year old doesn't have enough leg room!

Its also too bad that you have to step up to another pricing tier (Forrester / Legacy) to get adequate leg room in the back. Other cars we looked at (Mazda P5, etc) in this price class all seemed to have more back seat space, but no AWD.

I guess we'll save up a bit and end up getting a CR-V or something.

lumbar · October 2002

thel--I'm a big OBS/Imprezza fan, but you're right about the back seat. IMO it is only mildly useful for passengers when you have fairly short people up front and it isn't really "comfortable" even then. There's no question that this is a trade off for what I think is a terrific vehicle for under 20K. Ours has been great but kids are not an issue

You're right that the CRV, which I think is in a somewhat different price class, will have more room, but the Forester, which is basically an Imprezza with more cargo room and a different body, will not. FWIW, Edmunds indicates that the Protege (another great small car bargain IMO) only has 1.5 inches more room in the back.

I thought a Legacy, which is also an excellent deal, might help but was surprised to see that back seat room is not that much bigger than the Imprezza (less than an inch). I'd still check one out though, becasue they're nice for the $$$.

bluesubie · October 2002

Although I never put a child seat in the back of my old OBS, I frequently hauled my wife and two teenage girls. We usually go to SC at least twice a year, both times for a week (used a soft car top carrier). And this was a '97 which has slightly less rear leg room than the current models.

A Legacy L can be had for cheaper than an OBS. The rear seat advantage in the Leg feels a lot more than an inch.

-Dennis

ateixeira · October 2002

thel: a CR-V EX will set you back $22 grand or so.

Consider instead a Legacy L. You can get an L Special Edition from fitzmall.com for about $19.6k, and that's with 2 moonroofs, ABS, AWD, 16" alloys, 4 wheel disc brakes, cruise, keyless, CD, A/C, you name it.

Save yourself $2 grand.

If that's a bit high, we bought our plain L model for $17,827, far less than an equivalent CR-V, which we also shopped.

The CR-V does have the small edge in back seat space, but the Legacy's cargo area is much more usable, and the whole car feels more substantial. Plus you get a 5/60 powertrain warranty instead of just 3/36, plus 3 years roadside assistance vs. zero.

We also have a Forester and while the back seat is a bit tight, again cargo room is great, and kids fit fine, if that's what you typically carry.

-juice

lumbar · October 2002

does anyone know how it is measured for specification purposes. I assume you start at the base of the rear seat and measure forward to....where?
Is there a standard for where and how the front seats are placed? Is it a maximum?

When I checked Edmunds #s on the back seat of the Legacy v OBS, I was surprised at the small difference, and am wondering about that because it does seem like there's more than an inch difference.

ateixeira · October 2002

You kind of have to sit in both. The Legacy does feel a lot roomier. Even compared to my Forester.

The Forester has tons of head room, front and rear, that's where you'll note the difference from the OBS. Also, the cargo area is bigger and more square. Useful capacity is about double.

-juice

nippononly · October 2002

I felt a little squashed in the back of the Forester, just like I always used to in my OBS. BUT, if you move to a legacy wagon, still less than $20K (non-outback) you can have the AWD and all the space - its back seat is much bigger.

Or you could get a Toyota Matrix AWD - nice big back seat, one of the reasons I bought mine, BUT a lot less power. Same price range.

bluesubie · October 2002

The cargo area in my WRX wagon seems smaller than the OBS was. According to Subaru, it's supposed to have more room.

The best thing to do is go on several test drives and really check out the back seats, cargo, etc.

-Dennis

lumbar · October 2002

Appearances are interesting--I did a little math (always a dangerous thing) using Edmunds numbers on cargo capacity, and the OBS has 15% less room than the Forester, presumably mostly in the upper rear where the Forester is "squared off." That's a reasonably significant difference, but, to my eye, it appears greater when you simply look at the vehicles. Go figure.

ateixeira · October 2002

But the Forester has major front leg room. With the seat all the way back, I can barely reach the pedals, and I'm 6' tall. So you can easily move it forward an inch or two, unless you're 6'4".

The CR-V, OTOH, has very little front leg room, in fact I could not get comfy in the passenger seat (my wife drove it). They need to change the track so it moves back another 2 inches at least. I think the back seat is roomier than the front!

The Legacy's back seat is fine, even with the front seats way back.

lumbar: check out CR's numbers. For their biggest box test, the Forester can hold more volume than a Pathfinder or CR-V, for instance.

-juice

pun14 · October 2002

I just bought a 99 Outback sport wagon and I want to put my Yak Racks on. My problem is Yakima says the best way to get the Yak racks on to carry bikes is by taking off the factory racks.

Has anyone who has the same model and year had a problem with taking off the racks? There are 2 sets of screws, one on the tower and one on the bar. Both of which seem to just spin and not do anything when loosened.

Is there any safe way to put on the yaks with the factory on too? Any one have any advice?

I think that it is lame that the factory racks aren't more versatile with the number of attachments it can use.

Thanks!

linsavy · October 2002

Pun14,
The old rack can be taken completely off by removing eight screws. There are little plastic covers by the crossbar mounts. Removing these will expose the screws - large phillips type. Best spray them with penetrating oil the day before. Get a really big screwdriver and take them out.
The whole rack and track then lifts out. You will then have a lovely gap in the drip rail with the exposed rack mounts. New drip moulding will run about $160.
The spinning screws in the mounts are a common frustration. I broke 6 of them after only one winter.
The factory rack is pretty strong. Did you try the accessories at subaruparts.com for suitability?

celeste2 · October 2002

the beautiful sound of that Ganzflow sucking in the cooler air in the mornings is like a York peppermint pattie experience... aaahhhhhh......

VVVVvvvvrooooooommmmmm!!!!!!!1

ateixeira · October 2002

We still haven't heard from ramon lately, have we?

That wife of his really has him wrapped around her finger. Or maybe they had a long, long honeymoon?

I bet when he returns he'll have a ramon jr to talk about. :-)

-juice

celeste2 · October 2002

Here's a scary thought: his new wife caught on to how much he'd be spending on his car and it finally came down to:

ME or the CAR...

well, guess he made the right choice... like that story of The Lady or the Tiger?

Got a pretty good deal on Amsoil motor oil from my mechanic, so will use that and replace the oil filter every 6-7,000 miles. Afraid to use the Amsoil filter since I've read some web site stuff on i-club about how it doesn't thread on as deeply. So far I get about 1 mpg more in the city. The engine runs every more quietly. Good stuff!

ateixeira · October 2002

Hope not - if so I would re-evaluate my spouse.

Mine doesn't share my hobby, but at least she tolerates it. I'm a car nut, plain and simple.

There is an oil "idiot light", so if you leak oil or lose pressure, you'll know. I wouldn't worry about it, though.

-juice

brekke · October 2002

I thought I needed new brakes at 8K but the dealership checked the front axle and wheel bearings and found nothing wrong. The wheel had been making a metallic scraping noise, which had stopped before I took it in.

BTW brake linings are covered under the 3/36K warranty. (Are "brake linings" brake pads?)

thel · October 2002

It's a 98 with 81,000 miles. Its green with silvery-gold trim and has a 5-spd, AC, pwr windows and locks, cruise and tilt, ABS. Local Ford dealer is asking $8,950. Its been "reduced" from $10,950. Does this sound like a good deal? Anything that I should look for in this model? Thanks in advance for any help!

lumbar · October 2002

IMO, of course, that's a bit high without knowing where you are, and assuming the car is clean. The $11,000 number is ridiculous so who cares if it's been "reduced." The miles are high from the perspective of the asking price, although I'm not saying it might not be good for a lot more.

It looks like the only option is the cruise unless it has fogs. When you drive it, look for what I'd describe as a "tight" ride. The suspension on the car should be firm, even noticeably so, and there should be no problem with acceleration through high second gear into fourth. Even the 2.2 is fairly quick in that area. Other than that, standard issue warnings about *all* used cars apply (check the exhaust smoke, etc etc.). Other than that stuff, I'm not aware of any congenital problems with that model, but others might be.

Like I said, I don't know if you are in a high demand area, but I'd think low 8,000s with 81k, and I'd want a small warranty from the dealer with that.

thel · October 2002

I've got an 02 Miata so the OBS might feel like a Buick!

I was thinking of offering $6500 + my beater 1990 CRX with $7,000 + CRX as my target. Its got teeny tiny fog lights and a roof rack, but I doubt that they have a big effect on the value of the car.

bluesubie · October 2002

Sounds high to me too. Check Edmunds' used cars and also kbb.com for the blue book value.

-Denns

ateixeira · October 2002

TMV that bad boy with Edmunds' tool. The same year Forester goes for $10-12k around here, so the price seems reasonable.

Mileage is very high for a '98, though. I have a '98 with 49k miles, most Subaru Crew regulars with '98s have far fewer than 81k miles.

brekke: not sure what they mean by brake linings, I've never referred to them that way.

-juice

bluesubie · October 2002

Is that the rear drums?

-Dennis

celeste2 · October 2002

Here's something in your favor: I heard there's a real glut of used cars on the market now. So many dealers have been offering zero percent interest or such low interest that alot of people have been trading off their cars and this should drive down the price of used cars for now. I think you could go lower by quite a bit, and your plan sounds good to me!

thel · October 2002

The 5-spd seemed kinda "loose" and easy to jostle around while it is in gear. I also hated the weird acordion-like boot on the shifter. I was surprised at how quiet it was, even on the highway. The car had that nauseating "used car smell". For some reason, the wife said she was getting car sick, like she did when I had a Pro5. Handling seemed OK (remember, I drive a Miata

) The engine seemed a bit sluggish to get started.

The engine had a gratuitous "slime coating" so it was tough to tell much about the engine and leaking fluids. The funky interior seemed to be in good shape with no cigarette smoke smell or burns.

The tires were cheap Generals with one mismatched Continental but the tread looked OK. The power mirrors seemed sluggish, matbe the motor was getting old. The hatch rattled a bit but opened up fine.

My guess is that the car was owned by people that lived on a gravel road and were not very "religious" about cleaning the car. It reminds me of why I stopped buying used cars.

I think I will pass on this one and see what comes along later. I really want to like the Imprezza, it has good power and the value of the used ones seem to drop like a rock. I will probably end up saving up for a new car when I pay down my wife's car a bit more.

nippononly · October 2002

(he said with a remembering tear in his eye!) was mechanically identical to this '98, and had 117K on it as of June when I sold it. Slightly rattly hatch is normal for that car, as is the "accordion boot" for the stick shift, which is very durable by the way.

Roof rack is standard, cruise is not. Power mirrors are a bit slow even when new, and make a loud noise when moving.

Mine always semmed to turn over slowly when starting, but in all conditions and over 5.5 years, never once failed to start, or even hesitate.

My experience in the past with Subies has been that the pilot bearing for the shifter tends to wear early, and if you don't replace it with the clutch, it leads to some "wiggle" in the stick later in life, even if the car is in gear.

Prices on used OBS (and some other Subies too) do drop like a rock, making them some og=f the best deals in the used market. Around here, the car you describe would have been a decent deal at $7000 or so. I would have started at 6 plus my beater CRX!

thel · October 2002

That was exactly what I was thinking of starting with, $6,000 + my CRX. For that much it might be worth it. If I were to get the clutch replaced and this pilot bearing, how much would that run approximately? Thanks so much for all the input!

bluesubie · October 2002

The bearing is cheap. Around $20. An entire new clutch assembly installed by a Subaru dealer is around $1,200 in my area.

An independent shop will be cheaper, but make sure they do good work and have a good warranty (e.g. my dealer's work carries a one year warranty).

-Dennis

ateixeira · October 2002

I'd pass too, from what you descrived it seems as if this car was neglected for the most part.

Ludespeed sells a much better clutch for $460 just for parts. You could pay a local mechanic a couple hundred to install it, and have a better clutch for half the price.

But I'd still pass on that car.

-juice

thel · October 2002

They won't take $6000 + trade. I won't pay more. I guess I'll just save my pennies and perhaps buy a new one.

The only thing I don't get is how it can have about as much cargo room (rear seats down) as the Toyota RAV 4 and 1st gen CR-V and still have such a puny amount of rear leg room. To be fair, the 2nd gen RAV has even less rear leg room. But it has WAY more cargo room than the Pro5 but about 2" less leg room. I don't get it.

Does anyone out there have any experiences to relate about fitting kids and car seats in the back seats of the Impreza wagons?

thel · October 2002

How's your back doing? Been able to get into your Miata for some fun time? I think that the seats in 02 LS are the most comfortable I've ever sat in (I'm 6'2" even)

ateixeira · October 2002

Subaru figured you'll have little kids in the back seat most of the time, unless it's empty. Teens can squeeze back there and won't care much.

But everyone carries cargo, even when you're along. So cargo space was a priority. It's like that for the Forester, too. CR's biggest box tests reveals how the Forester can carry a bigger box than the Pathfinder or CR-V, both bigger SUVs.

-juice

ateixeira · October 2002

Your post slipped in right before mine.

My back is fine, thanks for asking. About 99%. I did almost reinjure it, but correcting my posture has helped a lot. I'm just as active as I was before with no pain.

Yes, I can now drop myself into the Miata, just in time for the cold! :-(

Leg room in my '93 is lacking. I lifted the front seat track with spacers, so it's a little better.

-juice

celeste2 · October 2002

Hmmm... the owners manual specifically says the 4 tires should be the same with this AWD system (anyway, I think that's how they put it--correct me if I'm wrong). This means the diameter has to be very close, too, meaning not 2 worn tires and 2 new tires. I questioned the Subie dealer in Tampa who hosts I-club meets here, and the service manager said if a tire had around 20,000 miles on it, it would be different enough from a new one,diameter wise, to not use with the other tires if new (we used to replace our tires 2 at a time on our Volvo, and according to the Subaru manual, this is nix). The wheel bearings could be something of an issue on older models, too, and I'd be suspicious that if he doesn't even go by the owners manual as far as tires, who knows what abuse the bearings have taken?

paisan · October 2002

Just curious but what would constitute bearing abuse?

-mike

ateixeira · October 2002

Incorrect alignment, 4" lifts, or exceeding the payload or tow ratings.

Hey, you asked. :-)

-juice

paisan · October 2002

How would that hurt the bearings?

I'd think also incorrect offset would cause it. But when looking at a car incorrect alignment could be detected by tire wear, wrong offset would be easily noticed as well and payload/towing ratings exceeded are easily noticeable. So I don't see that as a big issue really.

-mike

ateixeira · October 2002

Anything that changes the geometry of the suspension will put extra stress on the bearings.

Incorrect offset - definitely. I remember that was an issue when I shopped for rims.

-juice

celeste2 · October 2002

Thanks for the assist, juice--yeah, one thing for sure is wrong offset. Even the tire places can't be counted on to know what it's supposed to be. On my 2000 OBS I got a set of Enkei's I loved, and Discount Tire advised they were correct. Wrong-0! Got bad wheel well rubbing on hard cornering, so I found out my offset myself and chose a set of rims accordingly. They had to swap me out! Anyway, the dealer told me the wrong offset was hard on the bearings.

tommo123 · October 2002

Just bought a used 2002 OBS. I was wondering if anyone here has purchased and installed those side window vent/visors. I find many of them for sale on the web but none so far for the OBS (let alone the 2002 OBS).

I'm not sure that once they were installed that my windows would be louder due to wind noise or that they would ruin my window trim.

dude · October 2002

Tommo, I'm not sure those things exist for Subaru cars. The reason is that usually are attached to the doors and because Subaru widows are frameless, you'd have nothing to attach the visors to, or you wouldn't be able to open you door.

ateixeira · October 2002

I've seen them on JDM Foresters, so they exist in Japan for some Subies. I've heard that Subaru thought americans would not tolerate the wind noise they'd create, so they decided not to import that accessory.

But some Subaru dealers will import anything if you're willing to pay for it, so ask, I guess.

-juice

dude · October 2002

juice, but how are they attached to the car? I can't figure it out.

ateixeira · November 2002

I think with two-side tape.

That's how the fender flares attach to my Forester, though there are also some bolts in the wheel well.

I have two-side tape on my moonroof deflector, and it's been fine even after 4 years' exposure.

-juice

nippononly · November 2002

yesterday that the new look for the WRX next year is official - I like it a lot better because to me it looks a great deal like my '97 looked. Will this look be extended to the entire impreza line-up including OBS? I love the new look.

brekke · November 2002

There was a pic of a few redesigned Imprezas in a line and we could partially see a blue OBS. That nice new Forester blue. Plus 2004 Canadian OBSes will get 4 wheel disc brakes. I agree, I like the new look much better.

Subaru Impreza Outback Sport & TS

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