Subaru Legacy/Outback

c_hunter · February 2005

It's dripping like a big dog after the car runs for ten minutes. I can see it down below the radiator and it drips from the guard under the engine.

I would bet that is not a head gasket problem. Hopefully it's just a hose or clamp that needs attention. One thing to check is the radiator drain -- in the lower corner of the radiator on the passenger side. Maybe they did not close it all the way.

Craig

xwesx · February 2005

Ugh. The radiator drain is of a terrible design.

Barring hoses, it could also be the "weep hole" in the water pump. I don't know why it would have started just after a serivce, but if the water pump's bearing seal failed for some reason, the coolant will leak out this hole as a warning that the seal failed. If your coolant system is full, it will leak rather profusely until it drops to about 75% capacity. Hopefully this is not the case, but I just want to throw it out there. I didn't know about the weep hole and thought the pump gasket (between pump and block) was the culprit. Lo and behold, the pump failed and stranded me at -15F. :-D

It's real easy to see. Drive the car up on some ramps and remove the plate that is blocking your view. The water pump is on the bottom of the engine, driver's side, just above the thermostat housing. The thermostat housing is the plastic part to which the lower radiator hose attaches. The weep hole is just above the housing on the driver's side and you should see greenish stains and/or fluid over the surface of the pump. If you do not see stains on the pump, but do on the hoses, it may just be the lower hose connection or the heater hose (5/8" black hose just above the lower radiator hose connection and next to the weep hole).

pschreck · February 2005

Thanks for the help guys. We dropped it off at the dealer today per juice's recommendation. The service writer said if it is the head gasket that it would be covered by the warranty since it's a recall. We did purchase a six year Subaru Gold warranty when we bought the car in 2000. I think we're good on the financials.

Thanks again for all the input.

Paul

ateixeira · February 2005

Did they give you a loaner?

As Gold customers also, they've always treated us like royalty.

-juice

pschreck · February 2005

juice,

No offer of a loaner, however we didn't ask either. My wife and I work at the same hospital and it was no big deal to ride together, although I start 30 minutes before she does.

Turned out to be a cracked radiator. No explanation as to how that could have happened. It was covered by the Gold warranty (sp).

Thanks for the help guys. Good Karma all around if you believe in that sort of thing.

ateixeira · February 2005

OK, sounds like an anomaly, I don't think I've seen even one of those cases here on Edmunds.

Hopefully they'll swap it out and that'll be it.

-juice

mrk610 · February 2005

I'm also looking at he Goodyear TTT . I have 52 k miles on my oem RE92's. I was up skiing 2 weeks ago. While I was driving out of the parking lot my OBW just slid sidways off the road . I was barly going 5mph. I got out and the tires had about 1" thick of slushy snow on them . I got back in the OB and had to back out of the ditch I was in but I made it . The group that I was with said that the awd system was working well it keep trying to send power to the wheels with grip . The only problem was none of the tires had grip due to the 1" coating of slushy snow on them .The tires still look new have over half the tread left on them . I did noticed the other day while checking the air that they are cracks on the outside of the tread. Time to break open the piggy bank and buy new tires. I'm still on the original brakes and just had to change the small rear lites over the licenese plate.

Mike

jfl · February 2005

Mike,

My experience (and one other poster also mentioned this) was that our rear brake pads wore much faster than the front pads.

I think 52k is pretty good for RE92's. I replaced each set of RE92's at 40k: my originals and a second set (takeoffs from a WRX w/wheels). There was still quite a bit of tread but not much grip.

Jim

mrk610 · February 2005

Same here.I have alot of tread left but no grip and the car is scaryin heavy rain too. I'm moving at the end of the month so I'm going to wait untill probable spring forthe new tires . I'm really impressed with the reviews on the GY TTT .

Any suggestions anyone.

mike k

63corvette · February 2005

Mike,

I have run my Goodyear Assurance Triple Tred tires for about 3500 miles now, including several trips to ski areas in Idaho and Oregon. I really like them. I have posted a tire report at comment 5988 I think over on the 2005 Subaru board. I got mine from Discount tire direct.com because Tire RAck was out of them. The price was $105 ea vs $104 ea, but included shipping. There was also a $50 rebate, and a 30 day return policy, so I couldn't resist. Good luck.

garandman · February 2005

Same here.I have alot of tread left but no grip and the car is scaryin heavy rain too. I'm moving at the end of the month so I'm going to wait untill probable spring forthe new tires . I'm really impressed with the reviews on the GY TTT .

Any suggestions anyone.

I have the Michelin HydroEdge on a 97 OBW. Outstanding all-around tire. I have 32,000 miles on them and still have 9/32nd tread (11/32nd is new). Either tire should be a big upgrade over OEM, although dedicated snows like the Nokian MRi are much better on snow and ice at the expense of dry handling and wear rate.

Tires worn to 6/32nd or less have much worse snow and rain traction than new tires. I'm willing to drive a tire to 5/32nd during the summer, but if they're less than 6/32nd when winter is coming I usually replace them.

Unless you're buying wheels, by the time you get through shipping and mounting/balancing there probably isn't much of a savings. NTB and other shops often offer lifetime rotation and balancing, which is tough to beat, especially on a Subaru or other AWD vehicle where routine rotation is so important.

mrk610 · February 2005

I'm hoping to get atleast through the spring with the tires maybe into the summer . I have to get the car inspected in July which means i have to get a new windshield .It has been cracked for the past 2 years . I was wondering if anybody got their windsheild replaced by safelite autoglass.

I want to have the same dot matrix design that the oem one has .Or has somebody in my area have a good place to go .I also have to get a new battery the oem one was barly able to start the car in the cold temps we had while skiing .

Thanks all

Mike in South jersey.

significantme · February 2005

Does anyone know where I can get a wiring harness for the head unit in my 2000 Outback. Also, is there a specific type I need to get because I'm sorta new at sound systems.

vetmats · February 2005

Any car stereo shop should have the harness. Also electronics store like BestBuy, CircuitCity, etc. will have the harness.

They will have a harness that is specifically made for the Outback for your year.

FYI, I got the wiring harness for my 00 Outback at CircuitCity.

kellerc4 · February 2005

1) why does the car start to idle at 500rpm, then jump up to 1000rpm for a couple seconds, then drop down again?

2) My temp gauge seems to sit a little high... maybe 2/3 up the dial. My 97 Honda always sat about 1/3 of the way up... is this just a Subie thing, or do I have a potential problem that needs looking at. 33k on the odometer.

Thanks!

Chuck

dcm61 · February 2005

Chuck - The temp. guage on my '03 OBW A/T reads just below half when warm.

DaveM

subearu · February 2005

regarding #1, perhaps you have the A/C or front defrost on?

-Brian

kellerc4 · February 2005

Nothing was on... not A/C, defrost, seat warmers, nothing. not even the stereo!

ateixeira · February 2005

I think it's actually 750rpm. They skip the first marker I believe, so there is no 250 rpm marker.

Why the bump? Maybe some water in the fuel lines making it stumble?

-juice

dudleyr · February 2005

Could very well be some water. If you have a low tank on a cold night there can be condensation inside the fuel tank. This is one reason to keep a full tank when it is cold. One of best ways to remedy is to run a few tanks with ethanol. The alcohol soaks up the water.

kellerc4 · February 2005

So I went to the dealer today to drop off the car. I asked them to look into the car running hot, and also the fact that I got less than 20mpg on my first tank of gas despite perfect tire pressure and very conservative shifting.

While there, I finally got a copy of the 30k service they did to prepare teh car for sale. I compared it to the Subaru maintenance interval recommendations. Everything matched, except my dealer does not replace brake fluid. I showed them the print out of what Subaru calls for, and they said that every dealer gets to create their own 30k mile service package, and this dealer does not include brake fluid change in the package.

Strike anyone else as weird?!?

Chuck

robr2 · February 2005

It seems that the vast majority of dealerships have their own service schedule. It's up to you as the owner to ensure they are doing what the manufacturer recommends.

hox · February 2005

I'd love some feedback on these two cars from those who own them as I am shopping and very impressed with the new engine, love the sunroof. I only wish they leased better!

c_hunter · February 2005

libertycat, "Subaru Crew: 2005+ Subaru Legacy/Outback" #, 1 Jul 2003 7:28 pm

read on, lots of posts!

rob_m · February 2005

Strike anyone else as weird?!?

Yes, as my dealer seems to load up on every service, citing 'following an extreme conditions maintenance plan', and 'doing this will make your car last longer'.

FWIW, brake fluid change costs about $20, and I would highly recommend it at 30k. Rob M.

wienerfingers · February 2005

I have been driving a 2002 WRX wagon for almost 4 years. I needed something taller, tougher and more comfortable.

Hence.....following exhaustive research of many months and weeks, the 2005 Outback is it.

So yesterday, finally, I test drove the XT (limited). Never mind what I consider to be a wonderful interior and (for once for a Subaru) 1/2 decent looks.

It's about drivability/performance.

BTW....after driving manual trans. most of my life, the demo happened to be an automatic (sport shift, etc....whatever). Bottom line - forget the pain-in-the-*@# manual...the auto was just fine and fun. Acceleration, although not quite as good as the WRX, was great. Some reviews speak of persistent turbo lag. I thought lag was not an issue at all. The car handled wonderfully on snowy roads (it had fresh Bridgestone WS-50's).

The only knock is (I have read this somewhere as well.) the floaty/bouncy suspension. If only it could be a bit stiffer.

Then today I was all pumped to demo the 3.0 VDC.

2 things: 1) after fooling around in an icy parking lot inducing skids, I found I did not like the VDC. Instead of being able to go from understeer to oversteer by adding a bit of gas, the VDC seemed to just want to slow me down and keep me plowing straight off on a tangent. I really think now that if you have a few reflexes and good tires, and like to DRIVE (underline 'drive'), there is no need (for VDC). On top of everything I dislike the mandatory taupe leather and the wood trim.

Oh yeah.....did I mention the 3.0 engine? It is GUTLESS in comparison with the 2.5 turbo. I had read many 'expert' reviewers saying that "performance was more or less the same with both engines, the six cylinder being a bit smoother".............BALONEY

So all that remains to do is try and get an OK deal on the 2.5XT(Ltd)...hopefully I'll get that done in a few days.

lark6 · February 2005

If you like everything else about the car, especially the drivetain, maybe you should consider a Legacy GT wagon. Its suspension is lower and, IIRC, stiffer than the Outback's. I can't speak from experience however; though I have driven an '05 GT wagon I haven't driven an '05 Outback.

Good luck,
Ed

katway · February 2005

Disagree with analysis of 3.0 H-6 boxer engine. This engine is terrific. Everyone that rides in my 3.0R is incredibly impressed by the power and refinement of the engine. It is exceptionally smooth and provides a sense of luxury. It's so quiet, people can't even tell it's running. Yet, when I take off, people are surprised by all the power and the smooth shifting... it doesn't even feel like your going that fast when your passing everyone on the road.

In addition, the VDC has come in very handy during ice and snowstorms. I've managed iced up ramps with Jeeps, Explorers, and other AWD/4x4 vehicles sliding off to the side. The 3.0R didn't even slip a bit. Most upscale cars are adding this feature as a standard because it has proven to get the job done.

If you prefer the XT, that is understandable... everyone has their own preferences and I certainly wouldn't knock the vehicle.

From my experience, most of the expert reviews on the 3.0R engine have been right on target.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the Tribeca platform that will share this engine. Subaru has done a terrific job with it.

wienerfingers · February 2005

Ed

It would without question be the legacy GT (wagon)...i have not driven it, but i find it very attractive to look at and i'm sure it's a pleasure to drive. Trouble is our roads here in Quebec are about what you'd find if you ventured a little off the beaten track in a place like Costa Rica. (they pour all our huge tax $ into healthcare i guess)

Good thing about Costa Rica however is all they have is big honkin' potholes. Here we have the potholes plus cracks plus bumps, etc, etc.

I live in the country 90 miles east of Montreal and travel 50/50 dirt roads/'paved' roads. Again, the state of the roads is so bad I need something to (a) soften the ride, (b) hold up to the pounding a little better and (c) get out of and into my frequently unplowed driveway.

There really is, for me, no choice other than the XT.

I'll be making a deal somewhere on Monday.

I have one main issue to iron out 1st. My (small town) local dealer can't match the Montreal dealer's price.....there's a $1300 difference, and perhaps more if the Montreal dealer improves on my local dealer's trade-in offer for the WRX. (i'll find out on friday)

I could easily find a reason to go to Montreal a few times a year for maintenance.

OTOH, I do like the dealership here at home. They have serviced my WRX very well the past 3 years. They have all kinds of free shuttles, courtesy cars.....they aim to please.

As for any out there whose back i may have caused to mildly get up regarding my trashing of the 3.0 engine, my apologies. The words I chose were a reflection of how unexpectedly different I found the 3.0 to be vis-a-vis the 2.5T.

lark6 · February 2005

I understand your rationale perfectly. It was one of the reasons I chose a Forester XT over a Legacy GT. Our roads in eastern Pennsylvania, while probably less rural than the ones you travel, are pretty beaten up, full of cracks, frost heaves, potholes and loose gravel. Having the longer-travel suspension makes them easier to handle on a daily basis and IMO offsets any loss in handling on a street-driven car. There are things you can do to reduce the body lean without losing the ride height.

Good luck with your purchase.

Ed

xwesx · February 2005

Is it not possible to purchase the car in Montreal and have it serviced at your local dealer? It seems as though you would be receiving the best both have to offer if you could arrange it this way.

wienerfingers · February 2005

.......am i just a pathetic sucker who needs to toughen up? i don't know - after test driving a couple of cars and talking financing options with the local dealer, and after three years of very good service they have given me on my WRX, I find myself falling a bit for the 'have-pity-and-show-support-for-your-local-dealer-or-risk-walmart- izing-the-car-industry' spiel.

Yes, they would have to service the vehicle if I asked them too, but perhaps there would not be a lot of friendliness to go with.

It is handy to have a local dealer who will deliver me to the golf course and pick me up after my round while my car is being worked on.

Like I said however - if there ends up being $1500-$2000 savings to be had by buying in Montreal, I'll probably have to do it.

xwesx · February 2005

I see from where you are coming, but I doubt that the local dealer will treat you with less friendliness should you decide to purchase in Montreal. My guess is that more money (for the dealer) is made in the service department than in the sales department. After all, you buy the car once, but you have it serviced time after time after time. It is in the dealership's best interest to keep you coming back for service, even if it cannot compete with the "big boys" for the initial sales.

Best of luck to you!

wienerfingers · February 2005

thanks xwesx

i will post again next monday or tuesday to finish my story.

wienerfingers · February 2005

transaction completed in Montreal 2.5XT LTD, will take delivery next week sometime.
decided on a 4 year lease.
just have to get rid of (by all accounts very crappy) OEM tires and buy snows and summers.
leaning toward HAK2 studded and Turanza LS-V.

sduford · February 2005

Both are excellent choices for tires. I would recommend you make a deal with your dealer or a local tire shop to swap the tires out immediately though. Otherwise once they have a bit of mileage they will be worth next to nothing. I got $200 for my RE-92s on eBay and they only had 2000 kms on them.

Sly

wienerfingers · February 2005

sduford

my dealer offered me the same - $50 ea. for the 92's.

monday i'll see if the tire store can do a bit better.

have just read a bit about the upcoming HAK 4. square studs, genuine Finnish rapeseed oil of all things, and supposed improved grip vs. the HAK2. i don't think it will be out 'til next year however, so what to do, what to do?

i guess i could put on the Turanzas and try to be careful for these last 4 or 5 weeks of winter and wait 'til next fall to get snows. i suppose i'll be driving a bit on the slow side for a month or so, breaking in the XT, so....maybe this is easily do-able.

c_hunter · February 2005

H4 Turbo has a lot more guts than the H6 at lower RPMs, by a long shot. You can feel it and the power curves show it as well. On the highway, they feel about the same.

I had the previous generation H6, and I agree, it is one smooth and quiet engine. In fact, I have not really come across a nicer engine in any car. If you want refinement, the H6 is hard to beat and it is much better than the H4 turbo. That said, Subaru made huge improvements in NVH on the 05 Outback models, and you're less likely to notice the H4's more raucous behavior.

Craig

langweer2 · February 2005

I've got a 97 Outback with about 83,000 miles. I'm starting to look for new tires. I live in the Seattle area. I'm looking for a tire that will do well in the rain and maybe a little bit of snow but I really want a quiet tire. So far I'm considering Michelin MXV4, Michelin XW4, and Michelin HydroEdge. Any opinions on these or others?

bkaiser1 · March 2005

I had these on my 01 Outback -- they were great tires, if expensive. On the highway, they were silent and still handled well at high speeds in the mountains. Snow traction was okay -- at least as good as other all seasons I've had. I wouldn't hesitate to buy them again.

B

hox · March 2005

I'd love to know as I may wait if its signficant like a 6 speed.

hox

garandman · March 2005

I have 34,000 miles (just by chance I pulled into the tire dealer at exactly 120,000 miles) on HydroEdge on a '97 OBW. They still show 9/32nds tread depth - 11/32nd is new.

These tires are supurb in rain and handle well in the dry. Best all-around passenger car tire I've ever had. The other tire that OBW owners seem to like is the Goodyear TripleTread, but I have not driven on them.

K9Leader · March 2005

I replaced the OEMs on my 2000 OBW at about 35K miles (when I bought the car). The OEMs had a bit of tread left but one had a chunk out of the sidewall, and I wanted some new tread for the winter.
I got a good deal on the MXV4s at Costco. I've had the MXV4s on my 1994 Lincoln Mark VIII (same size as the OBW), and have been satisfied.
They are a bit expensive, but worth it. This is the fourth time in the last six years I have used Costco for tires -- consistently the best price I could find anywhere.

ebony5 · March 2005

Any suggestions on what type/brand and size battery I should get for my '96 OBW, and approx. how much it would cost. I live in New York City. Thanks.

amsbear · March 2005

I just replaced mine on my 98 OBW two days ago. The replacement was a ProStart from Pep Boys and the size is a Group 35 with a 550 CCA rating. It cost me about $70. They had two other choices there in the same size category which were a little more expensive with the same or just a little better CCA rating.

Alan
98 OBW Ltd

ateixeira · March 2005

Sounds good to me, I bet that's a lot more CCAs than the stock battery.

-juice

ebony5 · March 2005

Thanks for the info. Do the batteries for the '98 and '96 OBWs have the same group size;
Group 35?

amsbear · March 2005

They should take the same size. I just checked the Autozone website and for both 96 & 98 they offer Group 35 as the OEM replacement or optionally the Group 26R.

Actually, there was a label on the top of my old battery that had the size and CCA specs. Group 35 with 490 CCA.

The battery swap took less than 5 minutes to do with just a 10mm deep socket wrench. Remove the two nuts that hold the securing apparatus, and then loosen the two nuts for the battery terminal connectors. Take off the securing apparatus, move the wires out of the way and lift out the old battery. Install new one by reversing these steps.
Oh yeah, add another couple of minutes to reset the clock and radio presets

Alan
98 OBW Ltd

lfdal · March 2005

If you have the time and inclination, its a great time to remove any old crud from around and under the old battery box.

The battery box may have some old acid / crud built up from the old battery. Removing that and rinsing the area with some baking soda and water, then rinsing with some clear water will help neutralize any acid that's accumulated over the years.

Don't forget to wear rubber gloves and eye protection.

Also, don't forget to disconnect the negative (-) terminal first. Else, you might find out just how much juice is left in the old battery.

Larry

63corvette · March 2005

I posted several times my Goodyear Triple Tred Tire Report, but all I got from the members was "mind your own business", and Poo Poo on the posted tire reports from Tire Rack, so I'm just going to mind my own business from now on.

Subaru Legacy/Outback

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