Subaru Legacy/Outback

vdchawk · May 2001

Pat,

My VDC gets around 20 MPG, normally stop and go traffic, I have not been on any long trips to see the highway figure. I do have a heavy foot, and like to push that little engine (my last car was a 300HP V8).

The VDC should correct both over and understeer in all conditions. I have said in other posts that I have yet to get it to correct on wet or dry pavement, only on ice and snow. When I picked the car up we were getting 8-12 inches of snow, and I went out the dealers back entrance because a small 2wd car was completely stuck in the front. The back way was around 8 inches of untouched snow. The car performed as though the road was dry, and only the traction control light came on once or twice. I really needed to push the limit of safe snow driving to get the VDC to correct a skid.

Good Luck,

Keith

mplantan · May 2001

Hope someone can help.
Thinking about buying Outback Wagon but have some concerns
1 : Travel in mountains in N.C. is the 4 cyl dependable and have enough power,will be loaded with two kids and roof rack ?
2: Should I consider Manual Trans does it have more pep ?
3 : One we are looking at has Firestone Wilderness tires should i ask them to replace and does anyone know if they will ?
4:How comfortable is the car on long trips?
5: Pricing : Is at invoice possible or a couple hundred over a good deal around Chicago
Any Info would be great Thank You

subearu · May 2001

I guess I'll just answer your questions in order.

1. I think the 2.5 H4 is very dependable and has a good amount of power. But, power is relative. You should really just drive one and see for yourself. Maybe even drive a LLBean H6, which may provide you with the ample power you desire.
2. The manual trans is a tad quicker, but it is only available in the H4 models.
3. The Firestone Wilderness tires on Outback are NOT the same ones that have been troubled with Fords. They're a rebadged all season performance tire that Subaru & Firestone decided to name Wilderness to go with the Outback 'ruggedness'. Having said that, they aren't the greatest of tires, they have good wet and dry traction, not great on snow, but ok. I think the Michelins were better (they were on the pre 2000 Outbacks). We'll probably switch to those once the originals wear out.
4. I find the car very comfortable on long and short trips.
5. Should be no problem getting a '01 Outback at invoice. Not sure about the VDC and LL Bean models though.

-Brian

gam2 · May 2001

ANYONE have info on current finance rates? Subaruis advertiseing 2.9% for what I assume
is 2 or 3 years. Any info on longer terms?
GAM

rangerron7 · May 2001

I've got a 2000 OB Ltd with about 8K over the past year:
1) I agree with Brian. Test drive both the H4 and the Bean to determine for yourself whether the H4's power is adequate. I drive approximately 60city/40hway and I fing it fine for my purposes for around the Chgo area, however I don't have to contend with chugging up mountains.
2) I've got an auto trans so can't comment on the MT but everyone says that it IS peppier with the manual.
3) Agree with Brian 100% on the Firestones. I've got em and just make sure that I check the inflation about once per month. They are not the greatest tires but then again they are not the worst.
4)Couple hundred over invoice or less for an H4 should be doable around Chgo. Not sure about the Bean, I haven't priced them.
Ron

rangerron7 · May 2001

I've got a 2000 OB Ltd with about 8K over the past year:
1) I agree with Brian. Test drive both the H4 and the Bean to determine for yourself whether the H4's power is adequate. I drive approximately 60city/40hway and I find it fine for my purposes for around the Chgo area, however I don't have to contend with chugging up mountains.
2) I've got an auto trans so can't comment on the MT but everyone says that it IS peppier with the manual.
3) Agree with Brian 100% on the Firestones. I've got em and just make sure that I check the inflation about once per month. They are not the greatest tires but then again they are not the worst.
4)Couple hundred over invoice or less for an H4 should be doable around Chgo. Not sure about the Bean, I haven't priced them.
Ron

2ndwnd · May 2001

I've been away from these boards for about six months or so. I read and posted frequently while I was waiting to get my 00 Legacy L Wagon last year, and for a time afterward. Now its been in the body shop for a week, and I find myself missing it so much I guess I subconsciously came back here to read and talk about Subarus as a substitute while I can't drive my own!
I ended up with a rented Saturn L200 to drive in the meantime. Nice car, but an automatic, and just kind of bland. And the other day I hit the gas and the front wheels spun for a second, something I haven't experienced in awhile. Weird two wheel drive cars...

2ndwnd · May 2001

Now that I've read the last month or so of posts, I have a few comments:

Not sure what's up with the guy who installed a K&N air filter into his 00 Outback and heard a bunch of noise. I did the same and haven't noticed any change. Maybe something didn't seat right?

As for mileage, with the H4 and a five speed, I normally average about 25 mpg in mixed city/highway driving. On longer trips I've gotten anywhere from 27 to 32 depending on the load and if I'm using the A/C.

Now for a question. The 00 Legacy Wagons have a single speed, constantly moving rear wiper. I hate it, and I've heard others say the same thing. On the 01's they put a delay on it. Has anyone looked into upgrading an 00 to a delayed rear wiper using the 01 Subaru delay mechanism?

Dave B

nematode · May 2001

We have a 2k OB Ltd. (auto) with 30k miles so far.
In order:
1) We loaded out Outback up with 3 people, my 80 lb. dog, wifes 23 lb. cat, tons of stuff, a Thule cargo carrier (full), and drove about 2000 miles. It was about 800lbs total. That included going through the mountains of PA and VA. In my opnion the H4 does just fine. Sometimes you have to push it but even on I76 you can accelerate up the worst grades even fully loaded. We get 17 city / 25 highway. Our 80-90% highway commute gets us 23mpg. It you go over 70mph the fuel economy gets much worse.
2) Its even better with the manual but my wife did not want one. I personally dont find it under powered at all even with the auto. Its not a sports car!! Its a wagon.
3) Firestones: just check the pressure once a month. They should be fine. I keep my wifes at 35psi all around instead of 30/29.
4) Its super comfortable on long trips. We put 26k on it the first year.
5) Dont pay more than a couple hundred over invoice for any of their models. Even the VDC can be had for around $29k now.

The only problems have been with reliability. 8 trips to the dealer in the 1.5 years. 1 recall, broken CD changer, leaking rear door seals (fixed), driver side stopped closing properly (2 trips to 2 dealers and still not fixed completely), O2 sensor (not recall related), broken radio (different than the CD changer), weird noise from engine (still does it sometimes), brake cable adjusted (was starting to catch REALLY low). The car is not a lemon or anything like that but its not holding up as well as I thought it would.

Still, we like the car and it has not had any major drive train problems yet but it had lots of little annoying ones.

robr2 · May 2001

23 lb cat???? What is it - a domesticated mountain lion??

nematode · May 2001

Its a big domestic cat. We get some werid looks at the vet and when friends come over. You just have to see it to believe it. Even then he does not look real. His "little" sister who we also have is 16lbs. His head nearly comes up to my knee so he actually carries the weight without looking like a bowling ball. Dont get me wrong...he is chubby and you cannot pick him up with one hand without damage to your spine. All his brothers and sisters (taken in as a stray litter that our relatives have) are all in the 16-20lb range too. They also have 7 (yes seven) fingers so his paws look even more HUGE.

ateixeira · May 2001

Wow. My dog is only 12 lbs! He's way out of his league!

-juice

raybear · May 2001

I'm showing up to 6.9% on 60.

nematode · May 2001

just to transport all our animals to the vet at the same time. The dog rides in the back seat and the 2 cats go in "cat" carriers in the way back. The cat carriers we have to use are actually flight crates for dogs 20-40lbs. They outgrew their normal cat carries by 8 months old. We measured the wagons we were looking at to make sure everyone would fit properly. I cant believe we have had them for 7 years.

evilizard · May 2001

Try hitting them up for 5.9% for 59 months. Thats what we did.

2ndwnd · May 2001

... how many were going to St. Ives?

We have three cats, no dogs. The one male cat tips the scales at 14+ lbs, mostly muscle. He doesn't like to go in a carrier, but he is a big baby, so he'll just cling to one of the passengers, and the others ride in the carriers.

And of course the correct answer to the question above is one. Me. The rest were going the other way. In a Subaru naturally.

viktoria_r · May 2001

I have two dogs 92 and 97 lbs. Will I be able to put them in cargo area (without crates). I do that now with my Isuzu Trooper, but Trooper cargo area is a lot bigger than Legacy/outback. Anyone in similar situation? Tx.

ateixeira · May 2001

Ask a dealer to try it out. If they are interested in selling you a car, that's what it will take.

Maybe take a carpet remnant to keep it clean, but they should let you try. I'd be concerned with their height.

-juice

armac13 · May 2001

A couple of months ago I saw a Legacy wagon with two full grown mastiffs in the back! About 350 lbs. total, maybe more. They seemed quite content.

Ross

francophile · May 2001

7 toes, eh? I've seen the 7-toed "feature" on cats before, it must be a relatively common "feature". The two I saw it on were pretty big kittens, and we almost took them; now I wonder if they would have grown up to be knee-high! Wow.

Cheers,
-wdb

ffsteve · May 2001

Thanks to Breckco, mammothsun and the rest of you who helped me to make my decision. Picked up a white LLBean in San Diego last weekend for just $100 over invoice from Balboa Subaru. Found a fair and forthright team there that made me feel welcome and were willing to deal.

We've already tried a gravel road in North County, an 80MPH freeway run, and general noodling in and out of shopping centers. LLBean handles all with grace and competence.

Report on common issues:
1. New car smell plus a light burning-off of new-car-prep stuff. Not unpleasant and almost gone after 150 miles. New car smell remains inside.
2. Engine is smooooth and willing to rev. Apart from one run, will keep the speed low until broken in and change oil at 1000 miles. Curious also about mileage, but too soon to tell.
3. Nothing, absolutely nothing, included above standard LLBean features which are plenty already. Radio is lovely, only listen to a single CD at a time, and didn't rush to get a wind deflector or spoiler for the rear window.
4. Back seat passengers reported lots of room, and I'm a large guy who typically pushes the seat back all the way when driving.
5. No noise from the brakes.

I plan to get the windows tinted soon. And no, the cats haven't had their ride yet either.

Steve

yellowbikedon · May 2001

You've bought a great wagon! Mine is also white, now has 5,500 plus miles on it and other than a two and a half day "off road" situation waiting for a replacement of the fuel sensors to the on board computer, I've had no problems. My MPG has ranged from about 19 (city plus some highway) to 27.1 while driving down to Florida from Illinois.
This is my third Subaru and second Outback. It is leaps and bounds ahead of the '96 in terms of creature comfort, engine performance and quiet ride.

Good luck with your LL Bean!

Don

nygreg · May 2001

Congratulations! Got me scared when you said you were doing 80 with only 150 miles on car. Recently saw a white OB with tinted windows and it looked really nice!. If you ever decide on the hood deflector it is easy to install and you can get a good price at subaruparts.com. My H4 is getting around 25 mpg with 2K on car. You shouldn't be too far behind.

Good luck,
Greg

gxdragon · May 2001

I have a 99' Jeep Grand Cherokee. It has been a nightmare from the beggining. 3 rear diffs, 2 front diffs, defective brake booster, leaking transmission and much more. I'm getting rid of it and I want something that won't have me spending my days in the dealerships waiting room. I like the outback but I want to know that if it's reliable. Please post your experiences good or bad.

evilizard · May 2001

Well I have a 96OB, I've taken it off roading at Big Bend National Park and deep sandy beaches of North Padre Island in Texas, through the flooding streets of San Antonio and up to Vermont and back to Texas (all these trips were loaded with 4 people and gear). Got 67K on it.

The "problems" that were not related to wear or abuse have been
- Replace Camshaft Position Sensor - $90
- Replace Switch on Door lock - $80
I've had the check engine light come on twice, once was for that camshaft sensor and once was emissions related.

Wear items replaced so far are Tires, brakepads, oil & air & fuel Filters, accessory belts, Fluids, fluids, fluids, spark plugs.

mammothsun · May 2001

We picked up the Bean over the weekend in Irvine. Wife liked wine stone but we almost changed to white pearl at the last minute. Drove the sales guy crazy, but he didn't complain. Anyway that meant driving 2 cars back up to Mammoth. (other car is an 01 Acura CL-) First tank of gas was 21 and the 2nd went up to 25. Drove at 70-80 most of the way.
The Bean is smooth but of course the power is nothing like the Acura (Too bad they don't make an WAD car as there selling them in LA at the same price as the Bean)
Along the way we stopped to give the dogs water (one was in the Sub)When my wife got out of the Bean she hit the door lock the wrong way and the car locked with the dog in the back. Stood by the side of the hi way to try and spot a CHP...none in 20 minutes. The cell phone didn't work so I drove to the nearest call box to get AAA. We were between Mojave and Ridge crest and they said 45 minutes wait. As good luck would have however, another AAA truck came by and had the door open in 10 seconds. The door locks work opposite from the Acura which caused the problem. Believe that won't happen again.
Other than that....the car is very quiet, stereo is fine, no brake noise, no starting problem. Will get the windows tinted in Reno this weekend.
We were going to pay cash for the car but at 2.9 %, for 2 years, we can make an extra 2.3 % on the money just from a money market acct. That along with the fact that after about 3 years the car with equal mileage as an 02 figures to be worth only about $1500 less, and the dealers probably won't be dealing at invoice plus $100 for a while made the decision to get the 01.

rsholland · May 2001

I think you will find the reliability difference between the Grand Cherokee and an Outback to be like night and day.

Bob

bat1161 · May 2001

Gxdragon,

I have a 00 base OB wagon since September and love it! Except for the recall that Subaru instituted for the ECM module, which I had no problem with, the car has been fine. It handled the couple of heavy snows we had this winter with ease, and rides nicely on all types of road surfaces. The only downside so far has been that my gas mileage has been averaging around 21 mpg/city and highway. Even with that, I would still recommend the Outback hands down over the Grand Cherokee.

Mark

ateixeira · May 2001

My dad used to get Cherokees for his fleet at work, but they switched to Toyotas after poor reliability with the Jeeps.

Then a Camry he was driving caught on fire, believe it or not. I think he may not have had a recall fixed, since he was living in Belize, but that was bizarre.

He now drives a 2001 Outback, after hearing about how well my Forester and my cousin's '99 Outback have done.

No break downs or spontaneous combustions so far, so he's happy!

-juice

originalbitman · May 2001

If you haven't done so yet... you might want to read the break-in section of your owners manual before your trip to Reno.

bit

kmclean · May 2001

Steve and mammothsun:

I had my "back five" windows tinted on my '00 wagon last year, and have been very pleased. Based on my experiences with window tinting in San Antonio (I'm now in Seattle, and, yes, we do have sunshine up here!), I'd make two recommendations: 1) get the metallic style film in as dark a tint as your state law allows, and 2) pay the bucks to get a really good installation done (these generally come with a lifetime guarantee for the person who owned the car when the film was installed).

Cheers and sunshine from Seattle!

Hey! How 'bout them Mariners!? A-Rod must be kicking himself (not to mention Rangers' owners).

Ken M.

originalbitman · May 2001

I also did the moonroofs. They still let in light but not the heat. Also did the front doors with 50... not legal but not dark.

bit

keith51 · May 2001

...for the '01 Bean? I'm just curious what it does in 0-60 (yes I could time it myself, but the car is too new to abuse like that).

keith

nygreg · May 2001

When you locked your keys in, why didn't you try to use the Subaru 24hrs roadside assistance? Any available? Just curious. BTW, the locks work opposite my Camry and Sienna also. Hope this car does as well as my Camry.

Congrats,
Greg

rsholland · May 2001

in mid-high 8 second range.

Bob

wanabe33 · May 2001

I just picked up my new 01 outback from Dulles Subaru. I was going to go to Fitzgerald but when Tom at Dulles said he would match the 500 below invoice price I decided to stay with the local dealer. I love this car. We wanted the winestone but we ended up with a white one. (which was our first choice to begin with.) We had a great experience with this purchase.

mammothsun · May 2001

We could have used Subaru roadside I guess. Since we had to go to a call box (as the cell phone was out of range) we went to AAA. through the operator. I imagine Subaru works through AAA. ??? Since it was around 6PM and the car was partly in the shade, the worst of the heat was over. If it had been the middle of the day in the sun we probably would have had to break a window
kmclean...thanks for the tinting info. The Sub lets in alot of light and the sun at 8000' is intense in the summer

drew_ · May 2001

...at 6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern. Hope to see you there!
http://www.edmunds.com/chat/subaruchat.html

Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards

canadiancl · May 2001

Does anyone think that the rear end of a pre-2000 OB is actually more attractive than the current model's?

2ndwnd · May 2001

>>Does anyone think that the rear end of a pre-2000 OB is actually more attractive than the current model's? <<

Hey, does this late model car make my butt look big?? I don't think either is ugly. I like the better visability out of the back of my 00.

By the way, didn't you mean to say, "Does anyone ELSE think...

hypov · May 2001

I would think so. I have a 98 and I think it looks better than the post 99s. The current models looks like (no I won't go there), well lets just say a little bloated.

outbacksuw · May 2001

Hello there...I own a 2001 Outback Limited that is having a bit of a problem that Subaru hasn't been able to fix. Despite being frustrated with the wasted trips to the dealer I still do enjoy the Subaru. This is my 3rd. However, the car has not been fixed yet!

The car idle's incorrectly. Especially at startup...the car's RPM's shoot up/down several times between 200 - 2700 before the car finally settles down. The car appears to be straining at startup?

Any feedback? The dealer has already replaced an O2 sensor plus the vehicles wiring harness. What else?

HELP?!?

PAUL

oclvframe · June 2001

This is an echo to kmclean's post (1484) about window tinting...As well as getting a metallic tint, look into finding a Solarworks chain store in your area. They seem to have one of the best films available, plus, they are nation-wide. I had the windows tinted in my Lexus a few years ago and less than a year later, the shop that did it was gone. Lifetime warranties are usually hard to use if the instaling dealer is gone. (If a problem were to arrise with your tint, the film manufacturer could bail out saying that the film wasn't installed correctly thus no warranty.) I also used a metalic tint and also tinted the two sun roofs on my Bean. The legal limit in GA is 35% all around, so although it is dark...it is not limo dark. The main goal with the sunroofs was heat reflection. I used two different types of metallics: the windows are with a metalic film that does not look mirrored, just grey. The sunroofs are with a mirrored looking tint..this reflects the sunlight better.

As for the break in...I saw a couple of comments where there was a 'concern' with driving the vehicle at 80 or above during break-in. Why is this a problem? The only guidelines in the break-in guide (and this includes any motor...) is watching engine speed. If the manual tells you not to exceed 4000rpm, and, you can cruise on the highway at 80mph without going over 4000rpm...you should be ok.

subearu · June 2001

You may want to post over in the Subaru Crew - Meet the Members forum. A SOA rep (Patti) usually frequents there and can help you out.

-Brian

nygreg · June 2001

I believe the manual states to keep the speed to 55 and the rpms below 4000 for the first 1K. Engine is one concern, the other is the gearing.

Paul - Maybe you could try to reset your ECM by disconnecting the neg terminal on the battery for 30 mins. Something the dealer probably tried already, but thought I would mention it. Good luck.

And, I don't think my butt is too big.

-Greg

canadiancl · June 2001

Yes you're right. I left out the "else"

armac13 · June 2001

My Forester manual doesn't say anything about max speed (I just rechecked), just says keep under 4000 rpm and vary speed.

Ross

mhjamerson · June 2001

I just traded in my 1991 Legacy L S/W FWD for a 1996 Legacy Outback S/W AWD. I am not familiar with the All Wheel Drive system and am wondering whether there is problem with my vehicle.

When I turn the vehicle (as when pulling into a parking space or other 90 degree or more turns), it feels as though the brake has been applied - the steering has a heavier, perhaps chunkier feel to it. Is this normal for the AWD system on turns? Any info would be great.

balifly · June 2001

Hi,
My wife and I are in the market for a new car in the fall. We are trying to decide on the Legacy I or the OBS both in 5 speed and with A/C.

The questions of space versus fuel economy, we will be using the car for daily commute 5 miles each way. On weekends and holidays, it will be used for fishing and camping.

Your opinions please, I have posted similar questions to the OBS board.

Regards,
Balifly

Subaru Legacy/Outback

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