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Advertising Fees
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Comments
1) regional ad fees are legit
2) this dealer's ad cost can't be confirmed, so the $448. 49 could easily be scam or part scam
3) to introduce the additional charge late in the negotiations is definitely scummy, IMO
Were it me, I'd look at the whole deal to see how it compares to TMV. If you're still at/under TMV and close to invoice and you really like the car, I'd make an all inclusive offer and be prepared to walk if it's not accepted.
If this is the same Tahoe, I think you're still a little high. All in all, you've started/gotten sucked into a losing negotiation by negotiating from invoice, IMO.
So, I'd make a final offer of invoice plus $500-$600 in a dollar figure and walk if the final numbers are any different. It's the end of the month; and the dealer's got holdback contributing to the profit, too.
(The window etch is a scam. The doc fee is pure profit.)
Next- when you negotiate the price of the car, on the buyers order it will show in some cases as DOC fees, advertising, detailing, stamps, etc...) You'll see a dollar amount that is called Dealer Fees and in small letters you'll see what are they charging for. You always have to read the fine print, if u cannot see or read the fine print ask to see an original so u could see the TRUTH. I hope this will help you.
Sorry to disagree with you, but in business - EVERYTHING IS NEGOTIABLE - Politly refuse to pay the fee -maybe agree to pay 30% of the fee or if you do agree to pay the ad fee - get something in return. Say something like - OK I will pay the $462.00 ad fee but only if you agree to drop the $199 glass etching and $399 Vehicle protection package down to the $50 (or whatever) it cost you.
The ad fee can be legitimate - but that does not mean it is not on the table to be reduced or eliminated.
In fact any time you are negotiating and hear a statement like - This is "always" charged, this is part of our "standard" agreement, this is "company" policy it is a very good chance it is NOT "always" charged, NOT "standard" on every agreement and NOT really "company" policy.
The advertising fee is NOT negotiable, since it is a direct charge from the manufacturer and listed in the invoice, but of course, the final, "out the door", "driveaway", "over the curb" price IS negotiable.
IMO you must get into the details or you end up paying way to much.
$250 over invoice sounds good
$400 ad fee - why fight it
$199 glass etching - no big deal
$399 Protection package, not bad for a $10 wax job and a can of scotch guard
$150 Doc fee, after all someone needs to do the paper work
$149 pin stripes,and $200 for mud flaps - OK since you already put them on
$1,500 "EXTRA value package A" - floor mats and a first aid kit, plus tire warranty and locking lug nuts - How could I live without these
Give me $7,500 for my trade (but the blue book trade in value is $11,000) - OK I understand - you have 2 dozen on these on your used car lot and you can't even give them away.
Finance me at 15% - for 72 months well OK it does lower my payment (and keeps me upsidedown for 5 1/2years!)
Extended warranty adds another $1,500 - you can just add it into the loan - thanks for looking out for me - I will give your name to all my friends.
Since my loan is so high - you now say I need credit life and gap coverage. Great add it to the loan
But why should I complain I only paid $250 over invoice!!
$250 over invoice sounds good
Great, add taxes and licensing and we're done.
$400 ad fee - why fight it
Because it's part of the invoice cost - the dealer can't make it "go away".
$199 glass etching - no big deal
Just like drugs, "just say no".
$399 Protection package, not bad for a $10 wax job and a can of scotch guard
Refer to "glass etching" above.
$150 Doc fee, after all someone needs to do the paper work
If it's allowed by your state, then all dealerships will do it.
$149 pin stripes,and $200 for mud flaps - OK since you already put them on
How about, "just say no" - and "remove those items, please, I don't want them".
$1,500 "EXTRA value package A" - floor mats and a first aid kit, plus tire warranty and locking lug nuts - How could I live without these
Floor mats in parts dept, $50, first aid kit, Wal-Mart, $10, tire warranty (forget it) and locking lug nuts (Pep Boys, $20).
Give me $7,500 for my trade (but the blue book trade in value is $11,000) - OK I understand - you have 2 dozen on these on your used car lot and you can't even give them away.
Dealerships are businesses - businesses stay in business by making a profit. If you don't like what you're offered, sell it yourself.
Finance me at 15% - for 72 months well OK it does lower my payment (and keeps me upsidedown for 5 1/2years!)
If you have poor credit AND you're buying more than you can afford, it's nobody's fault but your own.
Extended warranty adds another $1,500 - you can just add it into the loan - thanks for looking out for me - I will give your name to all my friends
Extended warranties are negotiable - then again, there's that "just say no" phrase you hadn't learned yet.
Since my loan is so high - you now say I need credit life and gap coverage. Great add it to the loan
See above.
But why should I complain I only paid $250 over invoice!!
You shouldn't - if you just said "no".
You get up and walk out without thanking them for the free coffee - it tasted ugly anyway.
You can turn down anything and everything but some fees a dealership just won't mess with.
Why kill yourself over a $400 ad fee. Say a dealer down the lot tells you they will do it for 350, and give you 400 over invoice? you pay more. Best way to deal is an OTD price as zues suggests. Boom, 21,960OTD is much better than 22,960 OTD. Who cares how they got to it, you are still financing XXX, and the dealer did what they had to to make it pan out.
Had a dealer give me a great trade on my car, but MSRP on the new one. Other was average on car, but $400 over invoice on new one, difference in OTD? about $1500. I don't care how they get to it, all I'm worried about is the bottom line. If car X and Y have the exact same options, add ons, etc. what's the best overall price I can get it for. If you have your financing preapproved as a fallback, you shouldn't have any problems with 15% for 72mo.
As I have recommended before, before you go into any dealership, have your ducks lined up. Financing, trade info, new car info, warranty, etc. much easier to deal.
What do you base it on?
If one dealer gives you $21,960 and the second says $22,960 - yes dealer one has a better price - but are you getting a good deal? You don't know.
Zue - your just say no answer really supports my point, negotiate everything - don't just accept a fee / charge.
Maybe it is just my style, but just saying -
Your out the door price is to high - lower it - does not work for me. I have better luck using a more detailed approach. I have bought several vehicles for below invoice, with no add on fees. Several more at $100 - $300 over invoice - with no add on fees. I even bought one car for $500 under invoice minus holdback. Again no ad, doc or any other fees. How is this possible if they are not negotiable?
One last point -I always treat the salesperson with respect.
Jim
If the car is identical(lets say an '04 Accord EX V6 non Navi in Satin Silver), and one dealer offers you 24,990 while second dealer offers you 25,990 IMO, unless dealer 2 dropped in a warranty, add-ons, or some other pack item, I don't really care how much I am paying for doc fees. granted, it is possible to negotiate and spend time 'grinding' dealer 2, why waste time if the price is fair? ... Say you are getting the car for $100 over invoice, how much more can you possibly save, and how long will it take you to get it? Say you 'grind' dealer 2, and get them to go down to 24,940... takes say 3 hours... that's like paying yourself about 16/hour. not worth my time.
Of course it's just my opinion, and to each their own.
I have searched the forum, and gotten mixed info suggesting it is anywhere from $300 to $500. I spoke with one dealer recently, and he insisted that "EVERY" dealer would include this in their invoice price. However, the invoice price he quoted me would lead me to assume the advertising fee is in the neighborhood of $800. I know that the Edmunds invoice price does not include this fee ... Should it?
Can someone please elaborate? Thanks.
RAP
Start with the Edmunds invoice price, add on a couple hundred dollars, and add on the transportation cost. Then add on sales tax and a fee for tag/title ($50 in VA) to get an OTD price. See if they will accept that offer.
If not, then increase your offer. Keep increasing it until a dealer accepts it.
Of course, if there are dealer incentives or rebates for the car you want to buy, you should adjust your OTD offer accordingly.
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Terry.
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If I do a swap with a Virginia Market dealer they have no ad fee so they get screwed with my 300 dollar one and I get a little extra gross.