Chevrolet Cavalier

homerkc · January 2002

Dweezil, I agree that there is bias against American cars today. Consumer Reports loves all foreign cars, hates all American cars. I just read their comments about the Dodge Intrepid (I own one, and it is a great car - the most trouble free American sedan in model year 2000, I understand.) They picked at items, sure, but their bias is seen in their wording. They are much more complimentary of similar rated features in speaking of the Japanese cars. Trust me, the transmission on an Accord does NOT shift smoother than the Dodge automatic, however, you would never know that from reading their text.

The American manufacturers have caught up in many ways, and produce some fine cars. Some auto writers will take a decade of excellence before it registers with them.

allenorygun · January 2002

I only paid 11000, after the rebates and it's automatic also. I like the gray interior and the cup holders. CD stereo is quite decent. Seats are far more comfortable than Ranger or Focus, maybe even better than Corolla. I have 5k miles now and no problems. I bought this car because I wanted to try something different, and I am glad I bought this car. The civic seats are too small or something, compared to this car. Ford Focus seats are funky, in that you sit too high unsupported, or at least that's how I feel. The only problem I can see, is that's there's a very minor vibration, high pitched coming from inside drivers door, but I never even notice it anymore... almost imperceivable. Good Car so far. All I know, is that when you read these reviews, they put you in a mood against certain cars, and if I had listened to these reviews, I'd be driving an Accord, but I made up my mind and bought the Cavalier. I kind of feel screwed by my dealer though. I was a GM contractor, A recent college graduate and I took the $2500 rebate also. 8 weeks went by and I'm wondering where my rebate is, so I call the dealer. They cut me a check, but said they were withholding $400 because GM wouldn't give me the contractor discount with the college grad rebate. I say screw this and I wrote to Chevrolet, asking if they want to keep me a GM customer. We shall see. If they weren't gonna give me the 3 discounts, I say tell me up front, then I can go buy a Honda, but they didn't so I'm gonna fight for my 400 bucks. Good Car overall, no complaints, all praise so far.

dweezil · January 2002

religiously, and have been paying close attention on my commute to work, keeping an objective eye on what has been said on the boards and in CR about the Cavalier. It seems as if they're driving a different car than the one I bought. It's ordinary and simple and I still don't understand what engenders the animosity. Rides nicely, the handling is clean, it looks great,perhaps it has a different feel with the 4 speed auto over the 3 speed or 5 speed manual, as the engine winds nicely getting on to LA freeways, and the 4th OD drops the revs down real low at speed. It's comfortable, quiet, very efficient with gas. It does everything I expect it to do, and has been the perfect traveling companion on vacation, covering 700-800 miles in a day, a lot of it at 75 to 80 MPH. I am supposed to be embarrassed, or rather GM is for building this car?? I don't understand that.
Homerkc: I know what you mean about CR, they couldn't wait to [quote]"be able to recommend the Passat again" according to their winter New Car Ed.Its reliabilty rating had improved to "average".
I would have expected better than that given the rep. At least the Cavalier isn't a "nameplate to avoid" like the New Beetle or the Neon

alpha01 · January 2002

I really don't see it. For example, in their tests, the Ford Explorer topped all the other (5)SUVs compared in the September 2001 issue, including 4Runner and Pathfinder. Also, the Explorer Sport Trac and Dodge Dakota were shown to do better than the Tacoma and Fronteir (which got an especially dismal write-up). The Ford Focus is their HIGHEST rated small car (above Protege, Civic, etc) but is not recommended because of a poor reliability record. Other examples of American cars with good reviews from CR... the Escape (but again, reliability issues), the Park Avenue, the Lincoln LS, Chrysler Town and Country. And finally, in the same issue containing the comparo with the Intrepid, the Chevy Avalanche has a VERY favorable article.

Concerning your cite about the transmissions in the Accord and Intrepid, this is what CR said:
Accord- " The four speed automatic doesnt shift quite as smoothly as the best among these vehicles, although you can opt for a manual shift on four cylinder Accords"
Intrepid- " The four speed automatic is not as responsive as the others here"
How are they fundamentally different?
Perhaps you are just upset because your car, perceived as "great" by you or otherwise, was not rated as highly as others.

Now, getting back to the Cavalier..........
~alpha
(Disclaimer: All of the examples cited are based on Consumer Reports New Car Preview 2002, or Jan and Feb 02 issues)

taskmaster · January 2002

Do the Cavalier and Sunfire use the same power steering pump and steering rack? I have driven both and have noticed a stiffer feel in the Cavalier, which I do not like, and the Sunfire has a lighter feel which I prefer. I thought they use the same components.

Anybody know technically what's going on and what can be modified, etc?

johnc23 · January 2002

I have a 2000 Z24 and except for a paint problem when I first bought it, it has performed as well as a cheap economy car should. However, I have had a problem come up recently. The switch that directs the flow of air in the car to the feet, face, defrost, etc... has been acting up. In particular it is struggling to direct air to the foot vents. I was wondering if any of you have had a problem like this arise? If so, was it a minor problem or did it require a bit more attention.

vocus · January 2002

I would take it to the dealer if I were you. Is the car still under warranty? If so, don't sweat it and let them fix it for free.

charts2 · January 2002

This Teo guy critcizes anyone who doesn't agree with him. Because a Cavalier in his books is beneath him. His liking is for Audi's and BMeers. On the Impala board all Teo talks about is his Chevrolet Impala how good GM and Chevrolet are and then comes to this board and slams everything about them. He's hard to understand. He posts over 200 times a week on the Impala board.(time to get a life!!) As Cavalier owners know the Cavalier was redesigned back in 1995. Upgrades have been made to the engine and and interior as well. It is a great economical car for the American public, who don't want to spend big bucks on transportation. I am sure the next generation will even be better.

teo · January 2002

Hey Charts bitter eh? What is your freaking problem?

You are a silly, ill mannered poster that complaints left and right about his Impala because the DIC is 18% off...oh my gawd!!

...and expects GM to buy it back, LOL.

The one that clearly needs to get a life and some very needed manners is YOU.

'Nuff said

teo · January 2002

The Cavalier is an outdated embarrasement of vehicle. GM knows it very well. 20+ years on the same J-body platform is enough. Hopefully Lutz will speed up the Delta platform to replace this relic.

The Cavalier is an embarrasement for GM as an automaker.

vocus · January 2002

The Cavalier is one of the only ways alot of people get into an affordable new car though, especially alot of young people. Almost everyone I have known had a Cavalier at one time or another. So if they can keep prices down while increasing refinement and most other traits, that would be cool.

seminole_kev · January 2002

I'd get a Hyundai Elantra or a stripped Focus before I'd get a Cavalier if I had to go for the lowest cost. Really, if I was going lowest cost, I'd get a used car.

teo · January 2002

I hear ya. But GM is getting slammed in the press and the buying public alike by not offering a worthy small car competitor. The Cavalier can satisfy the needs of budget minded customers, but it doesn't mean they have to put up with an ancient platform (Yes the car was *updated* in 1995 but that's old already and the platform is the same 1981 issue) and lousy safety scores.

Toyota and Honda have proved over the last 20 years that a budget priced vehicle can offer superior quality, technology and safety.

GM can do it too.

www.opel.com

malibu99 · January 2002

We have a 2000 cavalier in our household. We ARE NOT embarrased by it! How could we be? We get the best fuel economy, a car that is cheap, reliable, and we have plenty left over to spend on the house. It is a little dated but it WORKS! calling it an embarrasement is silly.

teo · January 2002

Tell that to the automotive press. Instead of calling the Cavalier an embarrasement, make them call it an incredible automotive milestone...pleease!

joe3891 · January 2002

work on my 00 Cavy and that why i own one,easy to work on and parts are cheap.The so called great Cavalier coming will COST COST COST.

dindak · January 2002

Cavalier is outdated, no doubt. That said, our leased 99 has been very reliable and has a surprisingly smooth drive train. In terms of value, it's hard to beat.

I do however think a replacement is way overdue and Lutz should make it a priority.

malibu99 · January 2002

I find it funny when people go by "the press". What an incredible mastermind follower you are, that is unbelievable. We didn't care what the press said, we bought it because it was cheap to drive and got us from A to B with no frills. If the press doesn't like it, better, that means no one would want to steal it and our insurance is cheaper. Very sad to see people following masterminds, that is how "the press" got people to smoke in the 50s and now we are trying to cover up that booboo.

vocus · January 2002

I went against what the press said when I bought my Cavalier too. I was just unlucky to get a car just like they were talking about (unreliable). It has to do with luck too.

dindak · January 2002

Cavalier insurance for us for the year is C$709. Cheap!

vocus · January 2002

My Cavalier's insurance was $122 a month when I had it. Of course, I was 21 then and it was my first car that I financed (and required full coverage on). Not too bad though, I guess.

charts2 · January 2002

COOL DOWN TEO !!!!! COOL DOWN!!!

Driver information centre, you say!! GM took care of our concerns, yesterday(jan 15). Dave Westgate GM service representative gave Bill and I in writing the following because we were persistant. FREE OIL/FILTER CHANGES at any GM dealer until 60,000 km or 3 years is reached. I am only at 4,600 right now. Option to purchase Deluxe extended GM warranty at anytime prior to the original 3 year warranty expiring at GM,s cost of the warranty about 1/2 price, and that if a fix is found for our D.I.C. in the future we will have ours fixed.

YAHHHOOOOOOOOOOO!! But no new car as you always suggested. We even mentioned that to him, we thought he might go for it. We had a good laugh!

PS: I still like the Cavalier basic transportation at an economical price. But does need updating. Hopefully when I have another concern with my car and I post it you don't jump all over me again.......(no hard feelings) over and out

teo · January 2002

As long as you avoid directing anymore rude postings in my direction, I'll be cool about it, so keep your temperature in check.

Glad to hear GM did the right thing for you. Persistance really pays off.

No hard feelings from this side either.

tomcat630 · January 2002

If GM keeps the J platform, they should at least update the interior, big time. Also, reduce noise and vibrations in the base engine.

The rear end looks too blah and could use a kick too.

joe3891 · January 2002

Have you driven a 00 2.2 NO vibration,with radio on at idle you have to look at the tach to tell its running.

alternator · January 2002

I have owned the following Cavaliers: 1984, 1987, 1989, 1992, and 1996 (my present 2nd car). All of these have logged about 20,000 miles per year.

I always do the normal maintenance myself (oil & filter change, radiator drain & refill, tire rotation, chassis lube, spark plug change, PCV change, air filter change). These services are all easy to do on a Cavalier (oil filter location is awkward but can still be changed from above).

The only problems I have had worth mentioning are rust on door bottoms (through the 1987 model, but not on later models) and alternator failures on two Cavaliers (1987 & 1992, both replaced on extended warranty basis after some arguing with dealer).

I feel the 1996 Cavalier Coupe styling is still handsome and does not appear dated at all in comparison to competition. Having read so many derogatory comments about the Cavalier, I want to offer encouragement to those who might be considering buying a car that has been very, very good to me !!

joe3891 · January 2002

We are almost the same,i started with a 85 various yrs and now a 00.Do my own work and have had very little trouble,maybe thats the key.

isseyvoo · January 2002

I have a '92 5 sp. that I bought new and have meticulously maintained. First head gasket went at around 50K. (It was a leak rather than a catastrophic failure.) Set me back to the tune of around $450. This weekend after I pulled the car into the garage I thought I smelled coolant when I got out of the car. Popped the hood, and lo and behold, coolant appears to be oozing from around the head gasket. (At least that's the way it appears to my amateur eyes. I haven't yet verified it with a mechanic.) The car still runs well and burns no oil, which is why I kept it even after I bought my Olds last year. If it needs another new head gasket at 94K miles, though, I don't know if I'll fix it or not.

allenorygun · January 2002

Hello. I'm a positive person, but here's my story. November 11, 2001 I bought a 2002 Cavalier. I got the $2500 rebate. I was also a recent college grad, so I got the $400 rebate also. I was also working for a GM contractor, so I also got a small discount for that. I went to Grant & Hayes Community Chevrolet in Portland, Oregon. They wrote up my deal, giving me all three discounts, netting like $11,100 for the car with auto. A good price, yes, but I wouldn't have bought this car if I didn't get this deal. I go back 8 weeks later and they withhold 400 bucks from my 2500 rebate check, saying the GM said that I couldn't use the college grad rebate with the GM contractor discount. Yet, that's how they wrote the deal up. A contract is a contract is a contract, right? If came back crying to them that I paid too much, they'd tell me to buzz off. But they're not living up to the deal. I wrote chevrolet in early January, and yesterday I got a call from Chevrolet customer no service, they denied my request. This was my first GM car purchase, and MY LAST and I told the guy so. The 3 discounts were written into the contract, clearly showing the 3. Am I being unreasonalbe? I'd like to spread my story because this is unfair. I have many automotive dollars to spend in the future and GM will NEVER get another penny from me, and I'm going to make it my mission in life to take business away from them and give it to foreign car makers or Dodge/Chrysler.... comments welcome here or to my own email. And Yes, I'm still fighting to get my 400 bucks, by contacting 2 consumer advocate groups and a local TV station consumer watch unit.

dindak · January 2002

I see your point, but it is possible the two discounts can not be used together. That said, it sounds like the dealership did not handle the situation very well. Did GM head office confirm to you that the discounts can not be used together?

In the end I would just try and work some thing out with the dealer (ie. split the $400 difference). If you hate your dealer now or sales person, go to another one if you can.

I had a similar problem when I bought a used Accord many years back. The guy gave me a price (in writing), but he discounted too much and his boss rejected the deal. I was mad, but I still bought the car after the manager gave me a few free oil changes ect. The auto business is not a clean one unless you visit Saturn or something. Even then, no guarantee.

jpelder · January 2002

Good luck going after your $400. While I applaud your spirit, have you found out whether or not you are entitled to the discount in the first place? I think that is the most important factor.

I understand your point about the contract and all, but if the discount was listed in error, I would be a bit more understanding. I have made mistakes quoting to my customers, and in some cases would lose my shirt if they didn't allow me to correct my error. (I'm not a car salesman) GM has so many damn programs that it gets confusing to sort out.

I read about a discount for "friends and family" of GM employees and tried to get it. I got several different stories from several different people, it was that confusing.

When I bought my Alero this month, if I would have bought my car 1 business hour later, I would have saved another $500. (GM increased the rebates) It makes you mad, and there's alwasy the suspicion that the dealer was deliberately deceptive. But I know that the dealer did not knowingly have me pay $500 more, and they have nothing to gain by it since it's not their money, but factory money.

GM sells cars to dealers, not individuals. SO it seems your beef is with the dealer.

Good luck in your quest, but I wouldn't hold it against GM in general. How many other companies give such generous college grad rebates.

Have you called the GM phone number for incentive programs? I got the number from a dealer if you need it and could email it to you. I got tired of asking sales reps about program details.

mdaffron · January 2002

We're trading my wife's coolant-leaking, head-gasket-blowing lousy excuse for transportation for a 2002 Mazda Protege5 this Saturday. Time for a quality car we can depend on.

Good luck with your Cavs!

Meade

dindak · January 2002

Good luck. It's too bad you had a bad experience. Keep in mind that Mazda's are far from trouble free though. Just ask one of the secretaries in my office about here 626 and you will get an ear full. That said, I hope it's a good car for you. They certainly are cool looking.

mdaffron · January 2002

Somehow I knew you'd slink back in here for one final pot shot at me, dindak.

Well, 626s have Ford mechanicals, for starters. So much for American reliability.

Say what you want about Mazdas being "far from trouble-free" -- this will be our fourth Protege. The first three HAVE been trouble-free (well, except for the one I totaled in 1992 -- but I consider that "user error," LOL)!

Here's some pics to prove my credentials -- just don't laugh to hard at that pic of me before I lost some weight!

http://www.geocities.com/negatize/specialty_old6.htm

Meade

vocus · January 2002

I have to say I don't think Dindak's comment was a shot at you. He/she is right about all cars. No car is trouble-free. Some just have more trouble than others. You just got a lemon is all.

But to Meade's defense, Dindak, the 626 is built with Ford mechanicals. I have an office mate who has trouble with his wife's 626 all the time, and it's only got like 55K on it.

mdaffron · January 2002

Baseball, hot dogs, apple pie and Chevrolet. Isn't that how it goes? Boy, I feel all warm and tingly inside! Peace brothers!

Meade

vocus · January 2002

I do have to say there seems to be more Cavaliers lemons out there than Mazda lemons.

And baseball and hot dogs and Chevrolet? Ugh, I think I am going to yak...

mdaffron · January 2002

You probably wouldn't remember it. I think it was out right around 1980, give or take a year or two. Weren't you still in diapers then?

Meade

vocus · January 2002

You're right, I was probably still in diapers in 1980.

malibu99 · January 2002

Yes, that could well be true but 233,000+ Cavaliers sold vs 78,000+ Proteges sold will explain why there might be more bad Cavaliers, probabilities are higher. :-)

Source: Autosite.com sales volume

mdaffron · January 2002

So building more cars results in a greater risk of problems? Then why are the Toyota Camry and Honda Accord winning sales records AND winning reliability awards simultaneously?

dindak · January 2002

mdaffron : Not meant to be a pot shot at all. I really do wish you well. I know people that have had problems with all sorts of cars and won't buy them again. Don't blame them and don't blame you. Peace man!

mdaffron · January 2002

When it all boils down, everybody has their own personal tastes and preferences. If we didn't, there wouldn't be so damned many cars on the market and we'd all be driving the same thing! So we had bad luck with our Cav. Not all are bad, I'm not stupid enough to think that. But for me, I go by the adage, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on ME."

I've been screwed a number of times by THIS PARTICULAR car. If yours is great, wonderful! I choose not to take the chance again, and will instead go with a vehicle with which I've had three flawless examples. Maybe I've been lucky; I don't know. But all I know is what I've experienced.

That IS human nature, after all, isn't it? My dad asked me why I just purchased a Toshiba for my new 36-inch TV, when I could've chosen another brand like Sony or JVC which are touted as top-of-the-line. Well, I told him the reason: I have a 20-inch Toshiba that's been through a half-dozen moves, a couple of nasty power surges and other mishaps and it's working like a champ. Oh, did I mention it's approaching 15 years old? There was no question which brand of TV I was going to choose for my new one. Experience!

(Dindak, I'm saying this more for malibu99 than for you.)

So farewell, Cavalier fans! My dealer will confirm or deny your claims to quality with his trade-in offer!

Meade

teo · January 2002

Boring day at work, eh?

Do you feel compelled to get back at each poster that refutes your claims of unhapiness as an owner of a Cavalier?

Get over it.

You have get rid of the thing and soon you'll be driving a spanking new Protege5.

Time to move on and BTW, enjoy your new car.

malibu99 · January 2002

The more you build the greater the chance of a bad car ( or any product that is mass produced) simple fact, nothing I made up. :-)

allenorygun · January 2002

Thanks for the comments about my college grad rebate and the GM supplier discount. Yes, I understand, the dealers buy the cars from Chevrolet. So they are somewhat distinct entities. My dealer said he isn't going to pay because GM wouldn't pay the college rebate to them. I think my dealer should pay because he employs finance people who don't know how to implement GM's finance programs. The dealer should eat this as a result of their own ignorance. I hold GM responsible, because they have ultimate responsibility for the satisfaction of their customers. I may find out if I signed an arbitration agreement, then find how how to start that process. I can live without the $400 bucks, but I want justice. I wish evil upon them.

dindak · January 2002

GM is responsible for it's car owners being happy. You don't own the car, so it's really the dealer who you should take issue with. Will your dealer not split the difference or something? Perhaps a few free oil changes? I doubt complaining to GM will get you very far unfortunately as it was a dealer error, not the company's

allenorygun · January 2002

Ya know, maybe in a different industry, I might be more understanding. Say it was a miscommunication with an ebay buyer and seller thing, I would bend. I'm no tightwad, I pay for a lot of stuff, let a lot of things go, and generally I feel that being fair is the right thing to do. When it comes to cars though, I am as unreasonable as a woman. See, say the dealer charged me 24% interest on a car loan, then my dad told me that was too high. Do you think that if I went back, the dealer would split the difference? No way in Heil. The dealer would say, "you signed the contract" and so would the judge. So, I signed a contract, and I'm going to make them live by it, just like I had to live by my past contract where I got reamed up the XXX by car dealers. It's funny too, the motto of this car dealer is "the Saints of St. Johns!".

dindak · January 2002

So are they making you stick with the deal? Can't you just walk away or was there a deposit?

I would think if the terms of a signed contract were changed with out both sides consent, the contract is null and void.

allenorygun · January 2002

Dindak. I bought and picked up the Car Nov 11, 2001. That's the day I signed the papers and off I drove with the car. I took the $2500 cash back, and I financed the whole price of the car. So in 8 weeks I expected to get a check for $2500. The college grad rebate the dealer put towards my down payment, then he would wait to get paid for that. So on Jan 9th, 02 I went into get my $2500 rebate, and he only gave me $2100, withholding $400 because GM kicked the college grad rebate back to him. So it's not like I can take a car back with 4000 miles on it, although I know they can repo a car if they can't get you financed... So, yesterday, kind of in response to your posting, I wrote the dealer again, saying that GM Detroit denied my claim, and that I expect the GM dealer, to make me whole. So I expect to get a call from him saying "sorry sucker"... I sent another flaming snail mail to GM detroit plus Clark Howard, this one guy who fights for consumer injustice and to a local tv station consumer action team. Thanks for the enjoyable discourse.... Car dealers ask for it when they play these games. My dealer might have known, that if I didn't get all 3 rebate, then I had no loyalty whatsover in buying a GM car, even though I was a GM contractor. Essentially, I saved 50 bucks by using the GM contractor discount, but then I loss $400 bucks by them rejecting the college rebate. I bet the dealer knew this and thought I would roll over and play dead. No way buddy, I'm gonna fight.

Chevrolet Cavalier

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