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Volvo S40

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Comments

  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    CR found it torquy low down, unlike the smooth-revving TSX 2.4.

     

    But this 5-cyl is just so noisy to rev, worse than the Mazda 4-cyl 2.3. So in order to keep the engine from being too loud, you can't "zoom zoom" your way out quickly.

     

    But Mazda3's sound insulation, especially road noise, isn't great. So as long as you're just cruising, the S40 2.4i is still quieter than any Mazda3 or Focus (I & II).
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    Are they really selling the S40 for under $20K?

     

    If we wanted one of these, it would be an automatic...which would add maybe $1000. Also might want the stability control (DSTC) for another $500 or so. I thought we would be looking at about $23,000 with those two options added and considering the $1500 "marketing support" incentive to dealer. Am I estimating too high?

     

    We'd probably not like the sport suspension...
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    Mazda3 auto only got 4 gears, so you might as well get the S40's 5-sp auto. & the excellent legendary Focus stability program isn't even available for the N.A. Mazda3 while the S40 has it (DSTC).

     

    I kept seeing $19,995 ad price in S California for the new S40 5-sp manual. You might have to order a base model w/ the DSTC.
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    "I'm more than a little bit concerned by the turbo lag when driving in heavy traffic. Will I get used to it & be able to adjust????"

     

    I thought the turbo lag with the automatic was really really bad. But, i used to have a saab, which may have had even more lag, and i did eventually acclimate.

     

    I'm a bit sour on turbos. It seems that manufacturers have been getting similar economy and power out of NA engines.
  • grantchstrgrantchstr Member Posts: 371
    I did a lot of research and came up with Nokians to put on my S60. They are the only tires in the US which are all season AND rated as snow tires. I live on a steep hill so I need to overcome unplowed and icey slopes (not quite a black diamond but close!) and the Nokians are ace.

    The reason I am on this S40 thread is that I am interested in getting an S40 owing the pressure I am under from my kid (at college). I think he wants to drive it to work in the summer! It looks a great car and I might add it to the S60 we have ..... developing story...
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    "I thought the turbo lag with the automatic was really really bad."

     

    See:

    creakid1, "Volvo S40" #1028, 26 Dec 2004 2:15 pm
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    We've all read it before, and been asked not to rehash it. ;)
  • kwagner88kwagner88 Member Posts: 18
    I've done several searches, but can't find any information on expected life of the Volvo designed turbo charger. When you consider the cost when this unit fails, it's something to think about. I'm trying to make a decision on either the BMW 325ix, Mercedes C230 4matic or the Volvo S40T5 AWD. The Volvo is definitely cheaper at the $36K I want it configured, but I have to think about other things too. I drive a lot so if I can expect the have problems with the turbo at 80K miles or so, it's a big minus for the Volvo and adds some weight to a decision to spend a bit more for the Mercedes or the BMW. Another consideration is that I can't find any information on how Volvo's AWD systems compares to BWM or Mercedes, so any help there would also be appreciated. I've also seen rumors of a convertible version of the S40 being available this summer, but can't confirm it.

     

    THANKS!
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    "I drive a lot so if I can expect the have problems with the turbo at 80K miles or so,"

     

    Volvo's turbo charger finally switched to water-cooled since late '80's. Even if you don't cool it down before shutting the engine off, the temperature still peaks at below the normal operating temperature of the older primitive air-cooled turbo charger. So the turbo's longevity should not be a problem. Volvo's resale value might, though.

     

    The S40's AWD set up is a FWD w/ RWD added as a back up when needed. The BMW AWD is primarily rear bias to begin with, then adjusts accordingly. So if power-oversteer fun is what you want, then forget about the Volvo & take the new $50k Acura RL w/ std AWD & SH (Super Handling) differential from the Prelude.
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    RL is FWD biased too, so ????

     

    From what I have read SH behaives pretty much the same as the combination of Haldex AWD + DSTC on 60R.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,889
    but i don't believe haldex can distribute more power to just one wheel like the RL's system can, can it?

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    The Haldex can't but DSTC does, if the rotational speed of one wheel on the axle is different from another, and S60R has enough torque to load any wheel to the max of what the rubber can take.

     

    I did not say they work the same, I have read that it feels the same.
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    Water cooling will alleviate oil "coking" but there are still bearings and parts in there that will wear due to the high rpm's and operating heat. Still, a turbo should last 100K nowadays. Projecting a $1000 replacement after, say, six years, a $600 savings at purchase time ought to make it "worth it."

     

    If you're looking for "entertaining" RWD feel, the RL is not the choice; it's designed to eliminate that sort of thing.
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    prevents excessive/scary oversteer, but does power-rear-steer for you partially for fun, according to C&D. All magazines pointed out that the S40/V50 AWD only understeers.

     

    Due to high resale value & not-so-roomy rear leg room (much more cramped than the Accord), the $50k new RL is probably pretty comparable to a loaded AWD S40, cost wise.
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    "The Haldex can't but DSTC does, if the rotational speed of one wheel on the axle is different from another, and S60R has enough torque to load any wheel to the max of what the rubber can take."

     

    But enough to oversteer? Or just to cancel any understeer/oversteer & keep it neutral?

     

    As long as the DSTC is programmed to be oversteer-bias, then, yes, it can be done. I wish there's such kit for the driver to adjust the oversteer/understeer balance simply by dialing a knob. Some experimental system has been tested in England on the Impreza.
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    My limited personal impression (from a few laps at the S60R introduction event), and once again the info I have read, that S60R' AWD+DSTC is set to provide some oversteer to improve the cornering. I remember reading about a specific understeer/oversteer/neutral sequence during the aggressive cornering, but I could not find that article today.

    Volvomax, who's driving S60R can give you better perspective.

    And, in correction of what I have said on other board once before, after reading more about SH AWD on RL, I do believe that it is unique as a single system solution.
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    Here is one of the articles I have found. They all say about the same - oversteer at the entrance, neutral in the middle, understeer at the exit. The best possible combination for the aggressive cornering.

     

    http://www.wheels24.co.za/Wheels24/RoadTests/0,,1369-1373_1453282- ,00.html
  • scott31scott31 Member Posts: 292
    Did you mean C240 4matic?
  • kwagner88kwagner88 Member Posts: 18
    Yes, sorry. Typo. The 230's are too darn small for me.

     

    What is the zero to 60 time for the S40T5?
  • volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    Forget about Volvo turbos failing at any preset mileage. It just doesn't happen. A well maintained Volvo turbo should last the life of the car. Obviously anything can fail on any car, but to base a buying decision on something that may happen 100 or 150k down the line is silly.

    Just buy the car that works best for your situation. Even the "reliable" cars fail. My other car is a 4Runner, at 140k the tranny fell out. I could infer that all 4Runner trannies fail @ 140k and therefor I shouldn't buy a new one.

     

    As for the R's Haldex system, while you will never be able to hang the tail out Dukes of Hazzard style a certain amount of oversteer is obtainable. The pros at the track event the Lev refers to took us out and were demonstrating that and some really good 4 wheel drifting!
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    So far, I have attended three into events by Volvo - XC90, S60R/V70R, S40.

     

    I've fell in love with the XC90 and have bought one, was very-very impressed with the S60R, just did not feel like driving such demanding car.

    I liked S40 a lot, and will probably get one for my daughter in a couple years.
  • cotmccotmc Member Posts: 1,081
    I personally would trust the new Volvo turbos more than I would trust the reliability of a Mercedes C240 4matic. Based on all the evidence I have seen, the C-Class has consistently exhibited statistically poor build quality and reliability. (The key word is "statistically", as volvomax pointed out with his 4Runner, everyone's mileage will vary.)

     

    FWIW: I've always had good luck with BMW's, but these were all sedans built before the Bangle and iDrive re-designs, including the current E46 3-series.

     

    FWIW, part deux: I leased an S40 2.4i with the premium pkg about nine months ago. Thus far, no problems; no defects; no concerns; and no unwanted noises, rattles, squeaks, etc. (Knock on woodgrain!) I haven't returned to the dealer since I drove it off the lot. I finally made an appointment for the complementary 7500-mile oil change service just a couple days ago. Not bad for a first-year (2004.5) model!
  • cheerfulcheerful Member Posts: 31
    I am planning to by a CD/MP3 player for my 2001 S40. Anyone knows where can I find installation instructions? Or if I can have someone to install it for me for a reasonable price?

     

    Thanks!
  • mish02mish02 Member Posts: 1
    Hi, I'm seriously considering a S40 2.4i, but I'm a value oriented buyer. I would prefer to use regular gas. Can you use regular or does the manufacturer recommend a higher grade? I asked the salesman, but got a fuzzy answer. If I have to use premium, I might just save my pennies and go for the T5. Also, I tried to get a set of golf clubs attached to a golf cart into the trunk. No go! This is a very important feature for me. I can't walk to the golf course. Any suggestions? Does anyone play golf using a cart and drive a S40?

     

    Thanks.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    I'm pretty sure consumer reports review said it uses regular
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    The minimum requirement is 87, but engine is designed to use 91 or higher. Page 101.

     

    http://apps.volvocars.us/ownersdocs/2005/2005_S40/05s40_07a.htm#p- - g101
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    Those Brits - test the sportier version and complain about jittery ride...
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    They probably spilled their tea in the cupholder and the take away curry stained the T-tec material.
  • calhoncalhon Member Posts: 87
    Overall, the review is positive, but ... They say:

     

    "However, we're not so convinced about the car's quality - and we think this might have something to do with the fact it has so much in common with the Focus. Two things are particularly frustrating: the gearbox and wind noise."

     

    Well, neither the gearbox or the wind noise have anything to do with the Focus. The gearbox is unique to Volvo, coming straight out of the S60R, and the doors/seals (the source of the wind noise) are also unique to the S40.

     

    It's fine to have an opinion, but shouldn't you at least try to connect the dots? Sheesh!
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    if any at all, showed that the new S40 beats all Focus (I & II) & Mazda3 in road noise. Sometimes that's enough to decide which C-1 to get. ;-)
  • calhoncalhon Member Posts: 87
    "All comparison tests, if any at all, ..."

     

    Now, what is it that you really meant to say? I'm not trying to be a rude - just genuinely confused.
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    just too lazy to point out which.

     

    One Brit comparo had the V50 vs Focus II wagon vs Mazda6 wagon, & I remember the new Focus II still got more road noise than the V50.

     

    Mazda3's road noise is suppose to be at least as loud as Focus II's.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    Any news on when the C50 Coupe & Convertible variants will be coming out? Has anybody heard anything on pricing?

     

    I personally can't wait for these cars to come out. A C50 Convertible with AWD and a folding hardtop will be a sweet ride.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    Well, there is only one model, it will be called the C70.

    It will feature seating for 4 and a retracting hardtop.

    We should see the car in the summer of 06.
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    Interesting. How misleading, it's based on the same platform as the future C30. Well, most consumers are ignorant, so they'll be willing to pay around $40k for that.

     

    Actually, that's what I was told by a Volvo rep at the L.A. Auto Show a few years ago -- the next C70 convertible is most likely based on the new S40.

     

    Mercedes also denied the fact that the C-class sold here is really a 1.8 C180 Kompressor, which sounds more worthless than the '84 2.3 190E. So the rear deck of the '05 sedan still sez C230.
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    And the point is...?

     

    The XC90 is so much bigger than the S60 but is build on the same P2 platform.

     

    Let's not over exaggerate the real place of the platform (as being the floor plan, or part of the floor plan).
  • volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    Well,

    The next C70 IS based on the current S40.

    Which is also the donor platform for the C30.

    In fact a stretched version of the S40's P1 platform(P1+) will underpin the next S60 and probably the next S80 as well.
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    Max,

    Is this a done deal that S80 will be based on a stretched C1+ (P1+)?

     

    I am still reading the controversial rumors that it could be an updated P2.

     

    Were you , Volvo guys advised one way or other?
  • calhoncalhon Member Posts: 87
    Interesting!

     

    My understanding was that the P1 platform is the small cars platform and that there would be a new/modified P2 platform for midsize and larger Volvos (S60, V70, S80, etc). The new S80 is rumored to be a little larger than the current model. The new s60 and V70 are also supposed to be a little larger; with the V70 being just a wagon version of the S60 - as opposed to a separate car as it is today.

     

    It seems strange that Volvo would be willing to live within the constraints of the P1 platform for larger cars, such as the S80, with bigger engine/transmission needs, almost certainly including a V8. Remember, the I5 engine had to shrunk to fit the P1 platform. It also took some effort to fit a V8 into the XC90 on the larger P2 platform.

     

    Could it be just a matter of semantics and P1+ is the new P2 platform?
  • lev_berkovichlev_berkovich Member Posts: 858
    It's not quite that. The C1+ (P1+) is a new shared platform for the "mid-sized" cars like Mazda 6, replacement for the Ford Contour, and the new S60/V70 will be one of them.

    S80, from what I have read can go two ways - further stretched C1+ or updated current P2.
  • calhoncalhon Member Posts: 87
    Okay, I got you. Volvo will have three additional platforms - C1 (aka P1), C1+, and either C1++ or P2-prime. (My made-up designation on the last one)
  • volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    Remember everone that a platform really has no size limitations.
    The P2 platform is a good example.
    The S60 is 180 inches long and weighs 3300 lbs.
    The XC90 is 189 inches long and weighs 4500 lbs.
    Same platform.
    A platform is just a blueprint, its not a carved in stone thing.
    While there are certain "fixed" points ie, the slope of the windshield, suspension hardpoints etc, there is a lot of latitude in a modern platforms design.
    The P1 will spawn a convertible, a small car and larger ones.

    Volvo is being very quiet about the new S80.
    Even about what size it actually will be.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    And IIRC, platform also has manufacturing equiment in mind. There are certain grab points for machinery that can't easily be changed.
  • cheerfulcheerful Member Posts: 31
    Anyone knows an easy-to-install CD/MP3 Player for 2001 S40?

    Thanks!
  • roadrunner4roadrunner4 Member Posts: 5
    I recently tested the sport package 2.4i. But found it to be stiffer and busier than i like. Steering to be less sporty than i imagine. A bit of a disappointment after testing the mazda3. The dealer suggests me consider the sport package but with 16 inch wheel instead of the 17 inch. (reason for the suggestion is that he is willing to sell the demo w/ the sport package). Has anybody try this combo? Do you think this would work or would it just messes the ride? Thanx.
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    I finally got to drive an s40 that was mostly "to my spec." A manual tranny t5 AWD with the gore-tex interior and DSTC.

    Volvo had an event here to show of their 4wd. It was a rainy day here in chicago and the track was *very* slick.

    I thought the turbo lag was really mitigated on this car as compared to the automatic, which i disliked. With the stick, i thought acceleration was quite good, even starting off. The engine was quiet until i flogged it, whereupon it emitted a nice growl. I drifted the car through two of the corners pretty fast, and i could tell DSTC was working, but it was not too intrusive, and kept the car inline. If it was my bimmer, i probably would have spun it attempting the same maneuver. I really like the gore-tex seats, they seem better to me than the same leather seats.

    I later drove an automatic s40, and the lag is not as bad as i seem to recall. Perhaps this was because this car had some miles on it, and had been flogged at the track already?

    I also drove the s80 and xc90. Nice interiors, i guess, but not what i want.

    Checking the volvo website, it seems i could euro-deliver an s40t5 AWD with select package, xenons, weather(heated seats) and DSTC for 28,415, pretty close to what i paid for my certified pre-owned 3-series. Not too bad. Euro delivery is definitely how i'd go.

    I'll still wait until i try out the new a4 and 3-series, and i really do want a real eco-car, but i am now strongly considering the s40 again, before it was almost off my list.

    dave
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    You sure the Euro delivery allows you to avoid the premium package so you can keep the T-tech fabric?

    "I later drove an automatic s40, and the lag is not as bad as i seem to recall. Perhaps this was because this car had some miles on it, and had been flogged at the track already?"

    The slush box's torque-converter slip actually shortens the turbo lag by letting the engine rev sooner from standing still.

    "I drifted the car through two of the corners pretty fast, and i could tell DSTC was working, but it was not too intrusive, and kept the car inline. If it was my bimmer, i probably would have spun it attempting the same maneuver."

    So your Beemer's DSC allows too much slipperage?

    The S40's DSTC originally from the Focus is wonderful, as it only helps & doesn't intrude into your aggressive cornering in the wet.

    By the way, yesterday I just spun out a soft-suspension base RX-8 auto w/o DSC during a test drive in the rain. I did correct it but the salesman & my buddy thought we had to use the head curtain airbags this time. ;-) Then the 2nd RX-8 w/ 6-sp & DSC cornered hard in the wet just fine, but the ride was firm.

    How was the ride of the AWD S40 over bumps? I never had a chance to sample one in S Cal. The ride of the 2WD S40 w/ sport-suspension sucks either w/ 16"s or 17"s. The other 2WD suspension uses up the front spring travel a little too easily over the deep ones.
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    "I recently tested the sport package 2.4i. But found it to be stiffer and busier than i like. Steering to be less sporty than i imagine. A bit of a disappointment after testing the mazda3. The dealer suggests me consider the sport package but with 16 inch wheel instead of the 17 inch. (reason for the suggestion is that he is willing to sell the demo w/ the sport package). Has anybody try this combo? Do you think this would work or would it just messes the ride? Thanx."

    That was my very first test drive over bumps -- 16"s w/ & w/o sport suspension.

    17"s should make the short abrupt bumps more obvious, but it's the sport suspension that won't yield over any kind of bumps, including the larger ones.

    Take my advice, go for the 16"s, either w/ non-sport suspension or the AWD model's set up, which has the sport-suspension shocks/sway-bars but longer-springs.

    Or take my other advice, get the base RX-8 automatic w/ 16"s that rides like a premium sedan while its electric-assisted steering is actually more confident inspiring than the hydraulic-steering of the '05 American Focus, which beats Mazda3's, which beats S40's. This comfy base RX-8 already out corners just about anything else! This isn't a crazy comparison, as the ride, rear leg room, reliability rating & price of this 4-dr Japanese car isn't far off from the S40 w/ base suspension! The main difference b/t them is that one allows the driver to sit very high w/ a comfortable high door armrest & the other one...
  • creakid1creakid1 Member Posts: 2,032
    "And the point is...?"

    The next C70 is really an S40 convertible, but then this P1/C1 platform has German-design suspension & steering better than P2's anyway.

    What I find funny is that auto manufacturers mislead people by the way their cars are named. My doctor buddy thought an SLK is a great deal 'cause it's an "S-class". Wait till he sees the sticker shock of the "C-class" CL. So I told him to try the base RX-8 auto, which out rides/handles any Benz.

    W/in the Ford empire, the next Mondeo will be a stretched C1/P1 Focus platform w/ Control Blade rear suspension. So this could be the same one for the future larger Volvo's. The current Mazda6 platform, which will also be used in the future mid-size Lincoln/Mercury, is pretty similar to the current Mondeo's.
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