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But to answer your question, I've bought and sold some stuff on Ebay. I find it a great e-commerce site.
But nobody is paying anywhere near sticker for those Cadillacs.
Question? Where are you that a MB/BMW dealer is that far away?
But I agree, when I think "high-end" I think S-Class, 7-Series, A8, XJ, and LS430. The LS430 is the bottom of the category on it's base price, but I've seen them optioned up to 70K so it's in there. The S600 sits at the top of this group and as a entrance into the next group up.
Maybach, Bentley, Aston-Martin, Rolls-Royce are "ultra-luxury" cars. These cost 150K or better in most cases.
M
little more sound insulation."
Ok, I'll buy that for 2003. I'm not so sure though with the pre-facelifted 2000-2002 S-Class. The car lost a lot of rigidity from the 1999 model. The new E is very solid, a definite step up from the previous E-Class...the doors even "thunk" like the days of Benzes gone by.
Hmmmm you're that far west in "that" state huh? Interesting.
M
I personally think the E-class has all the "refinement" that anyone really needs. Actually, I like my 02 Seville LS. It seems like a very solid car with little wind noise. The frameless windows on the Riviera and Aurora would make noise in a head wind.
M
Yep that is probably the main reason as to why the A8 didn't sell. The other biggie is that 70k for an Audi is still a bit of a tough sell for those living off of Audi's past.
M
Merc1 - it's a good story and shows how BMW may be walking too fine a line. They wanted to break-out - but they seemed to turn off at least some, if not many of their loyal base with the new styling cues.
For those who haven't seen it, here's a pic of the exterior and here's one of the interior.
M
The new 7 looks like a camel - both literally and proverbially.
Literally with the odd-hump back shape remeniscent of a chop job where someone cut two cars in half and welded them together. The 7 now seems to wear the butt of a Volvo S80 shapewise. Proverbially, the camel being a horse designed by committee, of course.
I know the new 7 was 'designed' by der vunderartiste, but frankly it's a hodgepodge.
The Z4 is ugly too. It reminds me of odd styling originated in the 1970's fiberglass kit car craze. It's very choppy, the flutings on the side don't serve any purpose except to catch dust and mud. Yuk!
After two months of wavering while my 1998 740i lease ticked to the end, I started the process of buying the 740 from BMW (the lease was up) because of my misgivings about the 745. This thread was a huge source of info on that.
Then I learned that BMW had sweet financing terms on the 2002s to move them out, and I figured I'd be spending nearly as much on the non-warrantied '98 740 as on the new 745. So I made the decision to get the 745 -- without ever having driven it. Can't really explain why.
My conclusions so far:
** The iDrive complexity issue is vastly overstated. It took very little time to get familiar with the base functions. The system's logic is fairly transparent, so I did not even consult the owner's manual on the iDrive until I wanted to do some more advanced tasks, like programming in voice commands for the built-in telephone. The "this car makes me feel like an idiot" folks should buy Cadillacs and shut up.
** The 745 is about 30% more fun to drive than the 740, which was already a near-perfect driving experience. The extra power in the engine is evident, making it just a tick smoother in highway driving. The sensation is slightly up-higher and more knife-like, more like the 5-series, instead of the lower sedan-like 740 feel.
** Once you drive it, the "looks" issue becomes less of a problem for those, like me, who consider the 740 a classic. The 740 is still the better looking car, but the feel of the 745 is in synch with the body changes, the rearward location of the cabin, the accent on the wheels, the more rounded corners. (It's cute that the video BMW gives you with the car includes a Chris Bangle segment explaining that the raised trunk design is tied to the roof aerodynamics -- they clearly are defensive on this point.)
** There are a couple of really silly quirks that are beyond explanation. Why would any engineer design a headrest to automatically rise when the seat is adjusted?
** Of course, if the car ends up spending 2 weeks in the shop because of software snafus, I'll have a completely different view. But I've heard the mantra "those problems have been fixed and all the campaigns have been performed on the late-build vehicles" enough to believe it, for now.
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/01/magazine/01PROBLEM.html
http://www.germancarfans.com/News.cfm?NewsID=2021127.003
M
My only other suggestion to BMW would be to go out on a limb and provide warranty and maintenance protection beyond the 50k currently offered. You see more BMW's with lots of miles for a reason, they beg to be driven! How much additional cost would it add to the vehicle to make the statement, bumper to bumper warranty and maintenance for 7 years or 100k. That would really make a statement about BMW's confidence in their product.
Mercedes Benz S55
Audi S8
Infiniti Q45
All happen to be high powered (310+ hp) autos.
So it would seem that even though there isn't much talk about the Q45, there are folks out there still checking out the car. The LS430 and S500 weren't on their lists.
Which brings up another fact I came across on the BMW website. It turns out when you select the competitors to the 745, it only lists
Audi A8,
Jaguar XJ Series
Lexus LS430
In this case, they left out the Mercedes Benz S-Class. From a price point, I guess it makes sense since the 745 is cheaper than the S500.
Looking at Carpoint, it looks like the income demographics for an S-Class ($185k) is much higher than the BMW 7-Series ($175k, no longer listed) and the LS ($145k). So even if the LS is trying to compete with the 7 Series and S-Class, the buyers are a lot different they maybe what marketing is expecting. The Q45 trails at around ($100k) even though marketing is trying to cater to an income demographic of $200k (Edmunds src).
So in the end, if you want status, get the Mercedes or MB/MayBach. Actually if you afford the Maybach, then the S500 is probably too cheap for you.
http://www.germancarfans.com/News.cfm?NewsID=2021217.001
The 2004 BMW 5-Series is where the straw will be broken. So far it looks even worse!
The S-Class has always been on another level as far as it's average buyer;s demographic is concerned. One basic reason for that is the price, it starts where all the rest top out (except the 760Li). The S55 has moved further upmarket with 493hp and 107K sticker. I've driven the S500 and thought it was good enough, I can't image how a 191 hp increase must feel!
The Q45 is a very interesting car. Infiniti messed up on the marketing of it though. It was never as sporty as a 7-Series or an S55, and for all it's 340hp it's no faster than similar cars with less power. No large car marketed as a sports sedan has been a success, except for the 7-Series. Even the 7-Series has started to place more emphasis on luxury with each re-do. Infiniti should have marketed the Q45 as a luxury car first, with a touch of sport. Why can't Infiniti get their transmissions right? The M45 is a midsize car with 340hp and it's actually slower than the way less powerful E500, GS430, and 540i.
All is not lost at Infiniti. They are doing great on the lower end. The G35 is a hit, and rightly so. I'm forced to drive this G35 Coupe the first chance I get. The FX35 and FX45 look to be potential winners also. Infiniti, like Acura just can't get any respect past 40K.
M