Infiniti Q45

tgif888 · July 2001

Lexus also discontinued the ES250.

lenscap · July 2001

The Lexus ES 250 was not discontinued. It was replaced in June 1991 with the ES 300. It was/is still an ES, just with a bigger engine -- mid-size, FWD, near-luxury sedan. Just like when Mercedes redid the E300 and it became the E320.

Infiniti, on the other hand, dropped the M30 (it was a coupe and convertible which was NEVER replaced in the lineup) and also dropped the J30 (a rear-drive sedan which was also NEVER replaced). Infiniti upset a lot of buyers by doing this.

tgif888 · July 2001

Well, you are right. The Infiniti's starting point was already inferior to Lexus. Tell you the truth, I wasn't impressed with the nature's ad on Infiniti when it first markets itself. While, Lexus already offered the look on its line up. We only see rain, tree, and thunder in the Infiniti's ad.

Give Infiniti sometime and it is catching up. Infiniti just needs to change people's idea on the Infiniti brand.

maxamillion1 · July 2001

I think that Infiniti should call this new G35 the J35, because they both are rear wheel drive, and have v6 engines.

mvargo1 · July 2001

Q sales have been wonderful compared to last year. It is going to take a year or so for enough awareness of the Q to get out. It takes time to build an image for a car and even longer to rebuild that image. Infiniti killed themselves with the '97-'01 Q. It was a perfectly good car it just was not as good as the previous generation. After that kind of a mistake it takes a while to rebuild.

The '02 Q is one of the best cars currently on the market in its class and when you consider what you are getting for your money it is a lot of car for the dollar, but give it time and you will see. Infiniti should hold the line with the Q to avoid the kind of depreciation that plagued the previous model.

ljflx · July 2001

Thanks. I should have known about Prnewswire having dealt with them often for financial data on my job years ago. I think you make good points. Infiniti's lack of offerings has hurt them. They seem to be getting more aggressive now but I think they made a marketing mistake with the new Z. That should have been taken up several notches in class and been pre-marketed as Infiniti's version of the SC430 priced in the $50-55k range. It would have brought people into the showrooms. My Lexus dealer tells me the SC430 has helped out sales of the LS430 and even said that the new Q (ironically) helped firm up the prices of the LS430 which is born out by the tmv's posted by Edmunds though I never did see LS430's discounted to the levels posted by Edmunds in the first place. Nor did I see the BMW 7 show up on Edmunds tmv at the prices they were discounted to here in New Jersey ($10-14k off list).

I think Infiniti also needs the bigger truck that Lexus has in the LX470. Granted the Landcruiser (which I will depart with shortly) was a marquee truck to start with so it made sense to re-badge it as a Lexus which made things easy for them. I test drove the LX470 and decided to buy it recently because I continue to need 3 rows of seats and it is the limit in size that my wife will drive plus I got such a great buy on it. By the way it rides like the old LS400 - quiet and very smooth for such a large truck - with a lot more luxury feel than the Landcruiser. Had Infiniti had a big truck I would have went to test it.

Lastly remember that Nissan never had the financial resources that Toyota had at the launch of the luxury brands and Toyota has gotten much stronger since then while Nissan weakened considerably. I think the biggest mistake Nissan could make with Infiniti is to try to compete for the Lexus customer. What they need to do is cut into BMW the way Lexus cut into Mercedes. They want to take away the would-be customer not the existing 7 customer as that is a near impossible task. Lexus LS430 buyers aren't going to run to Infiniti when their leases are up. They will stay put particularly when Lexus raises the bar even higher with the next version of the LS430/500/600 or whatever it becomes with optioned engines.

mvargo1 · July 2001

Infiniti will have a full size SUV in two years.

The G35 which serves as the platform for the Z-car(like the J30 before it) is intended to compete against the 3 series and other compact sport sedans. It will also serve as a replacement for the M30 when the coupe and convertable versions come out. In addition the FX45 represents a radical new direction for Infiniti with large sport sedan qualities, a high HP V8 and the outstanding AWD system from the Skyline.

ljflx · July 2001

I think the issue raised is not what Infiniti is doing now but has its' past poor management decisions created a poor brand image that is beyond repair. I don't think so because you can see the committment they made in the new Q to raising the bar and secondly I think we are headed into a new bull market 6-12 months out which is slowly starting now. This will create newer (and more) luxury car buyers. Infiniti has to reach them. As an LS400 and now a LS430 buyer I don't see myself going to Infiniti for the lux car and I've always thought of Infiniti as Japan's BMW and Lexus as Japan's Mercedes. But if I was new to the scene and reaching a bit the new Q would get my interest quickly. Being able to afford more I will stay with Lexus and evaluate them vs. an S-430/500 as I did on this go round. The Lexus won my tests over the S-430 by quite a bit and over the S-500 narrowly but given the problems I read about on the S board, that narrow victory has widened considerably. Infiniti needs to get to that level and given its' high reliability grades it definitely can. I hope it makes it - why would anyone want one less luxury brand around. By the way old Q owners I know also rave about the car (the old model) and stay with it which gives it a darn good foundation if it can attract the new buyers.

robert_s_22 · July 2001

I don't belive Lexus will offer different engine options for the LS. Lexus/ Toyota has always tried to find what people want and give them that. If you look at the Tundra, Toyota focused on making a great 1/2 ton extended or standard cab, V-6 or V-8 engine choice. You won't see them offering several different V-8's. With the LS they are trying to reach a certain price point and because most people take the small or medium V-8 option, they hit it perfectly. Look at the S class, most of the ones you see are S430's with only a few being S500's, I've only seen one S600. On top of that, Lexus wouldn't have any other cars to share the motor with, although it would be cool, I can't see an SC600. I would like to see Lexus make some hotter V-8's though, under the L-Sport name. Kinda like an AMG or M car. And regarding the Q45, I spoke with the local dealer and he said next year Infiniti would produce a 400 horsepower "sport model", any word on this ?

fenn · July 2001

I have been driving my new Q45 for two months, It has been a flawless, troublefree experience. For a newly introduced car, that is impressive. I just love this car. I have owned four previous Q45's dating back to it's 1990 introduction, but this one is the best.

That it the good news. The bad news for Infiniti is that this new car still seems to be flying below most people's radar.

lenscap · July 2001

Great post, I couldn't agree with you more. My family at one time or another has purchased many new Lexuses (1990, 1993, 1996 LS400s; 1995, 1999 GS300s; 1995 ES300), but nobody has owned my all-time favorite, the new LS430. Enjoy your beautiful car.

ljflx · July 2001

Thanks. It is a fabulous car and I've had nothing but flawless performance from Lexus for 6 1/2 years running. I'm sure the new Q is also a wonderful car. No one puts that level of effort into a product unless they want it to be top shelf material. I simply prefer Lexus.

DonFenn - goodluck to you. I understand your post very well which is why I believe if Lexus or Infiniti captures you as a customer, given their phenomenal reliability, you're not going anywhere else unless you put status (and the other guys are weakening while Lexus is strengthening very fast (and I hope Infiniti does the same) as a number one priority. I almost made that mistake 6 months ago - no chance of it ever happening again. By the way how good is the 300 watt Bose stereo. The ML in the LS430 is the best I've ever heard but admittedly I haven't heard Infiniti's Bose. The ML seems to get better as you play it.

adob · July 2001

I love my 99 Q, and my local Socal dealer provides great service, despite the fact that they are in a dumpy, old facility. I would buy another vehicle from them, and likely will when the lease is up.

My sister has the exact opposite opinion. The one dealer in Northern Virgia, provides terrible service. She was much happier with her Honda dealer. The stories I have heard from her would make me NEVER own an Infiniti product in her area.

Infact after buying her 2000 Q for cash, she really wants to get rid of it and would never consider Infiniti again. This after I convinced her what a good car it is. All because of the after sale service.

Infiniti will never match the likes of Lexus or MB with just a great product. Their dealers, especially on the East coast from what I've heard, turn off current and potential customers all the time. When you only have 1 dealer within 50 miles, you have little choice but go elsewhere. That is a shame, as I said I have no such problem and like their whole line.

countdodo · July 2001

How does the rear seat room of the Q45 compare to that of the LS430? anyone? thanks.

fenn · July 2001

The new Q's stereo is great. Quite awesome. I have not compared it to the upgraded Mark Levinson system in the Lexus, but the auto reviewers that have have heard both have found it comparable. I think one of the auto magazines even preferred it.

I believe that the back seat room in the new Q is much improved over the previous version and is competitive with the Lexus. It may be just a tad smaller in space, but it is in same range. Two people are quite comfortable in the back seat. Although, the center rear postion is not very comfy.

As for the complaint about East Coast service, I think that somebody should contact the Infiniti factory or zone representative. They seem so concerned about service that I cannot believe that they would let East Coast dealer's bad service destroy their reputation.

it is ironic that everytime I have considered another car, I have let the fine service that I get from Infiniti sway me back to Infiniti. They have always tried to do everthing possible to please me. Too bad that that is no the case everywhere, but Infiniti should know this at a much higher level!

warnerf · July 2001

Which dealer have you been using? I've been going to Infiniti of Mission Viejo. These guys are first rate. The service manager used to work at Peyton Cramer Infiniti in SouthBay. I've also used Costa Mesa Infiniti (pretty good but facility is old), Joe MacPherson Infiniti (OK, but prices are 30% higher than all the other dealers) and Cerritos Infiniti (average, and their facility is very run down)

fenn · July 2001

I go to Miller Infiniti In Van Nuys. They have been great to me.

drod2045 · July 2001

I live in NJ and the dealer experience for my mom was fabulous. We are even friends with them over there now.

sysadb · July 2001

ADOB,
If your sister is disgruntled with the service she is getting from the No. Va. dealer then she might want to try Coleman Infiniti in Bethesda, Md. It's only about 10-12 miles from Rosenthal, which I presume is the offending dealer. When I lived in the DC area I used Kline Infiniti, a No. Va. dealer that closed a couple years ago. They were excellent - quick appointments always, and they would ask if I wanted the car picked up at my office or whether I preferred a loaner car, even for an oil change.
There are surely problems between some Infiniti customers and their dealers. Even Lexus has them. However, these are infrequent. Infiniti and Lexus have been at or near the top of all the customer satisfaction surveys taken since they were introduced. The probability is very high that a customer will have a good experience at these dealers.

adob · July 2001

The bad service is from Rosenthal, they have quite a mess over there. She has talked to several customers at Rosenthal and they've had the same experience. She could go to Bethesda (I would estimate the distance more like 20 miles away??) but that would be a total of 40 miles over the bridge into another state - she'd rather dump the car over that commute. I have been hounding her to call Infiniti Corp., but after the constant back and forth with Rosenthal, damage to her car, lying about service never performed, taking no responsibility for chromes they sold her that turned out to be all bent - she's over it.

I guess, the issue is when there is only one dealer in a geography, they can pretty much behave how they want - just like any monopoly. Sure service ineptitude will not help expand the market base, but as long as sales and product can keep getting in new customers they manage to survive. But at the expense of damaging Infinit's reputation. cest la vie.

trmga · July 2001

Interesting comments about Rosenthal. I lived in the Northern VA area for about 16 years before I left the area in 1996. Apparently Rosenthal's service department has not changed in any of their dealerships. I personally had such a bad experience that I never went back. This was 12 years ago. People who worked for me had similar terrible experiences and regretted the day they ever dealt with Rosenthal. Corporate greed and a "let the buyer beware" mentality seems to be pervasive in that organization. For the life of me I can't figure out how they have survived all these years.

fenn · July 2001

Hard to believe that they just do not care....At my dealer they politely ask to take the time to give Infiniti positive feedback if you are happy. And, I seem to always get a follow up call and survey of my satisfaction.

One would think that Infiniti would know about this bad dealer.

brad72 · July 2001

Interesting article on the new Q not having as much power as Infiniti advertised. Car and Driver also noted a similar problem with the new Q45. Is Infiniti doing anything to address this?

http://www.detnews.com/2001/autos/0107/26/a01-254941.htm

alibid · August 2001

Can anyone offer any feedback on the reliability and potential problem areas for the '94-'95 Q45. I test drove a '94 Q45a yesterday and found the ride rather harsh for a luxury sedan. The power was also less than I was expecting. Perhaps the added weight of the active suspension or a lazy shifting cranny are to blame for this. I loved everything else about the car. In any case, I have decided to rule out the active suspension models due to potential costly repairs and rougher ride. Edmunds.com gives a reliability score of 8.0 to the '94 Q45 and a score of 8.8 to the '95 model. As far as I know, there were no changes made to the car in '95. Can anybody explain why the '95 model is significantly more reliable?

drod2045 · August 2001

Car and Driver tested the new Q and got 0-60 of 6 seconds flat. With high altitude and the perfect condtions or simply better conditions, one tenth better could easily be achieved.

habitat1 · August 2001

I had an opportunity to give a new Q45 an extended test drive while my car was in for service. I was impressed with the overall quality and looks of the car; however, I do think there must be some mistake on the power ratings. I have owned and/or driven several other cars that were supposedly 5.5 to 6.5 seconds from 0-60 (540i 6-speed, 540iA Sport, S500). From my test drive, the Q45 definately felt slower than Infinity's claim. I think that this kind of horsepower & performance exaggeration is a good call for a fully independent testing /ratings agency.

Nice car nonetheless.

dc_75 · August 2001

Been reading the infiniti line-up/brand discussion...I just have to say that those were very excellent points.

Adding my two cents, I think Infiniti would do well to reaffirm its sporting inclinations by bringing in the skyline gt-r from japan albeit an infiniti'zed skyline (perhaps a more lux interior, adjustments in equipment levels, marginal aesthetics work to blend in with the rest of the line-up).

They could resurrect (perhaps) the M tag and also the skyline would have a major halo effect like the NSX to Acura and Lexus/Toyota doesn't have anything in its closet to directly compete. What do you think?

Also the skyline will go great with the new Q philosophy...

drod2045 · August 2001

The new Skyline (V35) is coming to the states in spring as the G35. 260hp (at least), RWD, 52/48 weight distribution (shifts to 50/50 on turns), 0 lift, .27 Cd (.26 with factory "aero" kit)... a lot of sport stuff basically.

The new GTR (not current skyline GTR), which will be GTR only and not Skyline GTR, R35, has a darn good chance of coming to the US as an Infiniti. AWD, 400+hp...sounds beutiful.

mvargo1 · August 2001

FX45 sport sedan with the GTR's all-wheel drive system, and the big V8 in place of a turbo'ed 6-cyl is as close as Infiniti is going to get to the GTR for now.

fenn · August 2001

My 2002 Q has broken the 5000 mile mark already...I have to admit that in recent weeks it seems to be much quicker. It responds to the accelerator quicket than it previously did. I do not know if it is the result of "break-in"...or just due to the warmer weather and the system's adaptive adjustment ....am I crazy?

carnaught · August 2001

I understand that the adaptive system "learns" your driving habits and will accelerate better after a time. Do you have a lead foot donfenn?

bmms8 · August 2001

my cousin has a 95 q45, and i like it, but i just dont have 50K, and a lot of people say the dealerships take a lot off, do u guys think a dealer in san diego CA, woiuld be able to take off 10K, to around 40k????

carnaught · August 2001

Around me, the dealer's are not discounting more than $1-2 thousand. Are you talking used, bmms8?
Wait one to two years and if like past Q's, you'll beable to get a smokin' deal.

mvargo1 · August 2001

If you want to get that kind of a discount try looking for a left over 2001.

ripinrocket · August 2001

You may be able to wait a couple of months and get almost that discount on 2002 models.

I see the 2002's are selling at about the sales clip of the 2000 model Q45.

lsc · August 2001

It's amazing how poorly the Q45 is selling... that means another great used car buy in about 2-3 years.

ripinrocket · August 2001

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/46967/article.html

New Road test on 2002 Q45 above.

currey · August 2001

but I thought the review gave the new Q a bum rap. If comparing to a LS 430 optioned similarly, the LS will be what, 12 to 15 thousand more dollars? I understand that the reviewer is looking at it from the "best luxury around," however, if the price difference is that much then the new Q looks like quite the steal.

Doesn't matter anyway, my wife would never let me spend that much money on a car. Oh well, a guy can dream.

jimxo · August 2001

Nissan does not need to apologize for the Altima since they corrected its HP numbers before the release date. As for 0-60 times that so close that even the GS400 & 430 have only shown a flat 6 seconds. Who care's, if you want to go fast the big sedans wont get you there.

speedracer3 · August 2001

It is obvious that the reviewers here at Edmunds did not like the Q.

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/46967/article.html

It seems that they disliked just about everything about the Q, I saw very few positives mentioned. They also made a HUGE deal about the horsepower issue and the 0-60 times. The reviwers went as far as saying that other competitors like Lexus etc. have nothing to worry about. Geez!!. That's not what the guys at Road and Track said. They compared the Q to the the Lexus LS 430 head to head and liked the Q better.

Hey Edmunds guys!!..if you hate it that much, hand me the keys...I'll take it.

Speed

cars26tampa · August 2001

I was wondering if anyone knew of the availability date of the inteligent cruise control option? I currently own an I30t and was planning to upgrade. By the way, got my current issue of Car and Driver and they had lots of praise for the new Q, even getting a 0-60 of 6 seconds flat, w/o Sport or Lux pkg.

pat · August 2001

Some posts have been removed for various violations of the Member Agreement, including copyright violations, spamming, off-topic and uncivil behavior - some responses to those posts were also necessarily removed.

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khuynh · August 2001

The Q45 is a very nice sedan. I actually thought the Edmunds review was thorough and fair. What I'm not sure about is how the Q can lose to the GS 430 in the recent C/D issue?

rapro · August 2001

Q 94 and 95 have excellent reliability. However, when parts need replacing due to normal wear (rarely due to a premature failure) it's very expensive. But you can get a good and cheap (compared to a BMW or Audi) extended warranty from www.warrantygold.com or similar company.

The active suspension model has superb handling, supposedly better than MB SL600 ($ 125,000 car) with a similar system. What the "a" gains in handling it loses in speed because of the weight gain, no pun intended. So it's up to you what you prefer, better handling or speed.

The active suspension is very reliable, but you have to recharge accumulators every 30-40,000 miles. If you get them new from the dealer it'll cost you up to $ 10,000. However there is a guy in Texas who can recharge the accumulateors for you for a few hundred dollars (he is just a Q lover and came up with this system). Go to Infiniti owners club and yahoo, his name is "texasoil".

ripinrocket · August 2001

khuynh,

It's really quite simple why the Q45 lost to the GS430. The GS430 is more sporty than the Q45. It's much more of a enthusiasts sedan.

kappaman1 · August 2001

The more I see the new Q the more I like it. It is a tremendous car, but I guess I'm just a little bias due to my affinity to infiniti. I'm looking at a '98 Q, any feedback on the model year vs '99.

drod2045 · August 2001

One reason why the Q performed so slowly to 60 in the edmunds review is the 97% humidity it was tested in and the hot weather. not exactly optimul conditions (actually at the opposite end of the spectrum). Ill take the Q over the LS any day. In fact, I prefer it over the comp when you look at the price especially but I guess Edmunds is...well, The car and driver of old now.

markhampton · August 2001

I got a chance to drive an Infiniti Q45 yesterday with the sports package. I was a little hesitant -- I'm used to the soft ride on my 2000 Deville, and thought the Q45 would ride harshly on our poorly maintained highways. I was pleasantly surprised -- the Q's ride was as good as my Caddy's, and its handling was far better. It's what I would call the best of both worlds.

The Q was impressive. Quieter than my Caddy, with more gadgets, and much better build quality. The voice activated radio/climate control worked well enough, but I don't think it was particularly practical.

The rear seat leg room was a little tighter than my Caddy's, and the trunk was really quite small compared to the Deville. I doubt you could get more than one body in there, where the Deville will hold two. It's definitely not a gangster car

.

After reading the brewhaha concerning the Q's acceleration, I had to try it out for myself. Sure enough, this car is definitely slow off the line. At highway speeds, passing is effortless, but that is also true of my Caddy and an LS430 I test drove awhile back. It certainly doesn't "feel" like a car with 340 horses under the hood.

Infiniti could learn something from Cadillac's DTS engineers -- gear ratios make all the difference in the world. There's a big difference in acceleration between a standard Deville and a DTS, and it's all in the gear ratios (the engines put out the same horsepower in both models). Is Infiniti afraid people will twist the rear half-shafts?

The Infiniti dealer I went to here in Denver would not budge from the MSRP. They also added ~2000 worth of dealer junk. $900 for a clear hood protector? Give me a break.

I didn't think the lease numbers were particularly good for this car either. The residual was 52% for a 39 month lease -- a fair bit lower than the competition -- with a money factor of .00208.

It was a nice car -- I certainly preferred it over my Deville -- but I think if I were going to buy a new car in this price range, I would get a 7-Series BMW or an LS430. Right now, a 7-Series lease is actually cheaper than an Infiniti lease. Looking at the lease numbers, it seems that Infiniti has little confidence that the Q will retain its value over the years.

It's a real shame Infiniti didn't get everything right the first time with this car. Right now, I'd say the Q is a very nice car in a market loaded with very nice cars. The Q has a lot of potential, but right now there isn't much that makes it stand out.

mmcbride1 · August 2001

That's the problem with Infiniti of Denver. There aren't any other Infiniti dealers within 100 miles or more and they know it. They are great for service, though.

mvargo1 · August 2001

You should be able to lease a new Q for 12K per year for around $760 per month plus tax with about $4,500 due at signing. The review does not suprise me Edmunds has never met an Infiniti that it liked, never mind that newer acceleration tests have produced acceleration times much closer to what Infiniti originally claimed, they would rather complain about an old problem.

Infiniti Q45

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