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Comments
Does anyone have any comments on reliability, holding value, etc., which may sway me a little more one way than the other?
As far as "never titled" is concerned with regard to the S4, it's still a used car except you pay more taxes than used.....
Thanks
If you want room, go for the A6 but if you want a little bit more speed and dont mind driving the old body style, go for the S4.
I know where I live in DC, there are great lease deals on A6 2.7t, $429 a month for 39 months, 3K down, which I think is a pretty good deal.
the body style of the S4(2000-2002) is different from the 2002 A4. The 2002 S4 is out of production now. A new S4 will be coming out in late 2003 as a 2004 model and I have heard from magazines, that it might be powered by a 370 HP V8. I have also heard an RS6 which has been confirmed by several Audi dealers is coming next year. RS6 is based on A6 but will have a 450 HP twin turbo V8. an RS4 (based on current A4) is rumored to arrive as well.
But anyway, it all depends on what u really want.
if you want the current style, more room, more spacious trunk, go for the A6 2.7 T.
36K seems like a pretty good deal on an S4 with less than 500 miles. Again realize the S4 is based on old Audi A4 style and is now out of production. You could be lucky to find some in stock and get a real good deal on the 2002s.
3.0 vs 2.7t?
what would be a great price now (amount over invoice for a left over 02.
Should i wait for the o3, and compare to new vehicles.
what's the usual discout during the year.
thanks
I haven't heard reports on '03 spec. changes, but rumor has been that they won't be significant. But it is likely that '03 MSRP pricing will be more aggressive, but accompanied by a reduction in features. It could be that the actual sale prices wont' change too much though, as dealer mark-up has been around $3.5K to $5K. If the margins are any smaller, I doubt you'll see a sale price reduction that corresponds with any lower MSRP. But still, since this is likely the last year for the current A6, and demand is declining, dealers will have to make deals to push them out the door.
End of model year pricing should be very aggressive, but sometimes isn't. It depends on the dealer's inventory and demand. This late in the model year, I think a fair deal would be $500 to $1,000 over dealer invoice. In the past, sale prices have tended to be higher at the beginning of a model year. Good, aggressive pricing has averaged $1,000 to $2,000 over dealer invoice during most model years.
To get an A6 3.0 with quattro and other assorted goodies for $500 a month on 36-39 mo. with zero down would probably be a little tough, UNLESS AoA has an incentive program, which they have had at least once, and sometimes more often during a model year. As this is likely the last year of the current A6, I wouldn't be surprised to see incentives. This past model year, the West Coast was having a 12k, zero down on the 2.7T for under $500!
If you like the less expensive FWD CVT, I think you should be able to find a deal for around $500 at some point.
These prices exclude taxes. I think these seem like good deals.
my dealer is offering
39/39k miles i believe 2k down for 399/ month with
3.0 quattro, conven and premium pkg msrp $40, 245 this was up to 5/31 but continuing now. they have quite a few on their lots. THey tell me this is a subsized lease by audi apr close to 2%.
Is the down payment negotiable? has anyone had success cutting down this down payment (cap cost reduction)
also the redisgn a6 '04 will have a screen dvd NAV system.
Is the cash down negotiable? Yes, and no. Everything's negotiable, but if this is an AoA incented plan, and it may or may not be, they usually have fixed components. I believe that lessors must now divulge the APR upon request.
However, if you get rid of a cap reduction, this will get rolled into the cap cost and the monthly payment will increase. Also, with just 12K miles a year, I'd check the cost of extra miles. Acquisition and disquisition charges are B.S., and should be negotiated out of the lease. My current lease through a credit union required only $100 up front. No month in advance, etc.
Is this an "official" Audi warranty?
I have seen official Audi of America warranties and they generally extend the Audi Advantage (fully) by 25K miles no deduct and service is included -- as I said a 50% extension of the Audi Advantage.
I bought one through my broker (who got the car for me) when the car was a year old and had less than 12k on the odo. It's exclusionary, but the exclusions are the logical ones (consumables, etc.). Got it from Heritage, a GE Capital company. 7yrs/100k. Including surcharge for AWD and zero deductible, paid $1,550. Reading through it it's virtually a clone of the Audi Advantage warranty, except that it wouldn't cover brakes, wiper blades, and light bulbs like the AA does. Also, there's a full money back provision if you don't use it. Which, with an Audi, will be highly improbable.
Good luck.
It's a big world. Take a look:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=extended+auto+warranties
2K DOWN
483/MONTH WITHOUT TAXES
aquistion fee 500
apr <1.9%
What do you think
Since no significan changes for 03, felt this is a reasonable alternative for an SUV for my wife.
If this is good, do i include the taxes in the lease payment or pay up front?
A6 2.7T
Conv. package
Lux. package
Sport package (or just the 17" wheels)
3 year lease
15K miles/year
$3K drive off (or less)
$499/mo incl tax (or less)
Does this sound doable? Has anybody gotten a similar deal? Would I have to eliminate something (conv. pkg for example)? Thanks for any input.
The water pump seized on my 2000 A6 2.7T at 60,000 miles (10,000 over warranty) which caused the timing belt to "come off". Which, as you experts know, in a zero clearance engine causes, if your lucky, bent valves. In my case, I have ruined pistons, crushed valves, split heads and ruined turbo chargers.
The dealership diagnosed the problem just from a brief roadside description as the car was being hauled away. Initial estimate was $6,000.
Further investigation revealed the ruined turbo's bringing the total cost to $17,000 (Anybody have a roll of TUMS?)
Insurance won't cover it, AoA is reviewing and the dealer is sitting on it because he knows I won't (can't)pay.
Has this happened to anyone else? Will Audi come to my rescue? Absolutely love the car, but declaring bankruptcy seems like my only option...and yes, I would recommend the extended warranty.
Ouch...all that engine work! Sorry buddy. Wish I could help you out!
Mark to the rescue?
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
While it would be wonderful if AoA would cover the whole deal, even some substantial help might get you over the hump. That $17K must contain a substantial portion of profit on both the dealer (labor) and AoA (parts) side. Maybe if everyone could give a little, you might get a painful but survivable number.
The only other option I can think of is seeing if you can find an independent Audi shop that can do the work. I'm sure the number would still be very big, but it would have to be less than what you're looking at.
You may also want to try visiting AudiWorld. I don't know that anyone can help you on the A6 board, but I've read of many more reported failures of one type or another on the S4 board. Maybe someone there can give you better information.
I hope this works out for you.
I simply want to pose the following question: When would you ever consider (assuming that you could) NOT having insurance on your house, your car, your health and probably your life?
I venture to say that most of us who can "afford" to drive Audi's and other such $$$ cars, hate insurance premiums, but wouldn't dream of "running naked" (that is without insurance).
I have made few insurance claims in my 51 years on the planet earth -- ditto my wife. I can only assume that we have been "profitable" for our insurance company. Yet, much as I hate to pay the premiums, I do not even hesitate to pay them (and from time to time I shop for new carriers, just it case I can find a better deal -- I haven't changed carriers for 12 years).
I do not have the mental (or financial) capability to have a car that is out of warranty. The $17,000 story reinforces that sense -- i.e., I can't afford to drive an expensive car (no matter how old) without a warranty that will protect me from such things, no matter how rare.
On the other hand, I virtually never buy those extended service plans that Circuit City and other stores try to sell on appliances and stereo equipment.
As I approach the end of my lease and with 29,000 miles on my car thus far, I realize I am way way under the 50,001 mile "danger zone." No matter what, no matter how long I keep one of these wonderful cars, I will not run without a full warranty protecting me -- things, no matter how fine, how expensive, etc. BREAK!
I hope Audi will offer some goodwill to you -- contact AoA, Ms. Carol Glynn - "director" of the Audi Owner Loyalty program. This may not be her area, but I'll wager she will direct you to the right phone # or e-dress to at least "make your case."
Good luck!
I have driven reliable (past the warranty, past 100K miles, past 150K miles) vehicles, with only tire, shock & brake maintenance. Others have too, and appear to expect something like that in their future "luxury" cars. What we're being told on this board is that the insurance industry (hmm. . .who really pays for insurance) is supposed to cover those who buy cars with "soul."
Let's reconvene this discussion in five years.
It'll be a hoot.
And, I do not understand the reference to appliances and cars with "soul" in the context of attempting to "insure" oneself from financial risk.
I suspect something in the statements was meant to dis European cars in general and Audis in particular.
Well, generally speaking, this forum is for fans of the marquis, not foes. But, if the point is to say that "cars with soul" can somehow be characterized as appliances -- it missed its mark.
A neighbor's Mercedes E class had the power seat fail -- out of warranty cost $1,400 (because MB helped him). A former employee's Subaru had catastrophic engine failure -- JUST out of warranty. Tough love -- he had to buy an engine from a junk yard and have it transplanted (at least the total cost was a four figure number instead of a five figure number -- but my young employee had to take out a loan to get the car fixed, and he had not paid for the car).
I agree with Tim, there are many examples of Audi's (and other European cars) that "lived long and prospered." And, likewise there are many examples of non-European cars (generally Japanese) that died young expensive deaths.
Because the costs associated with ANY of these "high buck" cars -- no matter from which country they hail -- is so "breathtaking," I would always urge one to acquire "insurance."
This is without regard to one's perception of the car as possesing a soul or being kin to a can opener.
And, as I mentioned, I cannot afford to drive an "uninsured" $50,000+ automobile. Perhaps you can. Self insurance, over the long run, I am certain -- is probably less expensive over a 20 or 30 year period. But ONE catastrophic expense, IMO, justifies the premiums. Hmm, other than my doctor's office visits (and I do have a copay), I have never made a claim on my health insurance and, thus far at age 51, I do not have any of the big diseases -- this means my health insurance premiums have been, technically, a waste of money.
I still consider it money well spent.
And, yes I do think Audi's "have soul." Of all the descriptive terms I can come up with, "appliance" would not cross my mind. To each his/her own.
I'll keep being an Audi customer and I'll keep making sure I'm "insured" from catastrophic expenses.
Some might call this overly cautious, I call it prudent.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
Here's why I monitor many of these boards: Several cars interest me, and I enjoy the day-to-day discussions of what lease deals are good, or what outright purchase deals work, or (most especially), what do I do with my recently-purchased used car. I'm a big fan of reliability, having driven several vehicles 200K+ miles, including commercial trucks.
I don't troll here hoping for previously-happy consumers complaining about being huge disappointments with high-dollar repairs. What I'm really looking for are the used-car folks coming in with something like: "I bought an Audi XX-YYY with 89,000 miles on it and drove it an additional 37,000 miles, and the rear door handle broke. I know it's 8 years old, so what's the best source for a replacement?" Stuff like that.
There are boards on Edmunds that actually survive while having this kind of discourse, with real answers. The engine and drivetrain lasts 250K miles, but the seats wear out, or the head liner droops, or the plastic on the tail lights breaks, or whatever.
Believe me, I monitor carefully all sport sedan (luxury, too) boards to see how the long-term thing goes. People who buy the vehicle with 70 - 120K miles on it, then put another 20K or so on it, then ask where the nearest dealer is, do exist.
If they buy Audis, they appear not to be aware of Edmunds.
Find out why the turbos are so much... and what they would charge for installation of third party parts.
Just curious for opinions of current Audi owners and their thoughts on holding an Audi for 7+ years with 150K+ miles on it from scratch. Obviously Japanese cars are best suited for this but I am interested in owneing a European car for a change.
Thanks for all input.
Yes, I do know drivers who have 160,000 miles on a vehicle and have only changed the oil once! I also know people that went to the casino and won $10,000 with one pull of the slot machine!
These things have never happened to me and probably never will. I have to make money the old-fashioned way-I have to earn it!! So, I agree w/Mark and stick w/ good warranties for the long haul.
She's tested it twice, likes it, drives well, a lease return, Audi certified, price OK. Considering additional warranty protection.
Appreciate advice as I continue to read through 2800 other posts! Can also reply to davidframe@earthlink.net. Thanks!
What I'd like:
A6 2.7T
Convenience pkg
Luxury pkg
Sport pkg
(Maybe premium pkg--xenon lights etc)
3-year lease
3K drive-off cost (or less)
$499/mo incl tax (or less)
15K miles/year
Does this sound possible? Anybody with a similar deal? thanks for any input.
Yep, at about 29,000 miles on my 2001 A6 4.2, I have accumulated -- under warranty -- about $5,000 worth of repairs (brake rotors R Us) -- perhpas the single most expensive repair/replacement being the "power operated til/telescope steering column. Maintenance, normal routine maintenance has been additional. And I have replaced my tires twice (I am on the third full set of tires -- 255 x 40 x 17's UHP or Max Perf wear fast, i.e.).
This probably means that on top of my lease payment, about $7,000+ has been put into keeping the car the way I like it.
My main problem, the one that has apparently been corrected for 2002, as you all know, has been with the purring or shuddering brakes -- I have railed about this problem both here and to Audi and as I have also noted Audi has been very helpful. And, this help has cost someone -- thankfully not me -- a bundle. Audi and my dealer have minimized my troubles, but I still find myself shaking my head that a $54,000+ car couldn't have brakes as good as the Pontiac Bonneville I rented on a business trip. My words, as I recall, have been to characterize my brake problems as "annoying" -- the brakes perform their function.
Moreover, I have shared with this erudite forum that I really love this car and that at over 25K miles it actually seems to drive, handle, ride -- perform, that is -- better than when it had 1 miles on it. And, although I am near to the end of my 30 month lease term, and despite what some would think, I am again (already done it in fact) ordering a new (2003) Audi (allroad 2.7T w/6spd), as is my wife (a new TT).
My point is to share my experiences pertaining to Audis with you -- and to wonder out loud about many things related to cars, Audis in particular. I enjoy 99% of the posts on this board and actually rely on many of the poster's opinions and experiences as I move forward with my choices of cars (well, Audis).
So, while I think that my experiences under warranty seem -- when stated as a number: $5,000 -- even to me, excessive, it does not diminish the pleasure I have had with this brand in the least. Likewise, I am even further convinced, if that is possible, of the wisdom of never driving a car -- any car -- "naked" (without a full warranty).
Finally, I just read the Car and Driver test report of the new Lexus ES300 -- the car apparently is perfect in every way, but the conclusion one can draw from this review is that while the car is apparently bullet proof in every way, it is uninspiring and one can extrapolate, boring.
I wish my Audi would be as, apparently, reliable as some of the write ups about some Japanese cars describe; but, I would not trade relability for the pleasure that goes with driving Audis.
To each his/her own.
BTW, while not flawless, my wife's TT has been -- except for tires -- almost 100% trouble free.
Good luck, let us know how it all comes out!