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Comments
FWIW.
LIY
It is real. It is also able to be overcome by reprogramming the tip each and every time you get behind the wheel -- and it takes about 9 seconds total to do so, probably 5 seconds if you catch your rythym.
If someone told you that there was "driveline" lag (sometimes there is some driveline lash -- but that is NOT an AWD only phenom) because there are multiple differentials -- he/she was speaking inaccurately (you determine if this was ignorance or willful).
Query the quattro club of america -- "ask uncle john," he seems to be very aware of the causes and potential cures of this transmission malady.
I don't fault the sales rep for wanting to "overcome your objection" -- it is what they (we as I am in technology and it is 99% salew, too) do to move the process forward.
I do fault the rep for either ignorance and "making up an answer" or for not saying, "I'll get back to you on that" or something other than a story that actually would make the quattro system appear to have a major flaw (which it DOES NOT have!)
Finally, tip lag is NOT bothersome to all people and I suspect it does not happen to every tiptronic equipped Audi (or automatic equipped "fill in the blank" car). Only you can decide if "tip lag" is acceptable, unacceptable or simply annoying.
I found it annoying and the work around did, in fact, work.
It just ticks me off to be in a $40,000 to $70,000 car that you have to make excuses for (even if the excuses are mainly to yourself).
Personally, my regular seats are quite comfortable, but I don't know what the S70's feel like so I can't compare...
Hope you like the car as much as I do...
That being said, as you probably already know, the car will "learn" from your driving style and get more energetic in "D" mode as well. But still not as fun as "S". I tend to use "S" when I'm alone, and "D" when with company as it is smoother and less jolting to passengers...
LIY
Kept it in sport mode the entire time -- no evidence of tip lag.
Ban D altogether.
Tip lag is a programming problem or issue, not a flaw.
D is for "dull."
I'll send the extra buck or two to the oil companies if that is what it takes to not drive a boring car (the A4 2.0T -- also test driven -- does not seem to have this issue, at all.)
What options, packages, etc. did you get?
In any case, I find the trunk roomy enough!!
And, we like your priorites!
LIY
LIY
Thank you...
Year to Date 2005: 5,782
Year to Date 2004: 3,425
As you said, the A3 and A4 will pick things upconsiderably for Audi this year.
When it's all said and done, 2005 should be an upswing year for Audi as a whole.
Its hard to say where the A6 will come in with pricing for 2006. The option packages have been minimized a lot. No more nit-picking with too many different options.
I hope the prices stay in line. And a FWD model is on the way for 2006.
1. premium sound w XM
2. tire monitoring
3. cold weather
4. 18" inch wheels
5. advanced key
6. Nav
7. voice activation
the ride is awesome. need a suggestion on a good bluetooth phone?
For me, it came down to the A6 3.2 and the M35x, and I have to say that one of the major determining factors was what I perceived to be the sluggishness of the 3.2 (3.1) vs. the much swifter pickup of the Infiniti.
I had all but committed to the Audi (after eliminating the 530, the E350, and the RL), when all of a sudden the M hit the scene and pulled me away.
The acceleration in the 3.2 is more than sufficient, it's very smooth, and, to be fair, quieter, than the M35x. It is, after all, a V6 so it's not like one should expect neck-snapping starts.
The salesman at Audi told me that a bigger V6 is in the works for the A6, and that it won't be the same one used in the new Passat. Who knows, maybe the second half of 2006 will have an A6 3.2 (3.something) that my M35x will be chasing after.
Full throttle is full throttle that is. There should be NO difference in this scenario.
However, under less than full throttle, the sport mode will hold each gear to a higher RPM level before upshifting. The shifts as I recall are crisper in sport mode, but this may be solely due to the higher RPM shift point.
Sport mode may indeed reduce tip lag since tip lag (or DBW lag) generally happens when you would expect the transmission to "decide" to downshift. In sport mode the need to be in third gear may not exist since you may already be in third gear, whereas in normal mode, you will already be in 4th or perhaps 5th.
What will make the A6 3.2 quicker? Well there are plenty of things that could be done, but decreasing the content of the car is unlikely. The engine is tuned for our fuel and probably has a lot of grunt left in it. At present the most likely thing that could be done will be to change both the breathing and the engine management to produce higher torque at as low RPM's as possible.
In the absence of the ability to do this, the car could be made quicker "as is" if the final drive ratio were shortened even as little as 3% or so -- of course gas milage would decline.
The FSI engine with really clean fuel can probably be made to have more HP and torque without any major fiddling -- 2006 may bring this fuel to the US by law. Then Audi could tweak the FSI 3.2 to have both a bit more torque and HP.
Mean time, your choice may just be to go with the M35X -- my final two choices were the A6 3.2 and the M35X. For many reasons, I would have taken the A6 over the M35X if I could get over the $3,000+ difference (more for the Audi) and the almost $200 per month lease premium Audi was commanding.
I hope I made the right choice, for the A6 is a very nice automobile, including or despite the Tip lag.
Maybe next time.
I must agree that, at least on paper, the M35x is faster (as it wasn't out when I bought my A6). All I can say is that I have the A6 3.2 and I can't stop smiling when driving in sport mode. Could I have found a faster car? Sure, but that's not what its all about for me. I wanted a fast car (anything around 7 sec 0-60) with adequate HP to get on and off highways and avoid accidents. That's it. Otherwise, I was more focused on the looks and aesthetics of the automobile...both from a classy, eye catching exterior, to an elegant, top of the line, interior, to great safety features and cool electronics.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that it is the "whole package" to me that makes the A6 such a nice car. Is it the fastest, or the biggest, or lightest, or does it have the loudest sound system? No. But it has all the features that I wanted with outstanding fit and finish and I have no regrets if someone in an M35 beats me to the next light by 1 second (if they want it that bad, they can have it...).
In other words, I agree with the previous post.
Now Mark, I keep telling you my car, a 3.2 has absolutely no tip lag. I keep telling you this and you keep on contradicting that. BTW a poster in the M35 forum did notice hesitation in his 3.5 engine when accelerating at certain speeds and gears. I think I also felt it on my test drive but it was only momentarily. I don't think there's a car out there that has immediate foot-throttle response in all circumstances. Our brains are still faster processors than our engines.
I have deliberately said tip lag not Tip lag -- the reason is I believe too that tip lag, or Drive By Wire (DBW) throttle lag and probably some other kinds of "hesitation" also are real (not simply effecting Audis -- and Porsches -- that is).
But, one more thing that I believe:
Robots are stealing my luggage (with thanks to Steve Martin).
If next year's gasoline is cleaner, I guess less sulfur, can they mod my engine and give me extra horses and efficiency. I average 14 MPG in NYC, on the highway
22.
I love how this car just soaks up the road. The Audi's are so smooth at 85 MPH. The car just begs to be driven fast. It started pouring down raining, but with the Quattro, I still felt like I owned the road in bad weather conditions.
I would say that the seats are a bit on the firm side. My butt did ache a little bit after driving 5 hours. But I think a lot of European cars seats are a bit on the firm side on a brand new car.
With respect to the trunk, it seems huge to me. I went on a long business trip (about two and a half weeks), and the trunk swallowed up all of the luggage I had to pack (two big rolling garment bags, a backpack, a large briefcase) with no problem whatsoever. I don't think anyone could fairly complain about the size of the trunk on this model.
FYI: My '05 A4 came with 18" wheels with summer-only tires. Despite quattro and ESP, it was still quite a handful in snowy conditions. Winter tires are recommended when using summer-only set ups.
"18" 7-arm alloy wheels with 245/40 all-season tires
Straight from Audi's website, so they are all-season. all of the cars I am looking at do not have the sport package. Thanks
You will have somewhat sportier tires, a nicer look (subjectively, I admit) and many of the benefits of the sport package without any stiffening of the ride that goes along with the stiffer shocks and reduced ride height (I personally prefer this set up, but the folks at Car and Driver said the A6 sport set up was a bit of a kidney jar-er.)
Also, can anyone (markcincinnati) give comparisons of the Audi sport package vs. S-line vs. M35 normal & sport packages? Would it be a plausible assumption that the S-line gives a similar ride of the M35 sport?
I've tested the M35 non-sport, and an A6 Sport 3.2; I feel the M35 was "tighter" and more responsive in its base form. Yet I am leaning towards the A6 for it's interior appeal (subjective) and my love of German "fahrvergnugen", something money just can't buy. Will the S-line bring the A6 to a higher level of sportiness?
Thanks,
Jeff
It's basically the same thing as a 2005 w/ the 18 inch wheels and sport suspension you can get on the V6 right now. No difference in ride quality.
It's more of a cosmetic treatment w/ S line badges, a differernt grill w/ air dam and painted spolier. And the S Line has the RS4 style 5 spoke wheels.
As above, the S-line isn't any different engine, that would be the S6 (yet to be released), not the S-line. The S-line just looks sportier (for the most part)...
I thought their was a 10mm difference in ride height between the Sport and the S-Line. The Sport being 20mm lower than stock, and the S-line being 30mm lower than stock... Any truth to this? Or, have I been doing too much research on different cars and getting the numbers mixed up...?
On another note...
I have written two emails to a salesperson at the Marin Audi dealer and he has not responded to either of them. I basically asked about the S-line on the 3.2, and special orders for color combinations... (I want the Arctic White on Amaretto). If anyone in the Bay Area has a "preferred" salesperson who would be responsive, please let me know. BTW, I will not deal with the local San Francisco dealership! They are grease balls....
S-Line in the past has not offered a suspension that is lower than the sport suspension alone.
The performance differences when there are any are attributable to the +1" wheel size (the A4 sport had 17" S-Line was 18" -- as far as I know the A6 S-Line comes with 18" wheels (at least for '05)). Other possible differences would be due to the body pieces that will or could effect c/d.
I don't know about creature comforts, but the audi salesman I dealt with told me that they have a more powerful V6 lined up for '06-'07. That would be great, what with the new and more powerful German offerings (E350 4matic and 530xi) and the infiniti M35x. (Can't speak as to the GS300 AWD's power.)
Also, Arctic white is a sold order color only for 2006.
2006? I have read much the same stuff that probably many of us have about some new juice for 2006 (ostensibly to make certain that Audi wins the horsepower war -- over the VW Passat's upcoming power rumor of 280).
Considering the A6 3.2 replaced (at the price point) the A6 2.7T S-Line at 265 HP and 280 ft pounds at about 150 RPM (just kidding) which was THE quickest A6 of them all (at the time -- 2004) and considering that every other car in this class seems to be producing numbers to 60 UNDER 7.0 seconds, well, Audi had better do something 'cause "Time, keeps flowin' like a river. . . ."
Had I been surveyed, I would have "voted" for the new A6 to have a slightly shorter final drive ratio and a tiny bit taller 5th and 6th gear which would have improved the 0-60 time and had little "highway" mileage impact. I wasn't surveyed.
Audis sales numbers, perhaps when viewed in comparison with the other cars "in its class" may be part and parcel because of the perceived performance prerequisites for a premium priced product like the A6 (sorry for the alliteration, I got carried away).
My guess -- sometime in the next 12 months, the A6 will "get some more muscle" by hook or by crook. Other gradual changes (improvements?) will certainly happen in due course.
It's between the A6 4.2 the M45 and the M35x. I really prefer the looks of the A6 (inside and out), and it certainly has more brand cachet (I'm insecure enough to care), but the Inifiniti has loads more tech goodies, is likely to be more fun to drive, and will probably be a good deal more reliable. The M45 will require the hassle and expense of snow tires where I live as well...I swear I have never had this much trouble picking out a car. Maybe I'll just get the RL :P