Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Options
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
I realize this is an Acura TL owners forum, but do not overlook the fact that failures are happening in all of hondas lineup including the accord and odyessy.
Honda knew there was a problem with this transmission as early as 2000 or so, and chose to do nothing until last year with the extended warranty ( offered only on certain years). It was not until this year that they finally recalled the transmission. Honda's solution early on was to just put in a rebuilt transmission with the same faults in it, and hence people were going through as many as 4 transmissions. This latest "fix" they have is just a cheap patch to keep it running unitl the warranty runs out.
Here is an example taken from the petition link that I posted here a page back or so :petition #2686. saundra Morton I will have had 2 transmissions put in my accura . The Accura dealership and customer service are refusing to pay for this 2nd one and the recall for these transmissions was just received a month and a half ago. I think something should be done with the honda customer service and dealers since you cannot get any results when they are at fault with these faulty transmissions. 2001 accura 3.2 tl
How would you feel if your transmission went out and Honda refused to take care of it? We all risk running into this sooner or later.
Recall #99V227000 - ACURA 3.5RL
NHTSA Campaign Number: 99V227000
Vehicle/Equipment Make: ACURA
Vehicle/Equipment Model: 3.5RL
Model Year, 9999 If Unknown Or N/A: 1999
MFR Campaign Number: K68
Component Description: POWER TRAIN:AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
Manufacturer's Involved In The Recall: AMERICAN HONDA MOTOR CO.
Begin Date Of Manufacturing: 19980824
End Date Of Manufacturing: 19990629
Vehicle, Equipment Or Tire Report: V
Potential Number Of Units Affected: 96518
Date Owner Notified By MFR: 19990830
Recall Initiator (MFG/OVSC/ODI): MFR
Manufacturer Responsible For Recall: AMERICAN HONDA MOTOR CO.
Date Report Received By ODI: 19990830
Date Added To File: 19990830
Regulation Part Number:
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard Number:
Defect Summary: VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: PASSENGER VEHICLES. A TRANSMISSION CASE BOLT CAN LOOSEN AND FALL OUT ALLOWING THE TRANSMISSION TO DISENGAGE FROM THE DIFFERENTIAL.
Consequence Summary: THE VEHICLE COULD LOSE POWER TO THE DRIVE WHEELS WITHOUT WARNING. ALSO, SHIFTING THE TRANSMISSION INTO THE PARK POSITION WOULD NOT LOCK THE WHEELS, AND A PARKED VEHICLE COULD MOVE UNEXPECTEDLY IF THE PARKING BRAKE IS NOT SET.
Corrective Summary: DEALERS WILL INSTALL A REDESIGNED BOLT.
Hope everything works out for you.
But Maldorf also mentioned "There have also been documented cases of these 04s breaking down."
That's new to me. I hope Maldorf can provide some 'document' here to back that up, if nothing, at least for his/her own credibility.
It seems no matter how many people have their transmission break down, some people choose to not care as long as their car was manufactured after the transmission was "fixed".
There really is not any point in me trying to find documentaion backing my claim about the 99. Fact is there was a problem, and continues to be one now for over 5 years.
First: The distinction between "required" and "recommended" appears to be a dubious one at best. Some manufacturers use one term, others use another. I will double check my TL owners manual, but even if it says "recommended", I suspect they don't sell any cars where they then use the term "required". The reverse is probably true with BMW.
Second: Is the idea of spending an extra 10-15 cents a gallon (5-7%) for premium in a $30k+ car with a 270 hp V-tech engine a hardship for anyone?? If so, buy a $20,000 car and have enough gas money left over for the rest of your life.
Third: There is a substantial amount of anecdotal evidence that performance and gas mileage improves with a high tech engine designed to run on premium. Probably completely outweighing any apparant savings with cheaper gas. That was the case for my 1995 Maxima SE and I'm quite sure the 2004+ TL is at least as good at utilizing the higher octane gas to it's advantage.
I jumped to a conclusion that the poster asking whether or not premium was required or recommended might be tempted to use regular if it was the latter. Go for it, if you chose. It's your car. Just don't lie when you go to sell it and someone smart enough to ask the question, does. I went so far as to keep gas receipts for my Honda S2000 and, sure enough, someone asked to see them.
I'm all for prudence. Putting regular gas in a V-tech engine has a different definition in my book.
The RL that you mentioned above is 5 years old news, and its also Acura that inititated the recall. Even with the most troubled TL/CL (2000-2001), if we look at those numbers, the precentage of failure (PREVIOUS TL/CL 2000-2001) was less than 2% with 4 recalls. According USAtoday, Acura extended the warranty 7 yrs/100k miles for TL/CL 2000-2003?
Actually I'm glad that you brought this matter up (I got spooked too but not anymore). So we can understand the situation better, there is nothing wrong with it. Btw you made me "shop" around to see used high mileage TL (it's fun), the oldest so far is 28k (with recalled tranny). I'm not planning to buy now but I will be when my 148k miles accord need to be replaced. I'm really interested with the NAVI-TL, since mine doesnt have one but my wife insisted that the replacement will be an SUV, BMW X5 or MDX probably.
Your TL'03 is fine and you said that you had nothing to gain from this lawsuit, so....? Do you want us to gain nothing while there's nothing wrong with our TL'04? (I have had bad experiences with some lawyers, "I always win this kind of case and I believe we can win it" but later on "Good god, this is my first loss on this kind of case") Anyway you have my sympathy and I agree with Pat, let's move on from this old news.
according to the powerchip company....the ECU chip for fuel management was designed for a certain octane fuel. But the company sometimes detunes an engine, because there are always someone who puts lower grade gas in the tank...thus not only forgoing the higher hp available in highly tuned engines, but damages the engine in the process.
the cayenne is tuned to 450 hp..using 91 octane..though for short distances 87 octane is OK....the computer adjusts for the lower grade....but it is not good. The existing ECU can be changed to give the car 487 hp using 91 octane, but the flexibility of the engine will be less...and 87 octane would damage the engine.
If 94 octane were available, the powerchip company could put in an ECU that would give the car 500 hp...but then the engine would surely not survive on being fed 87 octane...
the TL is close to a highly tuned engine. Giving it less octane will not make it break down in a few miles...but it would starve the engine....IMHO.
That said....I also think it is important for the auto maker to back up thier vehicle with good service and solve problems with permanent fixes, instead of temporary or questionable patches.
Specially if it were a safety issue....
Honda/Acura have some of the best engine technology in reasonably affordable cars on the market. Even a Ferrari 360 doesn't quite match the 120 hp/liter output of the 2000-2003 S2000. The current TL, with 270 horspepower out of 3.2 liters is also at the top of its class in power output per liter.
Following highender's logic, the CTS 3.2 liter engine is already "detuned" by 50 hp compared to the TL. So it also doesn't surprise me that you wouldn't notice any difference in performance with regular gas. It's not exactly a world class athlete to begin with, so a proper diet isn't going to make much of a difference. But the more the manufacturer pushes the technology envelope, the more likely a lower octane gas will result in adverse performance or worse. It is my understanding that confirmed use of lower octane gas in the BMW M3 (3.2 liter 333 hp) can be a basis for BMW invalidating the warranty (read that the computer chip actually monitors and stores such data as maximum sustained rpms, clutch useage, octane levels, etc.)
The Accord V-6 ratings assume regular-grade fuel, and Honda will market it as a regular-fuel engine. But — pssst — it's good for another 10 hp and 10-plus lbs.-ft. on premium, acknowledges V-6 engineer Asaki.
I think they are very pricy for what is basically a cosmetic improvement..
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
And high Octane gas will not always increase HP. Premium gas actually burns with less energy than regular. But it allows you to advance the engine timing which normally yields more power. The advancement or retardation of the engine timing is what affects the power. The octane only affects the timing. Too low and the timing must be retarded to prevent knocking. Higher can allow the timing to be advanced if the engine is designed that way.
Honda engines are known for there technological superiority and and for squeezing hp while saving gas (relatively speaking)
I think if one wants to put regular gas (87 octane) into the TL...then first go to powerchip company, and have them reprogram your chip and detune your engine to produce only 200 hp or so...then it will be OK for reg gas...
good luck.
One dealer has a $200 better quote than the other but only the latter is willing to do Michelin swapping 'free'. Is that really worth it (improved that much)?
Would you have bot 05 if it'd still come with Bridgestones? Or you wanted Nav anyway and they happened to get Michelins in 05?
For what it's worth, I have the 6-speed with HPT and Bridgestone "Potenzas". No complaints with 10,300 miles and they seem to be wearing reasonably well condsidering they are high performance tires.
Here are some list from NHTSA based on complaint about transmission related problem, mostly are from automatic transmission.
BMW 2003
325 12 earliest report on nov 2003
330 1
BMW 2004
325 11 earliest report on nov2003
330 7 earliest report on nov2003
INFINITI G35
2003 8 earliest report on apr 2003
2004 4 earliest report on nov2003
LEXUS ES
2002 ES300 37 earliest report on jan 2002
2003 ES330 17 earliest report on may 2003
2004 ES330 31 earliest report on Nov 2003
Acura TL
2002 68 earliest report on april 2002
2003 33 earliest report on june 2002
2004 none so far
Acura TSX
2004 none so far
Other than the hassle of an unscheduled repair, what is the big deal?
regards,
kyfdx
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I noticed some brake steer...meaning that when I brake, the steering wheel would turn right , almost 90 deg...but the mechanic could not figure it out....so I am getting it back today...
has any one else heard or had this brake steer problem ?
will have them check it again....
the service dept was excellent..they did a free oil change...free alignment,...fixed a few loose panels (that we knocked loose) and all were very nice.....
If it is happening on all road surfaces, you may have a problem with the right front brake caliper. It may be binding. Does the car veer to the right when you take your foot off the accelerator? It could also be a bad wheel hub or bearing. Do you hear any odd mechanical noises eminating from the front end when you're driving? Any problems with steering?
It's definitely not air in the brake lines. If that were the case, you'd have an extremely spongy brake pedal and virtually no brakes at all.
OK, so I went in to try the TSX and now I lust the TL.
I'm going to be OK because my business situation favors leasing.
So, if I am going to stretch a little farther and ignore discounted leases on less attractive (to me) Audi A4s and Saab 9-3s, I sort of need to know how much I am going to being stretched.
FUEL ECONOMY
Reading posts, I know fuel economy is similar to these other choices. Premium fuel is required or strongly recommended even if the knock sensor would allow lower octane. 6 speed is geared so I would expect to have lower highway mileage than if I picked the auto, don't you think? I am inclined to pay that penalty with a smile. My wife's Passat wagon will do 30 mph at 60-65, 25 mph at 80. Where is the TL's chip programmed for fuel economy? Please tell me they know a TL driver can't be expected to stay at 65.
SERVICE COSTS
Saab and Audi include service for a time, at least 36,000 miles. What is the cost of Acura's routine service during that interval? On a ~45,000 mile lease the cost of the others is nominal, but I presume there is at least one expensive service, although no tune up as I understand it.
INSURANCE RATES
Last, what do insurance companies think of the TL? How is it rated and in your experiences how do rates compare for other cars in this price range. I am nearly 50, married, good boring history, despite my love of driving.
Thanks for your help and support as I try to enter the family.
Thanks for your help and info...
Happy Holidays to all....
:-)
It allows you to control the stereo, navigation system, and heating and cooling by pressing a button on the steering column and giving a voice command.
The clutch on the '05 is very light, and the car is easy to drive and live with. the
Nav is a useful toy. I used it to find an address in Brooklyn (Which is VERY easy to get lost in), and it did great. Beats the old Hagstrom map! Also, I love the XM.
It's a great car. No problems at all yet. My 1st service minder came on yesterday and it will go in for 1st oil change on the 29th around 6500 miles. The dealer won't give a loaner for this service, even though I thought I was supposed to get one for any service. I won't make a deal of it since I'll be off then anyway, but...
2021 Toyota Venza Limited Hybrid, 2022 Ram 2500 Laramie 6.4 Hemi, 2007 Mazda MX-5 Miata PRHT
Has anyone had the car long enough to estimate the service costs? Ideally, someone has put 45,000 on a 2004 and can tell me all the services needed and their costs, but it would help to know of any experience.
The other issue was insurance. I know where you live is a huge factor, so the question is really more about how much it costs compared to other cars you have or had. I looked on line and it seems that the TL is above average on passenger injury, but below average in costs per collision and is a very attractive theft target. But, what does that mean in actual premium?
Thanks. I am still really smitten. Is it wrong to keep taking the all too brief test drives?
Love the car and have had no problem. I do wish it didn't ride so hard but even that is OK.