BMW 5-Series Sedans

riez · January 2002

laura528... Which one did you get? 2.5L or 3.0L? Automatic or manual? Sport or non-Sport? What was the MSRP? Ones on my local Jag dealer's lot have been consistently running $42,000-44,000. Have you read the Edmunds' test? Check out Motor Trend's recent comparison test. Think it was in 11/01 issue.

gerry18 · January 2002

The CD changer, kit, and shipping to Cincinnati was ~$440 to Cincinnati area through Pacific BMW, about $25 less through eurobuyers.com.
Can't help you relative to Chicago area BMW service. I was in Chicago visiting my son over the holidays and hoped to pick up and install the Alpine i-bus changer while there. BTW, the BMW accessories site refers to the changer as having an m-bus, but the unit indicates it is an Alpine i-bus compact disc changer "for BMW vehicles with factory pre-wiring & side bracket." The changer alone is either $375 or $399, depending on whether you go through Pacific BMW or eurobuyers. Now I'm not sure if the $300 regular Alpine 6-disc i-bus changer wouldn't have worked.

dantlo · January 2002

No, not right now. We just returned a 98 528 and leased a Volvo wagon. I am waiting for the new 5 series next year. The dealer which I bought 3 BMW's from gave me a great deal on my 325. I think I will give Long Beach a call when the time comes. I usually buy my Bimmers from Century West.
Dan

10cwalker · January 2002

I have a 1997 6 speed 540 and have gone through 2 catalytic converters in 70k miles. Someone suggested I'm shifting at RPM that's "too high". What's the optimal shifting RPM so as not to burn through catalytic converters?

Thanks.

6_speed · January 2002

Don't know about the "too high" bit. Under safe conditions, I usually shift just before redline. The limiter would kick in anyway if you try to go beyond.

However, at the suggestion by my mechanic, I do try to keep the _minimum_ RPM around 2500 whenever I can.

My car is still on its original cat.

snagiel · January 2002

I don't think shifting at certain RPM's will fundamentally change the longevity of the cats. Be glad, though, that they expired before 80k miles; I think they're only covered under warranty until then.

10cwalker · January 2002

Phew...something seems out of whack. I was originally shifting around 3000, then cut that back to 2500 when I lost my first cat...when I lost my second cat I considered dropping down to around 2000. Personally, I like the higher RPMs for performance reasons, but then there's the pocketbook to consider....

Shifting at < redline must play hell with the gas mileage!! I'm currently around 18.5 - 20 around town. Comments?

10cwalker · January 2002

Hence my concern...thw warranty will run out before I need my third cat unless something changes (driving patterns, whatever...)

So - maybe the question should really be, "What are the top two or three things that impact cat life?" (and this is in earnest, so no quips about "don't worry, cats have 9 lives")... ;-)

6_speed · January 2002

Most of my drivings are on freeway, so the number of near redline shifting is limited to stoplights or 'safe' just-out-of-the-corners/merges. I'm told some high revs are good for V-8. My mileage is about 18/19 mixed city/highway and I'm not complaining because it comes with the territory

Actually, some times I wish it could rev higher (like the E46 M3 or S2000!).

Since I try to maintain a minimum of 2500 rpm, I don't usually shift until around 4500 average, road condition permitting.

Mine is a '97 540 with about 48K miles.

chewie5 · January 2002

So I need some help. I went and test drove both the 530i and 525i (w/ sport premium pkg.) and really enjoyed both cars. The power difference, while noticeable, didn't knock my socks off. It would be nice to have more power, but I have a hard time justifying paying $4000 more for a slight gain in power. Are there any 525i owners out there that regret not getting the 530i? Would the power difference be more apparent with 4 people and the AC running?

Also, how do you all feel about the Acura TL type S? I have yet to drive one, but on paper it looks like a better buy--more power, similar features, but a lot less $$$. Yeah, I know that the styling is bland compared to the BMW, but is having a better looking car worth the extra cash when you get performance (acceleration) on par with the 540?

530bmw · January 2002

thanks for trying to give me a good reason and words of encouragement for getting the 530. I love the car so far and begin to understand why majority of BMW owners forever want to stick with the make. I hope I will not run into too many mechanical problems with the car as experienced by others. I will check out tirerack.com as suggested by you, do you think that I can use steel rims instead of the expensive aluminum ones? I am frugal but not cheap, after all I am still trying to recover financially from spending too much money on the darn car.

530bmw · January 2002

Please get the 530 if you can afford it, I decided to get it even though all along all I want is just the 525 to save money and did not care for the power differntial. I am glad with my final decision to get the 530. You will not regret it.

snagiel · January 2002

Sure, steel rims will work fine, but be sure you're comfortable with the look, because you'll probably have them for 2-4 months of the year (depending how safe you want to play it; I'm sure it'll snow a week after you re-mount the summer tires!).
And, I can't remember if you have the sport package or not, but I'd recommend the smaller 16-inch wheels instead of the 17-inchers, because narrower tires ironically enough handle better in snow than wider ones, and they're cheaper as well.

A quick glance at TireRack showed a combo I'd recommend: Michelin Arctic-Alpin (225/55QR16) for $101 each, plus Borbet Type H (16x7.5) wheels for $129 each, should be under $1000 with shipping, and you could install them yourself easily. Good luck.

div2 · January 2002

For those of you fitting snow tires and steel wheels, here is the part number for the OEM BMW E39 15" wheel cover: 36-13-1-093-324. Suggested list is $34.50. With your CCA discount figure @$26-$28 ea. IMHO they look MUCH better than any of the generic garbage.

snagiel · January 2002

First, the Acura TL Type S: Yes, it's far less expensive, but it doesn't truly compete with the 5-series. In fact, in a Car & Driver review last year, they said the same thing you do: "On paper," it looks good, but on the road its shortcomings become apparent, and the CL (the coupe version) lost out to the 330ci in a comparo. I drove the CL Type S a few months back, and concur with C&D: The powerplant is smooth and powerful, but I had three major gripes:
No choice of manual transmission (I can't stand manumatics that always seem to think they know better than you), front-wheel drive, and a nose-heavy imbalance. Even in relatively mild test-driving maneuvers it didn't steer and balance anywhere nearly as well as my 530.

Now, as for the 525/530 debate: My advice on this is usually "go drive them and decide for yourself." Since you've already done this, asking people here for input will only cloud the issue more for you. Power is an addictive thing; we soon adapt to what we have and take it for granted, and inevitably want more. In enthusiast forums, you won't find a shortage of 525 owners wishing for more power, but you'll see the same from 530, 540, and, yes, even M5 drivers. It never ends. With a stick, the 525 I test drove felt responsive enough, but I knew I'd crave the extra power the 530 offered and justified the price as such, but I stopped short of justifying another $8-10k for the 540. I found the 530 considerably more powerful and satisfying, but perhaps an automatic minimizes the gap. Honestly, if I couldn't have afforded the 530, I probably would've gone for the 330, which is a total blast to drive. Very fast and nimble.

Good luck.

riez · January 2002

chewie5... For most part, think snagiel's post adequately sums it up. Only you will know whether 525i or 530i better meets your needs. Take them both out for very extensive test drives. Over roads you drive in the traffic you experience. And make sure to run the A/C, if that is a worry. Bring along an extra person to two (or 3) if that is also a worry. It is your money. Make sure you get a car that meets your needs.

Are you going automatic or manual? If former, the 530i will perform better under full loads and while using A/C. If latter, you won't go wrong with either. And the Acura 3.2TL Type S comes only in automatic.

The FWD Acura is a nice car for the money. Wife and I test drove one as well as the FWD I-35, both on same day back to back. We prefered the Acura as a performance sedan but the I-35 was much more luxurious. The Acura is a very powerful car for an automatic. More so than the already powerful I-35. But both lacked the overall balance, ride, and handling characteristics of the 3 or 5 Series. Wife went with 323iA and I went with 540iM.

I might disagree with snagiel on cost of 540i issue. People routinely say the 540i costs $8-10,000 more than a 530i. But ask these people what the MSRP was of their 530i. Most come pretty loaded and they quickly start approaching a base 540iA. For the money, I'd rather buy a $52,000 540iA than a $50,000 530iA. But I'd rather have a $40,000 525iM or 530iM than a $32,000 Acura TL or I-35.

hnn · January 2002

Does anyone know if the 530i has a timing belt that need to be changed in recommended frequency (80K/90K)? Or the double VANOS is controlled by the timing chain? Thanks. Hnn

div2 · January 2002

US BMWs haven't used timing belts since @1992. Double VANOS utilizes a hydraulic mechanism to rotate the timing gears relative to the camshafts.

snagiel · January 2002

Correct on the latter: it has a timing chain, which I don't think is asked to be replaced at any sort of frequency.

snagiel · January 2002

This has come up before, but you're equivocating once again. Go ahead, say you'd prefer a base 540 over a loaded 530, but don't suggest that there isn't an $8-10k difference between the two WHEN COMPARABLY EQUIPPED.

jim52 · January 2002

Regarding your post (#1793) above. Can you explain how you purchased your car over the internet? Was it through a dealership's web site or some other service? How did you negotiate the price. Was it a tough negotiating process or did you get that price right off the bat?

tomjava · January 2002

chewei5,

Have you checked the new RWD Infiniti G35? If you can wait till March, you should check it out. An amazing car, roomier than 5 series and cheaper than 325.

alfaber · January 2002

Chewie5: The Acura TL and Infiniti I35 aren't BMW's. This is both good and bad. On the good side, they are a lot cheaper, give more content for the money, and are more reliable cars. On the bad side, they lack the combination of ride and handling that BMW does best.
I speak as an ex-owner of a 733i and a 535i, and present owner of a brand new I35 (and my wife drives a TL). Since carving up backroads is not my main driving pleasure (and I decided years ago that for most of my driving a manual transmission was just a hindrance, especially in traffic jams, when using the cell phone, etc), I decided that the "near luxury" Acura and Infiniti (and Lexus also) models were a much better use of funds. And while BMW probably generally uses better quality interior materials, my experience was that the cars just weren't assembled as well, particularly as it related to electrical problems, which seemed to keep cropping up with my BMWs.
YMMV, but that's my thinking.
--Andy

jwilson1 · January 2002

The point has been made several times, so I won't repeat, but want to add that the cost diff. between the 530 and the TL (similarly equipped) is quite a bit more, both new and used, than you might first guess. You need to decide the priority of finances in your decision -- you can't knock the TL, but it is not really a comparable with the BMW, imo. I worked on the same decision several months ago and found that there was about a $20k difference between the two cars if you owned them each for four years, either buying them new, or used.

The BMW has "free" maintenance, but depreciates much more dramatically than the TL, especially when new, but the difference continues when it is older. It is also more expensive to insure. The TL's 'sport pkg' comes with all-season tires; as you know from the discussion here, you will need snows and rims depending on where you live with the similarly equipped BMW. Cost of maintenance for the BMW is more than double that of the TL once the "free" maintenance concludes. The BMW gas mileage is somewhat less, and taxes are obviously higher because it's a more expensive car.

Otoh, as everyone here has pointed out, the joy of driving clearly belongs to the 5 series, along with the styling, and -- for better or worse -- the image thing.

And of course if you want to take the financial argument all the way out, you could just buy a bike. Used.

Good luck.
Joe W.

riez · January 2002

snagiel... I'm focusing as much as possible on apples to apples. That includes the respective MSRPs. Of course the 525i, 530i, and 540i cost different amounts. That is because they are different cars and have different standard equipment. The 540i has things on it that you can NOT get on a 525i or 530i regardless of how much you might be willing to pay BMW to install (e.g., the 4.4L V-8 engine). The 540i also has some standard equipment on it that is optional on the 525i and 530i. And both have options which you can choose to put on one or other or both. You really can option out a 530iA nicely if you want to open your wallet up.

One can easily option out a 530iA to an MSRP equivalent to a 540iA. They remain different cars. And it really doesn't take much in the way of options to bring a 530iA up to around $47-48,000. That is getting close to base 540iA territory. So how much is the DPS Premium sound or other optional item "worth" in the loaded 530iA worth compared to the base 540iA which has the 4.4L V-8? There is no disputing they will remain highly similar yet different cars though they have similar or nearly identical MSRPs depending upon options.

Think it fair to say a 530iA is much more similar in darn near all regards to a base 540iA than it is to ANY Acura 3.2TL or I-35. For my money, I'd rather have the 540i over the loaded 530i. Which is more similar to a $47,500 530iA: a $52,000 540iA, a $33,000 3.2TL Type S, or a $29,000 I-35?

snagiel · January 2002

Your argument is illogical. Obviously, the 540 is equipped with a different engine than the 530. When I said "comparably equipped," I referred--as most people do--to options which you can order the car with (i.e. Sport Package, not the 4.4L V8).

Go to the BMW site, and "build" a 530 and a 540. Yes, you can load a 530 up to near $50k, as easily as you can do the same for a 540 and $60k. Some things that are standard on the 540 you need to order the Premium Package for on the 530, but then again the 530 comes standard with a stick--if you want a manual on the 540, that'll be even more expensive. Regardless, price out each with the sport package, and add the premium package to the 530. Difference in price? About $8k.

The debate about power versus options/luxury features is a separate issue you're bringing in here; bottom line is, when equipped similarly, there's a significant price gap.

shipo · January 2002

525i vs. 530i debate

Speaking strictly for my self, there is a substantial difference between the two in the power department. As it turns out, I just recently swapped my 328i with the 325i (both manual transmissions) owned by Brave1heart of BMW 3-Series fame, so I can speak to the difference of power with some real world experience to back me up.

Prior to the swap, I was prepared to be unable to differentiate between the two cars given that the new 2.5 liter engine is rated only about 10hp lower than my 2.8 liter mill. That and the 2.5 liter cars (525i included) have a higher numerical ratio in the rear end, and you can see why I was expecting little if any difference to my butt dyno.

In the real world, I was constantly expecting the 325i to accelerate faster than it did and was surprised by just how much faster my 328i was, especially in the lower RPM ranges. Brave1hearts experience mirrored mine, his quote was something like I prefer the SP on my 325i, however, I could REALLY get used to the extra power of the 328i.

All of that said, the 3.0 liter engine has about 30 more ponies on tap compared to the 2.8 in my car (and more torque as well). While I have not yet driven either the 330i or the 530i, there is little doubt in my mind that the 3.0 liter cars will be SIGNIFICANTLY faster than their 2.5 liter siblings.

Chewie5,

The BMW has "free" maintenance, but depreciates much more dramatically than the TL, especially when new, but the difference continues when it is older.

Hmmmm, well, I suppose that depends on whose numbers you look at. With just a little bit of research, I come up with 36 month  15k miles per year lease numbers showing that the 530i has a residual of 62% and the Acura TL with a residual of 56% (the TL-S is 55%).

530i vs. 540i

For my purposes (and mine alone) the difference between these two cars is as follows:

$55,745  540i (6-Speed, Premium Sound)
$47,395  530i (5-Speed, Premium Sound, PP, SP, Xenon)
$08,350  Difference

Given that I will not yield on my goodies, and suspect that the 530i has roughly the same performance of my 328i (if not better), the extra $8,350 for the 540i is NOT worth it IMHO (not to mention the extra cost of insurance here in NJ). Of note, I drove the 528i back in 1998 and found its performance a little lacking, the 328i was (then) just about right. Interestingly enough, I do not know if it is because of age or some other influence, however, I have rarely (if ever) wished my 328i to have more power.

Best Regards,
Shipo

fjk57702 · January 2002

The old 2.8 was rated 206 ft-lbs and 190 hp
The new 2.5 is rated 175 ft-lbs and 184 hp

The torque difference is significant and is what you "feel" when you accelerate. The new 3.0 has 214 ft-lbs, so will be somewhat better than the 2.8, but the torque band is wider also (more at the lowend) which contributes to the feel of more power.

john01 · January 2002

Well, I found this one to be interesting, to see what other people's opinions are. I spent literally months going back and forth between the 2. In the end, I never had a chance to drive the 540 but maybe that is a good thing, otherwise I may have spent more than I should have. I ended up ordering the 530i 5spd. I felt the power was just about right for our use, and I did want to have all the amenities. I even ended up getting some non-US options as well (it is a US spec). When I compared the 2 with about the same goodies, whether it be standard or options, there were still about $8,000 difference. At that point it was really down to "Is 65 bhp worth $8,000?". I could not justify it, because I knew I would push just a bit more and start thinking of M5 (especially since about the same amount of money separated 540 and M5 for me out here).

If I ONLY wanted the power, then yes, I could have picked up the 540 at about the same price as the 530 we ordered, but we wanted the features a bit more than the power.

John

riez · January 2002

shipo... Does your $8,000 difference account for the Sport Package? It is standard on the 540i 6-speed. I don't see Sport Pkg listed on your 530i comparison. If not accounted for, the price gap narrows by another $2,300. That makes only a $6,000 difference. (To be truly apples-to-apples, you'd also have to factor in any standard equipment on the 540i that is optional on 530i which is not on your list.) Price out a 540iA without Sport and the gap narrows further, esp. if you look at your 530i and add the automatic.

riez · January 2002

snagiel & joho01... My focus on comparisons between 530i and 540i has always tried to take into account some things. First, people posting here seem to be buying 530i's that have a decent amount of options and which pushes the final MSRP in the $47,000-50,000 range. Second, many people buy automatics. Third, lots of people lease. Fourth, there is a trade off inherent to 540i vs 530i. To keep the MSRP same or similar, you might give up a few luxury "goodies" but you gain a lot more acceleration performance. For a lot of people, that is worth it.

The gap narrows quickly between loaded 530iA and base or lightly equipped 540iA. And the difference in total cost of two leases can be dramatically different than the total cost difference of an outright purchase.

Just for fun, how many people here bought 525i or 530i with a final MSRP of under $45,000?

Keep in mind we are talking about cars costing nearly $50,000. A $5,000 difference is only 10 percent. If you lease and not buy, the final difference over 36 month lease might not be that much each month. A $3,000 difference is only 5 percent. Not that big, esp. if you lease or plan to own for a very, very long time.

snagiel · January 2002

OK, just for fun, how many people here bought a 540 with a final MSRP of under $55k?

riez · January 2002

stickered for a bit under $60K. But she is a near fully loaded '98 540i 6-speed I bought CPO for about $35,000.

snagiel · January 2002

riez · January 2002

snagiel... Closed? I hardly think so. Is mine a cost of $60,000 or $35,000? I only paid the latter. Why can't I or anyone else looking at CPO cars compare any 5 Series for similar price, regardless of year, original MSRP, or type?

Notice you never address the cost difference between base 540iA and loaded 530i, esp. automatic. The price gap really does narrow and the differences are between critical factors inherent to each, like engine (bigger V-8 vs smaller I-6), and optional "goodies" (like DSP or Comfort Seat).

If someone is more interested in automatics and more interested in performance over luxury, then there clearly is a valid and fair comparison between base 540iA and loaded 530iA. In such a case it is not fair or accurate to always say there is an $8-10K difference. Case closed?

john01 · January 2002

I am not sure how many people will actually compare a loaded 530i to a base 540i, new, in this case. If one is looking at a loaded 530i, then the person is interested in all the features, but if the same person then looks at the base 540i, even with the additional standard items, one still does not get ALL the options one wants. With that in mind, loaded 530 to base 540 sounds like apples to oranges, to me at least.

habitat1 · January 2002

First, no matter what way you cut it, a 530i sport or 530iA, similarly equiped to a 540i 6-speed or 540iA w/ sport package has an MSRP of at least $7,800 less. Add a $1,300 gas guzzler tax to a 540i and you get a $9,100 differential. Don't even suggest a 540i w/o sport package - that's a waste of money for anyone desiring "performance".

Second, I would agree that there was a big difference in acceleration between the old 540i vs. the old 528i. The new 530i, especially with the super-smooth 5-speed manual, considerably narrows the gap. I test drove them extensively and the 540i only shows any measurable advantage after about 50-60 mph. And for those that like nimbleness, the extra 400lbs on the 540i can be felt at all speeds.

Third, the up front cost differential is only part of the story. I extensively researched the maintenance and repair history of BMW's V8's and I6's when I was considering a 5-series. There is no doubt that 120-150k+ miles on a V-8 is going to cost you a lot more in routine and non-routine costs than BMW's I6.

Using the current 5-series as the measuring stick, here's how I would rate the series today in terms of overall performance under enthusiastic (but not insane) driving:

Current 525i - 1 (note - not a "1" compared to other cars, just using as a starting point for the 5 series)
Former 528i - 2.5
Current 530i - 5
Current 540i - 6
Current M5 - 10

I would be hard pressed to advise anyone that current 540i is a good value as a performance "upgrade" over the current 530i. If you have the bucks, the M5 is truly in a supercar league. Whatever difference there is between the 540 and 530 is magnified at least 3-4 times between the M5 and 540. And at least it holds it's value well enough to partially offset the $20k price premium.

The new 5-series, which will likely utilize the 325 hp V8 of the new 7-series, will widen the gap and perhaps make the trade-up from a 530 a better deal. But in the meantime, for everyone considering a 530i, I think it's a great choice.

cramar · January 2002

I priced on net then i negotiate with a guy from Difeo bmw s internet dept. You can call him if interested Greg Berkowitz 201-568-9000. Tell him cramar sent you

snagiel · January 2002

I'll try one last time only because you keep bringing back the same desparate point. It is possible, yes, to option up a 530 near the base price of a 540 (although, with your term "goodies," you make it sound like all the options are pure fluff). I'm not ignoring that fact, I'm saying that fact is misleading, as John and Habitat pointed out above.

As for your CPO 540, you only proved my point that, in this luxury league, "base prices" are pertinent only for marketers. Virtually no one buys any car in this price range with no options. So your argument is not only misleading but unrealistic as well.

Earlier, when I considered the M3, I first thought that for a similar price I could get the Boxster--or better yet the Boxster S (MSRP $42.6k and $51.6k, respectively). Have you ever looked at the option list for a Porsche? It's almost funny; you can literally double the cost of the car with enough options. Granted, some are completely fluff (e.g. Porsche emblems woven into the headrest), but so much else you're shocked to discover they don't offer standard, like wood/leather, etc.

riez · January 2002

How many 530i buyers here have the Sport Package? Seems like like of you are buying just the Premium Package. How many are buying automatics? Seems like more than a couple. So what is the price difference between a base non-Sport 540iA and a decently loaded 530iA? Not as much as you'd think and NOT the $8-10,000 various people keep repeating here. The cars are more similar than different. The price difference, depending upon your "goodies", seems well worth it considering you can afford a $50,000 car to begin with (or we wouldn't be having this discussion?).

habitat1... As I've said repeatedly, I'm really talking about 530iA vs 540iA. Non-Sport, 'cause that seems to be what people are buying here. Your chart is purely subjective. My numbers would likely be completely different. Guessing give 10 different people the same task and we'd get at least 5 different charts. Maybe more? Why not put together a chart showing all the various 5 Series sedan combos, automatic and manual? There really is a significant difference between the automatic 540iA and 530iA. And the published acceleration figures still favor 540iA over 530iM.

My chart might look like (I think all BMWs are at least a 5; no such thing as a 1 or 2 except maybe the old 318iA)...

525iA 5
530iA 6
525iM 6
530iM 7
540iA 9
540iM 11
M5 13!

Remember the movie "This Is Spinal Tap?" BUT IT GOES TO ELEVEN!!!

A base, no options 2002 540iA w/dest has an MSRP of $51,845. A similarly equipped 2002 530iA might cost around $46,370 (options include AT, Prem Pkg, Prem Sound, and Xenon HID headlights). That is a difference of only $5,475. Or 11.8 percent of the 530iA's MSRP. The 530iA gets the "goodie" stereo, but the base 540iA comes with different wheels, automatic ventilation system, and upgraded multi-information display.

snagiel · January 2002

First, you're not proving what people are buying, only the already-accepted fact that it is possible to price up a 530. You continue to compare it to a bare-bones 540, which I argue is exceedingly rare.

Second, your chart is comical: If the ratings are relative and arbitrary, why use a 5-13 scale?! And if you think the difference between the 540 and the 530 is twice that between the M5 and the 540, you're delusional. I've driven or been in all of them, and the M5 is in a league of its own. The 540 doesn't come close.

Third, your price analysis is, surprise, wrong. The same premium sound is an option on the 540 as well, so there's no sense in getting it just for the 530 in your comparison. And the Premium Package would include the auto climate control as well as the upgraded trip computer. So that difference is $6,675 (14.8 percent increase), which isn't commensurate with the increased performance the 540 offers above and beyond the 530. And, neither of these cars are really worthwhile without the Sport Package, which widens the gap by another $500, and then you add the gas guzzler tax on the 540, not to mention the higher gas, insurance, and maintenance costs, and, well, that precious thin margin you tried finding between the 530 and 540 quickly dissipates.

shipo · January 2002

Sorry my friend, it is still a difference of $8,350. Maybe you missed the "SP" designation (used extensively over in the 3-Series thread to denote "Sport Package") in my description of the 530i from post #1826, but if you look back there, you will see it.

So, basically, different strokes for different folks. For me, the extra power of the 540i (or the M5 for that matter) would be nice, but not necessarly desirable for the price. Could I afford the 540i, easily, do I want to afford the 540i, no.

Best Regards,
Shipo

marcnyc · January 2002

I'm interested in a new 530i, but am concerned about the notorious door rattling problems I've been hearing about. Is this still a problem and how widespread is it? Thanks.

riez · January 2002

snagiel... Think you're wrong to say a no-option 540iA is "bare bones". The standard equipment list is quite extensive. That is why everyone adds Premium Pkg to 530i. It adds all those "goodies" which are standard on 540i.

Do you have a copy of the 2002 BMW full color 86 page 5 Series brochure? The detailed Equipment listing charts runs on pages 66-69. Both 530i and 540i come with standard automatic climate control; however, the 530i Premium Package does NOT come with the 540i's standard "automatic ventilation system (can be programmed to ventilate the car when parked"." This can only be had in 530i when "included with optional on-board navigation system." And the 530i Premium Package lists "upgraded on-board computer" but that appears to be different than the listing for the standard expanded 540i MID which covers "MID incorporating audio and accessory phone controls; upgraded on-board computer, and Check Control vehicle monitoring system". This is only an equipment item for 540i; no mention of it being optional with 530i regardless of package. But I'm just going by BMW's listing.

Ya gotta have a sense of humor. My post made quite clear that the chart put together by habitat1 and myself were completely subjective. That was the point of my chart. And mine was deliberately intended to be comical. Didn't you catch the SPINAL TAP reference? Guessing maybe you haven't seen the movie.

Check out the published acceleration figures for M5 vs 540iM and 540iA vs 530iA/M. Believe the gap between the former is less than the gap between the latter.

shipo... As I've said before, this discussion about cost comparisons is really between the 540iA and 530iA, not the 540iM and 530iM. Mea culpa as regards the "SP" in your post. If we're comparing 540iM to 530iM Sport, then question is whether the differences in performance are significant to warrant the differences in dough. Might not be for many in new car comparison, but could be for CPO comparison. Was for me.

riez · January 2002

Happened to notice a one-page article in the new 2/02 issue of Motor Trend discussing "Pre Owned '97-'01 BMW 5 Series". Page 120. Sub-heading is "Still the textbook definition of 'midsized sport sedan." Focus is on '98s. They say there were few major problems. 528i had occasional failure of VANOS solenoid. Makes mention of need for front AND rear wheel alignments. Praises "bulletproof powertrains", suspension, and styling. Dislikes are cost, lack of interior cubby space, and "uhhh". I concur. Get CPO and ya gotta great used car, regardless of whether it is I-6 or V-8, manual or automatic.

jim52 · January 2002

Thanks for the info. How hard was it to get them down to 3K under MSRP? Do you think it was an end of year thing or are they just more aggressive than other NE dealers?

indylowflyer · January 2002

The big difference in the two engines is the 110 additional foot-pounds of torque the V-8 has over the 6 banger.

habitat1 · January 2002

riez: I am a 540i 6-speed owner, too (2000). As much as I would defend the honor of a 540i, it is not anywhere near the performance of an M5, no matter what the published 0-60 stats say. Anyone who has had the pleasure of driving an M5 knows that at 60-70 mph in 3rd (or 4th) gear, it will snap your head off if you hit the accelerator too hard. It will also stretch your jowls going around a corner - just make sure there is no water on the road.

I got the 540i 6-speed in 2000 because it offered a lot more performance than the 528i. If I were to make a purchase decision today, it would be much tougher. In fact, I would probably hold out if at all possible for the new 5-series to see how they "spread" the price performance trade-off. I have driven and ridden in a business associate's 2002 530i 5-speed and agree with the above comments that it is a lot closer to the 540i than used to be the case (of course, I don't admit that to him).

I strongly suggest to everyone trying to decide between 5-series models to extensively test drive them for yourself if possible. Car magazine "0-60" and 1/4 mile stats are mostly for window shoppers and wannabes that can't afford to actually buy the cars that they read about. Your own butt should be the determining factor. And, IMHO, there is no right or wrong 5-series choice. They are all top of their class cars.

brave1heart · January 2002

Shipo, your position on the 530 vs. the 540 reminds me a lot of my position on the 3-series board - remember those heated discussion we had last spring about whether it's worth to pay the price difference to upgrade from a 325 to a 330? It's all very subjective but to me, a 530 manual would be plenty of power for everyday spirited driving. If you get an auto (I know you never will) and/or have a lot of passengers/luggage in the car frequently, then the upgrade to the 540 would be worth it.

riez - I love the 5 to 13 scale - that's some creative stuff!! You should be working for an ad agency, especially with all the Superbowl commercials coming up

)

riez · January 2002

brave1heart... Guessing maybe you saw the movie "SPINAL TAP"? The 540iM does "go to eleven" on a 10 scale.

epn2... Maybe the M5 then takes it to the next dimension where Einsteins tread on a metaphysical astral plain? I'd love to take an M5 out for a spin. But am afraid I'd fall so much in love that I'd do a Thelma & Louise escape or sell house, wife, & kids to buy!

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