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BMW 5-Series Sedans

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Comments

  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    NycCarGuy has it right, no need for me to chime in.

    That said, I will add two provisos:

    1) DO NOT turn off the traction control system (unless you are in a parking lot with lots of room to spin), I turned mine off (on my 328i) while I was climbing a hill in heavy snow and the car immediately snapped into a spin, even though I was ready for it, I barely caught it in time to prevent a visit to the ditch.

    2) For the typical wimpy winters we have here in NJ, the standard issue All-Season rubber should be about perfect (IMHO), however, if you have the Sport Package, it is recommended that you drive something else in slippery conditions, or have other more appropriate tires mounted on your car for the winter months. Now, if we could just predict what a winter will be like, we would have known before hand that we should have mounted Snows for 1995/1996, All-Seasons for 2000/2001 and Z-Rated Summer tires for 2001/2002. ;-)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • john01john01 Member Posts: 246
    Typically it is through a dealer, but in Germany some of the dealers are owned by BMW AG, so it is actually "direct" purchase.

    Yes, I was referring to the US MSRP.
  • jwilson1jwilson1 Member Posts: 956
    On the other hand.......your kids are just about to enter a growth spurt that will leave both your grocery bill and your car intimidated and weak with their onslaught.

    I've just been through the assault. When the oldest was ten and the youngest was six, I decided on the best "enjoyable" car I could afford then -- (a Maxima) -- and lived with it all through teen years ... not wanting them to "learn" on a better car that we could then afford.

    Many time my wife and I both lamented that we didn't have a minivan (oh m'gawd) for the kids and their barbaric friends, their pizza and other foolishness. If I had it to do again, I would choose a minivan, one without leather, a cheaper, reliable one, and either buy a fun little car for my infrequent times alone, or just dig into a "fighting hole" to wait out the bombardment of adolescence. A 525 is fun, but not so much when you have six kids crowded in singing all your N'Sync favorites ----

    Don't get me wrong: it's mostly fun, but a real assault (like I said) on cars, and the food bill.

    Take care.
    Joe W.
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    Thanks for the advice on driving in the snow, even though it was not my question. I live near Chicago and am hoping to buy my buddies 2001 530 w/Sport Package. He lives in the south with no snow, so I guess I need snow tires up here. But since I drive 25K miles per year on the car, will the Sport Tires last, or should I dump them for highway tires? 70% of my driving is highway!
  • sanand5sanand5 Member Posts: 33
    Message #2361 states a lease deal that seems hard to believe. $530/mo $3000 down for a 540i.
    How can this be possible?

    What kind of lease deals are most people getting?
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    I just ordered a 530i, 5-Speed, PP, SP, Xenon, Premium Audio, last week. Total cash out of pocket is $2,540.58 (includes second, manditory, lease payment up front for ED), with each lease payment being $558.29.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo

    P.S.

    If you check message #2377, you will see that the 540i was pre-owned (briefly), and must have had a fairly substantial downstroke by the initial owner.
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Sport package tires will probably last 20-25k miles. You can buy harder all-seasons (usually cheaper than sport tires too) that'll last, oh, 30-45k miles (although some brands actually promise ridiculous lifetimes of 80k miles or so). But be aware your traction during spirited driving will decline noticeably. And I'm not just talking about racing; you'll hear your tires chirp and squeal much more often around turns. But, like you said, if most of your driving is on the highway, I'd just get the non-sport package and save the money (although, honestly, as awesome as my 530i is, I don't like driving it on the highway...way too boring and easy; I can almost hear the car complaining it's not really being challenged).
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    Am I nuts to even consider leasing a 530 when I drive 25K miles per year, or could they be figured in without costing me $1000.00 per month? The above payment $558 is great, but betting it is for 10K miles per year!
  • mlbmwmlbmw Member Posts: 11
    I got my 530iA with premium sound option, the DSP sound is pretty good, but when i count the speakers, i only can find 10 speakers, the manual say there are 12 speakers with premium sound.
    Does anyone can tell me where 11 and 12th speaker located.
    thanks for your advice.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Actually, it is for 12,000 per year. On my 328i, I opted for 15,000 and have only driven just under 12,000, so I have just wasted a fair amount of money. I was tempted to go for the 15,000 on the 530i (just in case), however, my salesman told me that if I called BMWFS six months before the end of the lease to tell them that I would be over, they would charge me $.16 per mile (as opposed to $.21 at the end of the lease) for the overage estimate, and then split it into sixths and add them to my last six payments.

    In your case, I would call your local dealership and find out how much BMWFS charges for each mile over 15,000 per year on a lease; my guess is that it is about $.15. If that is the case, your monthly payment will be about $710 for a car exactly like mine. That said, with your kind of driving, I would probably recommend against the SP, which could save you about $2,300 on the price of the car, and about $30.00 per month in lease payments.

    Good luck, let us know what you find out.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Actually, BMWFS charges $0.25/mile, not $0.15, which would mean 10,000 miles/year * 3 year lease x $0.25/mile = $7500 charged at end of lease.

    I would therefore recommend financing the car, or plan on buying it at lease termination.
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Three in each of the front doors, two in each of the rears, plus the two woofers in the trunk/rear headliner.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    This from the BMWFS web site:

    "You are responsible for excess wear and use. You are responsible for excess mileage charge of $0.25 per mile over the base mileage allowance in your Lease agreement for BMW 7 Series vehicles, and $0.20 per mile for all other BMW vehicles."

    That said, the "Excess" charges at the end of the lease are $.20, however, I was told that if you "Fess-Up" six months early, they will only charge you $.16, and then pro-rate it for you.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • jobiejobie Member Posts: 47
    FYI - I'm about to come off a 323 lease (into a 530i 5-sp) and took advantage of the reduced per mile rate. Ended up driving more for business than I expected. It was simple - called BMWFS and told them I wanted another 10K miles. My last six payments increased to cover the $1,600 plus tax. I think you only save about $0.01 per mile if you "pre-puchase" miles at lease inception. If you underestimate your mileage, you lose the $.
    Jim
  • ek5ek5 Member Posts: 33
    Thanks for the info...there is a good picture of the new 5 in this months Popular Mechanics. Seems much more coupe-y. Not a traditional sedan look. Definitely will avoid first year of redesign. Can't decide whether to get current 530 or wait - but 2 years is such a long time!!
  • christophers1christophers1 Member Posts: 18
    This lease is for a automatic 530 with cold weather, premiumpkg, and xenon.

    acq fee 725
    doc fee 389
    price 44320
    msrp 45770
    money factor .00275
    tax rate 3.0
    tot due at signing 1171.

    payments 712.52

    This seems like a bad deal compared to others that I have seen on this board. Yes?

    Thanks for opinions in advance.
  • jim52jim52 Member Posts: 161
    Sounds like a bad deal. BMW Finance's acquisition fee is $525. I don't think this should vary by location so it appears that there may be some markup there. Also, if you apply for credit prior to the end of the month, the base money factor should be .00205 (assuming you have good credit). It again looks like they are marking this up. The extra .0007 probably equates to roughly 1,700 to 1,800 additional purchase price on the car.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Ouch! That looks like a lot of money. Posted below is a snippet of an analysis I just did for some ED - Residual calculations for a different discussion, you might find it enlightening:



    As for residuals on ED cars, you actually calculate what ever the going rate is on a US MSRP car (currently about 60%) and that is the residual of your ED car. That is one reason why leasing a car obtained through the ED program IS a good deal. Consider the following:

    The 530i that I just ordered via ED has an MSRP of: $47,395.
    The residual for that 530i (at 60%) is: $28,437
    The negotiated ED price for that 530i is: $42,180
    The effective ED residual works out to be: 67.4% (28437 / 42180)

    Looked at another way, the monthly lease payment for the following deals are as follows (assuming no other taxes and such):

    $47,395 (60% residual-$28,437): $686.68 (U.S. MSRP 530i)
    $42,180 (67% residual-$28,437): $530.38 (ED + 1500 530i)
    $42,180 (60% residual-$25,308): $611.12 (U.S. MSRP 330xi)

    Interesting to see that a 330xi leased for the same CAP cost as my ED 530i will cost about $79 per month more than my 530i.



    In other words, you might want to consider an ED car yourself and take a quick trip to Germany.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • christophers1christophers1 Member Posts: 18
    This is turning into an undesirable transaction. I hope this doesn't get too long winded.

    Early this month my wife desired a new car to replace a car given through her job. We went straight to Hendricks BMW Charlotte. We first went to the CPO section and found a 2000 528 with plenty of options. They quoted us a price in writing for 41,920, fortunately we weren't prepared to buy.
    The next day I looked on their website to see if they might have a picture of the car and to my surprise it was priced at 39995. I immediately wrote a letter and received one back telling me that it was a new trade in and wasn't listed on the internet. FUNNY that they would have two blue 2000 528 BMW with 13,187 miles on their lot! In the letter was an apology and a hope that this would not effect our relationship.

    So this time I returned to look at a new 525, but the only blue one they had was a 530, with which I posted their leasing figures. After recalculating their totals it appears they pulled the dyslexia card on me by switching the 4 and the 3 on the price, inflating it by 1,100 dollars. Honest mistake or a dirty cheating b.......d mistake.

    The only bad part is there are no other BMW dealers in Charlotte. And this car group owns the Mercedes, Acura, and others. And I hate to think this is who service my vehicle.

    Just my story but it appears to me they may be crooks!
  • musafirmusafir Member Posts: 27
    I am taking ED of my car in July, however, the dealership has asked for power of attorney to do the necessary paperwork. Is this unusal or actual practice. My lease for 530Ia is 577/mo.(15K/yr) PP, Xenon, DSP, lumbar, CP, Heated steering.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Yes, power of attorney is a normal procedure for ED. They need it to arrange for your temporary plates and insurance in Europe.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    You might want to consider Passport BMW in Marlow Heights, Maryland (about 400 miles from Charlotte). A salesman there Joern Essen (sp?) has basically a standing offer of any BMW via ED for $1,400 over ED invoice. A number of folks here at Edmunds have bought cars from him and every one of them have nothing but good things to say about how Joern treated them.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • 530bmw530bmw Member Posts: 130
    thanks again for the info.
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    My only advice to you on a 528 is this - even with a Sport Package and mileage below 20,000, you should be able to find one for around 34-36K, 37,000 at the most!! I have been looking for the right one, and balancing between finding one or a 2001 530, and those are the prices I am seeing for a 2000 528!!
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    Shipo - thanks for the analysis! Some good stuff. So are you telling me that for a ED BMW 530 -I have to personally fly to Germany, pick up the car, get it on a boat, and pay for transport to the Easy Coast, and than drive it to the midwest where I live? I think that is what you are saying, but not sure. How much will this cost me? Or will my local BMW dealer - or Passport BMW figure it out for me and help arrange it!!

    Seriously, I do not know the answer!!
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Well, sort of. You can order it from Passport (or any dealer closer that has a price acceptable to you), fly to Germany, pick the car up and drive it across town to E. H. Harms (which is a shipping company, however, Munich is not at a port, so the car is move to a port (trucked to Bremerhaven?) and then shipped back here to the ordering dealership. All of the above is covered under the ED program, you pay nothing extra. One of our TownHall members from Texas last year ordered a car from Passport, and Joern arranged to have it trucked to Texas from Maryland for an extra $350 or so.

    In my case, I simply called around and asked “Will you take a deal for an ED car for $1,500 over ED invoice?” One said yes, the rest is history.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    Did you $1500 over invoice include the $250 MACO fee or is that extra?

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    I paid $1,500 plus a $200 MACO.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • colt007colt007 Member Posts: 64
    The 530i we ordered is at the dealer. We're picking it up tomorrow. Wanted to pick up today but there's a rain/light snow mix predicted (in NY/NJ)& I wanted a dry track for the first ride home (i.e sport package). MACO, DOC, AD fees? What other fees could I expect?

    Colt
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    Rustproofing, Undercoating, Finder's Fee, Dealer Prep-Fee DOB (Dealership Owner's Boat) Fee, Picking the car up on a Thursday Fee, Extended maintenance contract, Extended Warranty...

    In all seriousness, I believe you'll be paying MACO (Which is the Ad Fee), $20 Documentation fee (It's Bull Salt, but the dealer charges this to you for the secreatry typing up the contract), $5XX Aquisition Fee (Or Bank Fee, which is also Bull Salt because it is a fee for some guy at the bank to puch a button) if you're leasing or financing. And I think that's it.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    Tax, Title, Liscense, & Registration Fees

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • colt007colt007 Member Posts: 64
    The one fee I've already seen (& had me blowin my top) was the documentation fee. These guys want $180 for it. Tax, title, license, Reg - I can deal with...its the few you started out with that will make me crazy. Did I read on this site that someone extended the maintenance contract for $399? Do I dare ask how much is the extended Warranty?
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    I was just kidding about the extended maintenance contract and extendede warranty...It was on an episode of Seinfeld the other night. Hilarious. $180 for a Doc fee is a bit excessive (about $160 too excessive).

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • colt007colt007 Member Posts: 64
    a little chop bustin uh? that's cool. Everytime I hear one of these dealer 'fees' it sounds like their bustin my chops! I can't see you profile right now...r u in Rockland Cty also?

    Colt
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    In New City (Rockland County) and my parents still live there. I live in the city now, but go up to New City every 1-2 weeks. Are you getting your car from Wide World of Cars? Who was your client advisor (Read: Salesman)? Congrats on your new BMW 530! You'll be amazed at how much better a car it is than your 300M.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • pvartpvart Member Posts: 2
    I'm currently looking at a 2002 530ia. However the newly designed 5-series is supposedly due out later this year. Does anyone have a feel for how much of a hit the 2002's will take in value once the new design is released?
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    The next generation 5 series isn't due out until next year (2003) as a 2004 model (That's the rumor flying around this week anyway). A body change will certainly make the '02 depreciate more. If you're concerned about residual value, then why not lease? A lease guarantees the car will only depreciate so much (I believe currently a 5 series is worth 60% of its value after 3 years).

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • pvartpvart Member Posts: 2
    I'm currently looking at a 2002 530ia. However the newly designed 5-series is supposedly due out later this year. Does anyone have a feel for how much of a hit the 2002's will take in value once the new design is released?
  • colt007colt007 Member Posts: 64
    ah, New City, a fine town. I'm in Hillcrest since 1995. Went to Wide World with intentions of buying from them. They didn't have 1 530i I could test drive. Said they would call back. 8 days later, they had a 530i in we could test drive. Wife got bad vibes from salseman & dealer. We went to Prestige on Rt 17 in NJ. Nice operation. Dealt with Nick D? (can't remember the rest of his name). Thanks for the congrats. The 300M is nice, but the 5 is in another class.

    Colt
  • multiplechoicemultiplechoice Member Posts: 113
    Can someone give me info. where I can get the ED invoice prices, also what is the typical wait time between ordering and delivery? Thanks.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    To say that I am less than enamored with the currently available pictures of the new 5-Series is a bit of an understatement, it seems that (former?) BMW designer Chris Bangle (the designer of the new 7-Series, which only a mother could love), has “Bangleised” the new 5er as well. In fact, I dislike what I have seen of the new 5-Series so much, that (among other reasons), I decided to turn in (at lease end, last of April) my perfectly serviceable 1999 328i with only 36,000 miles, so that I could make sure of getting one of the last of the current crop of 5-Series cars. Let me take it one step further; I would not be half surprised to see the resale value of the E39 5-Series car actually go UP when the new E60 is released.

    IMHO, BMW had better do some fast cosmetic work on the new 5er, or their market niche may be all but completely wiped out by their competitors. All this from a BIG fan of BMW. OUCH!

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    If you go to www.eurobuyers.com, and click on the "Revised 2002 5-Series Price List", you will find a three page PDF, where page one is all MSRP prices of the full lineup of 5-Series cars, page two is the invoice price list for the same and page three is a grid of package availability.

    As for the delivery latency between order and delivery, that actually depends on who you order from. In my case, I ordered a 530i last week Tuesday for delivery on 17-April-2002 in Munich. My dealership was able to swap one of their currently allocated cars (and as yet unsold) for my ED delivery in exchange for an ED allocated car from a month or two down the road.

    Put a simpler way, if you need it in less than 90-120 days, you will need to find a dealership that has vehicles going into production that have not yet been sold so the swap can be performed.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • multiplechoicemultiplechoice Member Posts: 113
    Thanks Shipo,

    I'm ending my lease in May, looking a various vehicles. ED has sparked my interest in BMWs again. I am looking at the 540ia with s/p, cold weather, sunshade, prem. sound. MSRP 57,020--I'm looking at 36mo/15k, could you guess what the lease payment would be? How difficult would it be to work with your dealership (I'm in CA). Thanks!
  • christophers1christophers1 Member Posts: 18
    Now they new deal is invoice 41920 + 1500 = 43420
    They lowered the acq fee to 525
    Still have a doc fee of 389
    Have changed the MF to .00205 after calling to lower to .00260.
    I believe I will put up the money for the 9 security deposits to buy it down to .00115.
    How much should this cost 9x550? Then the lease payment will be 561/mth.

    Respond asap, they want to do it before end of business.
    Thanks for everybodys help.
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    I am test driving a 2000 Silver 528 w/Stick and Sport Package tomorrow! 17,000 miles certified and they are asking $37,500!!! Any thoughts on the manual. Have not driven one in 10 years regularly, but realize how they add to the feel and thrill of the drive. I am concerned with cell phone use and shifting, etc.....I may be leaning towards the same specs if it was Steptronic!! Should I assume the stick in a BMW is rock solid and will last to 100K and beyond!!
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Assuming that this is a new car AND that you have confirmed that the "Invoice" price they are showing you are correct, it sounds like a "Fair" deal for all parties.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    The price sounds high, I just ran a TMV on a 2000 528i, 5-Speed, Leather Seats, SP, Metallic Paint and a Moonroof, the price came out to about $32,000, so, unless there is more equipment on the car, that is a bad price.

    As far as living with the 5-Speed on a daily basis, trust me, you will get so used to it that you hardly realize that you are shifting. Make sure that you get a phone with a "Hands Free" option and a "PTA" (Press To Answer) button on the cord somewhere. I use one all of the time, and it is briliant.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Hmmmm, $57,020, I only come up with $56,520. Did you mean to include Xenon Headlights as well? If so, then the $57,020 numbers works.

    I did also happen to notice that if you include the SP on a 540iA, Uncle Sam dings you for $1,300 for a "Gas Guzzler Tax".

    I will do the calculation based upon the car with Xenon and SP, and we will soon see what the number is.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Oops! Xenon Headlights are standard on the 540iA, so, I am at a loss as to where the extra $500 comes from.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • patellipatelli Member Posts: 24
    multiplechoice, i'm in southern ca and just orderd an ED 530i for $1,200 over invoice from Long Beach BMW. He said he'd extend the offer to anyone i referred to him. remember there is no MACO or training on ED.

    contact:
    Tony Lage
    Long Beach BMW
    800-794-4269

    Be sure to tell him ehstone@patelli.com sent you.

    Best of luck to you,
    Patelli
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