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BMW 5-Series Sedans

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Comments

  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Good day everyone!
  • vishnu11vishnu11 Member Posts: 59
    Thanks for the info...
    Check out your post #2580 (and congrats on snagging #3000):

    #2580 of 2583 RE: Transport Question by mcq7159 by snagiel Mar 06, 2002 (06:33 am)

    The boats leave every few days, on average, and the journey takes about a week. After that, figure in another couple weeks for processing at VPC, transport to dealer, and final dealer prep.

    But the Owner's Circle lags behind true status and lacks precise information. You can call 800-831-1117, choose option 3, and have your production number or VIN ready. They can usually tell you more accurately what the shipping status is, as well as provide a good estimated delivery date.

    Now take a deep breath and relax...

    I did file that away - it works of course, but the chaps at BMWNA told me it was "Status 190" like that's supposed to mean a lot to me. When asked, they said that it meant its on a train from the factory to port of shipping. That's obviously inaccurate because on an ED delivery, it goes to the delivery center first and then trucked from one shipping point to the other...friggin' computers...;-)

    Vishnu.
  • zubazuba Member Posts: 58
    Friend of a friend can get me into a BMW Auction - preview the car, check out specs, drive it, etc...

    My question is: Does buying a BMW at the auction null/void the 36,000 maintenance warranty that gets you the free oil changes, etc....

    I know the manuf. warrranty still applies!
    Thanks in advance!
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    I suppose that, since the period after you deposit your ED car, it's in a process not easily categorized given the "traditional" delivery procedure, as far as the order tracking statuses are concerned.

    It's too bad they can't improve the inventory tracking; When I went through the Spartanburg Delivery, I was impressed with the system they had in place at the plant there (where they manufacture the Z3 and X5 models). Every single car, as soon as its chassis is fabricated, is fitted with a homing device placed in lieu of the BMW roundel on the hood (which is symbolically affixed when everything else is done and it's earned the BMW logo). Within the plant, they can track every single car, and determine instantly whether it's in the paint-shop, the suspension's being fitted, fluids are being added, etc. Wouldn't it be cool if you could get that level of granularity in the tracking tool? I suspect there'd be an awful lot of people who's productivity at the office would drop dramatically after placing an order... :)
  • vishnu11vishnu11 Member Posts: 59
    The inventory tracking *in* the factory is exactly as you mention. I did the factory tour in Munich and they showed us this grey box that fits to the chassis and the "car" can be followed through its buildup incrementally and accurately. Pretty impressive, but obvious. After all, no better way of tracking the car than for it to broadcast its scanner code. I suppose this box is taken out after the car leaves the QA section (if not, do we have privacy issues?)

    The problem with lack of data comes outside the factory. Now its the job of suppliers/partners and customer-service agents etc etc and the information that they input and that is available to the owner is very limited. Who knows what the rationalization of this obscurity of information is! Or if there is any information at all.

    Re: productivity, mine dropped as soon as I took delivery of the car. I have been pacing endlessly like a caged animal since coming back from Germany..:-) I'm driving my wife nuts...

    Maybe I'll place a call the Harms office in Munich and see how things are going...:-)
  • joseph40joseph40 Member Posts: 17
    Pap5, Beewang, Shipo, and others,

    Thanks for the input and helpful advice on my upcoming ED. I am looking forward to it. One more question. How can I get European navigation disks? Does BMW "loan" them to you while you are there? :)) Thanks again.
  • pap5pap5 Member Posts: 144
    Yes, the wait is excruciating. Dropped the car off in Paris July 13, picked it up stateside Aug. 31. Look at the positive side -- you get the thrill of delivery all over again. In my case, it was also an opportunity for a second shakedown, this time solo. Picked up the car in the Milwaukee area (diverted there on the way home from business trip to Denver, so flight was no cost to me), then spent the next 1.5 days driving back home to the D.C. area. Even though it was on U.S. roads this time (speed limits incl. tiptoing thru Ohio, unconcious U.S. drivers, etc.) it was still a great trip. Got to bond with the car again, and even found the time to stop at the USAF Museum at Wright-Pat.

    On an unrelated but vital topic: GO TERPS!! (UMD class of '72)
  • pap5pap5 Member Posts: 144
    I've read here and on the 3 board that high oil use is not unusual for a new engine. What about the opposite? After 8,500+ miles, there is no discernable oil use, at least as far as I can read the dipstick. Is this unusual?
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    You're complaining about NOT losing oil?! :)

    Don't sweat it; a little oil burnup (1-2 quarts after 3-5k miles or so) in a new BMW engine is normal, but it should taper off after that. By 8k miles, I'd be concerned if I WAS loosing oil...
  • pap5pap5 Member Posts: 144
    No complaint, just curious. If early oil consumption is the norm, what would account for absolutely NO oil burned off by 8,500 miles? Unless the dealer that took stateside delivery, or the local dealer that did the fan recall, topped it off as a courtesy.
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    I'm not an expert with metallurgy, oil viscosity, or any other pertinent issue which affects oil burnoff during engine break-in. Perhaps you just broke it in gingerly. I wouldn't worry about it.
  • chesdin4chesdin4 Member Posts: 22
    Same here: my '01 530 has 8500 miles after 11 months and hasn't used a drop of oil. And I know 7000 of those miles passed with nobody else checking under the hood...!
  • swyattswyatt Member Posts: 1
    I am considering the purchase of a 97 or 98 540 manual with about 40-50k miles. Will I be looking at replacing a clutch anytime in this vehicle? If so, anyone know the approx. cost?

    If anyone has one for sale in the surrounding NC states, send me an email at scottiewyatt@yahoo.com
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Clutch life is heavily dependent on driving style, so its lifetime can easily range from 30k to 100k+ miles (for those who drive extremely gingerly, which is damn near impossible in the 540i6). You can usually start to detect a slipping clutch well in advance, so if you sense any slipping at all--especially when accelerating hard--expect you'll have to replact it in the forseable future. If you go to the dealer and have a clutch/flywheel replaced, it'll probably be $1200-1500. But I've read from several who've ordered the parts from volume BMW parts dealers (like Pacific of Circle BMW) for around $500, and had a local quality BMW technician (not at the dealer) install for around $300 or so.
  • alcardsalcards Member Posts: 10
    OK, so a bimmer is "the ultimate driving machine" etc. We've had no new posts for a couple of days, so maybe some controversy will bring the board back to life. Here are some opinions, not necessarily facts: 1) Learning to drive a stick first, will make a teen not just "cooler" than his peers but also a better, more attentive driver with a skill that may come quite handy some day. All families should change their automatic cars when Jr. gets of age. 2)Real "drivers" prefer the intimate control and man-machine interaction of a stick, provided they were fortunate to learn early in life. 3) Anyone can learn to operate a manual transmission competently, but if you start late, it will always feel as extra work and you will in time revert back to auto. 4) Driving is a pleasure, at its maximum when operating a powerful, nimble car with manual transmission in winding mountain roads. Auto drivers don't even know what they are missing. 4) Europeans think that americans are pampered and lazy for driving automatics while eating and drinking. 5)The bad habits of auto drivers can be so extreme as to include braking with the left foot and riding the brake. 6)It is the availability of stick shift in luxury, high performance cars that has endeared BMW to so many of us (the cool drivers of America).
    Well, I could go on and on but this is enough for now. What about it?
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    Indeed, it's nice someone finally posted! What can I say, I'm either too lazy or uncreative to come up with a topic...

    Anyhow, I agree with all of your points except the first. When first learning to drive, I think a 16-year-old should focus on the rules of the road. Mastering how to apply throttle, braking, and steering inputs is something most adults/experienced drivers don't do as well as possible, and I think the clutch/stick makes learning to drive that much more complicated. I agree, though, that once a young driver has mastered those first skills, teaching them to drive stick is advantageous. I wish my Dad had let me get a stick back then! I had to wait until I bought my Passat four years ago to learn...which I did the day I picked up the car. I've never looked back on automatics.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,410
    I think it is better to teach your child to drive on both a stick and automatic car. Have him or her take the driving test in the automatic car. Make sure their 1st car is a manual transmission.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • rlowrierlowrie Member Posts: 30
    Please help me clarify something. I like to use the various on-line car building sites where you virtually build the car. On some (like BMW) they let me add Nav and Premium stereo while on others if I pick Nav it excludes the premium stereo choice. When I get my head out of this virtual world and actually go in to order my car (which I have finally decised to do! 540i) is the premium stereo available with Nav or not? BTW- I am ordering automatic- my apologies to the previous posters!
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Here is the deal:

    Combinations that are allowable:
    Premium Audio & In-Dash CD
    Premium Audio & Cassette
    Premium Audio & Cassette & Navigation
    Standard Audio & In-Dash CD
    Standard Audio & Cassette
    Standard Audio & Cassette & Navigation

    Combinations that are NOT allowable:
    Premium Audio & In-Dash CD & Navigation
    Standard Audio & In-Dash CD & Navigation

    Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • chrism124chrism124 Member Posts: 134
    rlowrie, the DSP Sound upgrade can be ordered whether or not the 5-series has the Nav.

    Before ordering the upgrade, I would check to see if the dealer has a car with this option for you to demo. If you consider yourself an audiophile, then it is not worth the $1200 (cost of the DSP). While the sound quality is an improvement over the stock system there is still plenty room for improvement. I do have this option in my 02 530ia. If I was ordering another 5-series, it would be a coin-toss as to whether I would include it again.

    I now have 1200 miles on my car after two months of ownership. At this point the experience has been great. However I would change two things. First I should have gone with a manual transmission. The Steptronic is nice and smooth shifting but I do not have the full control as I would if it was a manual. Also I would have added the Sport Pkg. I noticed some of the limits of the standard setup during a recent coastal drive.

    A little side note regarding the E60. The latest issue of Roundel hinted that the iDrive will be a standard feature for the next 5-series. Apparently there would be significant expense in the manufacturing of two dash panels. One for the iDrive, and one without it. I hope the dash does not resemble the one used in the new 7-series. I prefer the cockpit design of the current 5.

    Chris
  • hnnhnn Member Posts: 34
    Does anyone know the strange behavior of this light indicator?
    My 2002 530i (3 months old) had the "Sevice engine soon" light stayed on for a couple times and disappeared when I drove around town. I noticed that at one instant, the message "check filler cap" flashing in the main display. I parked the car, removed the cap and put it back on but the "service engine soon" light was still on after I re-started the engine. It is off now but I am just curious if anyone seen this? otherwise I will talk to the dealer. Thanks. Hnn
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    According to a small Motor Trend "Spied" article in the May 2002 issue, the next generation 5 Series will be a model year 2004. Says base engine will be a 3.5L I-6 with 4.5L V-8 optional. Mentions 5.0L V-10 for future M5. Doesn't give any dates for introduction but there is a spy photo. If a MY '04, then likely fall of 2003 introduction. That is a long way off, but will be here sooner than we think! :)
  • laysmackdownlaysmackdown Member Posts: 19
    Check out the GS Forum at the end of the discussion (Hollywood Extra link!)! WOW! That's all I can say is WOW! WOW! A stunner! The 5-Series better......it better be a lot better than the current one, because it's days might be numbered! The Germans are running, the Germans are running! The Lexus Magic Show continues.....
  • alcardsalcards Member Posts: 10
    Snagiel, you are not lazy. You drive a manual tranny and post a lot of useful info. Your comment about teen learning is arguable but there is enormous logic to it, so I'll agree, an auto transmission only at the beginning is another valid way to introduce young people to the world of motor vehicles. NYccarguy makes a critical comment: if you help a kid with the purchase of a first car, make it a condition that it must be a stick shift.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    I went...
    I saw...
    I yawned...

    No thanks.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • chrism124chrism124 Member Posts: 134
    I agree with Shipo. I was not impressed. The 5-series still has the best blend of performance, luxury and styling.

    Chris
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    It looks like the new Altima to me..
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    hnn... BMW CCA magazine Roundel has had some articles and letters on this subject. They point out that due to OBD II, etc. you have to be careful when fuelling. Believe they recommend ensuring key is in the off position, then removing it. Do NOT fuel with key in ignition. Make sure not to overfill or allow to overflow. And make sure that cap is tightened properly.

    First time my wife fuelled her '00 323iA she kept key in ignition in ON position so she could run CD player while fuelling. Sure enough, Service Engine Light came on. It went off after I refuelled the car as per the instructions. And since I do it that way for both her's and my '98 540i6, the light has never come back on!
  • vishnu11vishnu11 Member Posts: 59
    Chrism124, rlowrie:

    I had the hardest time trying to decide whether the DSP is worth it, and in the end took it. Here's why:

    (a) The DSP comes with an upgraded amp, upgraded speakers and two extra speakers. Not that the upgrades are the greatest stuff on earth, but they are a considerable improvement over the base audio (which plain sucks). The power of the DSP system is adequate for the 5-series, but lacking for the old 7-series.

    (b) The DSP comes with a 5-band equalizer. All else being equal, an equalizer dramatically improves the perception of music quality. A 5-band equalizer is a decent start. Most upgraded car audios only have 3-band equalizers.

    (c) I am not the die-hard audiophile who will upgrade speakers/amp etc. In fact, if you want to upgrade your speakers and amp, you are better off NOT taking the DSP because the DSP is run on a digital bus, and your choices of aftermarket speakers and amps are considerably limited (as is the expertise) if DSP is already installed.

    Hope this helps.

    Vishnu
  • pap5pap5 Member Posts: 144
    Alcards, thanks for jump-starting things here - the 3 series board continues to be 5:1 more prolific than the 5 series. I agree that enthusiasts will prefer a manual trnasmission over an automatic. I also agree with Snagiel that concentrating on the basics of learning to drive is important, then learning to drive a stick can follow as Lesson II for the motivated. I started seriously learning how to negotiate a manual in much the same way as you, Snagiel -- while driving my "new" Triumph TR-4 home after handing a check to its previous owner.

    I wonder, however, if learning to drive a stick will improve the skills of mediocre drivers by making them more attuned to the whole driving experience, or just overload them more? There are too many drivers around who barely seem able to steer down the road (usually slowly, in the left lane) without overtaxing themselves.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    stick vs auto - it's a real personal thing. I drove a stick for 12 years. Now on the east coast in NY traffic jams...who needs it. I can still enjoy the benefits of a performance/luxury sedan without putting my foot on the clutch every 2 seconds. To each their own on this one.

    Ken
  • laysmackdownlaysmackdown Member Posts: 19
    who can't be objective for two minutes! Want to "yawn", look at the design of the current 5. Consider yourself warned, and unable to admit something wicked this way comes......
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    LOL..I happen to think to the 5 series is one of the most gorgeous cars in the world. The Porsche Carrera is another one. That Lexus doesn't do it for me. I thought the 5 was gorgeous even before I owned my first BMW. There have been posts in the G35 forum as well to the effect that BMW is now on notice. Whatever my next car is, I'm happy for competition, because it keeps everybody on their toes. Lexus makes a fine line of reliable and performance oriented automobiles, but there was a reason I got the BMW 330i vs the GS300 for example. I could have gotten the 5 but I really wanted the 3. Whatever BMW comes up with, you can be sure it will be a winner in the next couple of model years in terms of looks, style and performance. But that is why there is vanilla and choclate and strawberry plus 100's of other flavors. There are enough flavors and cars for everybody. Not every BMW will blow the doors off of every car, but there is something about driving one that is magical..to say the least.
  • laysmackdownlaysmackdown Member Posts: 19
    But the current 5 couldn't be anymore boring to my eyes. I like a bold, aggressive sport sedan. In dynamics AND style. The 3-series is starting to go down this same road of ho-hum styling. The design is still strong, but the front end definitely lost something with it's recent facelift. I give Lexus credit for boldness. Who said they were too conservative?
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    You raise an interesting theory with regard to the stick: whether it would force poor drivers to concentrate more and hence make them safer. It seems to me "poor" drivers--who seem to occupy nine out of every ten cars--fall into three categories:

    -First are those who, irregardless of their skill, are distracted by food, newspapers, books (yes, I've seen this), makeup, shaving, drinks, cell phones, other passengers, inebriation, and about 30 other possibilities.

    -Second are those who lack either good driving skills--I'm talking fundamentals, not Mario Andretti reflexes--or a good understanding of traffic rules and signs.

    -Third are the ones who see yellow lights as an invitation to speed up, a stop sign as a suggestion, and 55mph signs as "yeah right." Basically, those who drive extremely aggressively.

    I suspect a stick would help the first group, since it would dissuade them from fidgeting with whatever is distracting them. But it may overwhelm those in the second group who are genuinely unskilled drivers. And I suspect it would make those in the third group either more aggressive, distract them, or otherwise lead to an accident sooner.

    Since I don't know the proportions between the groups, it's hard to say if everyone driving manuals--hypothetically, of course--would make people safer drivers.

    At the end of the day, the safest driver is the most alert, responsible, and knowledgable one. To that end, it would benefit everyone to attend a good driving clinic like the one BMW sponsors in various cities. There, even good drivers are taught new things, and poor drivers are awakened to new important skills.
  • cmr530icmr530i Member Posts: 278
    The 5 has such classy styling. The shot of the Toyota...oh I mean Lexus 2004 GS looks like it will be dated fast.
  • div2div2 Member Posts: 2,580
    Funny how the Lexyota lovers love to troll the BMW/Benz boards to tell us how great their cars are- think they're trying to convince themselves???
  • philipnowphilipnow Member Posts: 24
    My friend who has a 740i just loaned me The Hire DVD. I liked The Star best. The problem is they just made me want to get a 540 now! I've been wanting to wait and see what the new 5's like.

    Has anyone heard if the new 5 is going to have the SMG as an option?

    I looked at the link of the 2004 Lexus GS430 and am completely unimpressed. Not even in the same league as the 5 series.
  • dl7265dl7265 Member Posts: 1,381
    was excited they have 2000 post now lol
  • vishnu11vishnu11 Member Posts: 59
    Quit trolling dude. People - please ignore laysmackdown's bait.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    For the record, I don't own a BMW. I almost replaced my Maxima with a 5-series last fall, but got an S2000 instead.

    I did, however, drive the heck out of everything out there, including the GS430. Personally, I don't care how good Lexus looks, they are not even in the same league as BMW in terms of driving "dynamics". If it's bold aggressive looks you want, go for it. Perhaps a Buick GS or Monte Carlo would be good for you. But without a major engineering and priority overhaul, there is no way that Lexus can compete with BMW as the serious driving enthusaist's car of choice. Heck, the only thing they even offer with a stick in is their boy toy looking IS300.

    The LS430 might be giving the E430 and S430 a run for their money, but I don't see anything coming out of Lexus that could seriously be labeled "a driver's car" to compete with the 5-serious. Looks are only skin deep.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    Nah...he's not trolling. He is exersizing his privilege of posting respectful dissenting opinions. :)
  • rlowrierlowrie Member Posts: 30
    Prior to going to one of the local dealers to work out a deal on a 540i I am planning to lease (and do European Delivery) I used the Lease Wizaed program and got some non BMWFS live quotes. The 36 month 15k miles quotes from 3 lenders were similar with a residual of 56% and a money factor of .0029. Is this similar to what I could expect from BMWFS?
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    I think that BMWFS is more in the neighborhood of 59% residual for 15K/yr and .00210 for the money factor. You might want to scan some of the recent posts over on the "Finance/Warranty/Insurance" - "Lease Questions - Ask Here" topic, if I remember correctly somebody just asked for the very information that you are seeking within the last week or so.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • snagielsnagiel Member Posts: 750
    I doubt the new 5 will have SMG as an option (aside from the eventual M5); from what I've read, BMW execs have expressed privately it'll be reserved for the M cars (but I wouldn't be surprised if it shows up in other high-end models, such as the Z8).
  • rlowrierlowrie Member Posts: 30
    Thanks for all the great info and both the on-board and email help members of this board have provided. I am going to be heading to a dealer in the next week or two (when I find the time and I can sneak out on my wife!) and make a deal on a 540i. This board has provided much needed ammuniation and conformation othat I am making a great choice and will likely get a good deal. I started this process many months age by lurking the various boards (i.e. MB, Jag, Lexus, BMW) not sure of what I was looking for. I have driven all now and clearly love the BMW. This has been enhaced by the fact that almost every day I can look forward to multiple insightful and helpful posts on this board whereas the other "competing" boards are good for only a few a day, if that. This indicates that a real passion exists with the BMW owners that just isn't there with the others. Again, thanks for all the help.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Welcome to the club. ;-)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • bluebeastbluebeast Member Posts: 258
    People are not always posting just to give a certain msg board a bunch of grief. I for one enjoy a variety of cars and like to read as much as I can and also share my experiences. In this case I have a 98 GS300 after trading in my 97 528 and a 96 LS400 after trading in my 95 M3. I love the styling of both the Lexus and the BMW, with the M3 being my favorite. I agree that the handling of the BMW is better than anything Lexus has to offer. I decided to get rid of the BMW's when I got to know every person in the service department. In 1 year I had the 528 in the shop almost twice a month for something. Got tired of it (wifes car). The M3 was not near as bad, but the last straw was when they could not figure out why the car would just stop running when you would be going 40-55mph. I miss how fun they were to drive and still think about getting a 540 6spd, but the realiability issue still lingers in my mind.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    My understanding (from reading many sources) was that the first year E39 5-Series had more than its fair share of problems, which were apparently worked out by 1999 (if not 1998). On the other hand, my first year E46 328i has been such a model of reliability that it would be the envy of any Japanese company, I guess that BMW learned their lesson on the E39, unfortunately, that was the car that you wound up with.

    Now in its seventh year of production (6 model years, the 1997 was released in early 1996), the E39 has evolved into a car that can run with the "Best of Breed" reliablility wise, from anywhere in the world.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • hnnhnn Member Posts: 34
    Riez, thanks for the tip. Hnn
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