BMW 5-Series Sedans

habitat1 · February 2003

I am impressed that the car seats fit.

Getting a great deal on a 530i to go along with triplets - not sure life gets much better than that! Congratulations and enjoy all of your new babies!

dzuba · February 2003

That is the car I am looking for as well.
What other packages did it have, Manual/Auto or CWP, Xenons, and can you let us know what you paid?

I am betting you paid 36K! Thanks

Man, I am jealous. I am moving into a new home in 4 weeks, and once settled - the car is next. But I want it now! Several times I have come close to pulling the trigger - but common sense tells me to get the house situated first.

ksqrd · February 2003

Again, the 3 seats were very tight, but possible to safely install. It took me a lot of shuffling to get the bases sitting tightly, and it's not something I'd want to do on a daily basis, so I'm glad we do have another car to serve as the primary baby transporter. Fortunately, the seats snap into the carriers quite easily once the bases are in.

Dzuba: The car had Xenons/Steptronic/Sport/Premium/Convenience packages/Single CD. Also, it was a late 2001 (8/01) which meant more free maintenance, as well as a longer original and CPO warranty than some others. The dealer asked 36,993, and I got them to accept 36,500 with a new factory CD changer installed at that price. Given that I was told that the changer would be $795+, you could say I paid just under $36K. Did I do OK?

It's Electric Red/Sand with a spoiler, and I think that made it a bit tougher to move quickly since most people want a more conservative look. We weren't looking for such a cop magnet, but we liked the look (save the spoiler, which is a bit unnecessary) so it wasn't a tough call.

2.5 hours 'til I pick the car up, but who's counting?

carnaught · February 2003

Car sounds awesome and deal good...enjoy!

chaseag · February 2003

I need a little help about tires.
I own a 525, sport pkg. with 235/45R 17 ContiSportcontact tires. I have 20,000 miles on them.
They generally seem to be good tires except they have developed a loud humming noise at 20-30 mph.
Speeds higher then that and the tires are quiet.
I rotated the tires at 15,000 miles and that seemed to start the problem. The noise is driving me crazy.
Does anyone have suggestions or recommendations on tires that are quiet and long lasting?
The car is not driven hard.
chaseag

riez · February 2003

chaseag... You should check out some of the various publications. EuropeanCar, Consumer Reports, etc. that have reported on tires.

Seems like more and more people are complaining about tire noise. Seems to be the price paid for ever higher levels of performance.

My '98 540i6 has developed tire noise issue. Yokohama AVS Decibels. They have around 20,000 miles. Me, I just turn up the radio. They still have tread life. Can't see spending $500-1,000 right now over noise. I'll let it go about another 10,000 miles.

george94 · February 2003

good luck with your car. I just put my order in yesterday for topaz blue 530i. I went for the 5 sp with SP and PP. Apparently it takes in between 6 - 8 weeks to deliver. I don't mind it since we are having a tough winter here, in Boston. Buying snow tires is the last thing I wanted to do at this point. I will save it for the next year. Meanwhile, can you, guys, give me some hints what to expect from a new BMW? Is there any break in period recommended or am I an old school?

srfast · February 2003

I picked up my 2003 530i on 12/13/02 with 2 miles on the odometer and because of the "normal" winter we are (finally) experiencing in the northeast (I'm in NYC), I've only driven it 677 miles. Sadly, it will sit in the garage until the excessive road salt is washed away.

Per the 5 series owner's manual, the recommended break-in procedure is: For the first 1200 miles, DO NOT exceed 4500 RPM or 1000 MPH in any gear. It is also recommended you drive the car at varying speeds during the break-in period, but not exceeding the limits stated above.

I recommend you register in the BMW "Owner's Circle" section of the www.bmwna.com site and download the 2002 5 series owner's manual. The 2003 is exactly like the 2002 so all the info applies. By doing so, you will be well acquainted with your new toy by the time you take delivery.

Hope this helps...JL

ksqrd · February 2003

Thanks--congrats on your car order, as well. If I were ordering a new car, it would be Topaz Blue, as well.

I do think that srfast meant "100 MPH" and not "1000 MPH." Unless his engine is a little more special (!)

sel3 · February 2003

The BMWUSA page states that tire rotations are not required, unless the owner insists on getting every possibly bit of life of each tire.

Look under 5 Series Technology, BMW Rear Wheel Drive Advantages.

Maybe this helps.

srfast · February 2003

cbgb1975 · February 2003

....Congrats on the the Electric Red to be picked up on Valentines Day. Great color and a great day to get it. With the triplets arrival and now this, you and your wife have got to be at a high in your lives.Enjoy!

cdnpinhead · February 2003

I absolutely agree that Electric Red is an excellent color for any car. I'm left completely nonplussed by most of the color choices offered by the sport sedan manufacturers.

Even BMW has succumbed to the metallic boring color thing. More's the pity. At least they had Electric Red once. The car I own never had a decent color choice and probably never will.

It's much harder to cover up defects in solid-color paint. Black is worst.

stl540 · February 2003

I just read your original question that you posted a couple weeks ago and am impressed you were able to get the three seats in a 530i. Congrats. I did not think you would be able to do it.

We have a 2002 MDX and a 2002 540i. I have a 5-month old daughter and I have a car seat base in both cars. I suggest getting a seat saver for use under the bases to protect the seats from conforming to the bottom of the car seat base. I do not have the Peg seats, but the from my experience the Graco's will leave indentions in the seat without the seat saver.

I find the rear facing car seat cramps the front seat in the 5. It is not terrible. In seven months, my daughter will be in a forward-facing seat and the front seat will not be affected. The slight cramped space of the front seat is a short term problem.

The MDX has a lot of room. I am sure the three car seats fit in it with room to spare. The LATCH systems in both cars (I assume the 2001 530i has them) make the installation much easier than using seatbelts to secure the base.

Best of luck on getting rest!

ksqrd · February 2003

Thanks again for the advice, and the kind words. What do you mean by a seat saver? Is there a specific kind or model that you suggest? The 530i will only transport the babes when the MDX is out of commission (for now), but might serve more hauling duty in the future. So the suggestion about indentation would be important to address before that eventuality. When our babies (small for now due to prematurity) outgrow the rear-facing Peg seats, we'll look closely at the width of the next-stage seats, so that we could use them in either car. If it gets to the point where we're each transporting one way (if my wife goes back to work) we'd need 6 seats (!) and we could get narrower models to accomodate the BMW.

As is, the rear-facing seat slightly affects the rear travel (particularly the tilt) of the front seats, but in a way that doesn't affect my driving. The middle infant seat sits more forward, and the back/top of that seat actually rests against the inside of both front seatbacks in the 530i. Thus, it's important to have the seats at roughly the same position.

Regarding the MDX, it does have a lot of room, and the seats fit easily with room to spare. Unfortunately, our 2001 MDX (which we bought new when it was released) didn't have the LATCH system, and the CPO '01 530 doesn't either. Both cars have tethers at each seating position (including seats 6 and 7 in the back of the MDX). Interestingly, it appears that the MY2001 3-series had LATCH, while the E39 didn't:
http://www.cartrackers.com/Buyers_Guide/Consumer_Advice/Safety/PI- - D.23998.58142219101.1.html

Re: Electric Red. I didn't realize until after the purchase that this color is no longer available. It's nearly an exact match to the color of the car we're replacing (a '93 Integra GS-R that is "Milano Red.") Every time I walk out to the garage, I'm more satisfied that we bought the right car, in the right color.

Re: Sleep. What's that? Haven't had more than 2.5 hours in a night in the past two weeks. I did get a chance to memorize the owner's manual while feeding at 2 a.m., though!

hnn · February 2003

Shippo - got my 530i upgraded to the new engine controller software Friday last week. I loved it. Just like you stated in prev. post, it made the 530i faster and seems like more power on freeway (even with steptronic). Thanks. Hnn

jeffry · February 2003

I've missed it, have you guys said this change is ok w/ BMW warranty & done by the dealer? Do you have some notion of how much it might increase the 50-70mph times? Are they available for 528iA too--in case I decide to go CPO instead of Euro on an E60 (240hp did I read?). thanks--great to communicate w/ such experienced people.

sergeym · February 2003

Will it work for 540 too?

snagiel · February 2003

Let's draw a distinction here between BMW software and after-market tuner software. The engine control unit's operating software is periodically updated by BMW if and when they discover improvements can be made in any number of engine management functions. However, since they spend a great deal of time and money developing and refining these engines from the outset, these maintenance types of upgrades are sporadic and usually fairly minor. I'm guessing Shipo's car was eligible for one of these updates (based on his model's build date), but it's not like every 528/530/540 driver can expect some awe-inspiring software upgrade to unleash untold numbers of sleeping ponies. Whenever you get your BMW serviced (at a BMW dealer, that is), they (should) run your VIN against BMW NA's database and check for all applicable recall/update campaigns, of which engine software is one part. If you haven't serviced it in a while (or insist on getting the latest software), ask the technicican to run a diagnostic on the engine computer and determine which version you've got, and ask if there's any updates. They may charge a minimal diagnostic fee for this (especially if you've brought the car in just for that), but it shouldn't be a big deal.

The other type of software upgrade, which I think you're alluding to jeffry, is that which is performed by after-market tuners. With normally-aspirated engines like ours (and highly refined ones at that), there's precious little improvement that can be expected. Even Dinan, a well respected BMW tuner who aggressively tries to squeeze as much performance as possible out of these cars--admits he can't get any more power out of the 3 liter inline 6. BMW has simply made it as efficient as possible. (The only things he can do are improve "throttle response"--which really just maps throttle inputs more aggressively, raise the redline--which I'm highly skeptical of--and remove the top-speed governor.)

While some BMW dealers are "Dinan Certified" and perform his upgrades (and honor his warranty), BMW NA's official position is that tinkering with your car potentially releases them from liability and their warranty obligations. Many have tested this assertion (if and when parts start breaking), and usually end up losing unless the dealer's objections are baseless (e.g. smashed valvetrain on a car with aftermarket sway bars).

hnn · February 2003

Jeff, Yes, the software is from BMW. I got mine upgraded by my dealer. Don't know about 528 or 540. You can tell the different for sure. It's performance felt closer to my old 540's after the upgrade. Hnn

shipo · February 2003

For my car at least, the only thing that the new software fixed was the throttle response, the performance (always extremely good) did not change. That makes me wonder if the old (maybe older than the standard issue in my car) software in "Hnn's" car was seriously flawed.

If you go to your BMW dealer for a software upgrade, do NOT expect a blazing performance boost. While it may well happen on a certain series of cars, my bet is that most cars will simply have their drivability improved, and that is it.

Best Regards,
Shipo

srfast · February 2003

I am curious. What are the build dates of your cars ? Does anyone know how "current" the BMW software upgrade you are referring to is ? Was is just released recently ?

TIA...JL

shipo · February 2003

The build date of my car was March, 2002, and with that software, my car was very fast and ran great. My car entered the USA, during the third week of May, 2002, and once here, either the VPC or the Dealership "Upgraded" my software with the "Bad/Downgraded" code. During late October, 2002, my car was upgraded again with what was then the latest code. My best guess is that it was an October, 2002 release of code.

In all cases, my 530i was fast, way faster than my former 328i. From my point of view, the only real problem was the throttle response, which was absolutely rotten with the second code version.

Best Regards,
Shipo

hnn · February 2003

srfast/shipo, my 530i built date was Jan 2002. I may have an older version of the software vs shipo's. The dealer forman told me that he received this new code on 2/11/03. I do not know the version number. Hnn

chrism124 · February 2003

I have an appointment, with Tulley BMW, to upgrade the engine control software. My 530ia was built in Dec 01.

Chris M

shipo · February 2003

This weekend my wife and I had a birthday party for our son who turned nine years old last Thursday. The party started as a "Sleep Over", where my son had four of his buddies over on Saturday night, and then on to an establishment that has three very large multi-lane slot car tracks on Sunday. The party itself came off very well (the Mom and Dad didnt get too much sleep, but other than that), and all of the boys enjoyed the racing immensely.

Being the car junkie that I am, as the parents did the drop-off/pick-up thing, I was keeping track of their automotive hardware, which went something like this:

Boy #1: Mom  Mercedes-Benz ML430 & Dad  Hummer H2
Boy #2: Dad  Chevy Suburban
Boy #3: Mom  Toyota Sequoia & Dad  Land Rover Ranger Rover
Boy #4: Dad  Dodge Ram 2500 Laramie Quad Cab Long Bed 4x4 (Cummins Diesel)

On the way up to the slot car tracks (riding in our lowly Dodge Caravan), they were all bragging about the cool "Cars" that their parents drive, and my son chimed in, "My dad drives a 5-Series."

The instant response, in harmony no less, was, "What's a 5-Series?"

My son said, "A BMW, of course!"

I dont know who said it, but someone actually said, "Oh, you mean a CAR!"

They then changed the subject; it was like my son had noisily passed gas at a Royal Wedding or something. Later, after all of his buddies had left, my son said, "Daddy, they just don't get it, do they?"

"No son, they don't."

Best Regards,
Shipo

Kirstie_H · February 2003

Don't forget trivia night on Wednesday, February 19, 9-10pm ET/6-7pm PT. Join other members for some trivia and member-to-member chat!

http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/townhallchat.html

hnn · February 2003

chrism124, let us know your feedback after your engine controller software upgrade. Hnn

carnaught · February 2003

Great story about your son. You obviously are "grooming" him well.

srfast · February 2003

OK guys, you have me thinking. My 2003 530i has a build date of 11/12/02 and I took delivery of it 12/13/02. I am wondering if it has the latest code available or if there is a newer version. I have a call into my dealer contact to check it.

Thanks for all your input...JL

chrism124 · February 2003

I am scheduled to have the update on 2/27. I will post the results.

Chris

sharris · February 2003

I'm getting curious, too, though I can't say I've noticed any problematic throttle response. My 2003 530i 5 sp was built early Oct. 2002, maybe 5 weeks before your 530. I'll be interested to hear what your dealer tells you.

shipo · February 2003

My bet is that you have the same software as I have now, which I find quite acceptable. That said, the next time I am in (for my 1 year service), I will have them tweek the software again.

Best Regards,
Shipo

mod62 · February 2003

My car was built in August and I took delivery at the end of OCtober. Should I ask the service department if they made the upgrade before I took delivery?

Thx

shipo · February 2003

Describe how your throttle response is when transitioning from part throttle to say three quarters throttle.

Best Regards
Shipo

stl540 · February 2003

I purchased a 'Seat Saver' from Babies R Us to protect my seat from indentions. It is overpriced (~$20), but I prefer to pay it than have the indentions. The 'Seat Saver' is a rubber mat that is contoured to fit the base and back of seat, while leaving room on the sides for the seat belts or LATCH belts. After five months of use, neither car has indentions from the car seat. You can probably use a normal rubber mat rather than the $20 Seat Saver.

Federal law states that any new car and new car seat sold (or manufactured - can't remember) after Sept 1, 2002 must have the LATCH system. I bought the MDX in Dec 01 and the 540i in May 02 and both have it. Both are MY2002, which is why both of mine have the LATCH.

Both are very nice cars. The 5-Series is definitely more fun to drive. Of course, the MDX wins in the ability to carry people (babies, in your case) or 'things'. I absolutely love my 540i. It is an absolute blast to drive.

Happy driving!!

srfast · February 2003

My contact ran my 530i's VIN through BMW's service database and reported that there were no current "BMW service campaigns" or upgrades for the car. The build date is 11/12/02 and I suspect it is the most current level of SW and that it is just being distributed to dealers now.

Hope this helps...JL

ksqrd · February 2003

stl540: I'll look into the seat savers! It looks like we have very similar cars (MDX+E39). I envy your 540, though I'm feeling very fortunate to be driving my 530iA.

Others interested in car seats: I found an outstanding link for info about car seat questions, including summaries of others' experiences with placing three seats or boosters in various cars:

http://pages.ivillage.com/carseatfaq/

shipo · February 2003

Great news from my Orthopedic Sturgeon today, my right leg is "Almost healed". Off came the rigid fiberglass cast, and on went an "Aircast", which is kind of a funky Go-Go boot with three big Velcro straps and foot print that gives "Gun Boats" a whole new meaning. ;-)

Better still, my range of motion at my ankle is a whopping 10 degrees, I know it doesn't sound like much, however, my OS said that it was very good, and that I should be almost completely recovered within 4 to 6 weeks (strength however, is another issue).

With any luck (and some good PT), I will be back in the drivers seat of my 530i in three or four weeks, which is about three MONTHS earlier than I had initially hoped. In the mean time, I will still have to live vicariously through y'all.

Best Regards,
Shipo

vcheng · February 2003

..(range of motion) recovery is a slow and sometimes painful process, and I wish you all the best Shipo! Like you said, good physiotherapy is the key.

To keep my post on topic, it will be a goooood feeling getting "back in the saddle" of your 530 I bet.

dabimmer · February 2003

Yesterday took in 530IA in for first oil service, even though I still have two lights showing. I only have 12,500 miles and when I called the technician said bring it in. They changed oil,and filter and added 7 qts of synthetic oil.Drained the brake fluid and refilled and bled the air out, and changed windshield wipers. All in all, very painless. I was in and out rather quickly and it was all covered by BMW, The BMW dealers in the San Francisco Bay area have been much maligned but I must say they treated me extremely well, When the two remaining lights go out I will take it in again for the scheduled maintenance which is also covered by BMW.I noticed that the car "seems" to drive much better and the steering is lighter and the ride is much better, I can't explain why exactly it just seems to .

akirby · February 2003

You guys left out a few observations from the C&D test. As for the options on the test vehicles you can only blame the mfrs - they supplied the vehicles.

It seems that one car outperformed the 2nd place 530 in EVERY acceleration and handling test and outperformed the 1st place E320 in everything except skidpad where it was only .01 g's behind. And it did all this with all season tires.

Since the cars in the C&D test were not comparably equipped I did a cost comparison on similarly equipped models using Edmunds TMV. The 530i sport was $48K. The E320 sport was $53K. This car was $40K. This car also has considerably more interior room than the 530i and just a bit more than the E320.

This car is the 2003 Lincoln LS V8 sport. Surprised?

I'm not saying it's a better car nor do I wish to debate the quality of the interior or any other subjective issues like styling. And yes - the 530i can be had with a stick while the LS and E320 can't. I just find it exciting that an American sports sedan can finally run with the top dogs from an acceleration and handling standpoint - and do it for a lot less money. The CTS, while a good first step, isn't there yet. But at least they're trying.

kdshapiro · February 2003

When you get into cars in this price range they really should be equipped similiarly. The BMW could have been a 525 and really get creamed. But I think a fairer comparison, would have been the E430, against the 540i against the Lincoln. You could say the Lincoln would have won on value, but Ford had to put an engine almost 1 liter bigger, or they could have used the 3L model. Either way I think the results would have been way different.

About interior room, I've been in both cars and the 530i feels bigger to me. It may be the better interior ergonomics of the BMW, but I did not get the impression the Lincoln *was* bigger.

pen101 · February 2003

All this software talk got me curious also, so I called the dealer to run the VIN's on my 530 manufactured 11/2001. The dealer said that there are no current service campaigns or upgrades available for the car. But shipo's software upgrade was made in late 2002, so what gives?

sergeym · February 2003

Are you saying that your BMW dealer did a free oil change at 12.5K miles with two green lights still remaining? And they drained the brake fluid?
That's great. I had to pay for oil service at 7.5K myself.

shipo · February 2003

BMW releases new software every so often, however, that does not mean that the old software NEEDS to be replaced. The car was certified with whatever software it came with, and unless there is a drivability issue (my car), there is no overriding requirement for the dealership to upgrade it. That said, if you push, they will probably do it, they just don't HAVE to do it.

Best Regards,
Shipo

dabimmer · February 2003

Yes , they did not charge me anything. You are entitled to one free oil service per year even ifyou still have lights lit. They also changed the windshield wiper blades .
I checked with the service technician and he told me they had checked for TSB and any software upgrades and on my copy under those headings it said NONE. Like I said my car runs really great and it is very,very quick.

akirby · February 2003

One correction - the 530i had a quicker 5-60 time, probably due to the faulty transmission in the LS (or better gearing in the 530i - not sure).

The LS is closer to the previous generation 740i than the 5 series in interior room. A lot of the extra room is in the back seat.

As for engine choices, I would venture that the BMW 3.0L V6 probably cost as much or more as the LS 3.9L V8 so I think it's a fair comparison.

kdshapiro · February 2003

Are we comparing what the kind of car you get for a specific dollar amount, or are we comparing the kind of performance you get with engines of similiar displacement? I would expect the mags to compare performance. I'm not disputing C&Ds methods - for it is their comparison. When I shop I might shop for cars for a specific dollar amount, or I might shop similiar engines, or I might shop interior room, etc. As sweet as the 3L engine is, is does have it's limits, when compared to engines with more cylinders and bigger displacements. One V8 vs 2 6's? What does that really say? Might as well compare an SVT and call it the winner.

I'm all for the comparo because it shows strengths and weaknesses of each car. But I think a comparison more along similiar engine lines each optioned out equally in terms of performance options, would have been the 3.0L Lincoln vs a 3.2L Mercedes vs a 3L 5 series.

pen101 · February 2003

Today the clutch went out. The car will not go into gear. Had it towed to the dealer. BMW roadside assistance was very helpful.

Here is the rub. My 530i has but 14K miles on it. The service adviser tells me that unless it is a manufacturer's defect (highly unlikely), I have to pay for replacing the clutch ($1000). He says the wear looks like it is from abuse. What?

How can this be? I have been driving stick shift for 23+ years (Japanese cars) and have never had a clutch go bad after just 14K miles. Usually about 80K to 120K miles. I am the only one who drives this car and I purchased it new.

Although I have had difficulty getting used to this clutch from day one, I do not believe I have abused the clutch. I rarely make quick starts necessitating slipping the clutch and rarely do I down-shift coming to a stop. Most of the time my shifts are smooth (even the 1-2 shifts). I have driven this car in a similar manner as my previous stick shift cars. So where is the abuse?

If and when (tomorrow) the dealer tells me that it was from wear and tear (normal?) and/or abuse and BMW does not cover this, do I have any recourse?

By the way, if I had purchased the car from this dealer, they would have given me a courtesy loaner car. But because I did not (they were over $2,000 higher than my purchasing dealer), I get nothing. I have to find my own ride at my expense. They told me that it may take 3 working days or more to get the parts and replace the clutch.

Again, my questions are:
1. Does needing a new clutch after 14K miles seem very unusual? How could this happen? How long does a typical BMW clutch last?

2. Is there any recourse when they say that I abused the clutch and therefore it is not covered?

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