Lexus LS 400/LS 430

nealm1 · March 2002

Has anyone read the CAR magazine (UK) review of the new 7? It is pretty brutal; not about the styling (although they are dubious there too) but about idrive. They note that accomplishing two discrete functions (radio and HVAC mods that can be done with 2 twists of a knob in an ordinary car) take 12 or 14 separate steps with idrive. They express two dominant reactions: (a) fear. i.e., real apprehension about the ability of drivers to keep the car on the road while engaging in routine operations (especially when the car is new to the driver) and (b) confusion; even when you have learned the system and it has theoretically become "intuitive," it does not even arguably make operation of the car EASIER which is, of course, the only legitimate reason to adopt the technology. If it doesn't make these operations EASIER, the only reason to use it is to have a wiz-bang gimmick that MB and Lexus don't have. Maybe that is a valid purpose from a marketing standpoint and maybe folks that trade their car every year or two will be willing to "suffer" so they can show off the latest stuff, but from the perspective of someone who plans to keep a luxury car for a while, it makes absolutely no sense to me.

I bought my LS last March specifically because I feared that this model year Lexus would make the Nav system/user interface standard. I would love to have the Nav toy, but until Lexus learns to make functinality foremost and de-couples the nav from the ac, stereo, phone, etc., I will not buy one. They do it on the SC (I think), why can't they manage it on the LS?

flint350 · March 2002

Not sure I understand what you mean by Lexus de-coupling the nav from the stereo and hvac. The only real part of either in the nav is the use of the large display screen for the displays. After all, they have to be displayed somewhere, so why not the nav screen which is large. But the controls for those functions are not part of the nav - rather there are separate buttons on the dash and steering wheel. Just like any car without the nav. Granted, vent selection is a graphic in the nav display, but maybe I'm missing your point.

ljflx · March 2002

Nealm1 - I agree with flint350 that the operation of virtually all of the controls are independent of the nav system if you want it so. You can also adjust some things with the touch screen but by no means do you have to. Temperature controls etc are in the same place with or without nav. The manual controls on the dash (in non-nav cars) for changing stereo settings - am/fm1&2/disc/tape etc. - are in the nav screen if you want to go that route or all can be done with the steering wheel controls. The only non-nav things I do through the touch screen is the speaker controls and the ASL. But once I set these I never touch them again.

pai7 · March 2002

you feel that the MB-S is roomier than the LS 430.Then you are in for a surprise.... The LS430 interior volume is 105.5 cubic feet and the trunk is 20.2 c.ft..whereas the interior volume of the long wheelbase MB-S is 105 c.ft and the and the trunk capacity is 15.4 c.ft (according to the brochure).Inspite of MB-S being more than 6 inches longer than LS 430,the Lexus LS is a "larger" car.The new BMW 7 Series-- 745i interior(passenger) volume..104 c.ft , trunk 18 c.ft.The new 745 Li has a passenger volume of 105 c.ft.The Friday March 8th issue of USA TODAY has a very intresting test drive of the new 7 Series.
Ijflx -- The LS has always been barely 5 meters in lenght.Its 197.6 inches length translates to 4.996 meters which is 4 mm short of 5 meters.There is a punitive tax in some countries(also in Japan) on vehicles which are 5 meters or longer.When the LS was first introduced in 1990 it had the same overall length as it is today.However they have made the car "bigger"by stretching the wheelbase,increasing the height,and inovating packaging ,as a result of which the car which was classified as compact by the EPA during introduction in 1990 is now classified as "Large"sedan because of the increased interior volume.

swiftm · March 2002

ron36330: just a advise and hoping this will save you some money. I had a LX and RX shipped to Hunts, AL 2 yrs ago to near invoice plus 1.2 k shipping to my front door, try dealers in southern CA area, you can email me direct if you need further information, swiftm001@yahoo.com. swiftm

ljflx · March 2002

I didn't realize the tax consequences. The rear is quite spacious indeed. I'm a pretty big guy and I have plenty of room in the back even with the front seat as far back as possible. But of course I'm never in the rear seat anyway. My point about the stretching of the car is more marketing oriented as it would attract the limo crowd. But I've noticed several chaffeured LS430's on the road now. They are usually outfitted with special rear lighting and sophisticated rear phones and based on the interior leather are either custom or ultra-lux.

Anyone ever feel how nice it is to sit as a front passenger in the car. My business partner has a sport suspension model and from time to time I ride as a passenger - seems to be the only times that happens. I appreciate the ride even more in those rare passenger moments.

nealm1 - on the nav outfitted cars you can access stereo controls in 3 places - on the steering column, within the touch screen of the nav or via the buttons around and under the cassette deck.

nealm1 · March 2002

You folks are obviously more knowledgable about these aspects of the car than I am, but from my test drives a yr ago I recall that there were numerous settings that could only be accessed through the nav screen (balance, fade, treble/mid/bass, etc). The steering wheel controls are only a partial answer for me; they don't access all of the features and if you are on CD and want to go to FM, you have to cycle through all the other functions. Same for radio PBs etc. In some Volvos, and I think in the SC (although I could be wrong), the Nav screen controls the Nav only, and there are actual buttons and knobs for everything else. That, IMHO, is the preferred method.

The point of my comment is that BMW has moved in the wrong direction. The more stuff you pack into the CRT display, the HARDER it becomes to access them. That is contrary to the whole purpose of the luxury car class; life should be easier and more enjoyable in one of these cars, not more difficult and exasperating.

ljflx · March 2002

BMW went way over the top here. Someone should have told them the internet bubble burst and the techies who may have loved the I-drive control, were now job hunting. I'm glad to see MB is not following suit in its new E-class and I doubt Lexus will either. By the way other than a handful of posters on these boards have you come across anyone who likes the styling of the new 7 anyway?

anthonycecil · March 2002

I find the screen easy to use, but the voice recognition is poor. Most of the time I just punch the button as to turn the screen back off is troublesome. I guess I mean to say, from the map mode. When the car was very new I was dangerous on the road, trying to get different functions to work,and just generally looking around. Tony

lenscap · March 2002

What do people think of the info being tossed around on the GS board? Apparently the sheet metal on the 2003 LS 430 will be completely redesigned (not a freshening).

ljflx · March 2002

It's been rumored that Lexus wants to introduce a bigger V-8 and the V-12 pretty soon so it could well be true. Why not do it in a new design and try to get away from the copying nonsense. The styles of the Camry and ES300 were certainly more aggressive and they probably will go that route with the LS and GS as well. But I think the LS will always lean toward conservatism though without question Lexus wants to attract younger buyers. They also should want to be more aggressive forcing restyles more often. They have the deepest pockets and most resources and the government would probably even help subsidize any job development. That would indeed be a smart strategy particularly because that is the year MB is supposed to update the S (but not really introduce major changes). But 2004 still makes more sense for any change given all the renewable 2001 leases.

merckx · March 2002

There's a great group test of LS430,S500,and 745i in this month's issue.
I guess I like it so because it is exactly my personal opinion.I do admire the LSgreatly,but i do think the Merc is better and worth the extra money.
The S is hardier,more flinty,if you will. And that quality has traditionally appealed to car-loving drivers. The LS does have that "ball of silk"that Rolls-Royce talked about,and that is not easy to achieve. But the Benz,I think,is a better compromise of other qualities.

anthonycecil · March 2002

Having owned three over ten years or so, I have ever really seen much outward change. When my turn comes up to get a new one, the improvements have been there, but not to such an extent that you would relly notice. The price has therefore held up. If the price does not hold up, where would the money come to buy a new one? I for one would not buy if I felt the depreciation would be too great. I do not think Lexus would have had near the success if they didn`t protect the customer. No one wants to take that first step particularly if it costs sixty five or seventy thousand dollars, and if they do they surely don`t want to do it again. Tony ps the moral is I doubt if the proposed change when it comes will be too noticeable

tdo123 · March 2002

A few posts back, someone talked of the rumors that are around next years LS. Any one else heard of anything to come? I think that Lexus is feeling a bit behind by still having the car produce only 290hp vs. the 315+ of the Q, 745 and new E500, although it gives more torque than all the others and can beat most in 0 - 60.

I know one thing I am looking forward to seeing change - who came up with the idea of offering the grey wood on the Ultra and Custom series cars. That is the only option if you go with the lighter interior. I hope they offer some new colors.

Any thoughts or rumors on the street?

dewayne1982 · March 2002

If there is any hint of veracity to the rumors, why would Lexus make changes to the LS 430 so early? The car is still a formidable competitor to the S-Class, 7-series and Q45. I'm thinking that Lexus would wait until the fourth model year of the generation, probably fall 2004, to make any dramatic changes.

Lexus probably has the legacy of the LS already planned. Starting with the second-generation, Lexus already had the third-generation in concept stages and gave us a hint at the future styling with the 1998 update. The rumored restyling of the third-generation, possible increase in horsepower and improved cabin, will possibly give us a clue to the styling of the fourth-generation model.

ljflx · March 2002

I would bet that the S will re-do at least moderately in 2004. Lexus has a lot of lease renewals in that year from the big year in 2001. So rather than sit back and wait a year to the 2005 model year, and risk losing any of the business they gained, they may very well match the S in its redesign year. They know they won a decent amount of business in 2001 from would be or forner S owners. Time to up the ante and get more aggressive. If I had their cash rich position, and past year success I'd certainly go that route. It would also silence some of the critics who always complain that Lexus waits until MB has committed - though I doubt Lexus is concerned about them. Plus the Yen remains in such a favorable position for them vs. their German competition.

dewayne1982 · March 2002

So, what will the next redesigned be called? Will this still be the third-generation of models or generation 3.5?

ljflx · March 2002

I think it's definitely an LS500. Is the re-do a complete body re-do, maybe lengthened 3 inches or so, and potentially will it havea v-12 as an option? Could be.

tdo123 · March 2002

I struggle to think that Lexus would go the the extreme of a V12, but I sure hope you are right. As for the idea of a 500 series, you could be right on. MB just changed the E430 to an E500 for this summer debut. Maybe Lexus will go that route.

I agree that a major change is 2 years or so off, but is there anything that they may tweak for 2003? The 430 today is a great car, but there are many things that I think could be improved.

toyotas1 · March 2002

considering a redo ever since the car was released to very negative press in Europe in early 2000. Lexus has long been against the need or implimentation of the Century's V12. When Lexus decides to break the 5 meter barrier and make a car that competes in size with the Germans, then the V12 will be implimented, but not before. I have ot heard ANYTHING on a 5L V8! Lexus can tune the 4.3 to 350HP+ if necessary with Vvti-i and a higher compression ratio. Power with THIS engine was never a question. Sales have been over the 25k they predicted, so WHATEVER the Lexus plan was for the next five years, it hasn't changed for poor sales. The buzz is the change will come THIS fall, but you make valid points for it not coming so soon. I'm sure Lexus feels the same way. If raising horsepower to.....320, and giving the exterior a major facelift does come around, it should be NEXT fall. If it is super successful, the redesign may be pushed back to 2007......

allan441 · March 2002

The 16 inch standard tires on my 2001 LS 430 will need to be replaced soon. Does any one have any experience with Michelin MXV4 Plus? I want to upgrade to 17 inch tires. Would 225/77/R17 or 235/55/R17 be better? I was told that the 235/55 has a larger "foot print". Will this influence the ride? Currently the ride is excellent, but again I was told that the increase in tire size will give me better handling, without comprimising the ride.

Any help would be appreciated.

hage45 · March 2002

I currently have "summer tires" Dunlop SP Sport 225/55HR-17 and I am thinking of replacing them with all season Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 225/55 W-17. I assume this will enhance handling, but was will be the impact on ride quality and/or noise? Any ideas would be appreciated.

barry5 · March 2002

I am also thinking of removing my summer tires as I believe they are unsafe in snow. I have been considering the
Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus Tire H-Speed Rated. Does anyone have experience with this tire. Is it Quiet, how does it do in snow?

rustyhinge · March 2002

The local dealer just got in a '99 LS400 with just under 15,000 miles. Beautiful condition w/Chrome Wheels,Moonroof, Nakamichi Sound. I was very impressed with the car when I test drove it today. It comes with the Certified Pre-Owned Warranty and is priced at $38,900. I think this is a fair price for the car and I plan to buy it pending my final inspection after they correct a few minor cosmetic flaws. Any inputs from the regulars to this forum on the pricing of this car would be appreciated. Looking forward to owning my first Lexus - I've wanted one ever since I test drove a 1990 LS400.

drcomputer · March 2002

I just replaced the factory Dunlop SP270's with Bridgestone Turenza Z Revo's from Tirerack.com. What a difference. The car handles MUCH better and corners without any tire squeal. The ride is a bit harsher, but wouldn't be noticeable to a passenger. I would recommend these tires over the Michelin or Dunlops any day.

rennybosch · March 2002

You might want to check Kelley Blue Book (www.kbb.com). Wouldn't tell you what is fair, but what others have considered fair.

feverhart · March 2002

My choice, too.

hage45 · March 2002

Per Tirerack, the Bridgestone Turenza Z Revo has been discontinued, what's your second choice?

jefftp · March 2002

Rusty:

I just spent 3 months shopping for a similar vintage LS.
That is a VERY GOOD price. You could easily pay that for '98 with twice the miles. Plus, if you have the chance to get the Nakamichi, do it. I could not get one w/ the Nakamichi and the stock Pioneer system is a real downer...

anthonycecil · March 2002

I took a road trip, my wife`s sport util. rx300, and my battery operated passport. I am not sure if there are as many police as I imagined. It rarely went off, and sometimes I saw police parked and it never went off. It was a nice mental feeling that I would have some warning, but in reality I am the hunted and the highway men are the hunters. I averaged about four miles per hour better, but if my luck was not in force I am afraid a ticket may be in my future. Some police were parked facing streight across the highway, and I wonder if the detector would ever pick up a beam or ray? The unmarked camaros [non-permissible content removed] backwards, and if I were not just about to bear off the I26 onto I95, I would have possibly, make that likely, gotten stopped. One time the radar detector turned it self off, and I went past a sherrif, again because of traffic , nothing. Everyone talks about all this horsepower and aceleration, but in truth a ticket is a painful experience. I would like to hear anyone`s opinion on a radar detector. Thanks Tony

wwest · March 2002

Useless, waste of money.

Watch brake lights ahead instead.

feverhart · March 2002

Get a Valentine One. It's saved me a wad and it's worth the $400. Brake lights may help if their's a car in front of you and only if that car isn't already caught. It won't help if you are being shot from the rear. Still it's wise not to be the leader of the pack or the back door. Also be wary of exit ramps by rear viewing as you pass them. Then too, there's VASCAR and laser. Keep an eyr on overpasses and side of the road far ahead. Helps make you a safer driver with all that mental alertness.

rennybosch · March 2002

Feverhart, does the Valentine One give you enough warning so you can slow down before they detect you? I always thought that by the time you see them, they have already clocked you.

But I agree that eternal vigilance makes you a better driver.

feverhart · March 2002

There are several bands used. The "instant-on" aimed at you will give a warning but too late, unless you are rapidly decellerating. Slowing up at that time will not allow an accurate reading; it must be locked on. If it's aimed at the car(s) in front of you, the signal gives you opportunity to slow down. Most of the radars, however, are operating constantly and there is plenty of warning.

Advantages of the Valentine One are that it is not only extremely sensitive, but will tell you if the radar signal is coming from the front or back and it also tell you the number of hits.

The stealth feature is especially nice if you forget to turn it off in those communities where detectors are illegal. In those communities there are radar detector detectors that can sence most operating detectors for which the driver is fined and/or the detector is confiscated,

Be aware though that the detector will not alert you to a police car that doesn't have radar and many do not.

tdo123 · March 2002

I use a valentine also, but let's get back to Lexus talk.

feverhart · March 2002

Sorry you were offended or chagined. I was simply responding to questions asked. Speed is deceptive in the LS and detectors have their place and in my opinion is relevant.

anthonycecil · March 2002

Maybe you would contribute about your experiences with your ls430, and how radar saved you from arrest, or ticket? Tony

barry5 · March 2002

I USE A SOLO CORDLESS AND IT HAS SAVED ME MANY A TIME...THE COST 199 IS VERY INEXPENSIVE COMPARED TO TICKETS AND INSURANCE PREMIUM INCREASES,

NOW BACK TO TIRES, OK NOW THAT BRIDGESTONE TURENZA IS GONE WHAT ABOUT MICHELIN 225/55R/17/H ANY INFORMATION? WILL ACCEPT ALL BRANDS AS LONG AS THEY ARE ALL SEASON AND QUIET AND GOOD IN SNOW.

ljflx · March 2002

I've ridden in the Euro suspension Lexus LS430 and found that the car was exceptionally quiet as well. I would assume the 17" tires on the Euro can also be put on the base car. Anyone know otherwise? Also does the ultra and custom lux come with 16" or 17" tires?

whybuy1 · March 2002

As a Lexus LS owner I, of course, value quiet. Some tires are quieter than others. What are the other owners' experience with the quietness of various replacement tires for the LS 430 with 17" wheels?

scottphillip · March 2002

I have had my car for two months now, and I am delighted with it. I haven't had a problem and am enjoying all the Ultra features. I may actually keep this car a couple years.

Scott

rennybosch · March 2002

When I got my Ultra, the rule was it comes with 16" wheels, but for $100 extra you get the 17" wheels which are supposed to give you better handling, at the cost of being a little less quiet.

Renny

pcolaman · March 2002

Hello Everyone, my wife and I just purchased our first Lexus LS400. It is a 1998 model with 42,500 miles. The vehicle looks and drives like it just came off the factory floor!

The four year warranty period has expired for this vehicle so my question is should we go to the expense of purchasing an extended warranty? If so, can anyone suggest a vendor for this service? Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

tdi90hp · March 2002

Best place for a warranty is your dealer. warranties are a personnal decision in general powertrains are very strong but one electronic gremlin could pay for whole warranty so your call. Remember that the dealer builds in up to 1000 dollars profit in some warranties so they are definitely negotiable and if your dealer wont budge call other dealers. Does not matter which dealer you buy it from.
I have a question now. To ALL older LS owners.
Please need a reply to whatI think is a very important issue. All older LS's seem to clack a lot a idle. Obviously from a valvetrain that may need adjustment Anyone I have heard with over 60k tends to clack. Has anyone had the valves adjusted, shims replaced or anything like that, is it necessary??? Am I worrying for nothing. My 92 has 180,000kms on it and does not burn a drop of oil but wondering about the "clacking"....
Please anyone with experience on this get back asap. Thanks. Love my 92. sandstone with Trac and Nakamichi.Claude

laysmackdown · March 2002

the LS is going to have a MAJOR facelift this fall! The car will be almost redesigned. What are you guys hearing?

ljflx · March 2002

Someone on the GS board started that thread and had data about many Lexus models. He certainly seemed knowledgable. Perhaps if the person checks this board he can give us more data. I've not read anything anywhere about this. If true wouldn't Lexus be publicizing this at the auto shows rather than just serving up the GX470.

ssheltmire · March 2002

I have a '98 LS400 that I purchased about a year ago. This is our second Lexus (still have the '93 GS300). Outstanding automobiles. My concern is the Navigation System on the LS400. As that touch-screen system operates some key functions, I would be interested in hearing personal opinions and experiences regarding its reliability and service history. With the vehicle still under warranty this is not a pressing issue but as end-of-warranty approaches I apply increasing importance to that as a vehicle trade-in justification. However, at this point, that would be the only justification. Otherwise, the car has been flawless. Thanks.

blehrlich · March 2002

After recent journeys through an MB S500 and Audi A6 4.2, I'm about to rejoin the Lexus club with a Midnight Pine LS 430 (ML/Nav pkg.). The MB was a beautifully riding car, with a great. responsive engine, but the interior quality was incredibly poor, especially the various plastic materials around the front seats. I went through three seat frames, with the dealer finally telling me that I was just "too large" (at 6'3", 240 lbs., I'm not small, but that's ridiculous).
The Audi, with quattro, was great to drive, especially in bad weather, but my kidneys are sore from the ride, and the electrical gremlins, road noise, and the need for more rear seat room (I don't like the A8), helped my decision.
I look forward to more postings about my experiences, and it's nice to not have to be a lurker.

syswei · March 2002

Doing the facelift in 2003 would break with past practice. The original 1990 car was freshened in 1993 (i.e., year four). The 1995 ls was freshened in 1998, also year four. If they freshened the 2001 car in 2003, it would be only year three.

Personally I would welcome them doing it in 2003 as I hope to buy a new ls around next january. If anyone has heard anything substantive and hopefully credible on this subject, please post it.

blehrlich · March 2002

My dealer/friend said nothing for this year...concentration is on new upcoming GS and GX SUV.

Lexus LS 400/LS 430

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