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Mazda MPV: Problems & Solutions
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Comments
The next is timing or the distributor(maybe cap is cracked)..
The shop should put an Ignition Scope on the ignition system. This will show exactly what is wrong. This is old science and no guess work is required. If the shop doesn't do this then go somewhere else...
(I did this on R4360 engines(56 spark plugs) used on C124 aircraft in late '50s)..
If the ignition system checks out then look for an emission system leak... If none of this works then listen at the tail pipe for a wheezing "Chuf chuf" sound this means a burned leaky valve...
Good Luck
Tj
More power to you!
We chose not to get them for the reasons I've described, and we're happy not to have them. If you've got 'em and they're working for you, great.
Please do not miscontrue my comments above as a critique of any form.
There have been reports of problems with them, and statistically speaking, they were a source of headache for a lot of folks across all brands for a while (Honda comes to mind...). That doesn't mean yours will fail, of course, any more than the reports of sulfur smell or transmissions shifting hard affect all of us.
'nuff said.
Happy door openings and closings to all of you.
-brianV
50 mph. The noise started after a minor mishap
in which the two passenger side tires were
damaged (and replaced) after impact with the curb.
The van runs normally as before, but for the
hum. The sound wanes (or is drowned out by
ambient noise) after 60 mph, but very audible
below this speed.
I checked the wheel bearings during a recent
tire rotation, and they are reported to be fine.
I'm wondering if the new tires are making the noise (they have about 6000 miles on them now),
or this could be something else.
Any help in figuring this one will be appreciated.
Thanks.
However I experienced a number of hard shifts today which was very surprising. So I am now working on two theories:
1). The transmission is "learning" to slam with the new fluid (per brianV's posting above)
2). The tranny may be very sensitive to fluid levels.
I carefully adjusted the level (it may have been overfilled slightly when I added the Valvoline) and am now testing again.
The good news is that it does shift better with the Valvoline, so I don't think I wasted my money if the hard shifts persist.
With the experience I have so far, I would have to say that the fluid level is the key variable with respect to hard shifting. Changing the fluid certainly made the trany shift smoother and faster but depending on the fluid level I did experience the hard 2-3 shift.
Having said that I'm finding that actually getting an accurate read on the level is no easy feat. Its really hard to tell what the level is even when following instructions precisely. I've noticed that being on level ground is very important.
I will keep the current trany fluid as is for the next few days to see if it continues to shift smoothly or if the issue comes back.
As to my MPV issues with the hard shift, it does just that it shifts hard once in a while. Otherwise it's wonderful. I do find it strange that so many are having the same issue. It makes me wonder.
In any event, I really love my Peevee too! Good to hear from you!
Leslie
P.S. It's freezing here today. In the high 20's. Bet you wish you were here!!! NOT!
Leslie
The solid aluminum rims don't bend, they crack. The crack could be hard to find and shows up when the wheel is under stress (moving). One suggestion is to put the spare on in each location and see if the noise goes away.. If it does then trash the rim and buy a new one...
Steel rims bend and are easy to find. Have a tire shop remove the tire and check the rim for damage and being out of round.... Replace with a new rim.
Good Luck
Tj
Mazda knows exactly what is wrong, but they are argueing with the tranny maker on who is going to pay for the fix....(I have been in a few of these kinds of meetings)
Leslie: Yeah the PEEVEE is best car we have ever had. So far no "bumps" in the tranny. I am tempted to have the tranny oil changed but will wait until 30K.
It got down in the 40s last night. The rec center has a huge outdoor hot tub so I am going to do a hot soak today after work out to warm up and catch some rays.....
Happy Thanksgiving (Granddaughter is cooking dinner, she can COOK, Yummmm)
Tj
If it does turn out to be the fluid level, I'd be very interested to understand exactly why it is having this effect.
It shifted smoothly except at the end of the first leg (50 miles) when the tranny was hottest (after stop & go and relatively warm outside temp) when I experienced two "rougher" shifts, not quite the slamming as before but definitely noticeable. On the way back (at night when temp cooler and not so much stop & go) the tranny shifted perfectly.
My working hypothesis is that when it was running at its hottest, the fluid level increased to the point where the rough shift was induced.
Having my handy extractor and and empty ATF bottle with measurements on the side, I extracted exactly 200 ml (about 6 oz of fluid) while the engine was still hot. Re-measuring at the dipstick, its slightly below the hot full indent as far as I can tell.
If my hypothesis is correct this will eliminate or at least attenuate the remaining "rougher" shifts. I also expect to experience this only when the transmission is at its hottest, if at all. If this happens I will extract maybe 100 ml more, making sure that the level stays above the low hot indent on the dipstick.
If this works, I will initiate a discussion with Mazda on the root cause, which I think could be:
1. Dipstick misalignment
2. Poor/inadequate tranny baffle design or misalignment.
3. Simply too much ATF fluid and a highly sensitive tranny
At this point I I really don't think that my problem is caused by the TCM. Its also interesting to note that that the tranny TSB posted on this board has checking the ATF fluid level as the first item.
I wonder how many Mazda service departments actually check levels carefully and extract fluid if they find its slightly overfilled. Or perhaps when they do the new car pre-delivery check, do they add a little extra ATF if the level "seems" too low?
Steve.
Nope, can't see software having anything to do with problem...
The cause I see, is clogged passages making tranny very sensitive to fluid levels.... Trannies are basically fluid amplifiers that when you change feed flow characteristics you change the final outcome... When you induce distortion (contamnation)into the system you get a totally random process that exhibits strange symptoms....(Ka-bam shift)
I was talking to an old buddy who is involved in the manufacture of gears. He said that nowdays they do precision casting of gears(cheaper) not machining like in yesteryears. There is a significant wearin process because the gears are not smooth like the machined type. And that wearin generates particles that can cause problems.... He works with motorcycle trannies.... Interesting...
Mazda knows exactly what is wrong, they are fighting over money with the vendor....
Tj
Good luck all.
I can't see software causing problem....
The random problems among some MPVs indicates a shifting malfunction caused by bad oil or contamnation.. I have same oil in my MPV... So I would say (not necessarly true) that oil type is ok. So the other possibility is contamnation due to wearin particles(tranny design is good(aka my MPV)).
So the first step is to do a complete flush of the tranny and replace the oil and filter.
Now, who pays for this?? The dealer should, but will they? If I had the problem and the dealer refused to do it, then I would go to a trusted shop(not the Jiffy lube types) and have them do it and pay for it myself.
Then you would know one way or the other....
If I was still working I would take a sample of the oil to the automotive lab have a purity test done...
Has anyone raised the subject of a flush with the dealers???? What was the outcome??? This is a standard procedure for rough shifting trannies... It should not be an issue....
Indications are that a good flush will fix. It is a gamble but buying a car is a gamble...
A flush is not that expensive and has a high possibility of fixing problem. If nothing else change oil and filter... Although a replacement tranny may be necessary depending on how bad the passages are plugged or damaged...
Lawsuits: Only lawyers win.. It takes time and lots of money. Cheaper to pay out of pocket for a new tranny or just live with problem and hope Mazda will come around and fix or replace tranny..
Mazda knows this and longer they delay more money they save...(Maybe they are hoping that the 30K oil change may fix most complaints) Morality is not a consideration in Corporations, only what they can get away with... They ALL do it....
Tj
I extracted about 50 ml more of fluid but still have problem. The hard shifts seem to come in groups.
That's probably the extent of my experimentation with the beast. Its really a Mazda issue.
Again I would strongly advise any prospective 2004 MPV buyers to hold off purchase until this issue is decisively resolved.
prominent at around 50-55 MPH. (I had hit
a curb hard some months ago).
Took the 2000 MPV LX to the dealer on friday.
First, they said the wheel bearings need changing. Then, the mechanic said that as
he put the car in drive, the right front
axle broke. He said the axle was probably
out of the joint and happend to break at
that instant.
Then today, the dealer said the control arm
is bent! Overall, what started out as a $275
job now has an estimate of $1000!.
Wondering if these guys are just screwing
me or if this is a plausible scenario. THe
van has been running fine for several months
now but for the low humming noise.
Hope the struts are ok. Alighnment check will find that out. Just be thankful that you are alive and didn't hurt someone else in a crash....
I would say if you can get it repaired under $2000 you are doing good...
Good Luck
Tj
and nobody was around.
So, we will see.
Dan2004, I'm curious, I read back through a history of your posts and didn't see where you've posted about ever bringing yours in for service on the problem. Did you ever have them try to fix it before you started flushing the fluid?
FWIW, he has 5 MPVs showing the problem. He reckons to have about 300 MPVs in his database, but can't say how many are 2002+ models.
Steve.
With the Mazda rep (second visit) we drove around for about 1 hour and it happened twice, though mild versions.
The rep will now take the car again this week for several hours drive.
Part of my frustration is getting the Mazda organization to just acknowledge this happening!
(Snicker)
That is a good one.... Which means that Mazda doesn't want to pay to fix problem... They are hoping that you will go away and live with it... When the tranny hammers itself long enough it will self destruct (aluminum doesn't hammer without cracking).
Has anyone demanded a Flush and fill and new filter????
This is SOP for hard shifting new trannies...
Mazda knows what is wrong. We are getting a song and dance routine....
Tj...
PS My Mpv has always shifted perfectly(10K miles) Hard shifting is NOT NORMAL......
I'll definitely be hammering them when that OD hits 3K, and it won't be long, we rack up the miles on our cars very fast. We'll be going back to IL for Christmas and that's 600 miles round trip right there.
My peevee is at about 5000 miles and the shifting still hasn't "straightened itself out." It seems to have gotten worse. I was in the car yesterday and the phantom shifing banged into gear 5 times. I have started keeping a record and from what I'm seeing it tends to happen when the engine is cold. It's very irritating and I've been to the dealer with it since they are unable to "duplicate it" so that means there's nothing wrong....grrrrrrrr
Mazda, are you listening?
My MPV has always shifted perfectly.. Bet problem is metal particle contamnation not the TCM... Dealer should do a flush and change filter....
Tj
Good Luck....
Here is the result:
1) The tech rep completely dismissed Edmunds.com comments--couldn't care less
2) He was able to reproduce two instances of "different shifts" during his test drive, appx 40 miles.
3) He recited what seemed to me a Mazda script that went something like "Mazda MPVs are experiencing occasional hard shifts and we are working on a solution. There is no current solution"
4)He said he downloaded data from my van to a disk and would send it to Mazda in CA for evaluation
5) I asked what the time frame would be for a solution--and this is were it got kinda strange--he started to say how the transmission was shifting normally and that he was going out of his way to accomodate me....
6) The dealer refused to give a summary of their findings to me in writing
Well what can I say, having the hard shift "thing" is one thing but dealing with Orwellian language from Mazda is another.
I am quite frustrated at this point.
If that's not a safety issue then I'm a moron. I know that I'm not a moron because I've met plenty on the road and I've also been driving for 25+ yrs in nearly every make of car. After that event the wife said, "Oh, I was going to tell you about that. It's been doing that for about 2 months now." AHHHHH. She almost had to walk. I can’t bear to imagine what the inside of the tranny looks like. I don't believe a word of the TCM needing to “learn” unless somehow ours got retarded after 10 months of flawless driving.
Now for the smell. I don't believe previous posts about the smell not getting inside the vehicle. I also don’t believe the gas as the problem. I don’t know what’s changed but I remember that cars smelled during the 70’s, but didn’t in the 80’s & 90’s. Now we’re back to the sink in the 00+. Mazda isn’t the only one, I’ve smelt a few others.
I’ve definitely noticed the smell more in our MPV when I drive than when she drives. So, I believe it’s partially dependent on how you drive. I also had somebody follow me one day for 50 miles and my buddy said he’d never follow an MPV ever again. His wife looked GREEN when she got out. We didn’t even notice the smell that day. If that’s not a rolling stinking billboard not to buy a Mazda nothing is (are you still listening MAZDA). Personally, I think it stinks all the time and it’s just how the fumes come out the back and how you drive on any given day. None the less back to the shop it goes.
I have to leave on a positive note: I do really like our MPV despite the current problems. It handles great and the engine is smooth. It's one of the 20+ vehicles I've owned that has a personality. Much cooler than a Honda.
Happy Holidays
Having read some of your postings here, I plan to take it in to Signature Mazda, Richmond, BC, Canada (Selling Dealer) very soon. Post-servicing result to follow.
I glad I am not alone! :-)