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Lexus LS 400/LS 430

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Comments

  • maxhonda99maxhonda99 Member Posts: 1,289
    Huh...let's see, if the RX400h does get a noticeable increase in gas mileage over the RX330, how can it not be considered green?
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    I also do not understand the theme of your post. If the RX400h gets 50mph/gallon in the city and 40mph/gallon on the highway, who cares? That is still fabulous gas milage as an average.
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    Ended up less than 5% over dealer invoice (almost 9% under MSRP) in Midwest outside Chicago. Was going to lease but ended up deciding to buy at last minute and will wait to see what the '07 new model brings rather than have to make a change. I can be happy with this for years and years!
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    As long as there is some MPG improvement compared to a traditional drivetrain, I think there is a legitimate claim to being green, or at least greener than a traditional SUV.

    Also, you can think of it this way: a V6 hybrid is a whole lot greener than a V8 conventional, while offering similar performance.
  • mox1mox1 Member Posts: 24
    Aggie thanks for the info. Out here in Arizona, custom lux is not available. I am loooking at getting one shipped from out of state. Could you please post your dealer details. Thanks a bunch. How do you like the car. Do you find the Ecru interior getting dirty easily?
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    I own a 2004 LS430 (custom luxury) and I am very happy that I chose (with the persuation of my wife & daughter) the flint mica with black interior. The contrast between a dark color exterior & ecru interior does not look that great in my opinion. The dark interior looks richer. But I guess "beaty is in the eye of the beholder". I absolutely love my car. In fact, I like it so much so that I signed an agreement with Mr. Car Carwash to get unlimited washes & vacuums for about $30 per month. My LS430 looks beautifully clean almost all the time now. Since I didn't care much about my previous car (2001 STS), it looked dirty much of the time. Do you folks have any similar deals with car washes in your location?
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    Move over to the LS Buying and Pricing discussion for more info on my decision. That's where we should be.
  • jamesfletcher2jamesfletcher2 Member Posts: 127
    For any one interested in the Toyota "financial prowess" comments/discussions by Ljflx check out this NY Times article - http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/20/business/20auto.html
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    The ONLY advantage the Toyota hybrid design has is the ability to recover the energy that would otherwise go into heating the brake pads and rotors.

    Using the ICE to charge the batteries during hwy cruise increases the net loss vs simply an ICE.

    I'm sure many of you have noticed that many "standard" cars in the Prius class can easily get better highway MPG than it can. If a substantial portion of you driving doesn't involve a significant level of stop and go, or just letting the car gradually slow as you approach a stop, then any regular car will do just as well if not better.

    It's simply a matter of diminishing returns as you put on more vehicle weight, friction, etc, the energy recovered can only make up so much.

    The RX400h was due out in April, then mid-summer, then in the fall, now the latest I hear is early in 05. With the Prius selling like hotcakes and with such good fuel economy, what could be the delay?

    Especially now that the Ford Escape is already out using the Toyota Hybrid design.

    But with an I4 I might add.
  • ron36330ron36330 Member Posts: 69
    That sounds about right. I paid $20.00/wheel or $80.00 for installation. The reason the parts dept does not have them is that they are sold ONLY for CANADIAN Lexus'. You cannot buy here in the states through a US Lexus dealer.
    Ron
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    Besides regeneration there are a couple of hybrid advantages that come to mind:

    1. Better accelaration with the same size ICE, or same accelaration with a smaller ICE.

    2. ICE gets turned off during stops at traffic lights, etc. Saving fuel that would be wasted while idling.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Better acceleration comes from using the batteries, if the "charge" you're using came from recovered energy all well and good. But if the "charge" was the result of the ICE charging the batteries earlier then a small turbocharger would have been more efficient.

    Smallish engines such as in the Prius could undoubtedly be stopped and then quickly and easily restarted using the alternator via its drive belt.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    What are you talking about? What "standard car" is capable of even close to 60mpg? Or is SULEV\PZEV? Even the best, most fuel efficient turbo direct injection diesel's can only achieve around 40mpg, and they do NOT come close to the Prius's level of zero emmision tailpipe. The new E320 CDI cant even be sold in 5 states because its too dirty burning.

    Where did you get this info that the only way the electric can recharge is through using engine power? Do you even know how HSD works? I suggest you read up on it. Also, the RX isnt using electric power to run some sort of Lysolm screw type blower. The reason the 400h is faster than the 330 is because the same gasoline engine is used, and the electric augments it, adding 40 additional hp, and filling in the bottom of the torque range while the 6 is winding up to its peak power band. The RX330 can manage about 22mpg, and hits 0-60 in about 8 seconds. The RX400h will get around 40mpg, and hits 0-60 in about 7 seconds. Yeah that sounds like such a flop to me. Why would anyone possibly want a cleaner, faster, more fuel efficient car, when they could get a slower Toureg V8 that gets 12mpg. Now that is science.

    Where are all these supposed missed due dates coming from? The RX330 was introduced the end of last year as an '04, and the RX400h was planned for a late '04 introduction as an '05. It was never going to be some sort of mid model-year intro.
  • mox1mox1 Member Posts: 24
    Have been planning on buying a new LS430. Wondering whether I should wait for another 3 months before the MY2005 come out in Sept. Does anyone know what changes are slated to occur next year. The salesmen at Lexus dealer do not seem to know.
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    "Smallish engines such as in the Prius could undoubtedly be stopped and then quickly and easily restarted using the alternator via its drive belt."

    Are there other cars that actually do this? If not, I have to assume that it can't be done quickly enough to be unobjectionable. Personally, if a light turns green and I step on the gas, I want to get moving right away.
  • erad98erad98 Member Posts: 23
    Ron:

    I assume the guards were installed uneventfully on an "American" LS430? Please confirm prior to my purchasing the guards via the internet vendor referenced earlier (any other vendor recommendations?). Thanks for your help!
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    The Prius works in such a way that the gas engine stopping and starting is entirely seamless. The only way you can tell the engine is not running is that the car is eerily quiet. The Prius is not a stop light racer, and I doubt that anyone is buying it for its performance. However, 0-60 is average for the class, not bad considering the engine only produces roughly 74hp.
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    I do understand the basics of how the Prius works. I think wwest was saying that WITHOUT a hybrid capability, a normal ICE could be shut down at a traffic light and quickly restarted. I'm just skeptical that this would work fast enough.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    Yeah I'm sure. The next time I need to be in NYC, I'll try turning off my engine when the light turns red. I wonder how long it will be before I get shot.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    I would expect that there will be very minor, if any, changes in 2005. The only exciting possibility for 2005 is whether or not a hybrid will be made available at some point. If so it would probably be well after September. The real question is whether the big big changes due are in 2006 or 2007? With those changes we will undoubtedly get a hybrid either standard or as an option. I think its 2006 - can you hold out that long? If you can't but want those big changes - take a 24 or 36 month lease. If those changes aren't important to you than a late model year 2004 purchase will save you money and likely get you the same car you'd get in September as a 2005.

    As Aggie76 stated - you'll be happy for quite sometime in this 2004 - that's for sure.
  • ron36330ron36330 Member Posts: 69
    Yes that is correct. I live in Alabama and my LS is an 03 LS430, US spec. The US LS is the same as the Canadian version except for some mods appropriate to the climate. They look like factory installed Mud Guards.
    Hope this is what you wanted to know.
    Ron

    .
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    I dont know of any changes slated for the LS430 for '05. It was just freshened for '04, so I would expect it to continue pretty much unchanged until the '07 replacement.
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    Wow, had some time to go through my owner's manual and just keep finding amazing things about my new LS. Took family for a long ride last night and all are just overwhelmed with comfort and quiet of it. Am so glad I decided to stay in the Lexus family.

    Delivery experience was ok with dealer. I still rank the experience I had in getting my first Lexus at Superior Lexus in Kansas City as the finest. They had an interior room at the dealership with the car in it; decorated with chandeliers, couches and easy chairs, carpet, mirrors & music. The room was dark when we entered with music and the lights rose up as we stood there. They had soda pop and non-alcoholic champagne to celebrate the event and we spent as long as we needed to go over options, etc. Then when we were satisfied the curtains at one end parted, doors opened by remote and we could drive out.

    Having taken delivery of new car in all weather conditions this was, and 7 years later, still the best experience. Don't know if Superior is still at same location but they sure did it right.

    Dealer here was excellent in the entire experience and the car reflects that too.
  • erad98erad98 Member Posts: 23
    Ron:

    That's what I needed to know. Thanks!
  • topspin628topspin628 Member Posts: 373
    Has anyone recently compared the Edmunds TMV on the LS to the market prices actually being paid?
    Just curious on how accurate this has been proven to be.

    Also, any feed back on using their system of getting multiple price quotes via this site?
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    I just negotiated my deal on an '04 LS with Custom & Smart Access and the TMV is more than $5k higher than what I closed my deal for. I did get quotes from several dealers but stayed with my local dealer who beat them all based on my relationship and good negotiation skills. In fact, dealer beat a loan rate I found at another place without any questions once we had agreed on a price.
  • gteach26gteach26 Member Posts: 576
    For me, I use the TMV as the "unofficial" MSRP.... often times you can do MUCH better than TMV..much better. If anything, use it as "high" benchmark.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    Indeed, my '01 LS430 is my second LS, and its been just a fabulous car. I used to own an S420, and it just doesnt come close.
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    I had looked at a number of other's and just couldn't make a change from the quality, reliability & enjoyment of a Lexus after all the great years and miles on my GS. I seriously considered the S430, E500, Phaeton, A8L, and looked, just for grins at the new 300C HEMI. None come even close to the LS. Just spent 2 hours going over all the options and making some changes to the ones I could impact. This Nav is certainly more comprehensive than the one in my spouse's '01 MDX. I miss the joystick but am sure I will get used to this within a trip or two.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    I wasnt impressed by the Phaeton, and am not surprised that its a slow seller. The A8 already weighs like a billion pounds, and since it doesnt have the ASF, the Phaeton weighs like 2 billion pounds. Plus, it just looks like a super-Passat. The S class is ok, but its definitely due for a redesign. It just costs way to much money for what you actually get with the car. But hey, Im pretty sure a CD player comes standard now on an S430! Wow! The '04 LS uses their newest 3rd generation NAV, with roughly 6 million POI. It makes the rest of the systems in the industry look like a childs toy.
  • markemarke Member Posts: 1
    I've got a 2000 LS400 Platinum with 35,000 miles-just purchased from my father-in law. Its out of warrantee and I'm wondering if anyone has any recommendations for extending the warrantee-- programs , fees , etc...

    Thanks
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    It's going to be near impossible to find a car that can replace this car if luxury and refinement is what is sought. It just has such super quality and executes everything so perfectly ans so easily. A dream car.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    I wouldnt waste your time and money on an extended warranty, not for the LS. The only thing you'll have to concern yourself with for the next million miles on that car is scheduled maintanence, and warranties wont cover that. By the time you can expect to start having to replace parts (roughly around 120,000) your warranty will probably be up anyway. As long as the dealer does regular service, you'll be fine.
  • topspin628topspin628 Member Posts: 373
    Thanks for the heads up on that. Can I ask you what you paid for that vehicle?

    Also, does anyone know why the invoice price is not listed on TMV for the LS and where can I find that data.
  • swiftmswiftm Member Posts: 68
    A loud boom in the back of my 04 LS UL with 3k miles yesterday while driving to a restaurant, engine shut down four times and restarted x 3 until I pulled into a parking lot, then the whole electrical system shut down completely with the battery light flashing prior to that, I called the lexus national service number and they send AAA with a flat bed tow within an hour, got a loaner car about 15 miles away from my home, dealer will look into it on monday, this is my six lexus and second LS, first Lexus trauma, what is that all about??
  • steven1steven1 Member Posts: 4
    I'm checking out methods to carry 1-4 bicycles on the Lexus. I've ruled out trunk and roof carriers as I'm concerned about harming the finish. I'd like to install a hitch and be able to attach a carrier.

    Anyone have any experience?
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    There are a number of sites on the web. Do a Google search for auto invoice prices and several pop up.
  • woppenhewoppenhe Member Posts: 61
    Surprisingly, this was the advice I got from my delaer as well. I was going to replace my 2001 with the 2006 when it becomes available. Given that my vehicle has been maintained on schedule, the advice was to take a chance for a year or two rather than buy the expensive warranty. I have 40K and I think that the drive tain is basically protected long enough anyway. Anyone know the drive train warranties when the bumper to bumper expires, or are they the same. Haven't looked at this for a while
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    I am using a Thule hitch-mount rack on my LX, but since you're getting a hitch this would work equally well on a sedan. My particular model is great because you can swing it out and then to either side, allowing unfettered access to the trunk.

    BTW before the Thule I had a Rhode Gear trunk-mount rack, which we used on a sedan. It was a total pain taking the bikes and then the rack off just to get access to the trunk.
  • steven1steven1 Member Posts: 4
    You're right about the trunk mount rack. Either you think in advance of anything you might need in the trunk, or it's a major unmount and remount of the bikes.

    During my investigations, I'm finding that there are hitches for most other Lexus models except the 2004 LS430. I'd want a hitch also that would potentially be removable at time of sale/trade in as it doesn't add to the car's impressive look.
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    Just to clarify, with the rack I bought you only need a hitch receiver on the car, not a hitch per se (which I think of as one of those metal balls). I would call Lexus corporate customer service, I think it is 800-usalexus. If you find that a hitch receiver is not available from Lexus for the LS430, there are third party alternative such as going to u-haul or, I'm guessing, maybe sears. BTW, Thule or whomever may specify a certain Class hitch receiver, Class 2 for example.
  • lexus lslexus ls Member Posts: 10
    I am looking to but a 1995 ls 400. I wanted to know if when the sun roof is fully open does it make a like wind/loud bass that pulsates noise at like 20+ mph? I just want to know because i love sun roofs and if i can't open it all the way then i am not going to buy the car. Urgent lol, thanks for the time
  • steven1steven1 Member Posts: 4
    Sure can't help you on the noise. I know my LS430 is quiet. However, with regards to carrying bikes, it now makes no sense to attempt to attach them to the roof as it will block usage of the sunroof.

    Thanks for sharing.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    I had a 96 LS for many, many miles before I bought my '01, and I never noticed any kind of sunroof noise issues as low as 20mph. Granted, at 85mph on the highway, you probably arent going to want to have the sunroof open, but thats true of any car. Below like 60mph though, its pretty quiet.
  • topspin628topspin628 Member Posts: 373
    Any opinions on the merits and value of each of the above packages would be appreciated. I also want the Smart Key option and am not clear if it is included in either.

    Also, has anyone hear cross shopped the LS with the Jag XJ8 and MB E 500? These are my final contenders and I'm leaning toward the LS for reliability.
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    Yes, I have a very annoying low-pitched drumming noise from my open sunroof on my '04 LS430. My previous three cars (different brand) with sunroofs didn't have this problem. Something for Lexus to improve.
  • topspin628topspin628 Member Posts: 373
    Any opinions on the merits and value of each of the above packages would be appreciated. I also want the Smart Key option and am not clear if it is included in either.

    Also, has anyone hear cross shopped the LS with the Jag XJ8 and MB E 500? These are my final contenders and I'm leaning toward the LS for reliability.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Smart key is not part of the option packages. It's an add on to them and I believe just about every LS that comes in, except maybe the premiums, has it these days. The Custom Lux gets you a few more things - most notably dynamic laser cruise, laminated side windows etc, and in some cases includes nappa leather at an added cost. But in some areas it may have neen discontinued per posts from last week.

    I doubt many people here cross-shopped the E. It's a noticably smaller car in and out thus in a different class. Most either went straight LS or cross-shopped the S-class and in a few cases the 7-series. I had cross-shopped the E and the S-class with the LS (A8 as well) back in 2001. The E was no match for this car as a premium luxury sedan (I've been in the new E and it is no match either) but the S and this were a photo finish. As lavish as the S is I just find this car to be more luxurious, slightly smoother and better riding, a tad quieter and far more reliable. The fact that it is cheaper is the icing on the cake. The A8 is a stunning car (both in 2001 and now as far as I'm concerned) but it misses the refinement and smooth ride of cars like the LS and S by a wide margin. It's also a reliability nightmare. No Jag experience at all - I just know the people who used to live next door to me couldn't wait for their lease to be up. They had a reliable car but they just didn't like it. But that was around the 2000 MY.
  • acco20acco20 Member Posts: 211
    If the problem being discribed is what I think it is, it can be stopped by lowering a rear window about 1/4 to 1/2 inch while underway. Hope this helps.
  • lexusguylexusguy Member Posts: 6,419
    I can tell you of experience first hand with Jaguar, and M-B. The E is nice, but as one magazine put it "computer-controlled controls". The steering is vague, as is the throttle, and the brakes are just awful. I hate that electro-hydraulic nonsense. There is NOTHING wrong with good ole mechanical brakes. I dont want a computer trying to guess what mechanical brakes "should" feel like, when my ACTUAL brakes ACTUALLY feel like that. Other than that, the E has a very strong residual, and combined with free scheduled maintanence, makes it a good choice for a couple of year lease, and a bad choice for a long term buy.

    The XJ8 is all new for '04...and while it does improve a lot of things, (the majorly cramped cockpit for one), its still behind in a lot of things. Of all the full size luxury imports, the XJ has the least amount of features, the plasticy center console, and the rather claustrophobic high dash line. Plus, its not that much fun to drive. When you get into highway speeds, it feels nervous, and the typical Jaguar numb steering doesnt help. Also, why cant Jaguar do a decent set of brakes? It stll has their signature too long pedal stroke, followed by a mushy brake response as the binders try and stop the big car. Also, unlike M-B, the Jag's residual is literally horrible. The car will lose 50% of its value in 2-3 years. Its not very reliable either. Jag's CR ratings are the same as M-B and BMW as "worse than average".

    As for the S-class, it used to be a very nice car, but its become really dated, and really expensive for what it offers. In the last C&D super lux comparo, the rankings were as follows: (which I agree with 100%)

    6. M-B S430
    5. VW Phaeton
    4. Audi A8L
    3. BMW 745i
    2. Jag XJ8
    1. Lexus LS
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