Volvo S60

wmcmtm · January 2003

Volvo's finally put it out (on their Website). MSRP is $36,825. The V70R's is $38,325.

cmnott · January 2003

Imagine, for the price of an S60R, you can get a 330xi.

Gee which one teo get,hmmm?

Seriously, good on Volvo not starting abpve $40K, this will surely impact Audi and BMW (their AWD models).

rjs1177 · January 2003

I saw the post from redfive2112 comparing the CL-S to the S60, but does anyone know how it compares to the 330 and the G35? I am guessing the Volvo has slower acceleration, but if there are other major drawbacks, then I would like to know.
I have already test driven the BMW and Infiniti and both cars are awesome, but a little out of my price range (I need to save $ for a bike). The Volvo looks fine, but comfort, power, and handling are very important to me as well. I was hoping for a coupe, but I may have to settle for a sedan.
I'm going to test the S60 T5 tonite, but sometimes it's a little hard to tell from a test drive.

ryoken · January 2003

I test drove a T5 about 5 weeks ago when I was trying to pick out a new sedan. It's quicker than I expected, the turbo 5 packs a pretty good punch (though the G35 and 330i are quicker). You say comfort and handling are both important to you, yet those two things are often at odds. The G35 and the 330 lean more towards handling, while the S60 leans more towards comfort (and it's a front wheel drive, if that's important to you). The car I drove had the Valvetronic transmission, and I thought it was a bit slow to change gears in manual mode. It has some nice little perks in other areas. The trunk is deceptively deep. The seats were the most comfortable of any of the cars I tried out. The rear headrests can be flipped down with a switch on the center console to improve your rear view when there are no rear passengers. Plus, as you say, money is a factor - and the 2002 Volvos are going for cut-rate prices right now, as the 2003's are already out. Since money is an issue, make sure you call your insurance company and get quotes from them on your top two or three choices, as there can be surprising differences. The G35 is classified as a "high-performance vehicle" and actually costs more than the 330 to insure. I also tried out a Cadillac CTS, Audi A4, and Acura TL-S before deciding on the G35. It comes down to the comfort/handling preference. Do you want a luxury-sport car (S60, A4) or a sport-luxury car (330, G35)? Of course, the money is a nice choice too. The dealership I was at was advertising $5k off MSRP on the 2002's, and I'd imagine you can do better than that.

rghessel · January 2003

Can anyone comment obbjectively on the quality of the stereo upgrade in the S60? I've read it is truly amazing. Unfortunately, my local dealer had no cars on the lot with the upgrade, so I couldn't hear it for myself. I superb stereo can easily shift the balance for me. (Currently considering G50, 330xi, Saab 9-3...)

dmarcus48 · January 2003

I'm thinking about leasing a s60 t5 in the next couple of months. I was going to get it with the 17" wheels, but have been told not to because of potholes. I live in NJ and the roads can sometimes be rough. Any suggestions?

rghessel · January 2003

*so many typo's in my original post...how embarassing!*

Can anyone comment objectively on the quality of the stereo upgrade in the S60? I've read it is truly amazing. Unfortunately, my local dealer had no cars on the lot with the upgrade, so I couldn't hear it for myself. A superb stereo can easily shift the balance for me. (I am currently considering G35, BMW 330xi, Saab 9-3...)

Thanks!

cmnott · January 2003

Hmmmm. Comfort, power and handling. that pretty much sums up this car's strengths in order of achievement.

Supremely comfortable car, thanks to the seats, driving position, phenomenal Prol Logic system and quiet ride.

Power? This car in manual form is simply a brute. The Geartronic takes away quite a bit of the intial accelaration but it does make up for it in the end. The Volvo is good off the line, but it positively honks to 100mph, faster than any sedan in its group and just .3 behind the S4. That, my firends, is a true display of power. If you can find a road to use it.

Handling is average. I have the Sport suspension and 17" wheels (Thor), I find the steering is very good but sometimes lacks feel in aggressive driving. It has a lot of grip and is very good in slalom but quick transitions can be tricky. Of course, this is all relevant at 9/10ths driving or at the limit. Otherwise, it has a much better ride than the 330i and G35 and pretty much equal to the A4.

Lastly, if you want a coupe, I think the silhouette of the beautiful S60 should help! Good luck but they aren't any losers in this crowd of cars. they are all fantastic.

cmnott · January 2003

I don't know what diff there will be, if you hit a pothole, I would think regardless of rim it will damage whatever size rim. Like I mentioned above I have the 17" Thors and the car looks stunning in black with these rims.

cmnott · January 2003

In all seriousness, the Dolby Pro Logis system, the only car to have this system (still?) is phenomenal, and this coming from an audiophile. i had a 99 Mustang GT prior with the Mach 460 and also have a 2002 Explorer Eddie Bauer with the JBL and these two systems are laughable compared to the Volvo.

As Edmunds wrote in their review, the clarity and surround sound can bring tears to your eyes. you must find a system to test...you simply will not beleive your ears! From amazing highs to young punk quality bass, this system has it all.

The only system that was remotely close at the time of my purchase was not the BMW (average and tinny) but the jag X-Type with the optional Alpine system was remarkable.

rghessel · January 2003

Is the stereo upgrade in the S60 the same stereo in the S80?

You have NO idea how much influence an awesome stereo can have over my car purchase.

The S60 has moved to the top of my list, neck and neck with the Saab 9-3 Arc (which isn't out yet). Then to decide...T5 or AWD? Any thoughts?

dmarcus48 · January 2003

I think the issue is that with a 16" wheel there's more side wall to absorb the shock than with a 17" wheel. But thanks for your reply anyway.

Dave

mikew18 · January 2003

The seat belt take up on our 2002 S60 squeaks continually. It is very irritating to ride on the passenger seat and listen to this. We took it to the dealer and he found nothing wrong with it but agreed it squeaked. The service advisor told me he was going to order me a new one. After I had not heard from him I called back two weeks later. He than told me he was waiting to talk to his Volvo rep since he had two other customers with the same problem. After I expressed my displeasure he ordered a new one and guess what it still squeaks. He told me he went around to other s 60's and s80 on the lot and found that many of them do it. It only happens on the passenger side and only when the belt is at full extension. After I called him today to tell him it still squeaked he told me he would contact the volvo rep again and call me back. He later called me back and offered me a seat belt ex tender. However, he asked me to sign a waiver stating use of the extender may negate certain safety features. Well, safety is one reason we bought it. I am a big guy but can comfortably buckle the belt now. It does than extend to near the limit, it remains my opinion it should not do this. They seem not to be offering a solution to it. My wife, who is the principal user is very upset. We like the car but this is not the first time they have been unable to fix something. Anyone else have this seat belt issue? Also advise on how to proceed with the dealer and the escalation process. I believe I have had my last dealing with the service advisor and am ready to walk this one up.

rghessel · January 2003

Does anyone know when the S60 R is expected to be in showrooms?

wrxsoon1 · January 2003

rghessel,
I believe the new R's (S60 and V70) are due in showrooms in March or so. At least that is what I've gathered from all my research so far. I'm very interested in the 70 myself. ;-)

-Ian

shadowchaser · January 2003

OK, lots of people have commented on the rear seats not being great for a long trip. If I spend 35K for this car, can I go out with another couple for dinner and not mush their knees in the back seat? I don't sit too far back with the driver seat and most people I hang out with are 5'6" -5'11".

Am I doomed to spending 8K more for the S80 because of the back seat?

desaljs · January 2003

I would not be too concerned about rear seat space. I use my S60 alone most of the time. But I do transport adults back there for shorter trips and so far, no complaints. If you are only going to transport adults on shorter trips, I do not think you need to consider the S80. Besides, the S80 is at the end of its life and will be replaced in the not too distant future. I really like my S60 and find the size "cozy". Hope this helps.

rghessel · January 2003

Found this very detailed website about the upcoming S60R...

http://vcc.volvocars.se/r/

rghessel · January 2003

I never thought I'd consider a Volvo (!), but I'm very serious about getting an S60. I'm considering an AWD or the upcoming S60R.

For current owners, a question:
What do you like least about your S60? (I am sure there are so many things to like about the car, I find it more useful to hear about the gripes)

On a side note, I'm really intrigued about the S60R. Anyone have any thoughts/advance info about it?

Thanks!

volvomax · January 2003

Advance info, 300hp AWD, 6spd manual.
Semi-active suspension w/ 3 different damping modes.
Basically, a sports car for the street.
2000 to be built for America.
Mean price somewhere around $43000.
Do you like to drive fast?
Do you like sports cars?
If so go for it!
Do you like comfort and quiet?
Do you hate to shift gears?
If so go with the S60 2.4T or AWD.

Fianlly drove our 03 AWD, nice car.
Almost as fast as the 2.4T and feels alot more stable.Plus you can get the T5 seats with it!

cmnott · January 2003

Hmmmm....that's a tough one. May I add that this car is a phenomenal winter car. Those Swedes have extremely cold weather and these cars certainly handle these tough conditions with aplomb. It has been consistently -30+C in Ottawa for a week and the car does not have that feel that it will crumble to pieces when you start it or drive it immediately after starting it. I don't warm it up and you cannot tell that it hasn't been warmed up. Amazing!

I would have to say that the steering isn't the best I have sampled. Keep in mind that it is fine for everyday driving, it is when you drive aggressively that it doesn't respond as I would like. in time, you know how to throw your car, but on a test drive, it may put you off.

banker74 · January 2003

I'm assuming many of you know the R pricing for the US was announced. A VERY pleasant suprise for sure:

http://www.swedespeed.com/main_news/01_03_03.html

Also, an FYI, vvspy.com (as well as Swedespeed.com) is a great resource and a more active forum than this

justanotherjoe · January 2003

My lease on '00 S80T6 is up in 4 + months. Test drove an '03 2.5TAWD S60 a couple days ago and had a good first impression. Looks like I can get close on the features I like most about the S80 - power/acceleration (albeit not quite as smooth), driver/cabin comfort (with sport package seats) and the great dolby pro-logic cd changer sound system, while improving on what I feel are the S80 shortcomings -suspension noises, less then crisp handling and torque pull. Has anybody else made/considering making this switch? Seems there are currently good pricing/lease incentives out there on existing stock of cars (I believe primarily on S60's and S80's) - I'm waiting to get numbers back from local dealer on the one I drove. The R seems like an interesting option - especially w/newest pricing figures. I was told they are only importing 2,000 to U.S. total. If true, seems it will be advance ordering prior to being able to test drive?

volvomax · January 2003

We've taken quite a few people from the S80 to the S60.
Mostly for budget reasons.
The 60 is more fun to drive.
If you don't need the backseat, go with the 60.
As for the R, we don't know when we will be getting a demo car.

avolvofan · January 2003

And do not plan on getting any price concessions on the S60R. You will be lucky to pay MSRP without any dealer-added markup.

hclll · January 2003

I am 6 feet 2 inch high and am cosidering an S60. Do you think the front room is ok for me or I need a larger car?

Also, What is the price for an S60 2.4T with only leather and geartronic tranny? Is the rebate still available?

dmarcus48 · January 2003

I'm 6'5", 235 lbs, and have been test driving the s60, you will be very comfortable in it. Amazingly so.

Dave

mikew18 · January 2003

For the third time my s60 awd is headed for the dealer next week for the squeaking brakes. The seat belt return continues to squeak and the service guy now tells me he has talked to the Volvo rep who will talk to the Volvo engineer about it. It has my wife so upset we have been driving my old jeep Cherokee the last week or so.
I am 6'3" 250 and have no problems with the front of the S60 lots of room and great seats, if only the damned thing would not squeak. I want very much to love this car, but right now, i am not really happy with it.

dmarcus48 · January 2003

All,
I went down to the Volvo dealer to try and figure out which s60 I wanted. I found out that I could get an s80 for the price of a loaded s60 awd. The s80 is a 2.9 model with the premium pkg, cold climate pkg, and 17" wheels. My concern is ... is the base engine on the 2.9 strong enough, and have the reliability problems with the s80 been fixed. The s80 is really a better choice for me because of the increased rear legroom over the s60. I'm comfortable in both. The s60 seems to me to be "sportier", but the s80 did drive and handle well.

I realize I'm on the s60 forum, but I'd like to know what you guys think.

cmnott · January 2003

I am attributing this to the relentless, bitter cold and salt on our road...it is constantly -30C for the last few weeks and they have been sueaking. If it continues, I will haveit serviced. What would they do? I don't have any loss of power or vibration...

smg5 · January 2003

I drove the AWD last night, and really liked it. I have a few questions if anyone here knows the answers to any or all ... This car, fully loaded, is on the upper end of, if not over, my price limit, so I really want to be sure ...

1. The dealer tried to dissuade me from the upgrade stereo and traction control as they would be "special orders". I can wait 6 weeks, so I'm not too concerned, but I wouldn't want to pay $1300 for a stereo that I hadn't heard. Are they so unusual that it's hard to find one to hear on the lot?

2. Is the traction control worth the $700? Does it kick in often in snowy/icy conditions? Dealer tried to downplay it, but if I weren't worried about traction, I wouldn't want AWD.

3. Re: the dual climate control -- can you set it so that the driver is the master control; ie, if I'm alone, I don't always have to adjust both? (side note: why not digital? Can't have everything, I guess ...)

4. Any thoughts on the navigation system?

5. Any idea how long the 1.9% for 60 months financing will last?

6. Do they come off sticker at all on the 2003s? I assume if any 2002s are left, I won't be able to get the traction or upgraded stereo.

7. Is it possible to get an auto-dim mirror without the rest of the touring package?

8. How does Volvo rate for repair/maintenance costs compared to, say, a BMW or Audi?

Any other thoughts, suggestions, warnings ...?

volvomax · January 2003

1 Stereo.
The audiomax is a wonderful system, but only offered on the T5 or AWD, so not very common.
If your not an audiophile the standard system is very good too.
2DSTC.
Is a yaw control program, designed to help keep a car from spinning out if you are driving thru a curve in rain or snow.
If your planning on racing in the wintertime, go for it. Otherwise the standard drive system will protect you as long as you use some common sense in foul weather
3Dual climate
Is independent for each side.
Volvo prefers knobs and dials since they are simpler.
4Nav system
A nice toy. If you do alot of traveling worth it, otherwise I'd pass on it.
5 1.9% financing

volvomax · January 2003

1 Stereo.
The audiomax is a wonderful system, but only offered on the T5 or AWD, so not very common.
If your not an audiophile the standard system is very good too.
2DSTC.
Is a yaw control program, designed to help keep a car from spinning out if you are driving thru a curve in rain or snow.
If your planning on racing in the wintertime, go for it. Otherwise the standard drive system will protect you as long as you use some common sense in foul weather
3Dual climate
Is independent for each side.
Volvo prefers knobs and dials since they are simpler.
4Nav system
A nice toy. If you do alot of traveling worth it, otherwise I'd pass on it.
5 1.9% financing
is offered thru the end of Feb, no word on an extension
6 Discount off sticker
Should be able to get something, unless the car is in high demand in your area. No rebate though.
7 Auto dim mirror
Only thru tour pkg.
8 repair/maintenance
Audi and BMW offer free maintenance for 50k, after that your on your own, they get expensive from there.
Volvo priced less so no free maintenance, service every 7500 miles.
costs average for $30,000+ car.
Repairs can be costly for any European car, if you plan on keeping the car past the warranty period consider an extended warranty.
Basically the 03 is a better car than the 02, more power and better driveability.

vegased · January 2003

To answer rghessel's question above, I think it's pretty safe to say, now, that they will be out in May. I had also been hearing March or April, but the Volvo reps at the LA Car Show and the Sales Mgr at our local dealership have both told me that May is pretty firm.

ariatari · February 2003

I've read a good many of the posts here over the last few days, and am still up in the air on these 2 cars. I've driven both twice, and am having a hard time with the decision.

The Acura has more power, is a little bigger, and really has more "giddy-up", but the interior isnt as nice, the lack of airbags (curtain) is somewhat of a concern from a safety standpoint, and I don't like that the rear seats dont fold.

The Volvo, while a 5 cylindar, still has some "go", esp with the geartronic shift (I'll miss my stick shift :-( ), and I love the comfort of the interior. The steering is so-so too. Also, the local dealer has his own twist on the current travel abroad package, and I can get the 2.4T with the premium, touring, sport and climate packages for 29500, which is close to 5500 less that the msrp here in the states (and even below invoice). Not to mention the trip, which is nice :-).

I also looked at the G35, and while I loved the power, I didnt care much for the interior and it was more "sporty" than what I was looking for.

Anyone have anything else I should be considering? I'm also expecting a kid soonish, and need to think about space in the backseat for a carseat.

Thanks!!!

amazon · February 2003

I chose the TL-p, mainly for quality reasins. I had an '00 S70 before, and had a lot of trouble with it. I just love the Acura. The car is a real treat to drive. THe seats are better in the Volvo, though.

wmquan · February 2003

The Volvo has more complete safety features than the TL, a better luxury interior, and generally a better sports sedan character. The TL will be more reliable in the long run, have more space, more power and probably better resale.

You probably already know this, but the TL is due to be replaced real soon now, on a platform based on the new Accord. It should be significantly improved, more expensive, and have better safety features like side curtain airbags.

Personally, I would not buy a sedan/coupe without side curtain airbags, especially with all those higher SUV's and minivans out there. NHTSA's side-impact tests are based on a small sedan hitting the car; the results could be a lot different if a big SUV t-bones the vehicle at a higher point.

Also, you might want to look at the new Acura TSX. Based on the smaller European Accord, it does have side curtains though the Volvo is still better engineered from the overall safety standpoint.

cmnott · February 2003

1. I wouldn't get it without the AudioMax, but I am an audiophile.

2. DSTC is phenomenal, I enjoy it as right before my house I have to do a hard left turn, so I go into the corner, when it is snowy and obviously clear, without slowing. Sure enough. the car makes the turn. I feel the front right tire brake, then the driver's rear tire brake. It is so cool. But if you are getting AWD I wouldn't bother.

3. I love the simplicity of the knobs. On my 2002 Explorer EB, I have it electronically and I enjoy the Volvo system better.

4. Waste of money, unless you travel a lot.

8. Two services a year for me, no biggie.

It is a fantastic car. Underrated because it won't win any road course races against Bimmers, etc... but in everyday driving, it is better than all the rest, IMO. That is why I got a T5.

hclll · February 2003

ariatari, you know what, I am doing exactly the same thing, wandering btwn TL and 2.4T right now.

I test drove an S60 2.4T On Saturday, found the engine has enough torque for me, but is not as smooth as the TL engine. I thought maybe all turbo engines are kind of rough, and so are some non-turbo engines that use turbo effect(e.g. TL-S engine). Even when I put the gear in parking, there is still some noticable vibration through the steering wheel. But the cabin is very-well isolated.

The front seats of S60 are firm yet comfy but little bit lacks side support. Cushion is smaller campared to TL's. Cabin feels narrower than TL but actually is wider according to the hiproom data on this website.

The TL I wanted to consider is base model, not type-S, because comfort , rather than power, is my first priority. (No money for a lexus). Compared to the S60, TL is smoother and quieter, is the best value for the money, but now I don't really trust American-built cars. For me,another bad thing on TL is the tight headroom because I am 6-2 tall. Although TL is 1 feet longer than S60, but it has only 1.5 inch more rear legroom.
Also, TL bumpers are a lot softer than the S60's, so the paint on them is easy to chip if get bumped. ( I live in a damnd "big" city where people bulldoze othe people's car away to get out parking spot.) Especially S60 has rubber protector on the bumpers.

Here is the compariso:
//TL pros//: Xenon, Large, 6-disk changer, smoothness, residual value.

//TL cons//: thin body panel easy to get dent, American-bulit quality, potential tranny issue.

//S60 pros//: Comfort front seats, cool styling, autostick is nicer than TL's, thick panels and hard bumpers.

//S60 cons//: no Xenon, small backseats, rear visibility, expensive.

cfg1 · February 2003

Is is possible to do a lease with European delivery?

volvomax · February 2003

Yes, but not with Volvos enhanced lease packages.
Have to find a bank that will do a lease with the car out of the country

aneta · February 2003

I am considering buying/leasing an S60 2.4 AWD. Wondering whether the car is not a little sluggish.
In addition, I would appreciate any feedback on reliability and quality of service. I hold cars for longer time and usually so not have significant problems. Of course, this model is relatively new.
Thanks in advance

danncas · February 2003

I have a Mercedes C230. I have been looking to replace it. I looked a several car. Audi a4 3.0, BMW 330xi or the 325xi, Mercedes Class. I have been to two auto show in the last month and several dealers. The Audi is nice but the back it very small, The BMW is the same. So after several time back and forth I decieded Mercedes or a Volvo. The Mercedes I'm looking at is 215 hp C320 with 4 matic will cost me over 40k. The Volvo also a 208 AWD. The Volve has less leg room in the back and doesn't have as many extra's as the Benz like real wood, power tilt wheel,auto tilt passenger mirror, and more. But I was told that if I pick the Volvo up overseas that I can get the Volvo S60AWD for less then invoice. Mercedes on the other hand offers no price reduction at all. So Im looking at getting the Volvo. I hope it will be as good as a car as the 1998 C Class Benz has been for me.

subyaudidude · February 2003

since I no longer own either a Subaru or an Audi. *sigh* Oh well. I am the proud new owner of a base-level S60 as of about 11 hours ago. Actually, I was until my wife drove it, so now I'm the proud new passenger of a base-level S60. *LOL*

Anyways, I have a couple questions regarding the installation of a Britax Roundabout convertible child safety seat. First, we tried our darndest and just could not get it in securely in the center rear seating position (the seat is not a LATCH/ISO-FIX model). No matter how hard we tried it was always loose and could easily shift from side to side. Has anyone had success at putting a child seat in the center rear position? We ended up putting it on an outboard position, where it's solid as a rock.

Second - at the rear of the front seat rails there is a metal "loop," one on each rail. Are these teather anchors for teathering rear-facing child safety seats? I couldn't find ANYTHING about them in the owner's manual. Thanks in advance.

dmarcus48 · February 2003

danncas,

I don't know what state you live in, but here in NJ you can get a loaded s60 2.4t or awd for well under invoice. There are some great deals out there now because the 2004's will be out in a couple of months, and I think that volvo is trying to unload the 2003's.

Dave

robr2 · February 2003

Try www.carseat.org

Lots of good information there.

Does Britax have a latch kit available for that seat? If so that might help.

Lastly, call your local police or fire dept. Usually someone on staff is trained and certified in the proper installation. They may even advise you not the use the center location if they feel the seat cannot be installed properly there.

Good Luck.

pat · February 2003

subiaudidude - if you really want to change your username, write to the Senior Host, KarenS -- karen@edmunds.com -- and ask for her assistance.

:-)

cmnott · February 2003

I have a Fisher-Price seat for 22-45lbs and when it is n the middle it is virtually part of the car, it is that solid. I am inclined to think that you are doing something wrong...do you kneel on the seat when you install it? It makes the car seat so sturdy, you leave imprints in the seat.

Good luck and enjoy your new S60!

subyaudidude · February 2003

ROBR2: - no, unfortunately Britax is not offering a retro-fit LATCH kit for the Roundabout.

CMNOTT: my wife swears she's pushing down as hard as she can on the seat.

We'll probably try again this afternoon. The only thing I can think of is a possible compatability issue between the Roundabout and the middle seat. As I said, we'll keep trying.

PAT: I can do that? Cool! Whadya think - VolvoMazdaDude ... hmmm, may as well be FordGuy. *LOL*

danncas · February 2003

dmarcus48
Dave I live in Pa. The dealer told me that I could do even better if I do a European delivery. I can get a discount threw the company I work for, but I was told that I could do better if I go over and pick it up. I'm really thinking about it. I have famaly in Europe and it would be great for 2003 xmas. I want to odered a S60 AWD at the end of this year. A 2004 model. Unless the S80 comes out with AWD.

Volvo S60

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