VW Passat Wagon vs Subaru Wagons

taft4 · October 2004

We owned a 2003 Forester 25XS Premium with leather for 18 months and put 12,000 miles on it. Mechanically, the car was faultless and when we traded it in we were pleased by its low depreciation.

However, its ride was stiff (hard) and it was noisey. By that I mean there were no rattles but the engine was louder than what we were used to especially when accelerating or traveling at expressway speeds. The automatic shifter was just plain goofy, something CU has also commented on. The 4-wheel drive was a waste in flat Chicagoland territory. Perhaps we were spoiled by the car we traded in on the Forester which was a 97 Towncar, which we loved but decided that it was getting too cumbersome in crowded parking spaces and our underground garage.

After looking at a lot of cars we bought the 04 Passat (GLX V6 sedan) and in the 6 months we have owned it we have enjoyed its smooth ride, its size, its good handling, and especially its quietness. For us and our usage and needs, the Passat is far superior to the Forester.

snarks · October 2004

I would not compare a Forester at all to a Passat (apples and oranges). The Forester shares its platform with the Impreza both smaller cars. A true comparison would be a Legacy GT or Outback (with Turbo or V6) and I think they are comparable. It just comes to personal preference, nice interior Passat or much more power in Subaru etc.

fendertweed · October 2004

Sorry, beg to differ, 90k is not a huge amount of miles on a modern car, they are routinely engineered to do well over 100k, often up to 200k or more without major engine work.

I have a friend in CT who had a Legacy GT that also died last winter, fried head gasket. His mechanic up there said he'd seen at least 4 of the same last winter.

It's definitely scaring me away from Subies, which are near the top of my list when I have to shop for a car next. There's no excuse for head gaskets at 100k or less on a car that's been properly maintained IMO.

ateixeira · October 2004

Boxers have a characteristic growl, but rev it up, no harm done!

Mine has 69k miles, and I'm still on my original brake pads. Repairs have cost me exactly $0.

Passat competes at a price level above the Forester, if you compare the Legacy it's more of a match, more refined, quieter, etc.

Subaru has stretched the warranty on head gaskets to 8 years or 100k miles, so apparently they agree with you.

Besides, it's been nothing compared to the problem VW had with ignition coils, not even close.

-juice

zscottie · November 2004

Can someone tell me the differences between VW's 4motion vs Subaru's AWD system? I'm trying to decide between an Outback XT vs Passat 4motion sedan/wagon (1.8T 5spd auto)

krzyss · November 2004

between 170HP car and 250HP "truck" ?

Krzys

ateixeira · November 2004

4Motion is a marketing name, I say that because it's used on several different systems.

In the case of the Passat, it actually gets Audi's Quattro, i.e. the center torsen diffy with traction control added to both axles.

I did some research and found a couple of limitations. First, it can only send up to 67% of power to either axle. Also, while a torsen is fast acting, it's still mechanical and reactive.

Subaru's VTD starts with a 45/55 default power split, but that AWD system can send 100% of power to either axle. It's also proactive in that it'll shift power to the rear axle when you're on an uphill, to the front when traveling down hill, and so on. Power shifts before there is slippage, so I consider it proactive.

However, with available stability control, the VW manages both axles, i.e. power split from side to side. The Subaru has a rear LSD only, so the front axle is not managed.

In summary, the OB XT isn't limited as to how much power can be sent to one axle, plus it can be proactive.

The Passat, however, manages both axles.

On the road both are plenty more than enough, it'll depend more on the tires you have mounted. The OB does have a lot more ground clearance so it would still be the better choice in deep snow.

The post above hints that a Legacy GT would be more comparable to the Passat, and I'd have to agree.

-juice

krzyss · November 2004

to power difference too.
VW 1.8T compares well to basic 2.5 Subaru engine.
Subaru's 2.5T requires VW to bring 3.2VR6. Passat does not offer comparable engine to 2.5T, for now (W8 had comparable power but was much heavier - it is discontinued by the way).

Krzys

PS AWD system is minor difference in this case. Suspension, tires and power clearly make them different animals. IMHO.

ateixeira · November 2004

Yeah, Subaru's base engine is N/A, the upgrade engine a turbo (let's ignore the H6 for a minute).

VW has the opposite, base is turbo and upgrade a V6.

W8 was nice but they priced it too high.

Nice to have lots of AWD choices, though.

-juice

evanderkolk · May 2005

Hey I'm a college student and looking to buy a car that will take me from maryland to California. I'm a rock climber and need something to haul a bunch of gear. I've come across two car within my price range and wanted a little feedback. The first is 97 outback limited with 126K mi with a price of $5500 and the other is 98 passat wagon with 65K mi for $6500 (both are private sellers and prices negotiable) I've noticed from this thread that the VW tend to have a lot of maintenace issues, but with the huge mileage difference will the subaru most likely have more? The history I've gotten on VW lists a bunch of repairs like brake calipers (i think there was a recall) and fan belt was recently replaced. The seller also said that theres a minor oil leak. The subaru, however, seems to not have any problems, no leaks, no major repairs and the car was used pretty much only for highway driving. One thing I liked about the VW was the acceleration, it clearly beat the subaru but id rather have something that I won't have to spend tons of money repairing. I'm planning on having a mechanic check them both out before I buy. Any thoughts?

ateixeira · May 2005

Wow, that's a lot. At that point it's all about what kind of maintenance was done to it, and pure luck.

The Passat is so much newer and lower mile that it would negate any reliability advantage the Subaru might have, IMO.

Check that leak, however, on the Passat.

Good thing about the Subie is that if the head gaskets have not failed by now, they probably never will.

I might keep shopping and try to find a lower mile Subie. Keep something in mind - the 2.2l in the Legacy wagon is Subaru's most durable engine. Back then the Legacy had it, the Outback did not.

-juice

PF_Flyer · May 2005

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davinocal · May 2005

I am down to a Passat TDI Wagon and a Subaru Legacy GT. Except for the hauling capability, they're pretty much apples and oranges. I am attracted to the TDIs outstanding fuel economy, the ride/quiet (I kind of like the way the diesel drives...) and the finish. But, I am not down with the supposed mechanical issues... The only thing holding me back from the Subaru is the gas mileage, aside from that this car is pretty awesome (and the 4WD would be great for this climate). I am moving to Utah from nocal and so gas is much cheaper. But, I am curious what people's real world experience is w/mileage on the Sub. Any feedback is good on either car. Thanks.

ateixeira · May 2005

KarenS, "Subaru Crew: MPG-Real World Numbers" #1, 16 May 2005 10:33 am

Real-world mpg for Subies belonging to Edmunds members.

Diesel fuel costs more than premium gas around me, make sure you factor that in. I do think the Passat's excellent range would be an advantage. But just remember as they fase in low-sulfur diesel the prices will only creep up more.

-juice

xwesx · May 2005

Depending on your point of view, 126K can be a lot, but I do not think it is for a '97. My '96 has 185K on it and it is not what I would consider excessively high mileage for that year (turns 10 years old come August).

If it has been well-maintained, the '97 would be a sure thing in my mind. But, I'd watch out for electrical problems that exist. Drive it; play with it; drop your offer based on any deficiencies. Don't go for it if you hear any grinds, scrape-squeaks, or if the tranny hesitates when put in gear. Look at the coolant and the valve-covers (bottom rear corners) for any signs of leakage. Subarus are good cars but they only age gracefully if they are very well-maintained.

That's my $.02. I haven't much experience with VW - I'm just going by price as preference.

ateixeira · May 2005

The good thing is that any flaws tend to be more obvious in an AWD subie. Listen for differential noise, wheel bearing whine, etc. If it's whisper quiet, buy it.

-juice

sahara111 · June 2005

Well Davinocal,

I can't give you a perfect answer, ie wagon vs. wagon. However I have
just purchased 2 new vehicles in the last 5 weeks close to what you are
after:

1. Got the new 2005 Passat TDI GLS sedan (auto, silver) on 4/30/2005 (19
miles on odomoter). My morning commute (8 miles 40-50mph on 2 lane,
then 40 miles I-5 at mostly 70mph) gets me about 39-40mpg so far, a
couple trips though have seen 42mpg. Return home nets about 1-2mpg
less. Car has about 2700 miles now, still breaking-in I guess. Mixed
driving thus far (w/in-town, stoplights, etc) is netting about 34-35mpg.
I use Flying-J diesel, and add about 4-5 oz of Diesel Kleen each
fill-up. My Flying J here has been $2.12/gal (cheaper than unleaded)
but is currently $2.21/gal. Car now has the optional VW 17" wheel/tire
set on it, I put about 38psi front, 44psi rear in them. This set was
included in my original deal; dealer was stupid and said they would have
to 'order' them in, right; then finally decided just to take them off
another Passat which they did. Handling improved immediately (drove
w/16" set first 2 wks), ride is a bit firmer, but noise only increased
very, very slightly. However, the 16" set is a softer, more 'luxury'
ride so consider that. I have no idea how mileage is on a Wagon version
of this car; I seem to recall though that the weight is quite a bit more
for the wagon...?, as opposed to....

2. We just picked up our new 2005 Legacy GT (non-Limited) wagon (auto,
Regal Blue!!) on 5/31/2005 (100 miles on odometer); I had a very hard
time getting exactly what we wanted. Only have about 750 miles so far,
have seen about 22 mpg in all mixed driving; it is VERY hard not to go
fast or stab the accelerator, it is an absolute rush (yes, yes, trying
to keep 'er below 4000rpm, etc, etc), I use the Sport Mode a lot, and
play with the paddle shifters too. According to Subaru specs, the wagon
only weighs about 60lbs or so more than the sedan (again, non-Limited,
auto tranny), so for me it was a no brainer. I had driven the wagon
before (auto) and the sedan in both versions. Definitely, the manual is
even meaner and way quicker off the line, but once moving the difference
is not quite as great. I haven't even check tire pressures yet, so need
to do that, etc.

One thing is for sure: these cars' suspensions do not compare. The TDI
sedan is nice and is very fun in its own way at highway speeds and its really satisfying gettig the great mileage, but the Subie is a whole 'nother story brother.

For you, you will have to consider how many miles you drive and see what
the cost diff will be; maybe insurance will play a role too. For us, we
were doing 35k miles total (2 vehicles) so I was able to afford one of
each....

BTW: we have replaced 2 SUVs: the '99 Trooper (117,000 miles,
outstanding reliability for us) is gone; the '98 Landcruiser (100,000,
also outstanding) is now listed too. Our new 2 payments + fuel on 2
vehicles = 1 payment + fuel on 2 SUVs (no change in insurance for us);
plus, we have 2 new vehicles and are avoiding higher mileage mandatory
maintenance costs, etc.

Good luck to you!

kens · June 2005

Wow, you certainly are qualified to answer in this forum! That's a great combination you have there. I'd love to hear more comparisons and contrasts between the two.

Ken

mmarton · August 2005

I just noticed your post, so you've probably made your decision between the VW and Subaru by now.

I just traded in my '01.5 New Passat Wagon with 54,000 miles on a 2005 Subaru Legacy 2.5i L wagon. I don't know if the '98 has the same problems but mine was a maintenance nightmare from the beginning and wallet drain after the two-year warranty ran out. It's a shame because the Passat is such a great car. But the last straw was when I brought it in for service to the VW dealer on the transmission (covered under the 10-year/100K mile powertrain warranty) which was done for free. However, the service folks said I had to have the rear brake rotors and a motor mount replaced.

Unbelievable. I didn't even have to change the brake pads on my 93 Mazda 626 until 100K miles. Never had to change the rotors.

ateixeira · August 2005

Consider getting the Chase Subaru credit card, you get 3% back in "Subaru Bucks" and can use those to pay for maintenance. I've collected $500 worth and spent $400 already.

You might even get all your maintenance for free.

Congrats.

-juice

roadscaller · December 2008

My wife is looking at used Passat wagons but insists on the utmost reliability with the fewest possible trips to the mechanic. She drives a 92 Hinda Accord sedan and likes it but wants to get a wagon for the family stuff. We don't want to spend more than $7,000 on a car. Can anyone help us with the best year and model, Passat wagon, in terms of reliability, cost, spacious and body style?

krzyss · December 2008

VW is not very reliable. If you find one request and insist on full maintenance record.

Subaru - cars before 2002 (I think it was 2002) were prone to head gasket issues.

Good luck.

Krzys

roadscaller · December 2008

Thank you for the advice krzyss. I read about 30 reviews of the Passat on the Kelly Blue Book web site and 1 out of 4 were really poor. That's just too risky for us. Your feedback helps to guide us in another direction. The Subarus are appealing but I too have heard of gasket problems. The search goes on.

Thanks again,
roadscaller

verdugo · December 2008

The gasket problems on the Subarus were resolved AAAAAAAAAAAAAGES ago. They've been bullet proof for ages.

As for the VW just make sure you don't buy the first/second model years.

I've had both a Subie and a couple of VWs.

A.

Brewster95 · December 2008

I think I am the victim of a bait and switch scam. Are there any markings on a 2007 Passat pressure plate or flywheel that will confirm that they definitely came out of a specific vehicle? The VW dealer is telling me they need to be replaced. The car only has 26,000 miles, but they say it is not covered by warranty due to "unreasonable wear and tear, such as hotrodding", which is completely a load of BS. This car has been driven with the utmost care, and I think they are showing me parts that came out of a different vehicle. Any suggestions?

verdugo · December 2008

Sorry to hear about your problem. I'm with you, it does sound a bit fishy. Do you have another dealer near you? Take your car there for a second opinion (don't tell them beforehand what is the problem). You could also take it to an independent mechanic who specializes in VWs.

Search the web for another forum that specializes in VWs. I can't tell you the name here (against the rules), but the name rhymes with fortex.

I've been reading that forum for a couple of years (I own an 07 Wagon) and I haven't heard of anybody reporting your problem.

Good luck and keep us posted.

ateixeira · December 2008

If you look at Consumer Reports' detailed scores, you'll notice that under "Engine - Major" the problems dropped dramatically from 2001 to about 2003. From 2003 and on all models score well, most exceptionally well.

Question is, can you find a Subaru from 2003 or later for $7 grand? They hold their values well, so that may not be easy.

If a small wagon will do, consider a 2003 Impreza, or maybe a Protoge5.

Most manufacturers stopped making wagons and shifted instead to crossovers.

biancar · February 2010

Wondered if anyone is still interested in these comparisons. We have a 10 year old Maxima that we are thinking of replacing. At the moment, we're considering the Subaru Forester and Outback, and the VW Passat wagon. The Passat wagon, from what I can tell, seems to have the advantage in driving feel and interior fit and finish. The Subs have the AWD, which where I live (Northern Virginia) I don't see as being a necessity, but might be good to have sometimes.

Anyone have any comments re: advantages of one over the other in the 2010 models?

roadscaller · February 2010

I am no expert with these cars but after all the research and test driving my wife and I completed in about a 5 month period we decided to go with a Subaru and are glad we did. This car is reliable, sporty and Subarus have a reputation for maintaining their value. A biggy is that it's easy to get them repaired at a reasonable cost. The Passat wagon was very nice to drive and a little more sporty, with better power and luxury features, however it turns out that they are expensive to repair, and in some cases are ridiculously costly to fix or buy parts for. The Subaru wagon has been reliable since we purchased it (almost a year ago) and it is comfortable, sporty enough, has AWD and gets fairly good gas mileage. No complaints thus far.

biancar · February 2010

Thanks for your response.

Which Sub did you get; is this the Outback? How good is "fairly good" mileage, something in the low 20's?

ateixeira · March 2010

We're happy with our 09 Forester Limited, though it compares more closely to a Tiguan.

You saw how much snow we got this year in the mid atlantic - the ground clearance and AWD were a godsend for us. My daughter had a sleep over the day of the 2nd storm and we thought she was stranded at her friend's house, though I was able to pick her up with the Forester even on unplowed roads.

We got sleet last night (here in Potomac, MD) and we should get more on Tuesday night as well.

This year has been a bit unusual, but we will always have at least one AWD/4WD vehicle in our fleet.

I haven't sat in a Passat lately, but I did check out a Tiguan and a Jetta wagon TDI. The Jetta was very nice, great interiors on those. The Tiguan unfortunately does not have the same interior, it's easily one or two steps down from that Jetta. The padded dash, fabric headliner, and wrapped pillars are all deleted for the Tig.

No regrets here. Best of luck shopping.

roadscaller · March 2010

I really cannot say for sure what the mpg is because it's my wife's car and she has told me a few times that it does not get the good mileage her old Honda Accord did, but it gets ok gas mileage. From everything I have heard from her, my guess is she gets around 24-26.

ateixeira · March 2010

Our Forester gets anywhere from 22 to 30 mpg. 30+ only if you're cruising on the highway and not going over 60, though.

If you want the mileage champ get an Outback 2.5i CVT - at 80mph it tachs around 2000 rpm. The tall gearing gives it better mileage than the smaller Forester.

carstryke · April 2010

Does anyone own one or have driven one? If so lemme know how it is.

The passat interests me more than the outback because it is a car not a SUV. Has anyone drove both of them?

biancar · April 2010

You might want to try posting in the VW forums, if you haven't already.

verdugo · April 2010

I have a 2007 Passat Wagon 3.6L 4Motion. I really like it. It has almost 48k miles and we've only had small teething problems (first year model). Once those were fixed, it's been great.

My Wagon is very different from the ones that you can buy today. You can no longer get the 3.6L engine, nor 4Motion. I also have the Lux 2 package, i.e., fully loaded. Unfortunately, they've decontented the Passat quite a bit. The CC has replaced the loaded Passat sedan, but there's no equivalent loaded Wagon anymore.

I'm not allowed to post other forums, but google for vw forums for a lot more input.

ateixeira · April 2010

Yours was also based on an Audi platform, right? IIRC that's no longer the case.

roadscaller · April 2010

Yes, I have driven both and the Passat is more fun to drive. It has more power and feels more sporty but the Outback is more practical, gets better mileage and is much less money to repair. Subarus don't require as much attention either. They are very reliable cars.

verdugo · April 2010

Yours was also based on an Audi platform, right? IIRC that's no longer the case.

AFIK, they are still being made on the same platform. Maybe Audi moved on to a new one? :confuse:

frapzoid · February 2012

I used to post comments here some years ago. I have a 2002 Passat wagon V6/stick with 171,000 miles on it. Though the car is 10 years old I still love the car and don't regret buying it. Just regular service and had to replace a sensor. I don't know much about the new Passats but mine has actually been as trouble free as a BMW I had. For those who bought Subarus more power to you. I made the right choice for me....

VW Passat Wagon vs Subaru Wagons

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