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Toyota Camry Hybrid Battery Pack Questions

keithlkeithl Posts: 106
OK I have conflicting reports as to whether the batter pack in the Toyota Hybrids is covers by the 8 year 100K warranty. Bumped into a Prius owner that said they were told $4-$5K to replace batteries and that Toyota told them the batteries are a "normal wear item" thus not covered by the 8 year 100K warranty. Does anyone have anything in writing to show this as true or false? Was this perosn being taken by their dealer?
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Comments

  • gampagampa Posts: 78
    Sorry to change the subject, but I have a Question...
    ... if one has a Hybrid for 14 years and the Hybrid battery refuses to charge, dies, or is removed ... then can one just drive the ICE until you replace the Hybrid battery?
    I assume there are two batteries, one for the Hybrid and the other for starting the car.

    Gampa
  • r_nashr_nash Posts: 33
    If the Hybrid battery dies, you can't start the car. The 12 volt batter just boots the computer so it can start up the inverters. Without the inverters running, the Hybrid Synergy Drive can't run the 2 electric motor/generators in the eCVT to start the engine or move the car.

    Ron
  • jan123jan123 Posts: 5
    In my TCH the Hybrid battery status never gets above Level 6 (out of 8). Is it normal, or is it something I should worry about? Sometimes I see the status dropping to Level 5, but it quickly gets to Level 6 and stays there. I've had the car for 4 days now and driven about 250 miles.

    What are other people on the forum seeing?
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    I've had the car for 4 days now and driven about 250 miles.

    I've seen no indication that there is any problems elsewhere so I'd get more miles on the car.

    What we don't know, other than you have not driven it much, is:

    What's your current avg mpg? Do you drive on level ground at low speed limits? Have you went up any long or down any long steep grades? I guess what I'm getting at you may live in an area that is "in balance" with the nature of the car. No extreems may keep your car in the sweet spot.

    Find a steep grade (1 mile or so_up or down) and watch the battery. It should either discharge more or charge more.

    Mine has been fully charged (on looooong steep grades) and down to the purple level when I was cruising at 35mph on a 10 m ile strech of raod, mostly without the ICE running. Both were the extreems of the driving parameters for the battery use.

    Remember the battery is a boost not a total replacement for the ICE
  • jan123jan123 Posts: 5
    What's your current avg mpg? Do you drive on level ground at low speed limits? Have you went up any long or down any long steep grades? I guess what I'm getting at you may live in an area that is "in balance" with the nature of the car. No extremes may keep your car in the sweet spot.

    You're probably right.

    Find a steep grade (1 mile or so_up or down) and watch the battery. It should either discharge more or charge more.

    I did that, and the battery was charged to all the way to Level 8. After I got on back on level ground, everything settled back to Level 6 again.

    Thanks a lot for your help!
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    I did that, and the battery was charged to all the way to Level 8. After I got on back on level ground, everything settled back to Level 6 again.

    Just so you're comfortable with this, find a spot where you can "coast" on battery for a long time and watch the battery level. On a long drive it will turn purple if you go low enough before the engine will kick on to charge it.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    The design of the HSD vehicles is that the battery is never fully charged and never fully discharged. The SoC is limited to a narrow range so the battery doesn't deteriorate and need replacing.

    You are in good shape.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,792
    The Honda IMA system can run without traction (main) batteries.

    The Toyota HSD system cannot run without traction batteries.
  • gampagampa Posts: 78
    OK then theroretically...Toyota specific... as long as the "non-charging" Hybrid battery remains in the car it should run the ICE all the time and reduce your MPG to the 23-25 range from 35-38 range.
    This way you can drive the car until you have the money to buy the more expensive Hybrid battery.

    Does this sound correct?

    Gampa
  • grandtotalgrandtotal Posts: 1,207
    OK then theroretically...Toyota specific... as long as the "non-charging" Hybrid battery remains in the car it should run the ICE all the time and reduce your MPG to the 23-25 range from 35-38 range.
    This way you can drive the car until you have the money to buy the more expensive Hybrid battery.

    Does this sound correct?


    No. You're not going anywhere without the high voltage 'hybrid' battery. Toyota hybrids work in a totally different way than other non-HSD hybrids.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,792
    "OK then theroretically...Toyota specific... as long as the "non-charging" Hybrid battery remains in the car it should run the ICE all the time and reduce your MPG to the 23-25 range from 35-38 range."

    If your traction battery doesn't hold a charge, the Toyota Hybrid system will not work. The car will not run at all.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    Of course the hybrid battery is covered as a part of the HSD system.

    The 12V car battery is a "normal wear item" but the traction battery system (the hybrid battery) is of course covered.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,962
    From Toyota website:

    Hybrid-Related Component Coverage: Hybrid-related components, including the HV battery, battery control module, hybrid control module and inverter with converter, are covered for 8 years/100,000 miles. The HV battery may have longer coverage under emissions warranty. Refer to applicable Owner’s Warranty Information booklet for details.

    http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/2005/prius/faq.html
  • glen4glen4 Posts: 9
    After driving my 04 Prius for 35,000 miles I find only one weakness. Drive Battery weakness. I really want to add to the existing battery. Why can't I simply create a 206 volt battery of sufficient power delivery and paralell it to existing? I think of the new Lithium-polymer batteries that allow very high discharge rates with little damage. Kinda pricey now but the will come down eventually.
    I presently own a 11 volt Li-po battery of only 1100 mil amp hours for a much smaller application. It charges rapidly, discharges up to 20 amps for a short time with no appearant damage. Any comments?
  • r_nashr_nash Posts: 33
    The current cost of the Prius battery back is $2,200, and can be found at salvage yards for $500.

    As others have posted, the NiMH battery pack is covered by the 8 year 100K warrenty AND in some states (California for one) by an 10 year 150K emissions warrenty.
  • glen4glen4 Posts: 9
    Keithl, I really want to add to the existing battery, which BTW is still fine, with a higher capacity Lithium Polymer or similar that will give me more battery power. There just isn't much available on the stock unit...maybe 3 miles creeping if your lucky.
  • sibbaldsibbald Posts: 106
    I am NOT an expert! I do use a lithium polymer battery for my electric powered model airplane. Right now, they can only be used in outside applications as they can catch fire if over charged or discharged too much. They are so much more powerful, lighter and can be molded into different shapes. They are the future for Hybrid cars and will be the difference that will main stream the technology.

    We are probably at least three years out. In the meantime, I will fully enjoy my Camry Hybrid (4 days old) as it was such a better choice than just another ICE.

    ps With the Imperial Gallon being bigger, I am enjoying over 50 MPH in mixed driving so far!

    Cheers, Tom
  • glen4glen4 Posts: 9
    Tom thanks for your reply. I too use Li-po batteries for my RC Plane. Mine is a 54" wingspan Fairchild Ranger, weighs 13 oz. A really slow flyer. I am building my 2nd and 3rd stick planes to use the same system. A 56" Pt-19 as well as a 36" Waco bi-plane, also lightweight stick I wonder if the recent fires on laptops aren't some indication of the hazards of using Lithium based batteries?
    I do not know of a larger application like a prius yet. Like you I am certain it will happen.
  • joystix2joystix2 Posts: 1
    Another newbie here. I just picked up my red Camry Hybrid over the weekend and put 300 miles on it already in 2 days. Boy this is a nice riding Hybrid and roomy too. It's been very hot here in the Bay Area California these past few weeks (100+ degrees). My question is that eversince I drove it off the lot my battery guage has never been topped off. Does it take a few weeks before the battery fully charges from the regenerative system?
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    The battery GAUGE never gets completely full. The most I've seen in 3800 miles of ownership is about 4/5 full. And that was after a 500+ mile highway trip.
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    Technically the battery never gets 100% charged because it's designed not to. However the gage will top off. It turns green when it gets to the next to top bar.

    I've had it top off (all green bars) in various scenerios. One is on a very long downhill grade and the other is in driving situations where the grade is slight (up and down) and the car is running along with the ICE on, getting about 50 to 60 mpg on the Instant FE gage and there is excess hp than needed from the ICE so the NAV shows the ICE running the wheels and chargine the battery at the same time. I have actually gotten it to the top green mark like that as well.

    When it gets to the lower levels of charge it will turn violet.
  • sibbaldsibbald Posts: 106
    I just completed a 1400 mile trip last week down south and like Larsh, never saw the gauge on the dash over 4/5 full, even with some very long downhill grades. We do not have the Nav. option in Canada.

    Cheers, Tom
  • r_nashr_nash Posts: 33
    I don't have NAV. Sometimes traffic has me in EV mode all the way down a 3/4 mile hill. The regen from lightly braking to keep my speed down frequently tops off the battery gauge. Here is a picture I snapped when I saw it last.

    image
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    Sorry, I have the NAV and never look at the "power" gage on the dash. (It's also in black and white). Looks like another poster has answered this and has a picture of the dash battery at the "full" mark.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    Mine has never passed the top of the + sign. Good to know it goes all the way up
  • sibbaldsibbald Posts: 106
    Thanks for the information, I have never passed the + sign either and a esp. thanks to nash for the picture. I will keep trying for a full charge now that I see it is possible.

    cheers... Tom
  • agnostoagnosto Posts: 205
    Does anyone know how long the HV battery pack for a let's say a TCH or even TPH last? I see from some posts they are quite expensive $2,000 - $3,000 and I want to know the duration and reliability... any issues with current owners specifically with HV battery pack...
    Thanks, in advance.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    No one really knows how long they will last.

    They are engineered to last the life of the car - somewhere between 150,000 and 300,000 miles.

    Toyota takes precautions with the software to lengthen battery life by controlling the charge levels, keeping the battery cool, etc.
  • agnostoagnosto Posts: 205
    Great, thanks, that is great news, make my decision easier to trade in my beastly 2006 4Runner LTD 4WD V8 (nice one, but it is a gas guzzler) for a TCH even though I will loose some money, it is better to save the environment than burning 13-17 MPG while driving in city... If you are an TCH owner any dislikes so far?? Trying also to get one before end of 9/30/06 so I can get the full $2,600 tax credit... it is hard to find though one with Navigation as they are all presold...
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    I love my TCH. My previous car was a 2004 HCH, so I actually have LOST 12 mile per gallon with my new car !!

    The TCH is definitely an upgrade from the HCH in virtually every way though - the MPG aside.....

    Very comfy and roomy inside.
    Rear A/C vents are MUCH APPRECIATED by my two kids.
    The larger trunk opening means I can carry my Segway in the trunk.
    The A/C is much better than the A/C in the Honda hybrid - gets cold much faster.
    Had the car up to 95 MPH and it was as smooth as 45 MPH. (will not admit that in a court of law) ;)
    I LOVE having the EV mode available and being able to cruise along in electric mode only - something the Hondas don't have.
    Quiet/ QUIET engine - even when the gas engine is running, this car is very well insulated for sound.

    Good Luck !!
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