Isuzu Trooper

boxtrooper

Kong,

I used the RedLineOil telephone help to get a recommendation of what synthetic oil to use. The guy on the phone seemed to know his product well. I told them my reason to go to synthetic was for better protection when towing my 4000 lb. trailer. They recommended RedLine MTL for my manual transmission. MTL is formulated for easier shifting while still being heavy enough for the synchronizers to work.

The effect of the MTL is much easier shifting. Still not as easy as my previous 1984 Trooper-II 4 speed, but a lot better than my 1995.5 5 speed was with the original Isuzu oil in it.

http://www.redlineoil.com

paisan

I put redline in my XT6, didn't notice much difference, but that may be because I have a bad rear diffy in it currently. We'll see what happens after I replace that.

-mike

keepontroopin

Are you factoring the mileage difference due to the larger size?

tetonman

My 99 S is due for the 30k services. When my wife called the dealer we bought the truck from, she was informed that they no longer carried or serviced Isuzu trucks (one less dealer in Chicago). She then called two other dealers in the area and was quoted $600+ for the service.

Going through the manual and then calling around to other ASCE certified shops lowered the cost significantly. The thing that bothers me is that the dealers wouldn't do only the maintenance required by the owner's manual. They added in a lot of extras.

Now I read that many dealers and manufacturers are not giving their vehicle codes to independent repair shops, forcing owners to use the dealer service department. What a mess! No wonder dealers have such a bad reputation. If you are going to force us to use you, please allow us the option of only getting the RECOMMENDED services only and not all the other garbage tacked on.

Sorry for the rant. At least I have a good truck that isn't being recalled every 6 months for repairs or falling apart.

sbcooke

I do the calculation actual miles = odometer*(new diameter/old diameter)...roughly (30.5/29.5) 1.03 times. So last tank was 160 miles --> 165 actual / 13.5 gallons.

This is only my second tank, and I do a lot of idling...it rained last week with about 85+ temps, so I sat in the A/C for 15-20 minutes at one point. It is hard for me to get an accurate mileage based on driving, but in general it seems down 1-2 mpg.

savvas_e

Hey 1offroader,

Can you describe the rattle that you were getting? Was it like a small component rattling loose, or did it sound like something big (like a back door)not quite fitting tightly and drumming away?

The one thing I find most annoying on my Monterey is some drumming type noise coming from the back, over rough paved or hard surfaced roads and tracks. I don't get the noise on gravel or dirt.

I always suspected that it might be either the rear barn doors, or possibly the roof panel (however, the roof panel ribbing should stop that drumming). Haven't been able to figure it out. I'll give the spring solution a go.

If I can get rid of this, then I'd happily say that I have the "closest to perfect" car that I have ever owned.

schulhof1

Tetonman,
My local dealers are useless as well. Same deal as you. My (now 108k mile) Trooper was last serviced by the dealer at 15k miles. Ever since at an Independent NAPA repair shop.

They let me call the shots. I tell them "I have 90k on the car, I want you to do X,Y,Z". No BS.

bluedevils

Our Trooper isn't serviced at an Isuzu dealer any more, but in the past at least my nearest dealer has been willing to do only the things that I ask them to do.

I can't believe a dealer would refuse to quote a price for work on a job-by-job basis. I guess they know the real profit lies in lumping it all together, calling it the 'official xx,xxx mile service,' and charging more for the whole thing than the sum of the parts.

tetonman, what exactly did you mean by "many dealers and manufacturers are not giving their vehicle codes to independent repair shops"? Of what vehicle codes are you speaking?

1offroader

The rattle sounded like a loose marble inside the tailgate, not a 'drumming' sound.

More info. on the fix. Once the two bolts are removed and the sliding gizmo is off the door, it comes apart without tools. There are four components - the mount or housing, the white nylon/plastic wedge, the rod, and the spring. Actually, I replaced the single factory spring with two springs. I couldn't find a single spring long enough, so I bought two shorter, stiffer springs of the same diameter as the factory spring and mounted them end-to-end on the rod. Once I figured out what to do and found the new springs, the repair took about one minute - literally.

It's a very simple repair. You do not need to be a Master Mechanic to do this. All you need is the wrench or socket to remove the two bolts. Finding the appropriate spring(s) will be the most difficult part of the job.

offroader

radman6

I'm curious what settings people are using on their Rancho shocks. I've had mine on for a few days at the three setting and the ride is pretty harsh. No more bouncy ride - just one solid bone jarring jolt when you hit a bump.

I may have to break down and try the two setting. Hmmm, wonder if I set them on the wrong number in the dark with my flashlight. Feels more like a five setting.

For those with Rancho's - did ride change / improve after a break in period?

I've had Ranchos on three other vehicles and never noticed this much difference before (in terms of stiff / harsh ride). Maybe it's because the Trooper had such a cushy ride before.

paisan

Give it 500 miles or more to "break-in" I ran mine on 2/2 til that became too soft.

I run the following settings now:

1/1 When mom or dad is in the car or driving, lincoln-like ride
3/3 Normal everyday driving around town near stock ride
4/3 Normal for my everday driving, at least til I do the T-bars
3/5+ Towing
5+/5+ Offroading

-mike

tetonman

http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/chi-0206200028jun20.story

Basically, boiled down, dealers are not sharing the computer codes necessary for independent shops to diagnose what's going on with the engine. Down the road, this could be very bad news for consumers if something isn't done to fix it.

paisan

I would think it's the mfgs. Dealers are independent from the mfg.

-mike

boxtrooper

I could understand a manufacturer wanting to reward shops that take the time to get the official certification with better access to useful information. Maybe some of the information or "codes" are dangerous if used improperly, and non-certified shops might have troubles and create a bad name for the brand name.

jimmyp1

that a certain percentage (within reason) of information can/should be proprietary.

Jim

keepontroopin

Thanks for lamb basting the Axiom owners on their whining about the ride of their TRUCKS. I bailed outta there after I said my 2 cents.

paisan

Just like I gave YOU hell on the wagons board! I play fair, or try to.

-mike

keepontroopin

Wagons are for weenies!

savvas_e

We have national laws with regards to anti-competitive behaviour of corporations in general. I'm sure the US should have something similar that applies in this case.

Manufacturers are not allowed to show any favouritism or exhibit any behaviour that can adversely affect competition. In this case for example, Holden cannot withold technical information from a licensed repairer on the products they sell.

Also, as long as a repair shop is appropriately licensed and hence correctly equipped, they can perform a "log book" service without affecting any manufacturers warranty.

The other thing is that the manufacturers of the diagnostic gear need these codes anyway to program the equipment they sell to the workshops.

So much for standards!

schulhof1

BMW does not print Workshop Manuals for sale. Only dealers get them.

They have received criticism for this. But it is true, for the latest model BMW's the dealer has the advantage. Once the cars age a bit the knowledge seems to trickle down to the Independents.

konghh

I am pretty confused. I have been driving 3 Trooper over a decade and on every single one, they all uses engine oil and NEVER gear oil. I checked with Redline www and they list the MTL as GL4 spec. AFAIK, GL4 contains sulfur and those are known to eat into the yellow metal of transmission. I believe, I am just guessing here, Isusu specifically uses engine oil to avoid sulfur probably because their transmission contains yellow metal parts. I think it would be prudent for you to double check with Isuzu on this matter. My 2 cts.

paisan

GL4 does not eat the brass synchros
GL5 does eat the brass synchros

The manual should tell you GL4 or GL5 for your tranny. My subaru uses GL5 in both the gears and the tranny.

-mike

konghh

That's not what I understand it. I have always thought one of the differences among the various GL specification are their sulfur content, among others. And GL5 has higher sulfur content than GL4 etc.. So if a car specify using GL4, you shouldn't use GL5. I don't know about Subaru but on ALL my diesel Trooper, they mention engine oil to be used.

paisan

They are not interchangable. I know that for sure. You need to check your manual about which it takes.

Also the diesel MTs are VERY VERY different than the MTs in our Gas engines. Don't forget we don't have TDIs here in the states

-mike

radman6

Last night I turned the adjusters to the "2" position and the ride seems a little more civilized now. Will try the 3 position again after a break in period.

konghh

That's not what I understand it. I have always thought one of the differences among the various GL specification are their sulfur content, among others. And GL5 has higher sulfur content than GL4 etc.. So if a car specify using GL4, you shouldn't use GL5. I don't know about Subaru but on ALL my diesel Trooper, they mention engine oil to be used.

wlbrown9

I have had mine on maybe 2 months. I have only used the 3 setting so far. I like this medium setting much better than the stock shock. I have one sharp bump, tansition from bridge to road on a downhill slope (they have ground some of the ashpalt down to make the hump driveable), and the Rancho's handle this very well. Another place I have noticed a great difference is a road through a strip shopping center that has a real washboard section in an S curve...they handle it real good. I like the ride on normal roads as well. I think I will try setting 2 for awhile and see what the difference is. (BTW, 2000 Trooper LS 2/wd 35,000 miles)

k2rm

Keepontroopin may start insulting and calling you guys whiners for putting better shocks on your Troopers to improve onroad ride and handling like he has insulted Axiom owners. Beware

tr0ss

Recently, my '99 troop (about 44K miles) has been taking me 2-3 times to start. For example, I'll start the engine, then it'll crank up, but kill immediately. The next time, I'll turn the key and it cranks for about 5 seconds before fully starting. Sometimes it'll kill on the second try. I can always get it started on the third attempt. I just replaced the battery ... does anyone know what else it could be? Could I take it in under warranty still?

Thanks

savvas_e

tr0ss,

What you describe doesn't sound like it would be a battery problem. Sounds like there is an electronic failure or something about to fail.

You may have read in this forum about getting diagnostic codes checked at Autozone. You should get that done while your car is still mobile and find out what trouble codes are being displayed. That should then tell you what the problem is.

PS... The Check Engine light won't necessarily come on unless the problem is affecting emmission systems.

bawbcat

What tires did you go with on your Trooper? I'm having Bridgestone Dueller A/T 693 P255/70-16 installed today to replace the factory tires. Anyone else use this tire? I actually struggled with the decision quite a bit, both in terms of tire brand, size, and P vs LT class. In the end, I couldn't pass up the price on the Bridgestones at Costco, less than $400 for the set installed. Sale runs through Sunday. I decided to stay close to stock size to avoid significant gearing/speedo/ride affects. Fingers crossed that these will be decent tires for mostly on-road but occasional off-road. I've never used Bridgestones before and I'm a little skeptical due to them being the same company as Firestone (which I consider to be pretty poor overall, even before the Exploder fiasco).

pat_pending

Howdy folks.

Well, it's been 8 months and I really miss my '99 Trooper. I had sold my boat, and no longer needed it. Hard to justify keeping it, since I probably used less than 10% of its capabilities.

I looked on my shelf, and I found an unused set of VSW variable rate springs. They are set for 25% increased rate over stock initial, and advance to a 45% increased rate as they compress. If anyone is interested, please email me at kensalen@hotmail.com.

(I keep in touch with the new owner of my truck, who now lives in Portland, Oregon. At 50,000 miles, she just had her first problem: check engine light. Since Oregon is a full-service-only state, I suggested she check her fuel cap, which turned out to be loose. End of problem. God, I still love that truck. )

justdrivin

I had posted a while back about my 2000S upcoming 30(35K) service. After getting very high prices from 2 local dealers ($840 and $550), I went with a local independent shop we use for my wifes Honda. I actually got to go over the service schedule in the manual and bounce ideas off the mechanic that was going to do the work...very nice. We decided on the following list
-Front and Rear differential fluid
-Transfer case fluid
-Cooloant flush and change
-Re-pack front wheel bearings
-Lube front and rear propshaft (he was familiar)
-Lube Accelerator linkage
-Lube chassis fittings as needed/known
-Check brakes and battery

It's looking like this will cost $300...I'm o.k. with that, as I have a great level of confidence in these guys to "do it right". They did say the re-pack was time consuming, and that there are about 10 plates to take off to do the various fluids. I think this is a pretty good list that keeps me comfortable with at least a minimum level of maintenance. By the way, transmission fluid and spark-plugs show at 100-120,000 miles! I don't think I will go that far, but not right now.
Also, the original 684's are looking sorry. I have priced some BFG A/T at 245-75/16 at $136 locally, $9 per tire for mounting and all. I think this is coming up soon for the truck.
I still love this truck!

paisan

I've heard that all the VSW springs sag after about 6 months

-mike

sbcooke

I went with the Dueler A/T 693's. I got 265/70R16. They have performed well. On-road traction wet/dry is superb, better than stock in my opinion. Maybe a little more noise? But not bad. I have had some issues with the balancing. I went to a Firestone place. I have to go back and have them check both rear tires again because I have a rumble at 70 MPH. Other than this being my 3rd trip back to the same place, I am very happy with the tire purchase. I am not concerned about the balance, once they get it right, it is pretty much good for the life of the tire.

leedavidyoung

I replaced stock tires with Bridgestone Dueller A/T P255/70-16 last year. At 30K I have had no problems. The size increase is mild and seems to improve overall ride. Much better off-road grip. I have had several sets of dueller A/Ts on both Troopers and Grand Cherokee's with great success.

I have recently installed OME springs and Rancho 9000's. Wish that I had done it years ago. Excellent Upgrade!! My debate now is 265/75's vs. 285/75's. Does anyone have any experience with the 285/75 R-16 size on a 1.5" lift?

konghh

Got a Bridgestone AT 265/70R16. Had 55,000-km on clock. Look like it could do another 10,000-km min. Rotated every 10,000-km. Mine's the slightly heavier diesel 3.1TDi. I am pretty happy with the performance so far.

boxtrooper

I have been given a dealer quote for a new 2002 Trooper-S 5 speed manual transmission allow wheels etc.. $21865 (MSRP $29185). Does that sound like a good price for it? I have not yet tried to talk them down.

bluedevils

I don't know what the current rock-bottom deals are around the country, but that price quote is about $7300 off MSRP. Sounds awfully good to me. Another way of looking at it is, what else could you get with your $21,865? Maybe a modestly equipped 6-cylinder Escape/Tribute. Or a well-equipped 4-cyl CR-V. Or an Explorer Sport. These vehicles are not in the same league as the Trooper!

If you can talk down the price further, great. But if you can't, you're still getting a good deal on a truck that is already a great value to begin with.

Is a trade-in involved with that price quote? I'm always leery of that, as dealers will typically give a great price on the new vehicle and give you less than fair value for the trade-in, or vice versa.

breakor

Sounds like a good plan. I think the service center may be slightly inflating the difficulty of the job. I can only count 3 (not the 10 they quoted you) plates that need to be removed and none are difficult. The overall price does seem within reason though.

If they will let you watch, you may want to make sure they do not strip the 3 set screws (per side) that hold on the front hub nut. These have to come off to do the wheel bearings. They are very easy to damage and would complicate any subsequent removals.

I would have them at least check the ATF level now. I would also have the flush done before 50k miles. Then again I am nuts about preventative maintenance and even routinely flush my brake and power steering fluids.

As to the plugs, they will likely go 100k miles. The only kicker is that if you leave them in there 4 or 5 years they might tend to freeze in place.

sdc2

If I had to guess, I would say you have a fuel problem, possibly with the fuel pressure regulator, or maybe fuel pump.

THese are the kinds of diagnostic problems that I take to the dealer. I have been down this road before, and have paid dearly for an independent shop to try to figure out what was wrong, whereas the dealer got it right away. Their hourly rate was higher, but they were a lot quicker so cheaper ultimately.

When I KNOW what the problem is, then I take it somewhere cheaper.

bawbcat

I know this is a subject with a lot of opinions, but I'm going to ask again anyway. I spend most of my time on the road with occasional off-road. I want shocks that are giong to help control the sway and wallow that I have with the factory shocks, so I'd probably want them to be too soft. I also don't want to spend over $200 for the set. These criteria rule out Bilstein and Edelbroch. Ones that I'm considering are KYB Gas-a-just ($150), Pro Comp 9000 ($130), Rancho RSX ($150), and Rancho 9000 ($200). The Rancho's are on sale and I have to order them today if I go that route. Any opinions on these guys? I leaning toward one of the Rancho choices, even though I don't necessarily need all their off-road capability. Are those going to be decent on-road, or are they to firm to be comfortable? Do the 9000's really go from soft to firm, or is it just 5 levels of firm? Thanks for any opinions!

bawbcat

Whoops, in my last post I meant to say that I DON'T want them to be too soft. Sorry.

paisan

The 9000s on setting 1 are actually too soft IMHO. They ahve great range from 1 which is lincoln like ride to ROCK hard in 5+.

I like em on mine. Other items to consider when trying to get the sway out:

$20 for Poly Urethane Bushings for the sway bars
$?? Poly end-links for the sway bars
~$220 Sway Away Torsion Bars
~$120 OME Coil Springs

I have th OMEs, Poly Bushings on the sway bars, and the Rancho 9000s. I'll be installing the sway-aways over the next 2 weeks so I'll let you know how that works out.

-mike

1offroader

I put a set of 31x10.50 Pirelli Scorpion ATs on my Toyota 4x4 pickup. I love 'em! Moderately aggressive tread approx. equivalent to the Goodrich All Terrain. Surprisingly quiet on the highway. Every review I have read has been positive. Dry pavement handling is very good, off road performance is also very good. Haven't had them on wet pavement yet. Can't say how they'll behave on a Trooper, but road noise should be the same (low).

I have a set of Rancho 9000s on my 99 Trooper, set at 4/4 all the time. I strongly recommend them.

offroader

bawbcat

Paisan,
Thanks for the info. I splurged and spent the extra $50 to get the RS9000 instead of the RSX. That way there will be no wishing I'd bought a firmer or softer shock. I also like the notion of being able to firm up the rear end when the truck is heavily loaded. The RSXs might respond a little more quickly since they are a true gas-charged shock while the RS9000s aren't, but it also seems like the variable valving in the RSX could be a disadvantage in some cases (just personal conjecture).

Paisan, a few questions for you:

- Can you reach your adjustment knobs without having to crawl under the vehicle?

- Can I use the same shocks with the stock springs as with an OME + Sway Away setup? I may consider that setup in the future and would like to not have to replace the shocks.

I'm currently suffering a little buyer's remorse and wondering if I would have been better off to get some cheap Gabriel GasRyder shocks and the OME springs for my $200 instead of the RS9000s. Oh well, too late now.

paisan

What makes you say they aren't gas? I'm pretty sure the RSXs are RS9000s with an auto-valving system rather than fixed/adjustable like the RS9000 and RS5000.

Shocks can be used with stock or OME setup, same part #s.

As for reaching them the rears can be reached w/o too much effort, a set of work gloves and you can reach behind the tires (easier with stock sized tires, but doable w/ 275-70s) to do the rears. The fronts you really need to reach by getting under the front, but you are less likely to change the fronts due to loading, so it shouldn't be an issue.

The way I look at the auto-adjustable valving is that they are made to be all things for all people all the time, which leads to being mediocre in all situations. With the manually adjustables you can "tune" them to your own liking.

-mike

lawdawgfl

It would seem that with the great deals we are getting for the Trooper, it is hurting the trade in value. I bought my 99 Trooper new towards the end of the year in 99. The sticker was $29,000 (approx) and I got it for $23,000. Now that I am thinking of trading it in I can only find trade in values at around $10,000 to $12,000. This seems a bit low for a vehicle that is really only three years old with 33,000 miles. Compared to my sisters 98 Rodeo, which according to all the research has a better trade in value. The Rodeo is a 4X2 and my Trooper is a 4X4. What gives???

Kelly Blue Book
98' Trooper 9,050 Rodeo 9,860
99' Trooper 10,305 Rodeo 11,165

Edmunds
98' Trooper 13,671 Rodeo 12,767
99' Trooper 12,868 Rodeo 17,327 !!!!

I need to trade this thing in now, before it gets worse.

sbcooke

Or drive it until the trade in doesn't matter. When I bought my 99, $24K, I realized that since they were cutting into the price so much, that the trade-in would also be adversely effected. What is the motive for trading it in? You should consider something that will hold its value better if you are going to switch cars every 3 years? or buy something 1-2 years old so that 10-20% drive it off the lot depreciation is already factored in.

paisan

I've preached it here for years...

If you plan to change out your Isuzu before 100K or 5-6years you are definitely in for a rude awakening. Their resale is almost nothing, so you need to drive em to the ground or at least over 100K. The trade-off is that for those 100K miles it will most likely be trouble free.

-mike