Honda Element

ateixeira · November 2004

I think a high quality paint job would run into the few-thousand range. Especially to prep that textured cladding surface.

I remember that one concept with all that audio equipment. Is that the first picture you linked us to, varmint?

-juice

varmint · November 2004

The black one with the faint grey flames is the Studio E. It had a monster sound system and full-size video screen built into the back. Obviously, an attempt by Honda to grab the "youth vote".

ateixeira · November 2004

OK, that's the one I was thinking of, then.

The pic I saw had the open back door with the massive subwoofers.

I guess you can't blame me for not recalling the exact paint scheme. :-)

-juice

varmint · November 2004

Aww c'mon, Juice! Next you'll be forgetting the name of the fuel cell-powered sports sedan Honda displayed in Tokyo last year! You're not getting old on me, right?

http://media5.motorcities.com/03A5C250316291C.jpeg

There's the business end of the Studio E's entertainment package.

ateixeira · November 2004

That Kiwami thang? Man, that was uuu-glee.

But I loved this one:

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4288056341&p=4193651198- &idx=206

The HSC. Photo 206 if I screwed up the link.

Now that thing was hot. You have to see it in person to understand just how low slung it was. It's kind of like the new Benz CLS - much lower than it appears to be in photos.

Check the logo detail - the shadow of the Acura badge appears upside down. :-)

-juice

goltgo · November 2004

You may have already checked this, but your E's slipping from a start in wet weather could be due to over-inflated tires, reducing the size of the patch that is in contact with the road. I normally cruise the Toyota 4Runner board, and some people there commented that their vehicles were picked up new from the dealership with tire pressures much higher than what is recommended.

I would've replied to your August and September posts earlier, but I am new to this group and have been reading all 178 pages here and there over the past few weeks to get up to speed.

footie · November 2004

I'll check tomorrow. It snowed here tonight and Stubby is outside. Most recently as I remember, tires were in the low 30's per the manual.

andrew4 · November 2004

I just wanted to say how pleased I am with my
new Element. I bought an 04 LX 5spd in green.
I had a hard time finding a 5spd. They shipped
one in from another city.
I had a 2000 VW Golf. It had problems over the
years and I needed a larger vehicle.
I chose the Element because of it's funky styling and reasonable price, and also because of Honda reliability. Cheers

ateixeira · November 2004

Went down to the garage today to help a staff that is retiring return some computer equipment, and voila, she's driving an Element. Silver EX, AWD automatic.

She said she loves it - she has a very large dog and the back seats stay folded up, it's easy to clean later on.

She usually drives along so no issues with the front seat belt being anchored on the rear door or anything like that, in fact she uses it as a 1+dog seater.

I was surprised, figured she'd be in a Volvo or something.

-juice

crazyslate · November 2004

I came across an element variant that was all blue on the highway this morning in Detroit. The vehicle color looked factory and not like a custom job, is the element getting Blue composite panels that are painted? The vehicle looked a solid blue color with no variation in paint, as if the composite panels were either metal or a very good paint that didn't look like painted composite. It also looked brand new. Best looking element I've ever seen. Was I dreaming?

ateixeira · November 2004

Could have been a one-off custom, or a concept of some sort.

I like the unpainted cladding, tho.

-juice

uv4me · November 2004

You're not dreaming...I saw one yesterday on the floor of a dealership. It was a very bright blue color....a little too loud for my tastes.
Yesterday was the first time I had looked at the Element and now I must say I'm intrigued. I've been looking for an AWD replacement for my Mazda 6 that won't break the bank. We have a Suburban we use to haul a large sailboat (and anything else we might need) so a 5+ seater isn't somthing we need in a 2nd car. Since we are a military family with two little kids and we move around alot, the AWD is really attractive since our 'Burb is 2WD and we never know where we will end up....currently it's Maryland were I hear it snows sometimes! So I guess I'm liking this Element thing for a lot of reasons...AWD, funky looks (I love the Cooper Mini too but it is just way too small) and Honda quality. Now I just need to get my wife to fall for the thing and we are set. Anyone need a clean 03 Mazda 6?

hbhawaii · November 2004

Well, finally took the plunge and bought my 'ment. Galapagos Green EXS AWD. From Big Island Honda -- excellent dealership. Got the Costco price of $1000 over invoice (which is very good by Hawaii standards).

Love driving it! Holds the curves nicely (we have a lot here). Makes it all the way to the top of my hill on wet grass. Plenty of pick-up with decent mpg. Handles our 140 inches/year of rain very well.

Went to the Arbor Day Tree Sale at "Plant it Hawaii" in Kurtistown. With the back seats out and the upper rear door open, we got 35 assorted fruit trees in 3 gallon grow bags, all about 3-4 feet tall, into the back.

I see a lot of Elements in Hawaii and now I know why -- I think it may just be the perfect car here.

Now I want to try the run up to the top of Mauna Kea and the run to the bottom of Waipio Valley. I'll let you know.

Howard

ateixeira · November 2004

Aloha. Sounds fun.

-juice

tallguy37 · November 2004

I'm looking at a used Element LX with under 5,000 miles on it for under $14,000. Only problem is that it doesn't have cruise control, which is a necessity because I drive a lot of interstate miles. I'm pretty sure I can get cruise installed. But: will it look okay? and will it function good? Any idea on the cost? The wheels will have to be upgraded, too, but that's the part I'm going to enjoy.

tallguy37 · November 2004

Follow-up question...shouldn't a Honda dealer be able to install cruise control?

ateixeira · November 2004

I had cruise added to my Forester, it was a couple hundred bucks installed.

I can't imagine it would be too difficult since OE parts are available.

-juice

tallguy37 · November 2004

I've looked into buying a new LX. However, the dealer told me today that it was impossible to add cruise control. Should I believe him?

307web · November 2004

It maybe impossible for the dealer to install the Honda OEM cruise control due to the way it may be integrated with other components.
You can probably go somewhere else and get a aftermarket system installed.
It will look and work "ok."
If you don't want to deal with it, just get an EX instead.

otis12 · November 2004

Anyone know when the '05s go on sale? It's nearly December and it seems like there's lots of '04s left on dealer lots. Is that why the '05s are not for sale yet?

mundomania · November 2004

Andrew

Just totaled my new Beetle 2000 w 165000 miles on it.

Considering a Honda element Are you happy after alll that farfagnuven I got tired of the Maintainance on the BUG

Is the MPG a killer on the element????

I cant find manual so im considering leftover
2004 ex

later Bob Bianco

Mundotozz@msn.com

ateixeira · November 2004

That dealer might not have experience with adding cruise, but I'm sure it can be done.

Ask another dealer or check under your yellow pages.

locke2l here on Edmunds had aftermarket cruise added to an EVO and it was a few hundred bucks.

-juice

tallguy37 · November 2004

I'm traveling 200 miles tomorrow morning to pick up my new 2004 Element EX FWD 5-speed in Shoreline Mist. I'm paying $18,300 plus tax, title, doc fee ($299 - the jerks), etc. The only upgrade is a set of mudflaps. I may have paid $300 to $500 too much, but at least I'll have my E. I am one happy man.

ateixeira · November 2004

I'd just call the price $18.6k. Not bad, though.

Congrats.

-juice

plantz · November 2004

Several comments on www.hondaelement.org and www.vtec.net say they are due in mid-December.

undecided6 · December 2004

I live in Michigan, about 1.5 miles off the main road. My road is not plowed very frequently, and could have 6-8inches of snow on it. Does the Element work well under these conditions? How does it do other bad wheather conditions? I have a 2WD Chevy Trailblazer, and already had it in a ditch on my road with last week's 4 inch snow. The good thing with the Chevy is that it is so big, that I feel safe. Since the Element is smaller - does it feel unsafe. Also, any comparisons with the KIA Sorento would be appreciated.

ateixeira · December 2004

Sorento is very different, you're talking full length frame vs. the Element's unibody.

Sorento also has a low range, and I'm sure it has skid plates at least optional.

Element has part-time AWD that engages automatically. Should be OK to get through a snowy driveway, sure. But it probably has less clearance and no low range vs. the Sorento.

Sorento is heavier and it's a truck. It'll seem more familiar to you coming from the Trailblazer.

Element will be more fuel efficient and probably easier to park. Less costly to own, I'd bet.

Since you're concerned about safety shop an EX to get ABS and side air bags.

Good luck. My guess is if you drive both you'll know right away which you prefer, they are so different.

-juice

lalagimp · December 2004

I have never heard anything extremely favorable for the Element in 2wd over wet or snowy conditions.

I have though had a 4WD 2003 EX for the last year, and when I bought it it was the dead off winter.

I think it's balanced fairly well and even though it shouldn't have gotten that far, I love feeling the Realtime engage the back wheels.

snowy conditions are a pain in the butt anyway no matter what you drive, but I didn't have any serious issues. Not even when the snow plow plowed me stuck in my parking space overnight and I had to ram to get out

trekman1 · December 2004

I really want to like the Element-it's got a lot of utility and it has the great Honda name behind it-but IMO the looks are somewhat of a turnoff. I don;t like the gray plastic panels-the look screams "Pontiac" for me-and I really hope they decide to match the panel colors with the car someday. Also I see the MPG is not all that great, in the low 20s. All in all it seems to be somewhat of a disappointment in my opinion.

library1 · December 2004

Element is much safer than any Kia; check the insurance industry for highway safety report on medical costs for car crashes- NOT TESTS- what actually happens in the real world-www.hwysafety.org/pubs.htm- If, as rumors have it, all the 2005 Elements will have side airbags standard, then it will be even safer. Only safer and reliable small SUV is the Forrester and that about $21K.

307web · December 2004

Real world insurance results are not controled. Results may simply mean that drivers of certain cars drive more carefully and do not get in as many accidents or less severe accidents therefore it costs the insurance companies less to insure them due to lower claims.

Crash tests show how cars perform in an identical crash scenario.

ateixeira · December 2004

Use both sources of info for what they are worth.

I agree that the real-world sample has to be normalized for the differences in demographics, for example less experienced drivers would tend to get in more accidents.

-juice

meezer67 · December 2004

Obviously, I am having trouble making a decision on which new car to choose. I love the New Beetle, but it's got no back seat room and less trunk space, and the repair record is horrendous. I'm intrigued by the Toyota Prius hybrid. It's about the same size as the '03 Camry that I now drive. Then there's the Element.... completely different, but very interesting too, and there's a Honda dealer less than a mile from my house. My Camry has been perfect and has an awesome stereo, with tape AND CD, very important to me. But it's about as exciting as a refrigerator! Any advice from out there in Edmunds land????

stever · December 2004

Keep the frig and take a trip to Peru or somewhere :-)

A dealer within walking/biking distance is a big plus (depending on what they sell I suppose).

Steve, Host

ateixeira · December 2004

Sounds like you are imagining yourself and what you will drive. That's great, but once the honeymoon is over, which one will best meet your needs?

Beetle was trendy but not practical, and the buzz has worn off long ago.

Element is spunky and will always be more practical.

Prius has wait lists and markups, though it is very nice at MSRP.

Camry bores you so skip that.

Drive a few and see which ones are fun to drive, yet practical enough to meet your day to day needs.

-juice

lucybell · December 2004

I currently own a 1995 Odyssey and intend to purchase an AWD Honda in the next year. I live in a rural area with lots of snow and have a steep driveway so I would like a automobile with AWD. I have studded winter tires on my Ody. but would prefer a more capable winter vehicle. Most of my daily trips are about 15 minutes in length on a highway - but I do travel long trips (2 hrs one way) at least once a month.

I had planned to buy the Element liking its versatility but was surprised by the low mileage as compared to the Pilot. According to Consumer Reports magazine tests there is only about 1 mpg difference between the Element and the Pilot for highway and city driving. The Pilot is much bigger so if I am going to get bad mileage I might as well go with the larger vehicle.

Can anyone give me advice regarding the pros and cons of the Element vs. the Pilot and even the CRV. The CRV is my last choice as it is small. There is only my husband and I so far in our family but I want enough space to lug mtn bikes, camping equipment and large items.

- Brenda Silver

Nova Scotia

varmint · December 2004

You might try to find a 4 cyl version of the Highlander. As long as engine performance isn't a big deal to you. They get decent mileage, have a bit more space than a CR-V, and have a good AWD system. It'll be tricky to find an AWD 4 cyl model, though.

Given a choice between the 3 you've listed, I'd say Pilot. Great AWD in that vehicle and enormous interior.

north1 · December 2004

I own an E and have driven the Pilot a few times on test. If you have the extra 10k to spend, then purchasing the pilot is the way to go. I get 24 mpg in my AWD EX Element and am extremely happy with its utilitarian setup. It doesn't ride as nice as the pilot but it wasn't designed to compete against larger SUVS. The element actually seems larger on the interior....drive both and decide.....

north14

ateixeira · December 2004

Pilots around here are being discounted now, for $28k they're a great value IMO.

Of course you could get an Element for under $20k. So there's still a big gap there.

-juice

library1 · December 2004

I see I need to clarify medical costs. The IIHS lists cars in the current model for the costs of medical claims by crash survivors. This is what it costs a person to repair the injuries sustained in crashes.

The Camry is at 92, or injuries in a Camry crashes average $92 if $100 is the average for all cars. The Element is at 77. It costs 15% less to treat the victims of Element crashes.

You are correct that driving style has a significant part in the severity of the crashes. A Passat is 79, the wagon variant is only 51. And Hybrids do well: a Prius ( 1st gen) at 65 is almost 90% safer than an Echo, even though the Echo had better crash test results. The Honda Civic Hybrid is 78, the regular civic is 127. The Mazda6 is at 129 despite much press about its safe design. Too much fun to drive?

But its not all the drivers. And tests are only tests. Check the crash test passenger compartment intrusion measurements; there is not a strong correlation with injury costs.

What actually happens in the real world is that of all small, reliable, and affordable vehicles, the Elements stands out. Good E!

ateixeira · December 2004

Too many factors you'd have to normalize against.

Wagons do better because they tend to have families in there, and parents drive more safely with kids in the car.

Hybrid owners are very affluent (read: educated).

I think a good score is a positive, sure, but there may be many reasons why, not the least of which is the manner in which they are driven.

-juice

library1 · December 2004

Drive safe. I think the Hybrids are safer because they are underpowered, and their drivers are hyper aware of how they are driving- carefully - to get maximum economy.

Anticipating when you will brake, accelerating slowly- its a concept that may account for the difference since structural changes, for example, between a Civic and a hybrid Civic are minimal.

As a postscript, the Edmunds "True Cost to Own" shows that after 5 years the E costs about $5,000 less than a Subaru Forester.

The E is a good choice!

footie · December 2004

We thought we had gotten a honey of a vehicle earlier this year when we found the Element.

We have a front wheel drive, 5 speed manual EX Element in Galapogos Green.

We love everything about the E except how it handles in slippery weather.

It's TERRIBLE!

We have had nothing but FWD vehicles for the last decade here in New England. They all did great in our winters: Sable Wagon, Plymouth Laser, Toyota Camry and Avalon.

The Element on the other hand is just awful. We have 11,000 miles on our E since Feb of 2004.

I was headed east on a major 4 lane a few days ago in very light rain. I stopped on an upward sloping road at a traffic light. Light changed and I accelerated away.

The E went to the right, not forward!

Bottom line! The FWD E desparately needs a limited slip differential or something to control its tendency to jerk right when the road conditions are just a bit other than dry.

We are very, very disappointed with this aspect of the Element and recommend anyone considering purchase in our kind of road conditions to only consider auto/AWD.

anonymousposts · December 2004

Have you thought about changing the tires? I know you don't want to replace the tires at only 11,000 miles but some better all-season tread might help your situation. It's worth a shot.

library1 · December 2004

Checking the alignment- by an expert- would also be a quick and cheap sugestion. I doubt that is normal or Honda would have had a few comments on it these past 2 years!

lalagimp · December 2004

wet and snowy conditions, the 4WD has been the recommended way to go. I've seen numbers of complaints from people with the 2WD models.

I am however, without my baby. Ellie had to go into the shop because I couldn't get her out of PARK. Throttle body sensor. Screwed up my gear and my idle.

I should get it back by friday

14687 miles and 1 week shy of a year since purchase

ateixeira · December 2004

$5k in 5 years? I kinda doubt it in the real world. It's cheaper to buy, but the rest should be similar expect gas, where the Forester would have an advantage.

Are you comparing FWD to AWD?

-juice

library1 · December 2004

Check Edmunds' 5 year total True Cost To Own

2004 Elements:

EX $32,345

LX $30,160

2004 Foresters:

X $36,537

XS $37,430

XT Premium $41,675

lalagimp · December 2004

but does that include interest vs paying cash?

library1 · December 2004

If you look at Edmund's site you will see the answer for yourself, and a good deal more you should know. You have to make it fit your specific criteria; for example, I didn't finance my last car (cheapest Toyota made) and my wife's Passat had 1.9% financing.

Honda Element

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