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Thanks for the info! We're going down to a local socal dealer that still has a few '07s w/ good deals ($24k OTD w/ Navi, wheel locks & mud guards). We'll see what happens!
Thanks again!
Sean
Possible action???:
NTSB (or similar agency) complaint (safety issue with all the weight on the inside tire, braking and traction suffers and of course, quickly balded tires which one tries to stretch;
Lemon Law (I missed my State deadline);
BBB - follow Honda's complaint procedure (good luck there);
State AG consumer protection (I'll give it a go);
Maybe a class action lawsuit or threat thereof;
Lots of letters/e-mail to Honda and/or,
PRIUS (next time; somebody dope slap me).
With proper documentation and a very courteous demeanor I took my car to where I purchased it, Auto Park Honda in Cary, NC .
After inspecting my tire for 30 minutes, the service girl informed me that "they" determined the inner tire wear was from "Overloading" in my car. I had 2 toolboxes in my trunk and they come to me with that crap. The totally unhelpful and unsympathetic Service Manager totally blew me off and told me straight up, "You're not getting 2 new tires today". AVOID Auto Park Honda! I'm paying $530 a month for a car and warranty backed by Crooks. There are over 300 cases of this Negative Camber problem on various websites on the net with the same problem, but mine is "Overloading"?
They said nothing was wrong with my car, but he could not deny that others were coming to him with the same problem!
CAVEAT EMPTOR
I have had my HCH in the shop for a total of 14 working days for a Motor Position Sensor issue, and now these CROOKS can't take the blame for an OBVIOUS mfg defect in which the HCH eats the inside of tires, or at least the 300 plus mine I've read about.
I hope that at least one person reads this and goes and buys the PRIUS instead of the HCH. And go to anyone else other than LEITH, they own the place and must train these folks to do anything but take responsibility and refuse to right a wrong.
And on top of all of that, they were OUT OF COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i took it to my local tire shop for alignment and the rear was only slightly off, less then .3 degrees i believe, but the rear tires were definitely worn much more on the inside. this at 12K miles.
took it on several more road trips, and the alignment didn't help at all, still scary to drive with cross winds.
so, now at 13.5K miles, i scrapped the low rolling resistance dunlop factory tires and put dunlop m3 winter tires on (i do a lot of work up north).
the car is now very quiet...and now has a sense of center. Fuel mileage has definitely taken a hit, from around 40 combined to 37.
i'll be curious how these tires wear, and will definitely be looking for the tsb on the alignment issue...i hope my car doesn't already have the fix as there is an issue with it.
EG
I wanted good mileage, I wanted reliability, I wanted a quality car from a quality company.
From the moment I left the dealership with my new car, it seemed that the rear end of the car was just roaring. Everyone that rode in it complained of the rear end road noise.
So I was not that surprised when my rear Bridgestone radials just happened to have the steel belts protruding at 20,000 miles.
I will not bore you with the 20 hours and five visits to Honda dealers and Bridgestone tire dealers that I made as Honda claimed "no problem" and the Bridgestone people said "Dude, you have a defective car". I've owned a few cars, and the fact that the front tires were pristine told me that Honda had a major problem with their rear end alignment on the 2006 CAR OF THE YEAR.
I did their route, all the hoops and mental midgets at Honda of America Customer Service in Torrance. They told me I had defective tires. I didn't bite. I escalated. They told me I had worn (only) the rear tires down due to "aggresive driving" or "overloading". (Virtually all freeway miles, two passengers, 100 pounds luggage?)
Their final word to me: "There is absolutely nothing wrong with your car OR tires, what you have seen is normal wear".
I sent them a demand letter saying that if they didn't reimburse me for the two new rear tires, I would sue them.
Lo and behold, I got called by an apologetic Honda Lawyer. So sorry. Defect in rear suspension. Engineers working hard on fix. Recall soon. Will pay 75% of cost of new tires.
I said flat out no. That they were getting off cheap. I spend 20 hours and drove 350 miles to get their lies, lies, lies, lies. He quickly said they'd pay the full expense.
Reading this thread, I'm inclined to stuff their check where the sun don't shine. These people at Honda are practiced, skilled and trained liars.
DO NOT EVERY BUY ANOTHER HONDA. Look for a class-action suit against Honda. They will be killing people with premature tire wear, you can bet.
Did I get the wrong tires? Does Discount Tire sell a different tire I should have gotten? Are Kuhmo's any good? Can I even get them exchanged now?
Any help would be great.
When I brought up the dreaded, "How do you intend to reimburse me for the ruined tires" subject, the service manager told me that there was a TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) in process and expected within a few weeks.
Apparently there are control arm issues on the 07 Civics. She asked that I call them back within a few weeks to see what corporate Honda was going to recommend with regard to the tire replacement and possibly further control arm replacement.
While I'm less than pleased to be driving in a New Hampshire winter with defective tires, I'll hold off a few weeks rather than getting myself all wound up and firing off certified letters to various mucky mucks.
I took the vehicle to the loca Honda dealer, who confirmed that there was a Service Bulletin on this and ordered the required parts (rear upper control arms).
Apparently, some upper control arms were manufactured slightly short, causing the alignment problem. Because the parts came from a certain manufacturer and there is no record of which cars received them, it is not possible to identify problem cars by serial number or date of manufacture.
All owners of this vehicle should be aware of the problem and look for unusual wear on rear tires.
I have now had the warranty work done, and other than the chipping on the interior edge, the tires where not worn more than usual, so I am hoping that they achieve a normal lifespan from them.
I thought it was just my driving, or crappy tires, but maybe not.
could you post the TSB on this, or tell me how find out the number.
thanks
When I asked about the exceptional wear on the tires, they said that when the fix is made they would take care of tire wear caused by the alignment problem.
My faith in Honda is partially restored. When the fix is done I will be a happy camper.
I found if funny that after I emailed the TSB to my dealership it was mysteriously removed from the internet. I saved a copy and I think everyone should be able to view this Candadian TSB so here it is...
http://showcase.netins.net/web/reptiles/stuff/Bulletin(VIII-10-07).pdf
Also, here is another great link about this issue...
http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread/2166644
Anyway about time on Honda's part...thanks again for the post.
This situation gets me mad. This is my first new car and I bought it for it's relability. I now want to trade the car in. Do we think this problem is ever going to get solved?
I do not have the SERVICE BULLETIN number at this time.as soon as I receive the
paper work from the dealer I will post it for all of you....I too will be selling my civic hybrid soon.maybe the new Malibu hybrid will be good...arthur
In September of 2007, my wife experienced a flat tire while doing errands around the City of Canyon and Amarillo, Texas, the tire was replaced and a new one was purchased from Walmart due to undue wear on the sidewalls.
In October of 2007, this car experienced another flat tire on the other side and this time the car was taken to Discount Tire here in Amarillo, Texas. The service manager indicated that the tires were wearing wrong on the side walls and that the car had a serious alignment problem. The dealership was contacted and James the service representative for Bob Howard Auto-Mall indicated that the control arms on the rear of the car were defective and that this flaw was causing the tires to wear out on the side walls.
He also indicated that there was no fix to the car at that time and that it could be as late as December 2007, before a fix is made to the car. As of the January 18, 2008, there is still no fix for this flaw. The dealership has informed me that it may take another 10 months to fix the rear control arms on these vehicles.
As for the tires, James indicated that we should contact American Honda for reimbursement of the tires that were purchased at Discount Tire by American Honda in California. They were contacted and a check was reimbursed to us for approximately 375.00 dollars of the approximate 750.00 dollars that had already been spent. During both flats the car was driven over curbs to get the vehicle out of the road ways. And on either the first or second occurrences damage was done under the automobile that causes the brake light to flash while going down the highway.
The car was taken to Southwest Honda in Amarillo, Texas and they indicated that damage was done to the undercarriage of the automobile and that my warranty would not cover the damage that was done. It was explained to them that the damage was done due to the flats on the rear tires and that due to safety concerns of not changing the tires in the middle of the road, I had to go over the curb to get out of the traffic flow instead of changing it and causing an unsafe condition for other drives and myself. Honda America is uncooperative and unwilling to help us in resolving this issue. They implied that we should have been killed or hurt because of this flaw, before they will do anything to resolve this issue.
Conclusions:
This car has a serious flaw and American Honda knew it and deceived the American public into believing that the car is safe and free from defects, this car was represented to us as not having any problems or flaws or defects. However, Honda America sold a vehicle that has rear control arms that are defective and need to be replaced before a serious accident happens with these automobiles.
Customers are unaware of this flaw who bought this car believing that Honda produced a safe product, however what will happen when someone is traveling at 60 mph or even 70 mph, and a blow out occurs. Does someone have to lose their life or their family before something is done by Honda America and these companies like Honda America is held accountable.
The bottom line is Honda America is not interested in anything we have to say and is not willing to fix a problem they caused. Get the word out do not buy a HONDA of any Kind.
Cheers
This is my last HONDA and I am telling as many people tha I can not to buy one.
Cheers :mad:
Again another Honda Dealership is misleading customers.
Cheers and Never again will I buy a Honda :mad:
I had a little run around with the dealership. It seems to be a very new bulletin so they had to order the parts. I am having to buy the tires. After calling a variety of tire places, I did find that 30k is not unreasonable for Dunlop tires. I don't think I want to fight with the dealership to get reimbursment for the tires even though Honda has apparently created this mess by not disclosing the problem as soon as they found out. Good luck.
I had to go to Honda America and faxed information into Ron Rubinoff and they reimbursed us 375.00 dollars for new tires at Discount Tire. Some dealers are being stuck with the cost of replacement tires that is what they are not allowing tire reimbursement. The dealer in Amarillo Texas would not pay for tires but the one in Oklahoma City would. I filed a complaint with the BBB last night about this issue and demanded complete reimbursement for the bad rear control arms.
Cheers and Hang in there. :mad:
I called Honda and told them what I wanted which was replacement upper rear arms and new tires. They gave me a number for my complaint and said they would get back to me. That was last week. It is now 2-8-08. I will continue to blog and let you all know what they do here in Waco.
here is what i know for the Denver area.the Honda Rep is Scott E....per my copy of the work order the service bulletin is # 8-001 to replace rear upper control arms and replace 4 tires.all the work has been completed..i am not sure i will keep the car long enough to see if it worked....good luck
Mine is going in the Amarillo Globe News, we are not keeping it either to see if the fix works. I highly doubt that it will work. I am out 1500.00 dollars in maintenance costs. The add will read 2006 Honda Civic LX, whale Tale, Aluminum Wheels and New Tires. In shop more than it is been in my care. :mad:
THERE IS A NEW SERVICE BULLETIN
http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2225229
IF YOU GO TO THAT THREAD I FOUND A PICTURE OF IT IM TIRED AND DONT FEEL LIKE LOOKING IT UP I HAVE A MORNING CLASS TOMMOROW BUT I HOPE THIS HELPS
Prior to the warranty work, they asked me to sign a release that would basically agree to arbitration with both parties paying half of the arbitration fee, without possible reimbursement of such fee. That seemed like a really stupid idea that was not part of the warranty process, so I refused to sign it. After getting the general manager involved they agreed to work on the car without my giving up my right to a suit.
It had about 9,600 miles on it when I began the process a month ago (with 2/32 of tread left), and about 12,000 miles yesterday (with 0/32 of tread left). According to the chart they should have charged me 25% of the replacement cost. Instead they didn't even attempt to charge me for the replacement tires. I was pleased they didn't insist on this since, since Honda is affiliated with/owns Tire Rack, and I wouldn't have been happy letting them profit even a little from warranty work that wasted hours of my time and had me driving a death trap for the last few months.
Cheers
P.S. Anyone looking for a HONDA, I'm Selling :mad: