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Anyway, nearly 5000 miles on the Santa Fe and haven't seen any rust yet, but live in So. California, so maybe there's a salt corrosion component? Had the rotten egg smell come wafting through on the first weekend trip (less than 2000 miles) but it hasn't happened since . My guess would have to do with the catalytic converter, cause I had one go out on an old car and that's the smell, but since it hasn't happened in the last 3000 miles, I'm not too worried. The gas mileage is improving, and it hasn't given me any trouble yet.
And, just as an idle question, are car buyers really so stupid that they'd look at the numbers of posts without reading them and assume that it reflects the number of actual problems? I'm not tracking that reasoning. After all, there are, what, probably 50 of each of the other SUVs sold for every one Santa Fe, so there'd be a 50:1 ratio for problems posts if they were exactly equal. Give the car buyer *some* credit for brains, eh?
Decided to investigate the Hyundai Santa Fe, Mazda Tribute/Ford Escape V-6, 2002 Ford Explorer, and the Subaru Outback Wagon with 2.5 4 cylinder engine, automatic transmission. These vehicles were selected because of decent reviews, price and value to some extent, capacity, handling, cruising at 65 to 80mph, quality and opinions offered by many on various net sites, and last in importance trailering or towing ability. I currently own a Toyota Avalon and an 18+ year old 4 x 4 3/4 ton pickup rusty which is hardly used but operable.
My wife and I drove each "test" vehicle at least twice in different weather conditions. Here are our biased opinions.
My wife thought the 2002 Ford Explorer had no real styling as compared to the Santa Fe at the other end of the spectrum, for example. The Explorer she thought looks like a box. She thought it lacked power and its mass above 70mph makes the engine work to maintain that speed or a greater speed. We also thought the interior was okay but nothing special and that the coin holder was basically unusable while driving. Fit and finish seemed good; however the vehicle handled like a big lumbering oaf. We decided it was too large for us, got fairly poor gas mileage, lacked styling inside and out and probably would have difficulty getting out of its own way in an emergency handling situation and had Ford "reliability" or lack thereof. Lastly, the Explorer XLT (2001 version in this instance)is a 4WD vehicle not an AWD vehicle and the Subaru Outback Wagon beats ALL in the snow. NO CONTEST. Last winter I test drove the 2001 Outback in an empty mall parking lot which was basically sheet ice and hard packed wet snow. I COULD NOT GET THE OUTBACK TO GO INTO AN UNCONTROLLED SPIN NO MATTER HOW I TRIED TO ABUSE THIS VEHICLE. I MEAN IT! TALK ABOUT GIVING A PERSON CONFIDENCE!
We then drove the 4WD Mazda Tribute V6 and Ford Escape V6. We both were impressed with the power. It is a lively vehicle to say the least. However it is NOT an AWD but a 4WD vehicle and will not perform as well as an Outback in the snow. It emits a fair amount of engine and road noise. As all SUV it does not give us the feeling of safety or confidence in an emergency handing situation with the center of gravity significantly high. Perhaps a great view of the road in a SUV but I don't want to flip if I have to perform an emergency swerve. In additon to the powerplant another strong point is the Tribute's/Escape's 3500 lb. towing capacity compared to the Subaru's 2000 pound capacity. Gas mileage fairly decent, interior straightforward and plain vanilla. The Tribute's/Escape's doors seems to lack any heft and felt rather "tinny" which probably added to the road noise.
The Santa Fe AWD in our view wins the exterior and interior design award. We drove 2 different AWD Santa Fes. We were very impressed. The ride was excellent and was similar to the ride we experience in our Toyota Avalon. The fit and finish were excellent. For an SUV there was a minimum of lateral swaying. The engine could use more power and it supposedly doesn't tow over 1500 pounds in the AWD model. It is VERY WELL EQUIPPED. However, the down side is that there was a noticeable smell similar to something burning when we existed one of the 2 vehicles. The salesperson tried to blow it off but we found similar comments re the Santa Fe on the net. Further we decided against it because of few dealers and limited dealer support, very limited numbers of Santa Fes for the marketplace and in many cases a premium of $1000 added to the MSRP. NO THANK YOU. I AM NOT A FOOL. However, I do believe that Hyundai is a real comer in the global quality marketplace.
All in all, the Subaru Outback looks and feels like a quality vehicle. It rides and handles superbly. The interior is tasteful and appealing, bordering on plush, 2 tone dash with complimentary tan/creme colors and nice tan fabric seats. Fit and finish are excellent thoroughout. The specs are great. The OUTBACK is 14 inches longer (& more stable) than the Tribute/Escape and 10 inches longer than the Santa Fe. The 2002 Ford Explorer is only 2" longer than the Outback, hard to believe. The Outback has 4 wheel disc brakes and the Tribute/Escape do not. Pickup and accleration are certainly decent. The Subaru Outback can cruise better and handle the road better and has a better top end than the other vehicles in this comparison plus it gets far superior gas mileage and is the clear winner in snow/ice conditions. Thus we chose the 2002 Subaru Outback, tried and true 2.5H 4 cylinder engine, auto transmission, All weather package (including heated seats), comfortable rear seats, a nice heavy duty cupped rubber mat for the rear cargo area. I feel I am getting the same vehicle for around $23k that would cost over 30k if I ordered the leather seats and 6 cylinder engine. In my mind, a great vehicle and even better value.
Perhaps this evaluation will help a few folks decide.
under MSRP. Make the dealer know that you are
serious about buying their car and negotiate with
them would help a lot.
I also test drove the outback. The biggest
drawback is that the outback is way
too narrow for me.
gross weight, boat and trailer and gas etc. aboard. Does it perform OK even tho I know it will not be a very quick vehicle which I am prepared to put up with for the occasional towing
duties it will perform.
The towing will basically be on flat ground and not ever be over 150 miles each way. Comments and experiences please??????
I tow a 14.5 SeaDoo Jet boat, about 1600 lbs, with a 2.7 AWD GLS. It does well on level highways at 70 mph. It slows and downshifts on hills. I would be a little hesitant to pull over 2k with it, and would be interested to hear from anyone who has.
fact that the battery went dead several weeks ago and we put a charger on the battery, and got the vehicle working again, and when we took it in for its 3k oil change, and told the dealer about the
dead battery, he checked the battery and told us it had a dead cell. They replaced the battery.
We've had quite a few occurances where the cruise control kicks off. Some of these are on flat ground, and some are while the vehicle is climbing a hill.. We plan to bring the vehicle in and have the dealer check this out.
We're seeing the problem with filling the tank full.. We just came back from a 650 mile trip and got an average of 24 mpg for the trip... Not too bad..
Still a very nice vehicle...
Dave & Pat Frandin
dfrandin@lvcm.com
When we first got our SF (LX, FWD w/ABS) I had some problems with the cruise kicking off, also. I finally figured out that there seemed to be two causes. Most of the time I was bumping the "cancel" button accidentally - it's quite sensitive, and close enough to the steering wheel rim that it's easy to do without noticing. The times I was sure I was nowhere near the button, I had the shifter in "manual" mode, and was going up a hill. I think it kicks off the cruise in that situation to keep from lugging the engine. Now that I keep track of those two things, I haven't had a problem.
Cindy-
I, too, was an anti-Hyundai bigot. My wife convinced me by showing me the prices of an Escape, Liberty, and Rav4 with the same options as the SF. That did the trick! No regrets at all. It's a great car for what we need.
-Jason
Daughter beat that car for three years. All I had to do to it was brakes and tires. After she graduated, got married and got a new car, her little brother got the 87 Excel. He finished high school, went in the Army, and beat that thing some more. Finally, at 137,00 miles, another set of Brakes, and rebuilding the carburetor and other routine stuff, he oil-starved the engine, so it died because of youthful neglect.
Since then we have enjoyed three Excels, an Elantra, and I am now enjoying retirement in my 2001 Elantra. I have NEVER owned a car any better than these. Cheap? no! Low Cost? Yes, but quality is there, too!
And I could give you some stories about Altima, BMW 328I, Sentra and Camry owners that have re-thought what they paid and what they got for it.
But if you husband is more concerned with "what the neighbors will think" or his beer buddies will think, you don't have a prayer of winning the argument. Pride and Ego is a powerful force.
Carl http://www.rnc3.com/misc/misc_photos.htm
For $22,400 out the door we got a 2002 Sante Fe GLS FWD V6 with the following options: abs/traction control, floor mats, cross rails, storgage containters, mud flaps, and tie down net. Not to mention the great warranty. The car drives very smoothly, has excellent acceleration, tons of cargo room, baby seat tethers (wife is pregnant), easy to use controls, dark tinted windows (have to get high level packages on CRV and Tribute to get that), heated side mirrors, remote entry w/alarm, cd/cassette & 6 speakers, and IMHO the best designed tailgate out of the three.
We test drove 3 Sante Fe's and they all felt very well put together. No rattles or loose pieces. We were originally looking at the Focus wagon but that message board is almost all horror stories AND the ZTS wagon with traction control and abs is only a couple of thousand less than the Sante Fe with a bare minimum warranty and weak engine. All of these things helped to sell me on Hyundai but it was the Sante Fe itself that eliminated all my hyundai prejudices.
Why aren't there are a RAV 4 problems forum?
Who decided to make this forum?
Are you saying that the Santa Fe is so horrible that it needed a forum just listing it's problems?
I think there's just more interest in the Santa Fe than the RAV4 in general. Try a board search for "Santa Fe" and then one for "RAV4". There's way more messages about the Hyundai in the general topic, owner's clubs, etc. than the RAV4 (maybe those guys need an owner's club?).
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Could it be a defect in the paint? or could they have mistakenly baked my whole car when replaced my bumper? They won't seem to give me a straight answer. They claim they don't bake the whole car for a bumper and the guy claims that I left the tree sap on for too long before I washed it, except that I washed it 5 days prior to dropping it off to them and the paint was flawless.
I know I need to ask a professional, but how can I when i can't even get a straight answer from the dealer's paint and body shop.
I thought maybe someone might have had a similar problem or heard of something about tree sap etching itself thru the clear coat. I know it's thru the clear coat cause I took it to a professional paint and body shop elsewhere and when they tried to do a same color buffing to see if it's repairable that way it didn't help either.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Thanks,
AM
Thanks again.
Anybody else have any paint problems?
AM
to get a complete fillup on the fuel tank. In all cases,
the pump shuts off long before the tank is completely full,
and if you want to get a completely full tank, you have to keep clicking past the shutoff for quite a few clicks...Is there ANY fix for this by Hyundai or do we have to live with the problem?
Dave Frandin
First, I still love my Santa Fe and after driving a lovely 2000 Geo Metro from Enterprise I REALLY WANT MY SF BACK!
Okay, back to the story...
My wife and I decided to drive to Crested Butte, Colorado a few weekends back to view the changing colors of the Aspens. It was beautiful and we ended up having a great time. The trip home, however, was another tale. Driving off of the mountain into Carbondale I noticed my steering getting tighter and tighter. Not wanting to alarm my wife that I was having trouble driving I just kep pointing out the windows going "oooohh" and "aaaahh" trying to distract her from the fact that I was driving down a steep mountain pass with no guard rails or pavement. I own a 2001 2wd GLS. The road was dirt and very hard-packed. Plenty of old couples driving their luxury sedans up and down the pass so I was NOT off-roading by any means. Knowing the road-side assistance policy I needed to get to pavement. When we finally hit black-top I pulled over and noticed there was no more power steering fluid in the reservoir. I did not have the confidence in the road-side assistance people to just stay put so I drove into Carbondale and stopped at the nearest gas station. The mechanic there told me not to drive anymore since I might lose my breaks, steering and GOD knows what else. So I called Hyundai's road-side assistance people (Cross Country Motor Club in my area). They sucked worse than Dracula. They had no idea what Hyundai's policy was. It took 2.5 hours for the tow truck to arrive and I spent most of that time on my cell phone trying to find out why Cross Country was only authorizing $300 towards the towing when I was cleary more than 150 miles from home and exactly 154 miles from the nearest dealership (in Golden, CO) or service facility. They were DUMB. The tow driver hauled the SF and our butts to Golden (3 hours at least) and got us to the dealership, which by the way was the same dealership we purchased the SF from, and proceeded to drop the SF off. It was now 8:30pm, the dealership closed at 9 and the service department wasn't even open on Saturdays (another problem). Planet Hyundai in Golden Colorado was just as DUMB as Cross Country. Everyone had a different understanding of what was covered by Hyundai's road-side assistance program. We ended up paying $100 out of pocket for the tow. Not one single sales person helped us and one dope even had the nerve to say that if we had purchased the car from them this would have been a different scenario. I told him I did buy the SF from them and all he said was, "Oh". and walked away. Their service department rocks. I don't want those guys to get a bad rap. That department is the only thing saving them right now.
The power steering fluid return hose had completely ruptured. According to the Hyundai service guys the old part is now obsolete (meaning no more single hose to replace the one that blew) and that there is now 3 parts to the very same return hose. The last of the three parts was released on Oct 4th and so far my dealership doesn't have the new part to fix my problem. It has been 2 weeks and add that to the 9 hour road-side assistance fiasco I am NOT happy with that particular service. I called Hyundai directly and 2 different people told me that the tow should have covered by them without question and I should have never had to pay any money out my pocket. I will get a refund. The dealership knows they owe me BIG since I told them I lodged a complaint with Hyundai regarding Cross Country and their dealership. On top of all of this, the dealership closed it's doors at 9pm and left my wife and out in the parking lot trying to get a ride home. We finally arrived at our front door at 11:30pm. Carbondale is 3 hours away from my door and this whole thing started at 2:30pm.
I will not go back to Planet Hyundai to buy anything ever again. I am considering adding towing back onto my insurance in case Cross Country screws this up again. I'm just glad this all happened in my home state rather than on my summer road-trip to California (which was sooo much fun and added 3500 miles to the SF).
I would ask about the power steering problem. It looks like Hyundai is aware of it.
I still want to know who will pay for my roaming charges on my cell phone since I spent about 1.5 hours on hold (total) out of 3 phone calls to the road-side assistance people.
Still love the SF and our new 2001 Tiburon purchased about 2 months ago but I dislike my old dealership. Fortunately the Tib was purchased at a new Hyundai dealership in Boulder and it happens to be closer to my home and they have a service department open on Saturdays (gasp).
~v
p.s. - The service department at PH asked all the right questions. After 1 week without my SF or a rental I spoke with our mechanic and he asked if we had purchased the extended warranty. We did and he informed us that it would pay for a rental car. Nice of the sales guys to sell us the warranty but not ask about it when I was screaming at them to help us. That is how I ended up with the Metro (ugh). The department set everything up for me and I can at least get to and from home and work. Thanks guys. Service Dept. - 1, Sales guys - less than zero.
And I guess it's minor when it happens to someone else!
Discussions by Hyundai owners and wannabe owners on several Town Hall boards always point to Hyundai's 5 year and 10-year warranty provisions as being the ultimate back-up should newer Hyundai models have the reliability problems of the older generations.
This point needs to be reinforced - that warranty (or anybody's warranty) is just a piece of paper.
It's only as good as the factory technical support personnel, the servicing dealer personnel, the parts support from factory and dealer, the Roadside Assistance personnel down to the tow truck driver, etc. etc.
And the cruel part is that just when you need all the support you can get, you're usually on a trip where dealers and parts are hard to find.
So, as ol' GTMustang would say - "Just buy a RX300 and don't worry about it." At least I think it was GT that said that...
Hey GT - where are you these days? -- the RX board misses you. Of course, now we have gimpyRX with an oil sludge problem after 25k miles and one oil change, so maybe we can get by without GT.
a SUV. Does anyone have such a unpleasure experience of Santa Fe?
How stable is it on high way and on turning?
Fast forward to 1998. I bought a Caravan (used 1995). The salesman told me there would be lifetime road assistance within a 50 mile radius as long as I owned the car. Should have gotten that in writing! I got a flat tire in my home town one day and being the non-mechanical female that I am, hadn't a clue how to work the spare. I was stuck with my toddler in the car too. I called the dealership and they REFUSED to come help because the mileage was 2000 miles more than their cut-off of 36,000 for this service. When I told them about my agreement at time of purchase, they just ignored it. It wasn't like they had to drive 10 miles to get to me. I was literally 2 miles from their door. I ended calling a tire shop and they came out, put on the spare so I could drive (and NO CHARGE!!). Naturally I went to their shop to purchase a new tire. I will never do business with that dealership again! This is called progress, give me "the good old days." I'm sure EVERYONE was similar horror stories. Now I drive a Kia Sedona with the same warranty as Hyandai. Therefore your story worries me.
Moral of the story: I'm glad this didn't happen on the highway or somewhere far from home. I include towing in my insurance policy (the extra $4 per payment is worth the piece of mind) AND I have AAA, just in case!
thank you
Just took it to the dealer. Mechanic says that noise is coming from inside the steering rack. They are ordering the rack and will be replacing it. I'm hopeful that that is the problem. However, I'm not 100% confident. Reason being that on occasion I hear a similar popping noise in the front suspension, although not as noticeable as described in first paragraph, when I travel over bumps, RR tracks, or just generally bumpy roads. To repeat, this popping is not as dramatic as it is when I make it happen by rocking the steering wheel. Nonetheless, it makes me wonder if there is a problem in the front suspension somewhere. Anyone else with similar experiences? Or thoughts?
BTW--I've consistently got 20mpg in city and 24 highway.
Last thing--I've always thought there is a fair amount of road noise with the SF. I'm thinking of getting it undercoated at the dealer ($100), hoping that this cuts down on the road noise. Thoughts road noise/undercoating?
Please give details!
Thanks!
We looked at the only Hyundai dealer in Colorado Springs (two locations, but same dealer) and noticed that they had an item on their sticker labeled "Regional Price Adjustment". When I asked them about it I was told it was because the SUV was in demand and hard to come by. This adjustment added $2000 to the sticker price. We also learned from experience with many dealers that Colorado Springs marks up their cars (no matter the make) and they don't like to negotiate. So we went to Denver. I guess the Regional Line ends somewhere between the Springs and Denver because their dealers do not have this mark-up. We went to two different Hyundai dealerships. One being Planet Hyundai where our experience with the sales people were similar to a previous post. They were not willing to negotiate more than $300 off of the sticker price (is that even a negotiation?) and the saleswoman kept trying to convince me she had been dealing with my husband for weeks. He finally asked her when she had been calling him so frequently because he didn't remember any of it.
We returned to McDonald Auto Group/Hyundai on S. Broadway where we dealt with Jeff and Chasity. They were great! We were taken seriously from the moment we stepped on the lot. They let us take the car out alone to test drive it. And the negotiations were good. We finally ended up at $1500 under invoice for a 2002 Santa Fe LX with a clear bra on it and the hood deflector (we like the sportiness it adds), mud guards, roof rack with cross rails, and carpet floor mats. Final cost $23,519. I would highly recommend them for the sales experience. They were upfront with us on how low they would go for the best deal. Not alot of back and forth to the sales manager's office.
We test drove almost everything on the market (RX300, Tribute, Escape, Outbacks, etc) and finally found that Hyundai had what we wanted. A solid riding, quiet SUV that comes with a lot of extras as standard at a reasonable cost.
I look forward to a happy, positive experience with my Santa Fe and a possible second Hyundai in the future.
http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/maintenance/articles/43781/article.html
The following site about timing belts has information about the interference engines and lists some in the PDF on this page:
http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?brochure=981&location_id=540
ALL the Porsche, Honda and Volvo cars/engines listed have interference engines too.
I would go back to the dealer or the repair order and see exactly what happened...It's important to be well informed. BUT, as you say, they replaced the engine under warranty and you should be OK now. If it was not under warranty, you might not have to replace the engine completely. It could still be repairable depending on if any damage was done and how much damage was done.
Diamond ATF SP-III or SK ATF SP-III
I don't know if Dexron III is compatible but the owner's manual also said that "Damage caused by a nonspecified fluid is not covered by your new vehicle warranty." You should check as soon as you can with your dealer/service center and take any action they suggest.
I live in Taiwan, I got my GLS 4WD Santa Fe for about 6 weeks. I had the same problem like yours the popping and thumping noise from the steering wheel was noted since 4 weeks ago. The mechanic also says that noise is coming from inside the steering rack (a connection join).
They replaced it in last week, after that the noise was gone. That was very pleasure to me, but the noise coming again in yesterday. But this time the noise not in rocking the steering wheel back and forth abruptly between 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock. The noise happen when turning the steering wheel to right end and slowly moving front or back. I supposed the replacing part was made in the same time so they had the same problem. I well try to ask my dealer to order a new one. If any thing improved I well let you know .
Thanks!!!
I have read with interest the postings on the subject of SF problems and it seems to me that while there are a few genuine issues, a lot of the postings are from owners who, given the level of intelligence shown, should not be allowed to drive let alone own a vehicle.
Anyway, the point that I wanted to make was this:-
My first ever new car was a 1999 Toyota Corolla and I bought it based mainly on the supposed reliability of Toyota products. While it is basically a good little car, it had several problems at the time I took delivery and has so far been back to the dealer 4 times in two years. To date it has had 1 new power steering pump, 3 drive belt tensioners, a weather strip replaced, a cup holder replaced and a new set of tires (not covered under the warrenty) at 17k miles. The point of my ranting is that if this had been a Hyundai, people would have been telling me that this was to be expected and that it served me right for buying it. Because it is a Toyota, people tend to have a short memory. I have owned many cars with supposed bad reputations and have found that most of the time problems are either caused out of ignorance on the part of the owner or that the problems are little different than those suffered by owners of so called reliable makes.
So my advice is drive and enjoy your Santa Fe with a smug grin that comes from knowing you have a great car at a bargin price.
End of diatribe.
I am not bashing Hyundai and I really love my SF. I am disabled and I find that it is the best for me as I can easily get in and out and it has more room of any that I have looked at. The ride is great, it is really solid. It weighs about 1K lbs more that the Rav4.
If you have a black SF check it out for water spots.
Then one night a few weeks ago, my car wouldn't start. I had to turn the key twice for a rather long time before the engine started. I didn't think much of it til it happened again the week before Thanksgiving. This time the car would sputter when I went from first to second gear. Plus the rpms were very high. I took the car in, and they said that the crankshaft had gone off center and that affected the spark plug too. Those got replaced. But I don't think my engine or automatic transmission is back to normal. It takes too long to speed up and the car sorta shakes when I'm changing gears. The gear shifts are painfully slow too.
Should I take the car back in? I'd appreciate any help or feedback