Questions About Test Driving

isellhondas

And I'm sure they are true.

Still...a good salesperson can see through the old clothes etc...it's the attitude.

kytim6482

I just want the car buying experience to be easy and painless. Many dealers can make this happen. But, some salespeople and sales managers make me cringe to even think about buying a car.

I looked at a Firebird once. The salesman drove the car off the lot and drove to a nearby park. At the park, the salesman explained all of the car's features. At this point, the salesman let me drive. I was directed back to the lot. I got to drive 4 blocks of stop and go traffic. I did not have enough open road to reach 15mph. Then, the sales manager wanted to begin negotiations. I left very quickly. Now that is what I call a Ridiculously short test drive.

Question for all salesmen... Is it true insurance requires the salesman to drive the car off of the lot?

alinda

yes.

landru2

Not an insurance requirement here for the salesperson to drive first. It is an insurance requirement that the customer be accompanied by a salesperson. However, we do want our salespeople to drive first. This is very much a safety issue. Although, everyone considers themselves to be an excellent driver, very few are. And many are horrible. So the salesperson drives first, makes sure it has fuel, adjusts the mirrors, makes sure the windows are de-fogged, makes sure the stereo is turned down, etc. This gives the customer a chance to check out some of the controls without trying to drive at the same time.

Imagine going for a ride with someone you've just met. The car is totally different from what they are used to. They hop in and pull out into traffic. They can't see out of the mirrors, they're trying to fiddle with the fan control, they don't adjust the seat so although they can get a toe on the accelerator they can't apply pressure to the brake, and they've cranked up the stereo so they can't hear you scream that they are turning in front of a semi.

Sound like fun?

isellhondas

Do the dumbest things. They will try to adjust the tilt wheel while driving on the freeway etc.

I've had to almost yell at people who are fiddling with the radio while almost rear-ending the car in front of them.

Then there are the immigrants who want to drive on the wrong side of the road.

It can be downright scary!

KCRam

...literally didn't even go around the block.

Back in 1990, I went to one of those "warehouse" dealerships here in NJ, shopping for an F150. After going through reception, the call-down ("next up!"), the grilling, and walking around the lot, I asked to test a nice looking black SuperCab 4x4.

Salesdude goes inside to get a D-plate and the keys. Comes back out and says he has to drive first for insurance. No prob. We pull out, the guard at the back gate makes a note on a clipboard, and we leave. Salesdude pulls to the curb and we swap. I adjust the seat and tilt wheel, and he tells me to turn right at the next corner, not even 100 feet ahead. I make the turn, and we haven't traveled 500 feet when he tells me to make a K-turn and head back. Transmission hasn't even made it through all the forward gears, folks - it may have gotten to 3rd. I turn around, and the salesdude is glossing over the maneuverability. I park the truck back on the lot where he indicates, and he takes me back to the desk for the hard sell. Instead, I thank him for his time, and just about leave skid marks as I exit the customer parking back to the highway.

kcram
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juicius

A couple years ago, I, for whatever reasons I have since forgotten and so far failed to justify anew, decided to trade in my '99 Lexus RX300 for a truck. Man, you should've seen the salesmen stream out of the showroom floor like it was a jailbreak. I sold the truck after some months, and went around a few dealerships, this time being driven by my fiancee and her hardworking (and showing it) '00 4 banger Accord. It was like night and day. We must have roamed the floor for half an hor before anyone would make time for us.

isellhondas

A lot of salespeople would have taken one look at the RX 300 and gone the other way assuming the owner was buried in it.

dave000k

In 1982, I was ready to purchase my first car without a cosigner. I wanted to test drive a Camaro. The salesman told me the manager didn't want much mileage put on these cars and would not let the car leave the lot. I made two loops through the dealer's parking lot, and the salesman told me the test drive was over. I went straight to the import dealerships down the street.

nippononly

you salespeople out there: is it reasonable or even possible for a customer to insist on a solo test drive on a car they are pretty serious about?

There is nothing more irritating than the 5 minute preset test drive route.

rroyce10

..... If a buyer is ready Now .. not just getting out of the bathroom reading the top 10 of the 03's from Car and Driver .. then he/she should be able to drive solo, drop the license and the ins card and take a drive ..

        Sadly, we get alot of the folks that have TP still stuck to their shoes, so it kinda messes it up for the majority ...

              Terry.

bgt1

When I went to buy my BMW, the first test drive was with the salesperson, then when I saw a car I really wanted instead, he just handed the car keys to me. (well, with dl and insurance proof from the first time).

But, I think he knew I was ready to buy anyways- which I was!

CarMan@Edmunds

It is obviously very important for any Smart Shopper to test drive the vehicle or vehicles that they are considering purchasing before actually buying one. As such, I thought that many of the visitors to this message board would find the following article that was just published here at Edmunds.com interesting: The Feel of the Wheel — How to Test-Drive a Car. Enjoy and please feel free to use this discussion to talk specifically about this article or about your experiences with and thoughts on test drives in general. Thanks.

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p1race

thanks, stuff I've never thought of before. I've been test driving
a lot, looking for a new car i'll use this article to my advantage. I recently testdrove the new lexus IS sport design, and had a blast i'll probably go back with these tips in mind. I found an offer online that said I could get a free preferred membership to live365.com for testing the IS, so it's worth going back. here's where I found the link, just in case you guys are interested.
www.live365.com

tk865

It's also good to remind people that the car you drive will one day be somebody's new car. Treat it accordingly. Throwing it into a corner to check grip, and panic stops are well and good, but there is a fine line not to cross. I once had a customer test drive an Avalon, and he said "I'm a fairly agressive driver, so I need to be sure this car can perform up to my standards - will that be OK?" Of couse it was. After sqealling around corners, jackrabbiting out of stop lights, and a full on panic stop from 80MPH on the Interstate, he came back and said, well, let's work some numbers. As I strated to get the VIN off the one we drove, he said, "Oh, no, I don't want that one.... I want this one" - and picked out an identical car. I asked why, and he hemmed and hawed about "It just looks a little nicer, I like it better.... I really don't want that other one...." He wouldn't admit that he didn't want the car he'd just abused. (#'s didn't work anyway - he expected a $350 payment on an Avalon XLS)

isellhondas

Well, I keep a fairly tight leash on test drivers.

If they scare me or do something stupid I'll let them know it's not acceptable.

I'm not about to get killed on a test drive.

Fortunately, this doesn't happen often.

tuneful

CarMan! I've test-driven a bunch of times in the past few months (having no car experience since an 87 Civic). Some dealers let me go alone (they get points), some don't (I prefer to go alone). I've learned a lot during the process, including willingness to go back and request an additional test drive (ALONE) or two if needed. Also, write my impressions down, alone, right afterward. I don't like it when the sales guy feels he has to keep up a steady stream of chatter on a drive. I have a good "poker face" and I think it drives them nuts :-D

isellhondas

Believe me, no salesperson enjoys going on test drives. It's a necessary part of the job.

Most well run stores require the salesperson to go along on most test drives for a variety of very good reasons.

Personally I see little need for lengthly or repeated test drives but that's just me.

And I felt the same way even before I got into the business.

prodigalsun

If I'm gonna be spending up to two hours a day in a car (Kenmore to Renton), I want to log a little time in it and get a real world feel for it. a 10 minute drive won't necessarily tell me that the lumbar support is gonna let me down.

isellhondas

We are all different.

Now, I don't have a bad back bt if I did, I would no doubt feel the same way.

lmp180psu

Very informative article, that while is mostly common sense, points out that the "new car smell intoxication" can sometimes be a negative factor in making a wise decision. I like the idea of splitting up features of a car into the "must-have", and the "want" categories.

I have one question concerning whether or not the salesman rides along during the test drive: Would I have a better chance of taking a test drive without the S.P, if i brought my MOM along who happens to be a Philadelphia police officer? BTW, I will be 23 by the time I am in the market for a car ( within a year), and I would think the dealer would know that I wouldn't try to steal or abuse the car with my mom in the car What are the feelings of the salespeople on this board (isell, tk, mack etc.)regarding this question/subject of who would and would not be able to test drive without a salesperson? Thanks, Lou!

tk865

on the basis of race, age, or sex would be ILLEGAL. For that reason, no customer at our dealership rides alone. I know it seems silly to tell a 40-year old mother of 4 that she has to have a salesperson along on a Sienna test drive, but by the same token if we let her do it, we couldn't deny it to an 18 year old in a shirt reading "Born to Steal Cars" who wanted to drive a used Viper. Fair is fair. (This is also why we must copy EVERYONE's ID. Yes, it really is just for security. At the end of the day (or around lunch on busy days) they all go in the shredder as long as the car has been returned). I've had a few police officers get miffed at having to have a "ride along," one even went so far as to say "You do know what a permit to carry a concealed weapon means, don't you?". From my experience, police are a bit harder on cars during a test drive than most customers anyway, though I suppose it's justified as they may need to get somewhere in a BIG hurry in it one day.

FWIW you couldn't pay me enough to be a cop. I think what we pay or police officers is a shame sometimes compared to what some other government employees make.

lmp180psu

Yes, I agree that we do not pay cops enough based on the stress and danger that goes along with it. Your reasoning about test drives makes sense as well. Are you saying that dealerships have either a no salesperson on test drives OR must have a salesperson on the test drive policy, NOT some customers yes and some no?

I understand your point about cops being harder on cars because of the propensity to be so on the job, but I know in my situation my mom would have plenty so say( like she does all the time I drive; "Don't do 40 in a 25 zone!!" aagghhh!) about testing the brakes, or doing a couple of higher speed curves etc., preventing me from being outrageous. At least now I know that the dealer can't discriminate based on what they think you will or will not do with the car. Thanks for your perspective.

One more thing: Can a dealer run your credit report while you are on a test drive, or is that ILLEGAL? I would hope it is, but you never know.

dsattler

It is illegal to run your credit report without your knowledge/approval.

rivertown

for a dealer to get your credit report without your knowledge and/or consent, but . . .
some do it anyhow.

My last three buys (once, Yoda; twice, Honda), the dealer arranged financing without so much as a credit application. LOL, one wanted an explanation for an ex's crappo credit showing up on my report; so, I know without doubt he had the credit report.

How'd they get mine? The only way possible was with DL copy obtained before test drive, which had DOB, address, and SS#. LOL, twice I was driving a rental.

lmp180psu

>>"How'd they get mine? The only way possible was with DL copy obtained before test drive, which had DOB, address, and SS#. LOL, twice I was driving a rental."<<

I remember reading in a article on Edmunds.com (I think) that you don't have to give the dealer a copy of your license, and it should be enough to just show your license to the salesperson. This would seem like a good solution to the problem rivertown had. Why do they need a copy of your license, anyway? The only one I can think of is just in case you steal the car, they can track you down..?

rivertown

For me it wasn't a 'problem', beyond knowing how far over the line the dealer would go. That sort of thing sucks, IMHO.
As far as their having my credit report, I've got nothing to hide and no reason that a hit on my credit report would hurt me. When I go to buy a car, I already know how I'm gonna pay; and the only question is whether the dealer's financing is better.
So, I was responding to your post asking if was legal and to dsattler's post saying that it's not legal.
I agree, that it's not legal. Even so, I know for a fact some dealers do it anyhow.

FWIW, I understand that too many credit report inquiries can hurt your application for credit.

lmp180psu

Thanks for the clarification.

I personally have good credit also (just not a long job history), so I don't have anything to hide/explain to the dealer. I guess I was wondering if the unauthorized credit report would somehow affect the negotiation process(i.e. If they know you have good credit, and would qualify for any special rates, would they try to negotiate a higher price since they wouldn't make their money off financing).

rivertown

Gotcha, Imp; and I think you're right as far as you're going with it.
Ultimately, I think it doesn't matter. If the dealer needs $XX.00 profit, he's gonna get it off the sales price and/or off the loan; AND you pay it one way or another.
FWIW, I think you can sidestep a lot of the complications by net shopping. Ask for a quote on the specific car you're interested in, and say you'll use your own financing or theirs depending on the deal. That way, you'll get a price on the car without your credit even entering into it. Arrange your own financing first, compare it to the dealer's, then pick the loan that's best. That's simpliest.

LOL, you can save some money by letting the dealer upsell you credit with a high apr while discounting the car and then refinancing at a better rate. That's REAL complicated, though; and most folks are gonna get bit.

rroyce10

....... Being able to choose and Not choose, who demo's a vehicle is -not- illegal, it's a private business on private property and the dealer has the right to say who drives and who doesn't drive .. obviously it needs to be done on a one on one customer basis.

          Every dealer is going to be different depending on the area and the customer base they sell to .. I have some dealer friends that don't allow demo's after a certain time at night, or demo's when the sales staff is low, alot has to do with the "type" of vehicles they sell. One dealer friend up north, is a BMW/Toyota dealer and unless they run your credit first, your not going for a ride .. then again I have a dealer friend out west, and "Attilla the Hun" can go for a demo drive there, he feels that it's 40 miles from getting lost - it's all different.

          Now, running someones credit without their approval -is- illegal .. most states are taking the SS# off their new license, which I totally agree with, especially with all the new fun games that are going on right now - like identity theft.

                 Terry.

eddie777

I went by myself to test drove a minivan last week. The salesman came with me and the ride lasted about 20 mins. Not bad (I've been on shorter ones).

After I got home and discussd with the family, we decided it would be ideal if we could try the van out for a longer period. How else could we test it under our real-world conditions (i.e. with our two little ones). Putting car seats in and out properly takes a while and is not something I wanted to do on a routine test drive. I called up the salesman and asked if I could borrow it for a night. He asked the manager and he OK'd it.

I got it Monday after work and returned it Tuesday noon. I took the car seats out of my car and put them in the van, loaded up the family and away we went for the evening.

For this to work, I think you absolutely must have the dealership's confidence that 1) you are not a car-abuser-type and 2) you are a serious buyer. Also, you cannot request a "hot" seller.

During the course of an evening we checked out just about every feature and test-drove it on any route we wanted. The best way to test-drive if you can swing it!

isellhondas

My experience has been the longer and more creative the test drive, the slimmer the chance of a sale.

lmp180psu

<< My experience has been the longer and more creative the test drive, the slimmer the chance of a sale. >>

Isell, I understand your reasoning regarding your statement (based on your experience in the business), because people have a longer time to find faults with the car/reasons not to buy the car. But as a buyer I would also look at it from another POV: If the salesman either lets me go on a solo test drive( either for 30 mins, or overnight), or lets me go on a test drive( with the salesman) other than the "4 right turns and back to the dealership" variety, then I would have a better feeling of the salesman. Also, I have a greater chance of buying from this person if I decide after other test drive of other manufacturers cars, because of his customer service "philosophy".

Do you find people commenting to you that the reason they bought from you was because of your honesty and service, or are they just looking for the "rock bottom" price?

eddie777

I haven't bought it . . . yet. I will be buying this model thanks to my extended test drive which actually helped solidify my choice.

Whether I buy from him will in large part depend on the price he offers. So far he's insisted on sticking close to sticker, so I will be trying my luck elsewhere. I will not buy from him just because he gave an overnight loaner. The business side still has to make sense for me. I don't think I am being an "inconsiderate buyer" in this regard.

But he definitely won some goodwill on my part and I will deal with him if I can. In other words, if he's in the ballpark of what others are offering, he'll get the sale based on his good service.

isellhondas

No, it just seems that the long and creative test drives seem to attract joyriders more than they do serious buyers.

But, there are always the exceptions I suppose. I just haven't met them.

eddie777

My motivation for the overnighter wasn't so much a longer test drive (although it was nice), but being able to test with the family. It was impractical to bring them along since it's a pain to take out and put in car seats. I think it's unrealistic for people like me to be able to make such a big decision affecting the whole family based on a solo 20-minute test drive. Just curious, if I made made this request of you, what would you have answered?

tk865

but the dealer would be open to a BIG discrimination suit, and, provided they didn't settle out of court (they would) they would lose if evidence could be produced that people of a different age/ethnicity/gender/etc were allowed to take unescorted drives. Look at (American?) airlines..... They are a private business, they chose who could and couldn't participate, they are being sued to smithereens. Also, river, when I got a hint my credit had been pulled, my first words would have been "I don't recall signing a privacy notice, or giving permission." My next sentence would have been "Can you get me the address of your dealer's legal counsel?" Understand - I've never sued, and rampant litigation is one of my pet peeves, but pulling credit (and possibly damaging your beacon score) without your consent is a BIG no-no. Also, believe it or not, the dealer having a copy of the license can protect you. If you're in a wreck, and your license has expired, but the dealer has a copy, that shows the dealer should have know it was expired (they made the copy, didn't they?) and are therefore at fault..... Kinda.... Also, yes, in extreme cases the copy of a license could help track someone down. The biggest value, though, is as a deterrent. If you're planning to steal the car/kidnap/rape the salesperson, etc, you would get REAAAL nervous about being asked for your ID, and having a copy made. (If you just SHOW it, but you kill the only person who saw it.,...) Sorry, but I stick by my guns, regardless of Edmunds advice. If they ask for a copy, let em. If they run your credit, sue em. I liked the idea on one website of actually writing on the photocopy "permission is NOT given to pull credit".

rroyce10

..... ** BIG discrimination suit **

         Nope, even that is a little strong .. the Airlines only rents/leases property from city/county property and it falls under Federal guidelines .. two separate entities.

                   Terry.

tk865

I say any good civil rights lawyer could stick a legal prybar into that one and open a door a mile wide, at the very least draw a big cash settlement. Just becasue it's a private business doesn't mean it can discriminate. Yes, there is the "reserve the right to deny service to anyone for any reason," but that doesn't cover you very well. Wonder what zues thinks on this one?

michaellno

...we have buyers like my parents, who are in ther market for their first car purchase in 10 years and their first NEW car purchase in 30 years. They drive about 5K a year, mostly around town. For them, the "4 right turns and back to the dealer" would be more than sufficient.

I'm trying to give them a bit of a hint what to look for (are the seats comfortable, can they reach everything), but I'm 1000 miles away, so all I can do is guide them.

rivertown

I agree - especially on the unauthorized credit report. I'll be shopping for my kid's car before long, LOL; and we'll see what happens.

On the test drive & discrimination issue - I think a pattern of different treatment by ethnicity, age, gender, creed, etc., (intentional or not) would be plenty for a civil rights attorney to sink his/her teeth into.
A smart dealer would either keep records to ensure and prove there is no such pattern (what a PIA that record keeping would be!) or adopt an effective policy of non-discrimination which prevents the development of such a pattern. "Everybody drives with a salesman" seems simplest to me.
If I were in business, I wouldn't want the NAACP, the AARP, or advocasy group for the disabled, etc. on my tail! Defending something like that would be another expensive PIA, even if I won.

manamal

Age discrimination is legal....as long as it is it is not against someone who is over 40 y/o.
At least in employement law. I suspect the dealer can also discriminate based on credit report. Something like...if you are going to take it alone, we need to pull your credit.

isellhondas

We can always make exceptions and we would in your case.

This doesn't happen often but, probably once a year, I'll get an oddball request. Somebody wants to take the car for two hours,etc...

And we will grant these requests within reason.

These "Special Request" people rarely buy.

Did you buy the car you drove home?

edle777

(Eddie777 here, Edle777 is my userid from work)

Anyway, yes, I did buy the car I test drove. But only because the color was my wife's preference and the salesman and I worked out a reasonable figure.

But even if I didn't buy it, so what? I don't have that obligation do I? There are no guarantees just because you loan the car out. I could have been a joyrider, but that's his call to make. All he does by loaning me the car is buy some goodwill (which admittedly may have dubious value). If he had said "no", I would have moved to another dealer and tried there. Whoever gave me a loaner would earn my goodwill of dubious value.

Isell, I hardly think asking for a car for two hours qualifies as an "oddball request". Once you assess that the requester is likely "serious", then granting the loaner might be an important step to closing the deal. Just a thought.

isellhondas

I guess I said "oddball" simply because we rarely and I mean rarely get such a request, hence the verbage.

Of course you were under no obligation to buy that or any other car, I was just curious if you did buy it since, under these circumstances it just seems that people seldom do.

Glad it worked out for you.

mackabee

We've been down this road before (no pun intended) At my dealership a copy of the driver's license is required and also a salesperson is required to go on the test drive. There are exceptions to the SP on the test drive rule. I.e, car only seats two, couple want to test drive, etc. When I was on the floor I would always ask the prospective customer "Would you like me to go on the test drive or would you prefer to go by yourselves?" 99% of the time they would ask me to hop in. The 1% would want to go alone "If it's ok we'd like to go by ourselves." no problem. I did have one lunatic about a year ago that wanted to see how fast the Matrix would go on the freeway. I immediately asked her to either slow down, or pull over and I would drive the car back to the dealership. She responded "If that's the case then I'm not buying the car." I said "Fine, if you want to do over 100mph you can do it in your own car when you buy it and with me not in it." Needless to say, she didn't buy the car and it turned out she was with her cousing and was just visiting from out of state. Her cousin was being assisted by another salesperson and her credit was so bad she couldn't buy a car even if I loaned her the money.
                           ; )
                           Mackabee

isellhondas

I've told this story before but it still burns me when I think of it.

On a BUSY Saturday I had a guy ask to drive a new Accord. I could smell something was funny since he was asking me a lot of personal questions.

After awhile he tells me he can tell I'm a pretty savvy guy and how would I like to attend a get together at his home the following evening.

He was evasive about the content of the meeting...aomething about investments etc.

Well, I smelled Amway and I was right! I point blank asked him if this had anything to do with Amway.

" Well...Amway is one of the companies we represent"

He then went on to tell me that it had been suggested to him that he try to recruit people this way. Of course, he had just started with Amway.

Man, I was TICKED and let him know it!

dbgindy

Mack,isell,sarah,rroyce and all you other great experienced posters. Do you often have people come in to test drive if they don't have any intention of buying a vehicle? Do people really do this as a time killer ( or in isell's case a recruitment tool :-)? I know to paraphrase Jim Morrision "people are strange" but outside of a really hot sports car or something I guess I just never thought anyone would want to do that. Just curious.

isellhondas

This happens pretty often. We call these people "test drivers" or "joyriders". they entertain themselves by driving cars they have no intension of ever buying.

Running into one of these time wasters is the worst thing that can happen to us.

Had one yesterday and I knew it as soon as I met them. I will never understand what motivates people to do this.

dbgindy

I'm with you. Like I said aside from maybe a hot sports car or something why would anyone want to do that? Beats me. On a related topic I cringed after reading a lot of postings here about GM's new 24 hour test drive. I'm all for bending backwards for a customer but I'm just assuming they have some limits or it would be free rental car for a night wouldn't it? :-)