Any Questions for a Car Dealer?

audia8q

Initially I would ACV (actual cash value) your car in the 8K range due to the mileage...but after reading your details, like non-smoker and binder of service history I would call the car at $8500...which is right on target with edmunds numbers. with the salestax savings on a trade in, your actual amount is more.

If you trade at a dealership the negative equity is easy...they will roll the balance into the new loan...If you go with the Protege5 they are offering 3.9% for 60 months so you can roll over the balance at a good rate.

of course, your kidding about the Corolla part, haha
You should be able to work out a deal on the P5 for a few hundred over invoice.

Rich

force98

I got my '99 Cadillac Escalade from them--amazing dealership. They sell all GM and Chrysler line vehicles. They claim to be the largest Dodge truck dealer in the U.S. At the time I dealt with them, every vehicle they had was marked at no more than $217 over invoice. Each vehicle had the invoice taped to the window, which showed the $217 profit and final cost. And believe it or not, this included Vipers, Corvettes, Prowlers, etc (which had to be ordered). They had 25 Escalades lined up, all listed at $39K (which was about $2K below invoice). I bought my Escalade for less than what the Spokane dealers would allow for a loaded Tahoe.

This was a great way to buy a vehicle. No haggling, great prices, state-of-the-art show room, etc. You'd have to visit the place to believe it. It's located in a small mining town in the mountains that has gone bust. It would probably be a ghost town if not for the dealership. They own parking lots all over town, and they have to take you to a specific lot depending on what vehicle type you want. I must have seen over 100 Dodge Ram trucks on one lot alone.

I guess they make their money by selling tons of cars. I know on the Saturday I purchased mine they sold 46 vehicles. The only drawback to buying from them was the wait, as they have to pump so many people through finance, prep the cars, etc. But it was worth the wait for the great price and no hassles. Plus, they had a BBQ going and fed the wife and I burgers and hot dogs for free.

I've been told the GM and Chrysler dealers in Spokane hate them. Definitely worth the 75 minute drive as far as I'm concerned.

Any other dealers sell like this?

protegextwo

Rich, thank you very much for your thoughts and advice. I really appreciate the time and effort the auto sales professionals put into Town Hall.

Respectfully,
Larry

bretfraz

http://www.southerngm.com

force98

http://www.davesmithmotors.com/

rsheffer

Is there any advantage or disadvantage to the buyer when he makes the initial dealer contact through the internet? Is the dealer's internet contact usually just another salesman that's been assigned internet duty that day? I'm going to buy an Acura 3.2 TL and just wondering what the best way is to make the initial contact with the dealer.

raybear

Usually there is an internet manager. Don't expect test drives and walkarounds. These guys are strictly business at the major stores.

pepper50

I plan to pay the entire price of a new car by check. Is a dealer likely to accept a personal check directly written on my money market account, or will a certified check be required? If a certified check is required, then I'll have to transfer the funds first which will take 2 business days. That would require them to hold the car for a couple days, so I guess they will want some kind of deposit the day the deal is finalized until I pick it up and pay the balance? Can that deposit be by personal check or credit card, and how much deposit would be normal on a finalized deal? Thanks

rroyce10

....... As a rule (if there is one) most dealers have no problem taking a personal check .. I have, many times.

But also as a rule, I wont take a out of state check because of the lag time (5/7 days) ..

Food for thought here, you can have the money "wire transferred" to the account from the money market acct --- that takes about, Mmmmm about 18 minutes depending on the account.

Terry.

timadams

I bought my last five cars with personal checks, one was even an out-of-state check. I never had a dealer balk at that, or even order a credit report. I know not all dealers will do that, but I've had no problems.

If I recall, I used checks directly from my money market account several times. They would be out-of-state checks, wouldn't they?

pepper50

Wire transfer is not possible since it is mutual funds money market out-of-state. It takes 2 days for an electronic transfer. I bet I can talk the dealer into taking the check. If not, they'll just have to wait two days. For whoever said that a dealer might not want to wait 5-7 days for an out-of-state check to clear, that fact should have no effect at all on the dealer. The dealer's bank account credits his check the day he deposits it. So any interest is begun on the day it is deposited whether it is local or not. Now, granted, the dealer may or may not be able to withdraw part of the funds for 2-3 days (here in Texas it's never more than 3 days), but if the dealer is so strapped for cash that he needs my check for his immediate cash withdrawal to pay some other bill, then his operating reserve is too low and his business too shaky for me to risk doing business with.

rroyce10

..... You might want to be lookin' for a new broker ..or something.

Anything done before 10am will be in the "Hip National Bank" by noon. I have done it a ton of times.

And by the way .. that was me, that said "out of state checks" ... Do you really think I'm going to let a customer stroll around in my $20,000 vehicle for 3 or 4 days, til his check clears.

I have no Idea what kind of business your in, but let me strike you a reader for $20,000 and I promise it will be good in 3 or 4 days ....

You got to be kidding ... right..? I guess economics 101, was just one of the courses you flunked.. .l.o.l.

Terry.

dardson1

for any of you GM people out there....what happened to the SmartBuy? Been doing those for years, never ended up more than $500 upsidedown even when the residuals were very high (and therefore the sales tax advantage on a trade was worth the $500 lose). Been trying to buy a Tahoe....got a nice price, learned to live with the $ for my trade, and even got my wife's keys and cleaned out the car assuming we'd do the deal after working out the finance details. What I wanted (as per usual)was a 36mo SmartBuy. The residuals right at 50% for 3 years and 12kmiles. The finance guys turn kinda pale and change the subject back to straight finance and then quoted me a very high figure on a SmartBuy which ain't so according to the GM BuyPower payment calculator.
What's the deal? Doesn't GM think an 02 Tahoe @ $34.5k will be worth $17k wholesale in 3 years? The finance option with the 5.9% is not out of the question. The down is more and the payments are higher but I can afford it. What I can't afford (since I trade often) is a vehicle that can't hold 50% of it's value over 3 years. Has GM lost it's confidence in their SUV's?

pepper50

>You might want to be lookin' for a new broker..or something. Anything done before
>10am will be in the "Hip National Bank" by noon. I have done it a ton of times. ....
>I guess economics 101, was just one of the courses you flunked... l.o.l.

I've said in no uncertain terms (Reading 101) that it cannot be wired. It is not a "broker", it is not a "bank," it is a mutual funds company. And it is not cash. It takes 2 days; the shares are sold after the market closes that day and transferred the second. Trust me; I have done it a "ton of times." (whatever that means... usually in most states time is given in numbers rather than weight.)

Anyway it's a moot point, since today I decided to have them do a dealer trade for a unit with slightly different options I want. So it will take 2 days to get that done, and that all works out perfectly. Another happy ending.

davefromny

When a redesigned car, such as the Toyota Camry or Hyundai Tiburon, arrives at the dealers, how much does that depress the selling price of leftovers from the prior year? What happens to the leftovers that the dealers can't sell at a profit? Also, what's the effect on the value of used cars of that model?

rickroz

I know these apply to a new car purchase, but what about buying a used car from a dealer??

odd1

Give rroyce a chance. I've been reading this board for close to a year now and have never seen his response be condescending before. I know that is not his normal helpful way around here. We all have those kind of days.

abtseller

The manufacturers will bump incentives on the older model to clean them out. You will usually find someone willing to take them if they become $1000 cheaper or have a great interest rate. The ideal situation is where the dealers sell out of the old models before the new ones arrive. We were out of new 01 Camrys a month before the 02s arrived. We're sitting on 1-2 02 Corollas with the 1st 03 just having arrived. Some things, such as our new Chevy commercial vehicles can sit for one or two model years before getting sold.

Ed

nyccarguy

You're buying the car brand new for a much cheaper price than you would the new model, but you take a bigger depreciation hit when you go to sell the car 5 years down the road. Even though you bought your car at the end of the model year and it will have less miles, it is still a car from that model year.

amcdan1

I am considering a 2002 Hyundai Santa Fe. The base model, 4-cylinder would be about $30 less per month than the GLS V6.

If/when I look to sell or trade the Santa Fe in 4-5 years, will the depreciation hit on the base model 4-cylinder offset the $30/month I would save over the years (i.e. 30x12x4 = $1,440)?

Both would be fully equipped, including ABS and automatic.

Thanks for any insight.

abtseller

are going to lose about 90% of their value in 5 years, so it shouldn't matter.

Ed

amcdan1

In 5 years, an SUV with 60k or less miles - even a Hyundai - is only going to be worth around $2,000?

rroyce10

..... I wasn't trying to give you "brain damage" .. just an idea.

When you sell out of your Mutual Fund via bank, broker or the Mutual fund itself. The sale time is up to you, do you sell at the 3:30 bell or the 9:45 turn, it's your choice.

As soon as it's sold, the fund broker or co, can and will wire transfer the cash.

Again, I was just trying to give you a hand, I'm glad things worked out.

Terry.

isellhondas

Careful...some people will take you literally here.

Of course, that number might not be 90% but we do know that anything Korean depreciates like nothing else.

amccdn,

Seriously...if depreciation is a concern to you, there are better choices...much better!

amcdan1

thanks for your reply.

"Depreciation" wasn't really my overall concern. Rather, I was using it as one way of comparing the V6 to the 4 cyl.

And while I took abt "literally", it was only in an attempt to see if he would give me a real answer.

abtseller

close. There are other threads on this board about Hyundai and resale values.

Ed

nyccarguy

to answer your question, a 6 cylinder Santa Fe will be worth more than a 4 cylinder Santa Fe 5 years down the road!

im_brentwood

Are part of the invoice cost of many NEW cars.

They should NEVER EVER come up on used car. EVER.

As for the Santa Fe.. I'll say here what I am about to say over in Real-World Trade-Ins (My home topic)

If resale is a concern, look elsewhere. A 1997 Sonata is barely worth, in reality, $2,500.

Bill

tlaplante

My 18 year old son,living in Florida, went to Texas and traded in his 99 Blazer(clear title) for a 97 Mustang. This was 12/13/01. He has never received the title, although at first the dealer claimed to have sent it.
Subsequently the dealer said he had copies of documents and would resubmit the application to the state. Finally we spoke to the county tax office which had no record of the application for title being submitted.
In Texas, the dealer has 21 days to apply for title, and now it has been 7 weeks.
We have obtained a complaint form. Today, we spoke to the dealer who said they were having problems obtaining the title from whomever. (They say the state).They say they paid off the lien on the Mustang and are waiting for their title.

My questions are: Should I go ahead and file a complaint or give the dealer some more time?

And: Does this sound like a problem that would take the dealer more than 7 weeks to straighten out?
Thanks.
Tom

bretfraz

Last night I was doing some research of Gerogia law pertaining to a similar problem. In GA a dealer has 90 days to submit title paperwork. If something goes wrong in the process they have another 60 to rectify it.

You really should spend some time reading Florida laws regarding auto titles. GA law had numerous sections so I'm sure FL does too. Start with the state's website and go from there.

Perhaps a Florida dealer will chime in or maybe an attorney with knowledge of Florida auto regulations.

tlaplante

We went to the Florida tag office to get an exrension on the temporary tag. We asked if we could apply for a Florida title with the paperwork we had (the copy of application for Texas title and bill of sale and odometer verification) and they said no, we had to have the Texas title before they could title it here.

gabling

Hello! My wife and I purchased a new 2001 Toyota Tundra September, 2001 along with Toyota's extended warranty. The truck had 278 miles on it, but was sold to us as NEW (the salesman said the manager had to pick his daughter up at school once and used the truck). It was the last left-over on the lot so we bought it. We just received the packet with the warranty information, and it turns out the vehicle was put into service four months before our purchase! Sounds to me like they put it into service as a demo and sold it to us without disclosing that.

My question is do auto dealerships HAVE to disclose that a car is a demo? The dealer has been 'looking into how this happened' for 3 days now and I am going to call them today to find out what the delay is. I think since the truck was a demo and sold without disclosing this - a discount on the purchase price is warranted.

Any comments??? Sorry for the long message...

Thank you for your advice!

Glen

agt_cooper

a more accurate determinant as to new or used is whether it's ever been titled. A "demo" is a new car (it has never been titled) that has been driven by someone for some purpose. (There may be a limit as to how many miles can be put on a car before it has to be registered, but I really don't know.)

It could be that a couple of people took long test drives in the truck, or the dealer used it for a weekend, etc., etc. Regardless of how the miles got there, they have not deceived you; the truck was still considered new when you bought it.

As far as the "in service" date, I'm not sure what that means exactly. Somewhere on the truck, you will find a build date. The dealer likely received the truck within 15-30 days of this date, at which time it is fair game for use as a test driver, or a dealers "demo" unit, if that dealer provides such a thing to their employees.

Personally, I wouldn't sweat 278 miles on a Toyota. While they might not have been the gentlest miles ever put on a vehicle, I doubt the truck is any worse for wear.

Oh, and by the way, I'm not a car dealer, so maybe I shouldn't be answering in this thread!!! OOOOOOOOPPSSS!!!!

landru2

278 miles in 4 months? Doesn't sound like much of a demo to me. Something isn't right though if you mean that you have to do with 4 months less warranty than normal. I would want to know why it was put "in service" 4 months ago and driven only 278 miles. My guess would be that it was sold once (4 months ago) and returned for some reason.

rroyce10

...... Hmmmmmm, sounds like the ol' -- I got to have, one more vehicle, to break the volume bonus -- deal to me.

It sounds like, the dealer was short by one vehicle about 4 months ago. And he punched the ticket, as a sold item to the region to hit Bonus. It's common.

That's why the warranty clock, has been ticking on your vehicle.

Terry.

isellpotiac

The store I work for does not put vehicles into demo service even when we do drive new cars as a demo. That does not mean the store you purchased from practices the same thing. The two scenarios landru and Terry provided seem the most likely. If anything happened like an accideant a dealer must disclose this to customer in my state. I would not make a big deal out of it. Will you drive the mileage allotment in 32 months? If your answer is ye you have nothing to worry about.

audia8q

I think RR is right on here....The dealer needed an extra sale a few months ago and you car was probably reported sold to Toyota and the warranty started ti click off....the idea is the sell that car to a "real" customer as fast as possible..in this case it took 4 months.

Rich

gabling

Thank you to everyone who responded to my original post about our Tundra possibly being a demo!

While waiting to call the dealership, I talked to NJ Division of Motor Vehicles. They did a search on the VIN of the Tundra and found that the truck was titled and registered only once, to us. So at least we know that no one purchased it, drove it off - and then returned it. (Phew!) I called the dealership, but got the ol' "We'll call you back and never called back routine". I'll be calling back this Monday to put an end to this mystery. I've been very pleasant to them, but Monday I'll have to start some pressure! At this point I'm looking for either an extra year on our warranty (We put very little miles on, so we'd never hit 75k in 7 years!) or some cash back. I know 278 miles is nothing to worry about, but I feel that this whole 'mess' would have been avoided if they would have disclosed this information at time of sale. (And we still would have purchased it!).

Thank you again for your advice... I'll post again when I hear more!

Thanks - Glen

agt_cooper

but now you guys have me curious....

Exactly what does "put into service" mean? I always thought (silly me) that a warranty started once the car was sold to a customer. How does it really happen? What's the difference between a car that's been sitting on the lot for 4 months and gets driven 275 miles one weekend, vs the one that is the subject of this discussion?

The last car I bought was a demo, but my paperwork clearly shows the warranty start date as the date I bought it. (3,000 of the 36,000 miles had already been used up, however....)

Hope I didn't step on any toes with my attempted answer before.....I'll leave these things to the experts from now on, lest Bill or Terry send me to my room yet again!!!

kkollwitz

Economist.com | European cars www.economist.com/agenda/displayStory.cfm?Story_ID=984279

aomorales

First Question is:
My sister-in-law is trying to trade in her 2000 Dodge Caravan. She asked me how can she trade in since she owe almost $17,963.00 on it. The term is 72 months. She likes the 2002 Nissan Quest GXE. Please can someone help on this one. Thank you.

Second Question is:
My brother-in-law is trying to get out of the lease on his Toyota 4runner. He still has 2 years lease contract with Toyota. He is trying to get a much cheaper payments on another SUV. What is the consequences of returning the SUV before the contract expire?
Thank you for your help in advance...

Angel

abtseller

It sounds like both of your relatives are going to be hurting if they try to get rid of their current vehicles. Check with the "Real World Trade In Values" thread for information as to what their vehicles are worth. The Caravan is probably only going to bring about $8-10K wholesale, so if she doesn't have the balance for a down payment, she will likely be unable to buy anything (decent) without a sizeable down payment.

The 4Runner may actually be worth the payoff on a trade-in, so check the value of it vs. the payoff amount. You can't just quit making payments and turn a lease vehicle back in, it will count as a reposession on your brother's credit report, which won't help him in his quest for a new vehicle.

Ed

isellhondas

I can't think of too many cars that have worse resale value then a Caravan. She is probably buried. She can trade it and it may be possible to roll some of the negative equity into something else. Then she will be REALLY buried!

The Toyota has better resale, but he is responsible for the remaining lease payments if he trades or returns the truck.

And he wants "much cheaper" payments??

I deal with this pretty often and always wonder WHY people do this to themselves!

isellpotiac

If it ends early someone will pay.

rroyce10

..... I never heard that one before ..

I like it ..!

Terry.

carleton1

Posting #601 (Name of poster deleted for privacy purposes):

Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
605 messages,Last post on Jan 22, 2002 at 07:56 PM
#601 of 605 resale by Jan 20, 2002 (06:21 pm)
I've been trying to trade my 01 Sienna XLE, leather, power door (1), fancy mirror, and that's about it. When I bought the car in Oct of 2000 it had an MSRP of $33.5k with none of the pie-in-the-sky adds like protections pkg or extra mile option (you know the stuff....high dollar low value adds that mean nothing at trade time). I can't get any dealer (trade) to budge a penny higher than 19k for my 12k mile, no dent, no ding, just-like-new 01 Sienna XLE.
I bought this Toyota for many sensible reasons not the least of which is their reputation for great resale. And yes, I've shopped the car at enough dealers to believe 19.5k is about all anyone is going to give.

And here from Smart Shopper a confirmation by an expert:

Real-World Trade-In Values
5254 messages,Last post on Feb 11, 2002 at 06:35 PM

#4647 of 5254 Previa and Sienna by Jan 15, 2002 (10:05 pm)
I think that Sienna would do just under $20K to MAYBE $20K at a sale.

AND now for my comments: I realize many Honda dealers/salesmen do not like DC minivans, but facts are that Siennas (and even Odysseys) have depreciation. Let us compare trade-in to trade-in values of all vehicles and not use Caravan trade-in vs Retail of a Certified Sienna or Odyssey at a dealership.

I have NEVER seen a Caravan depreciate $13,500 in one year and only 12k miles.

aomorales

Ok, the first question:
I understand what you have just told me. I just talk to the Internet guy at the dealership he said that a Caravan has a low trade in value. He told me that it just cost only $9000.00 which is right on the money guys...:)talk about bumming out. She still owe $17K on the freaking thing. The internet guy says the best thing to do is bring the van at the dealership to give an accurate value on the van. So, guys what is the BEST thing to do? 1. Stay and finish the payment of the Caravan or 2. Trade in and get a much better van even though it will cost her an arm and leg in the process but at least better car value at the end...

Second Question...
Since you have mentioned that 2000 Toyota 4Runner have a much better value is it possible he can get out of the lease by trading it in at the dealership for a 2002 Nissan Xterra SE V6. What will be the consequences of this?

Thank you very much for your response..

Angel

carleton1

The Caravan STILL remains # 1 in sales by a VERY large margin. Town & Country was # 2 for Dec 2001 and T&C + Voyager would make Chrysler # 2 in sales for 2001. Check this link:

http://www.autosite.com/editoria/asmr/svolva.asp

Honda and Toyota lovers will tell you that sales volume is not the indicator of value. Fine, the same applies to #1 sedan Accord and #2 sedan Camry.
Sales numbers just indicate buyer perception of VALUE for the dollars spent for those who cannot afford luxury like Jaguar, Lexus, Acura, Mercedes, etc.

mark156

Aomorales.... 72 months on the Caravan...what was your sister-in-law thinking? It sounds more like a mortgage. She has only had it for two years, maybe when it's four years old she may not be SO upside down. Tell her we wish her luck.

Mark

abtseller

If you have to own a mini-van, there's nothing wrong with a Caravan. Personally, I like them a lot. It, however, is cursed with the "family name" which is synonymous with poor resale value across the board.

Percentage-wise, you're going to have better resale with a Toyota or a Honda, but that is once again a consequence of the family name.

Have your brother find out the payoff on the 4Runner and then see what the dealer will give you for a trade in on it. The dealer will pay off the lease just like it was a regular purchase.

Good luck, let us know how it works out!

Ed