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Real world mileage with 2.5 and CVT

2

Comments

  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    I'll get better with a few more miles and an oilchange.

    Wow, 60 MPH, the engine must only be turning about 1750-1800.

    I've done some trips in my wife's 04 Lexus RX330 and kept it below 65 and gotten above 30.

    You're right about the aerodynamics, I swear the new Outback is the size of her Lexus.

    I like that color too.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It is much taller than the old one. Frontal area must be 20% bigger than before.
  • watkinstwatkinst Member Posts: 119
    Fuel up and do a gradual ie easy entrance to the highway - put it on cruise with no major hills or wind in play and you can do 70mph and get around 30-33mpg. Toss in a down hill run say Colorado across NV going WEST and yes you might even see 35mpg. However that is not really your every day milege or even road trip average.

    I've done two classic SF to LA trips on I5 in CA with the same load. The first trip we got an average of 27mpg doing 70-75mph the whole way thats both directions!

    The second trip in order to avoid being tail gated - and the agressive drivers I set the cruise at 80mph and we got a rock solid 26.5mpg that happened to be both directions also same load.

    Running north to Eugene Oregon we got a solid 28mpg there and 29mpg on the way back. Around town very flat - very limited traffic suburb type driving a solid 24mpg consistantly. In SF 21-22mpg solid. Towing our boat - 20-23mpg with no head wind 60-65mph with head wind its been as bad as 17mpg.

    Only time we posted 30mpg for any distance was with nearly zero hills - traffic - cruise control set at 70mph and a very light on the throttle freeway approach. Yes you can get 30+mpg but your normal every day driver will never see that.
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    Don't know if you're in a Legacy or OB (outback rating is about 1 MPG worse) but we don't get to drive 80 MPH. As far as light throttle on the freeway approach, well I've been driving for more than 45 years and I use the amount of throttle that will get the job done, no more, no less.

    Actually I did recently get less than 30 on ONE tankful. Driving to Austin last week my wife got the gas while I hit the restroom on one stop. I got behind the wheel leaving the station and I noticed the needle wasn't all the way up. She calculated the mileage at 37 MPG. Uh, oh. The car had been on a slight angle and she pulled the nozzle when it cut off. At the next fill up it registered below 30.

    The two tanks we drove back on got 31.5 and 32.4, about what we've averaged (highway) for the 14K miles we've put on the car.
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    I'm a bit over 28,500 on my 2010 Legacy Limited with 2.5 and CVT. Just got back from a trip from Fort Collins to Cincinnati and got 34.4 on 3 of my fill ups. That's with 2 adults, suitcases, laptop, snacks and one set of golf clubs. Generally we were driving at 70-75 MPH except in the construction zones. On my last fill up, Hays KS to Thornton (just north of Denver) we got about 32, but that is "uphill" and the temps were in the 90s.

    Overall very pleased with this unit. Not sure why watkinst can't get above 30 MPG on the I5.

    easypar
  • timadamstimadams Member Posts: 294
    I have a 2011 2.5i CVT Legacy with 6k miles, and I'm certainly happier with my fuel mileage than I was last winter. I've noticed a big spread between 100% highway vs. mixing in any significant amount of "regular" driving - I don't want to call it "city" driving, because I live in the country and rarely ever drive in stop-and-go traffic. I took two recent trips and got 31.5 and 31.7 MPG, with all highway driving. My normal everyday mileage is about 24 to 28, depending on the type of driving. I would like to have higher, of course, but I'm pretty much hitting the EPA estimates, even if it tends toward the low to middle end with typical suburban/rural driving.

    My last car only had about a 4-5 MPG swing between my everyday driving and highway driving. The Legacy seems to have a 7 or even 8 MPG swing. That seems to be the case with many new cars, which are designed to loaf on the highway for boosted highway mileage.
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    With such few miles you'll see an increase after another couple of oil changes. The extra gears in the CVT seem to really help a lot. The only time my revs get high is maintaining highway speeds going up to the Rocky Mountains.

    Very please with the numbers on this car. Makes my wife's RX330 (which we liked the mpg on) seem like a gas hog!
  • kingscorpiankingscorpian Member Posts: 16
    2010 Legacy CVT
    I travelled from Northern NJ to Virginia just outside of Washington DC last summer. I used my cruise control just about all the way averaging speeds of 65 -70 MPH. I also used the AC on and off just to cool off. I made it there, parked in a garage and back on a full tank of gas 36 MPG @ 575 miles with 60 mile to go so that was over 600 miles total. I get an average of 33 PMG on my way to work with about 90% highway. :)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Sweet. :shades:
  • pilot1226pilot1226 Member Posts: 166
    I have an `11 Outback 2.5 Limited and recently did a bunch of driving for a summer vacation with the family.

    Had about 525 miles on my tank before the light came on and filled it up. I have noticed a pretty big difference (as expected) if you stay closer to 55-65 rather than driving a lot faster than that. Trip computer seems to suggest that I could exceed 600 miles range if I drove highway at 55mph.

    The computer also suggests that I break 30MPG highway, which is a few MPG higher than the window sticker suggests.
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    edited August 2011
    Amen on the slowing down bit. Back in '08 (the last time gas spiked) we were doing a fair amount of back and forth from TX to CO that was just long enough that it couldn't be done in one day. We routinely drove at 60 or so and often got 30 mpg +/- from my (former) '93 Maxima with 3.5 liter and my wife's '04 Lexus RX-330.
  • occkingoccking Member Posts: 346
    Have had my 11 Outback 2.5 for 10 months now, just passed 26k. I do mostly highway driving. For the last four fillups, have averaged (based on consumption, not the onboard computer that always shows higher than actual (by about 5%) have averaged slightly over 30 mpg. I last reset the trip computer 5000 miles ago and it reads 30.6, and I know the actual over that period of time darn close to 30. It's either the warmer weather or car getting broken in, for the first few months (October to April or so was averaging around 27.

    I fill the tank to the brim every time, so I know my calculations are correct. One of these days I will run out of luck, on three occasions I have put 18.7 plus gallons in, once I even squeezed 19 gallons (take supposed to be 18.5 gallons.

    Also when you have approx 100 miles to go, seems like the minuted it drops down to 80 or 70 miles to go, that's when the idiot light comes on. But, don't plan on going 70 or 80 miles further as that number is optomistic.
  • almattialmatti Member Posts: 164
    occking: That practice of going past the Fumes to E in the tank is not really adviseable. No matter what Gas you buy, there's always some sort of silt or dirt in there that usually settles in the tank. Taking iot down to below 1/4 tank is not a good prcatice. You won't be looking forward to engine problems or clogged gas filters that will stop you in your tracks when you least expect it. Who needs that Headache...Just some friendly advise from an "old Man"...
  • skomanskoman Member Posts: 24
    I have had a 2010 since March 2010 and put 36,000miles on in 18 mo, and averaging 74-79mph freeway I regularly get 31-32 on the freeway. If I keep it at 69 or less it goes into the 33s no problem.
  • saabgeorgesaabgeorge Member Posts: 22
    I could never understand this logic. The fuel pick up in your tank is always located on the bottom of the tank so what difference does it make if the tank is full or not? If there's sediment in the bottom of the tank it will get picked up even when full. Plus the fact that modern cars have fuel injection that use a fuel return line for the extra gas that the fuel pump sends to the engine and then isn't needed so as your tanks gets lower the fuel left has actually been passed through the fuel filter multiple times making it even cleaner. But is bad to go too low as this can damage the fuel pump as it requires the fuel for cooling.
  • skomanskoman Member Posts: 24
    I agree, I had an 1997 Ouback Sport and I would run the tank down to fumes regularly and had zero issues and it was at 214,000 miles and running strong when I sold it (my mistake since that car was a tank and ran like a swiss watch). Same for 2000 Outback and 2010 Legacy with less miles.
  • shirotorishirotori Member Posts: 51
    Maybe it's just me, but I think a diesel would be a near perfect fit for Subaru...torque torque and more torque with amazing fuel economy...just look at the Volkswagen TDIs! Diesels would fit in perfect (IMHO) with Subaru's image as a rugged safe vehicle. Let Toyota and the others have hybrids, diesel would be a great way to go for Subaru.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I agree, but they have to get their current diesel engine to meet CARB emissions first. Right now it doesn't.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    edited October 2011
    Why would they need to meet CARB to bring it over? The majority of the states don't require that level of emissions standards (yet), so they could sell a fair bunch of them at the federal level while they feel out the market and work toward CARB. That's assuming, of course, that the car will meet federal requirements as is or with minor tweaking.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    They don't *have* to, but to not sell it in Cali would limit sales, as that's where a lot of green buyers are to begin with.
  • robr2robr2 BostonMember Posts: 8,805
    edited October 2011
    They don't *have* to, but to not sell it in Cali would limit sales, as that's where a lot of green buyers are to begin with.

    More importantly, many Subie strong holds follow CARB: CT, ME, MA, VT, NY, RI, OR, WA all follow CARB.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    And Subaru has 7% market share in VT, vs. just 0.5% in Florida, last time I saw a state-by-state break down.

    That's the best and worst states for them, FWIW.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    All the more reason to roll it out now. If the cars sell well in states such as Alaska, Colorado, New Hampshire, Minnesota, Wisconsin, etc., then there's probably a pretty good argument to invest in CARB compliance for those other markets.

    Those states include:

    Arizona (2012 model year), Connecticut, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington, as well as the District of Columbia.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    MD - so no diesel Subaru for me. That's why I want a CARB-compliant one!
  • robr2robr2 BostonMember Posts: 8,805
    The 14 CARB states I would say represent about 50% of all Subaru sales. Further, they are some of the most populous states in the country.

    Why would Suburu offer a vehicle that can't be sold in a vast market?

    Also, dealers in states like NH sell pretty much only CARB rated vehicles because they don't want to lose sales to border dwellers in the CARB states that surround them. I'm sure northern VA dealers are the same way.
  • dcm61dcm61 Member Posts: 1,567
    Why would Suburu offer a vehicle that can't be sold in a vast market?

    They still offer the Tribeca. :confuse:
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    Because they already have it and it would sell. Like I already said, if they offered their current machine for sale now (assuming the CARB requirement is the only impediment), then they could feel out the market further to see if it is even worthwhile to pursue CARB compliance. Besides, I'm sure they could also sell it in Canada, so why lose sales and frustrate customers because of one state's emissions requirements (that other states have voluntarily adopted)?

    I'm all for "clean cars." At some point, however, one has to recognize that there is a certain level of demonization occurring when it comes to diesel fuel, regardless of the fact that vastly better fuel economy can be achieved from a diesel engine with all other things being equal.

    We can cut off our nose to spite our face, but that sure makes it difficult to tell when something stinks.... And, I'm not talking about diesel fumes! :P
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • robr2robr2 BostonMember Posts: 8,805
    You are looking at it from a consumer perspective and wouldn't it be great if I could get a Subie diesel. From a business perspective, it doesn't make sense to sell a unique engine/model in certain states. It makes for fractured marketing, more difficult logistics, et al.

    AFAIK, other than new model rollouts, no manufacturer is selling particular engine models in only specific states. It's an all or nothing propostition. Further, I believe a new engine/model combination would require complete EPA and NHTSA testing before going on sale. Spending that money to sell a vehicle to less than half the population of the market doesn't make sense.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The high cost of getting it all certified and federalized means they won't do it if they can't sell it everywhere.
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    This is definitely true. Back in the '70s (when emisssion/safety rules were being met by band aid type "fixes") Porsche made all US export, probably all LEFT HAND DRIVE models to California specs. IIRC 90% of their US sales were to CA so that was the way to go. Since 911s weren't that plentiful on the Autobahn CA was possibly a majority of total sales.

    easypar
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    I just think it would be great for them to give a big FU to California! If more manufacturers did that, the public pressure might actually make a positive difference in all our lives.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • robr2robr2 BostonMember Posts: 8,805
    Well that's a political argument, not an market based one. Even if it were useful in this case, do you really think Subaru would be the one to do it? After all their image is all about peace, love and understanding - that's the California way.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    Hahah; no, that's NOT the California way.

    If Subaru is willing to sell a car like the Tribeca, which has been a bomb since day one and was built primarily for the NA market, then surely they can take a chance on the Forester diesel, which would NOT be a bomb (even if they had only 2/3 of their potential market).

    I think they're more likely worried that it would cannibalize their gasoline-engined sales, and it would, but not to an extreme level. For example, I'd buy one in a heartbeat but am otherwise not likely to purchase a Subaru for my next vehicle.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited October 2011
    What they need to estimate is how many incremental sales a diesel would bring if it was offered to only half of America, and then whether the costs of certification would justify it. Tribeca is already paid for, certified, and notice they have not updated the powertrain since 2008.

    It would be a pretty big gamble, and Subaru is ultra-conservative.

    Don't get me wrong, I'd *LIKE* to see one, but given their track record it's soooo not happening it's not even funny.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    it's soooo not happening it's not even funny.

    There's no doubt about that at all. Knowing Subaru, they'll probably wait until the market is already doused with diesels, and then it will be just another contender.

    Right now, they could really make an impact. You say markets like Florida are not Subaru strongholds, but put a >40mpg car into the mix, and I don't think having AWD would even be a factor any more. It certainly wouldn't detract from it. Really, the uptake rate is going to depend on the premium associated with the engine. If they can keep it as a sub-$30K offering at MSRP, it'll be a hit (and not just in the northern climates).
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Exactly. They will be the 7th diesel entry in the compact crossover segment, after VW, Honda, Toyota, Mazda, Chevy, and Jeep. :sick:

    Forester diesel, right now, for $25-28k. Hire extra accountants to count the money.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    I might even apply! :shades:
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • mcharliemcharlie Member Posts: 22
    6000 miles, one long trip from Reno to Seattle and back. Overall trip mileage was 29.6 mpg. That is what it was, up and back. Never over 30. Around Reno, mileage is averaging 27 something. We are mountainous, above 4000 feet, which will change mileage. The car has lots of power...more so than the 2000 Forester we traded in with 200,000 miles. Lots more cush! We just got the basic model and I put in the Bluetooth accessory. Took both of us a while to get used to driving with the CVT transmission...like driving a 1955-56 Buick with its DynaFlow transmission on steroids! I read some reports that people were claiming 35-36 mpg with the CVT Outbacks....Horse hockey...Maybe going downhill for 500 miles..but not in the real world.....
  • skyiceskyice Member Posts: 21
    edited November 2011
    My car is 2011 outback 2.5 i. I got an average 20.1 MPG since I bought it, about 3900miles now, mostly city roads. 20.1 MPG is acceptable to me. However, it gets worse now. I filled up the gas tank when the low fuel light was on (for the first time) yesterday. The number on "distance(or mile) to empty" meter dropped very quickly from 330miles (full tank) to 260 miles for only a 20 miles drive. You may say I should not trust the digit meter. But I did a calculation between two fill-up before. 16.6 liters for 105 KM or 15.7 l/100km or 15mpg, that is a lot to me. Does anyone has any idea on this? I just saw too many good MPG in this forum, which makes me feel upset. :cry:
  • easypareasypar ColoradoMember Posts: 191
    Three points here;

    1. Not very many miles yet, probably haven't had your first oil change, right?
    IIRC it took me until about 8,000 miles to start getting pretty good mileage.

    2. All town driving will definitley kill the average.

    3. The computer seems to recalculte almost every mile so don't go by the onboard DTE numbers.

    If I spend a week or so driving around town and then fill up for a trip to Vail mine will say mayber 300 miles DTE when I get on the interstate highway. By the time I've driven the 50 or so miles down to Denver it will read 380 DTE, by the time I've driven to Vail (all uphill) it may still say 280-300 DTE.

    Usually my car doesn't move once I've parked it at a ski area. When I drive back to Denver (all downhill) it may read 350 DTE and then back around 300 when I get home.

    If it's really bad on actual (you calculate) mileage then maybe check to make sure there isn't a loose connection around the air cleaner. Not sure why there would be but on my wife's Lexus they used to always lose one of the screws when they would check the filter at oil changes. The first time I realized they were doing this was when we had the oil changed the night before a trip from Austin to Denver. I could almost see the fuel gauge moving and had to buy gas before we got to Abilene!

    easypar
  • skyiceskyice Member Posts: 21
    edited November 2011
    Thanks a lot! easypar

    I had my first oil changed 3 months after I purchased this car at 1000 miles which is suggested by Subaru owner's manual. Now it is about 7.5 months and I will do the second oil change next week and see if the MPG can be improved. I will ask the dealer to check the air cleaner too.

    I just don't get it why so many people have such great MPG in both city and highway. As I see, most of them can gain from 23-27 MPG. Now I can only have 16.2, which is too abnormal.

    It is my first outback and everybody told me it is a very reliable car before I bought it. I was very happy with it until last week. I got two recall letters from Subaru America regarding windshield wipe motor and moonroof. Although they are just small problems, I still feel uncomfortable. :sick:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Keep in mind they are merely addressing even minor issues. That should actually reassure you.

    Subaru had issues with head gaskets and extended warranty coverage on those to 100k miles, too.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 16,130
    Honestly, it depends on how "city" your city driving is. If it is literal stop/go every quarter mile (or less) all the time, mileage is going to be terrible. There is just no way around that. Typical city driving involves some distances of a mile or more before having to stop again, which then helps to bring that average up.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    If it's cold, mileage will basically stink until the engine is warm. So for the first mile or two you are getting terrible fuel efficiency.

    That's why it's a good idea to combine errands - the engine's already warm.
  • skyiceskyice Member Posts: 21
    edited November 2011
    Thanks both xwesx and ateixeira!

    Yes, I do have a lot of stop/go on the way to work and back to home in my city. The weather here is nice but I still warm up my car every :blush: morning (until the blue light off) and remind my wife to do so as well. I believe the MPG on highway is much better than the city roads with a lot of traffic lights and stop signs. Anyway, I will keep watching my MPG.
  • dcm61dcm61 Member Posts: 1,567
    The weather here is nice but I still warm up my car every morning (until the blue light off) and remind my wife to do so as well.

    THAT is what's killing your gas mileage. Modern cars do not need to be "warmed" up before driving off. Start the car and drive "sensible" until it's warm.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    You can drive while it warms up. The ECU is programmed for that, actually, so it's OK to drive off.

    You should give it enough time to establish oil pressure and flow before driving off, but that's a matter of seconds, not minutes.
  • skyiceskyice Member Posts: 21
    edited November 2011
    This morning I calculate the MPG again by myself between two filled-up. The MPG is 16.2. 50 miles city roads killed 13 litre. The trip computer for the average MPG reset after last filled up is accurate, showing 16.2 MPG.

    I don' think it relates to the warm-up engine issue. It'd never happened before I drove extra 15 miles when the low fuel light was on last week. I think the poor MPG may be the consequence of potential gas pump damage. Is that possible?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It would be hard to isolate it to one factor, since there are so many.

    Remember, when you're sitting still, idling, you are getting 0 mpg. Enough of that will bring your average down no matter what kind of roads you drive on.
  • lykalyka Member Posts: 1
    I have had a similar experience. On my last trip I got 35.7 mpg, mostly interstate driving with 2 adults and luggage. I also have noticed that if I buy my gas in central or southern Virginia, I will get up to 2 mpg better than Maryland gas. I have the same 2010 Outback Ltd with 2.5 ltr.
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