I picked up my new 2011 Optima EX with Premium (w/o Heated Steering) and Tech package on Tuesday. It has the leather wheel and it is very nice - soft and supple.
I test drove a car with heated steering a few days ago and the heated version of the wheel is not very nice. It felt more like plastic to me and it was hard.
So which is better in my opinion? I definitely prefer the unheated leather wheel. It feels fine to the touch on a cold morning.
So far, I really like this car. I am getting nothing but and tons of compliments on it. All of the comments on the leather and plastics have been that they were premium quality (and those came from Audi, Infiniti, and other luxury car owners).
Even my snobby insurance agent drooled all over it and jumped right in to check it out. He had nothing but praise for it.
Any questions - post and I'll do my best to provide answers...
JC
ps - It is Platinum Graphite - the car is stunning in this color.
I was just over at my local Kia Dealership getting a recall taken care of on my 2011 Sorento. They had a loaded Optima EX on the showroom floor. Had everything: Heated and Cooled front seats, Heated rear seats, Heated Steering Wheel, Nav, Panaromic roof, Etc. Was Pearl white with the beige interior. Fantastic car for a Msrp of $27,500 I think it was. I would have loved to taken a test drive, but I knew it would be a bad idea. I have a 2009 Ford Fusion SEL V6 that is loaded with only 28,000 miles on it, so it will be awhile before I'm in the market again. Probably another 4 years after my youngest graduates from college. With tuition and room and board at the school he wants to go to it's about $47,000/yr. Even with the scholorship money it's going to be expensive. Too bad. This car is going to be hot for Kia. I am envious jcs. Enjoy your car and please let us know what you think of it after you put about 30,000 miles on it. Would like to know what kind of Mgg you actually are getting once it's broken in.
2012 Highlander Limited AWD V6 and 2015 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
I didn't notice that the seat bottom was particularly hard. Of course I didn't take it for a test drive. Didn't sit in for more than a couple of minutes.
2012 Highlander Limited AWD V6 and 2015 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
LOL, look at the invoice prices on the Optima and the TSX for even the base models. No way can you get a new 2010 TSX for the same price as a 2011 Optima. Unless you are trying to compare a base TSX with no options to a fully loaded turbo Optima.
I am not an Optima owner, but you are clearly comparing apples and oranges. I am sure the TSX is a more refined car (my sister owns an 09) but you are paying a lot more for that.
Which is the whole point here. Kia is giving you a lot of car for the money. I don't see how anyone can dispute that.
I bought an A4 and it cost me a LOT more. I love the Audi, but I still respect the Kia Optima. The front passenger seat 'compartment' was tight to us and it was what ultimately disqualified the Optima. Unless they stumble seriously in the next few years, Kia and Hyundai will be on my future car shopping lists.
Today on the radio a West palm stealership was advertising 9,000 off, 2011 kia's including the optima. I find that hard to believe. I believe the dealership was napleton kia.
If you take a jog over to the sonata discussions, you'll see quite a few people lemon lawing their 2011 sonatas. 10 years ago I considered the XG300 (hyundai) vs. my current camry. Glad I made the choice I did. But I 'did' think by the time I needed a new one they'd be ready for prime time. It appears nothing's changed in 10 years. Just because a car is pretty (and the optima is) doesn't make it desireable (same with women).
Nice cars. I had an '02 and an '05 (2.0T, which I chipped). Both w/ manual trannies. I thought those cars shared the nicest interior ever put in an automobile, even if the back seats were tiny.
A quick check over on ebay shows the following- There are 5 Sonatas that are '02s that have between 110K and 150K miles. There is one '03 Sonata that has 169K miles.
I refuse to believe that Hyundai now makes sub par cars. In addition, since we all know that the best warranty is ONE THAT YOU DON'T USE, Hyundai is not dumb enough to offer a 100K warranty to lose money. I am sure they have done plenty of testing/design study on their cars.
Back to topic, since Optima is based on Hyundai platforms, one can expect improved reliability. Those hard front seats are another matter.......
In addition, since we all know that the best warranty is ONE THAT YOU DON'T USE, Hyundai is not dumb enough to offer a 100K warranty to lose money.
They'd have a hard time losing money on their warranty under any circustances. From most of the posts I've read, it appears they fight you tooth and nail over everything or just plain ignore you. Why would people have to lemon law their 2011 sonatas if it's such a great warranty... :confuse:
Let's keep the Hyundai talk out of this discussion and focus on the Optima instead.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
It's hard to completely separate Hyundai from Kia seeing how they comprise HKAG and the Optima/Sonata have shared so much over the years and that continues w/powertrain of the 2.4, 2.0T GDI mills and six speed transaxles.
I bought a 2011 Sonata LTD 2.0T and I'm not thrilled over its seats. However, I rode in my brothers 2010 vette and like his even less.
Mine has the left pull, that entails a small percentage, yet I've faith that it'll be addressed to my satisfaction.
New models can have issues crop up that need tending.
I bought the car due to the great reviews, price point value, warranty, MPG and the powertrain.
I encourage you to do the same. The field is crowded and competitive, so you should have no problem mixing, matching and comparing trims.
I would embrace the alliance of Hyundai-Kia similar strengths and appreciate the diversity among them as more options from whence to choose...
Where can I get a 2011 optima manual without having an optima. I went to their site and they want a VIN##. WHAT!!!! I want the manual as I research my decision between a Buick Regal T07 or a fully loaded optima SX.
I was able to download the Regal manual with no issues. Come on KIA what gives!!!
I am pretty sure you can get the owners manual as well as many others (like the Nav system) at http://www.kiatechinfo.com/ You have to register but no VIN is required. Save a copy to your PC to view them in larger format.
Hi JC; Thanks for the information. I'll take a look later today.
My wife and I test drove the SX yesterday as I test drove it on Friday and reading all the post about hard seats I wanted to have my wife and myself check this out before we make our final decision.
Well the seats are not hard they are pretty comfy we took the car for a test drive without a sales person most likely because they know us as we had test drove an EX 3 weeks back. We took it down a gravel road, twisting, a 200' - 300' assent and descent twisting road. Using the paddle shifters through this area was excellent!!!. It was way above what I expected for the performance and road handling. Then we did a test that the Buick dealer had me do to test the stability control. We went down a gravel road with a decent descent and driving 30 MPH jammed on the brakes at the same time turning the wheel left and right. The car stood straight, right on track. EXCELLENT!!
Through this test drive we found the seats comfy and supportive. The regal seats are a bit more comfy but the optima has way more to offer at 5k less then the Regal.
Any new Optima owners having the steering problem a lot of new Sonata owners are having? The Sonata forum has a lot of complaints of the cars pulling to the left and a need for constant pressure to keep the car going straight. This is not torque steer as it happens on freeway at steady speed. Since the Optima should have the same setup, just wondering if anybody here has a similar problem.
Thanks. Good info. I'm not considering the Sonata as I really don't like the styling as well as the Optima....in or out. It may very well be the struts or strut braces as that seems to be one of the things that owners have been getting replaced to alleviate the problem.
How is the seat comfort? Lots of mention from auto reviewers about how hard the drivers seat is. I sat in at the auto show(5 mins) and didn't seem much different than my present vehicle which admittedly has firm seats. I'm thinking it's a real personal thing and some people just are used to or like very firm seats and some don't.
There are indeed reports of what seems to be a similar issue on the Optima. Several people on another forum have mentioned it on their Optimas. I would recommend everyone check for this issue specifically when test driving. Apparently having someone in the passenger seat offsets it some as well so ideally you'd want to test it solo.
That said, i have seen it characterized as simply a "drift" on the Optima. It's not sharply pulling so you'd have to pay attention and specifically try to reproduce it to notice it. At least that's my understanding from reading various accounts. Some of the Sonata video's I've seen it's a full out 1 inch drop on the steering wheel and a very sharp pull to the left. Does not appear to be that severe.
EDIT: I should have said 'a similar issue" so I fixed it.
BTW seats felt fine when I sat in one. Have not had a chance to test an SX yet.
I'm really not sold on EPS. I realize that it saves a little gas and is the wave of the future though. Ford seems to do a better job than most with it. My understanding is that you don't get the same feel and that microadjustments to the wheel are almost constant or even fairly heavy pressure to resist the crown of the road is sometimes needed as well. I'm sure every year will bring improvements in this tech and they will eventually get it really good.
I remember the good old days when you could drive down the freeway and hold your hands an inch from the wheel and go for a long ways before any kind of adjustment was necessary. Course they probably didn't do a good job of crowning the roads then either and you had more hydroplaning too. Everything is a tradeoff I guess.
I'm a bit skeptical too, but if it's done well I feel like it's one of those things you'd never think of. The Sonata pull I've seen doesnt look electrical, looks structural but I'm no expert.
As for the Optima, I really would just like to get some seat time in an SX and take it for a ride. I've been following this darn car so long I'm almost burned out on it already and starting to re-consider entry level lux class cars. No SX's in my area still.
I have not noticed any of the issues that some are talking about. My experiences so far are:
- No drift - No problem with steering on crowned roads - No problem with taking hands off the wheel - My car tracks dead straight at cruise, acceleration, and braking - No hard seats
Now for something not mentioned before...
I have noticed that on really cold days and when I have the climate controls set to auto and at 75 degrees, the blower is on and set in the medium fan speed. That causes cold air to blow under the dash vents and onto my legs. IF I set the temp down to around 72, the blower slows to low and it is not as uncomfortable.
I have a 2007 Hyundai Santa Fe with Auto climate controls and it does not do this. When it is cold (and no matter what temp it is set to) the blower comes on at the lowest speed and adjusts accordingly as the car warms up. It also automatically sets to front Defrost as well.
So far my Optima's automatic climate controls are behaving differently.
Any one else seeing the same thing as me on their Optima?
You really have to be 100% certain that the road your on is flat. I have noticed in any car I have ever driven that if the road is sloped to the shoulder to allow possibly for drainage that a car will seem to be out of alignment when you take your hands off the wheel. I've also noticed that sometimes the right lane on the expressway might be sloped to the right while the passing lane will be sloped to the left. Not sure if this is just my imagination, but it sure seemed to make a difference if I have a pull to the right in the right lane and then switch to the left lane it has a pull to the left. Or maybe I'm just crazy.
2012 Highlander Limited AWD V6 and 2015 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
. I've been following this darn car so long I'm almost burned out on it
LOL. I've been there several times as well on many different cars/trucks/suvs.....you name it. Data overload almost. I've drifted away from the Optima at times but still follow it closely.
I'm looking at the EX35 also. For me it fits. No kids, rarely carry passengers, like a little room to haul some boxes now and them, sporty, luxurious, lots of tech, awd for the snow, dependable and big discounts given off MSRP. It has drawbacks too but so does every vehicle out there. I usually keep vehicles 7-8 years so I will probably only buy another 3-4 new cars in my life. So I'm kind of leaning towards luxury cause I won't go around again.
No, that's exactly what I was taling about when I mentioned the crown of the road and hydroplaning. They used to make roads pretty darn flat and with the sloppy steering of older cars(I'm talking 60s/70s/80s) you could turn the wheel a quarter turn without even affecting direction(possible exaggeration but close). Well, on the old flat roads they would go straight as an arrow for a long time. However, those same roads were terrible for hydroplaining in the rain as they didn't drain very good.
Now, the engineers have crowned the roads and with better tires and steering it's a completely different ballgame.
One good think the kia optima has going for it is it's made in Korea. The sonatas with the issue, from what I can see, are all made here in the U.S. Most sonatas are made here. Some are still imported.
If you ever had ridden in a car with just coil springs you'd never consider buying one. Both of these vehicles use a strut spring assembly just like most FWD cars.
"I remember the good old days when you could drive down the freeway and hold your hands an inch from the wheel and go for a long ways before any kind of adjustment was necessary. Course they probably didn't do a good job of crowning the roads then either ...."
These must be the good old days as I can do that with my 10 yo camry. As for the crown in the road, the alignment of the vehicle is set up to compensate for that, and that has been the case for a long time.
One good think the kia optima has going for it is it's made in Korea. The sonatas with the issue, from what I can see, are all made here in the U.S.
Why would the production location matter? I think all modern factories do a good job with quality control...or correct an issue once its identified.
I don't think there are specialized craftsman working in factories where you can have a local pool of resources that have years of experience.
I could be wrong...but I think it's all automated...push this button...screw that bolt here.
I think after a certain number of years you're an expert...which is why they pay to layoff older (higher paid) workers. If it takes you 5 years to be an expert...then the guy with 25 years experience is just an overpaid expert.
"my current camry. Glad I made the choice I did. But I 'did' think by the time I needed a new one they'd be ready for prime time. It appears nothing's changed in 10 years. Just because a car is pretty (and the optima is) doesn't make it desireable (same with women)."
According to TrueDelta, the 2011 Sonata has above avg. reliability which is good for a 1st year model.
And gee, I wonder which manufacturer had an issue w/ engine sludge?
"They'd have a hard time losing money on their warranty under any circustances. From most of the posts I've read, it appears they fight you tooth and nail over everything or just plain ignore you. Why would people have to lemon law their 2011 sonatas if it's such a great warranty..."
Funny, according to the JD Power CSI survey - which evaluates customer satisfaction for service and warranty work, Hyundai scores ahead of Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda and pretty much all of the non-luxury Japanese makes.
Nice, try, but once again, you are debunked.
Anyway, yeah, there have been complaints about the Optima's "hard" seats, but personally, I had no issue with it.
My first ever post! Very exciting. We are deciding between the LX and EX Optima. No options. I am leaning to the EX primarily because of the tires and wheels. While my wife would like leather, it is not a deal breaker. Is the ride measurably better with the larger tires? I think the car looks better with the larger tires, but that is not enough to pay extra.
I have not started negotiating. Here are the prices given. These prices do not include DMV or taxes. Supposedly, all other fees are included. I think I am supposed to get a $500. rebate for owning a Honda Civic.
LX MSRP $21,285 Quote $20,080 EX MSRP $23,190 Quote $22,025.
Price is pretty go compared to Edmunds market value.
Test drive both. You probably will not be able to tell much of a difference. You can always buy aftermarket wheels at a later date should you buy the LX.
Smaller wheels provide a better ride in general. Manufacturers have gotten better at disguising or diminishing the inherent problems with larger wheels (more weight, more noise, lower mpg, and the need for less compliant and lower profile tires). Large wheels are the fashion now, and all cars are moving toward them. Thus we have seen a steady improvement in ride and noise with 18 and 19 inchers. Still, if you are not into fashion for fashion's sake, a 16" or 17" wheel will generally give you a smoother and quieter ride. Plus you will save big when it comes to replacement time. Remember that just a few years ago, the standard was 15" (and 13" and 14" for small cars), so 16 and 17 were the big sizes then. I imagine we are moving toward ridiculous 22 to 25 inchers (which still ride like lumber wagons) before this fashion passes, and smaller wheels become the new hot thing. :P
What do you think the Optima deals will be next month. I am ready to buy but the dealer does not have the color combo I want. They claim, since the car is hot, they are not able to get the color I want from another dealer. I qualify for a $500. rebate and I like the financing deals.
While I do not have a signed deal, I think I can get the LX for $19,580 before taxes and DMV or the EX for $21525. before taxes and DMV
Regardless of any recent tire technolgy improvements, 18 and 19 inch wheels are going to have a worse, bumpier, noiser ride with lower fuel economy than a higher profile 16 or 17 inch tire that fits the same car (higher profile tire).
The advantage of the larger tire is mostly a styling preference and then maybe a bit better handling and braking. Larger tires like 18's usually also have much lower treadlife and cost much more money to purchase. You are going to be spending a lot of money frequently replacing very expensive tires, so you better really **LOVE*** the way they look for it to be worth it. Check the estimated tread life and replacement cost of both tires.
Normally I would urge someone to go for the model up based on $2 grand spread out over 4-5 years for instance.
However, since you mention you don't really need/want leather or fancier wheels, the other simple stuff you get on the EX (fogs, push button, some trim pieces) probably aren't worth the cost difference. Honestly, the leather is OK, but it isn't that high a quality.
Stick with the LX auto. Add the convenience package if you want a power seat and homelink.
Thanks Conwelpic I did go to that site this week and when I clicked on the agreement link it brought up a blank, empty page. Nowhere to click I agree. I'm using Firefox then tried Safari nothing. I did read on these forums that most of the KIA sites will only work with IE. So I tried IE and that worked.
What happened was I wrote KIA consumer affairs and they called me and then sent me an email to the same link. They also told me that many more SX's will be available in June as I mention I would be look at purchasing around August / September.
I did go to the site and downloaded all 6 SX's manuals.
Supposedly my 01 camry is one of those with the engine sludge issue. I guess someone should tell that to my car. It has 177,000 trouble free miles. I guess the same people who don't know how to operate floor mats have engine sludge problems as well.
Comments
Since they've apparently withdrawn the heated wheel, I'm not sure whether the wheel will now be leather in the cars with that package.
I test drove a car with heated steering a few days ago and the heated version of the wheel is not very nice. It felt more like plastic to me and it was hard.
So which is better in my opinion? I definitely prefer the unheated leather wheel. It feels fine to the touch on a cold morning.
So far, I really like this car. I am getting nothing but and tons of compliments on it. All of the comments on the leather and plastics have been that they were premium quality (and those came from Audi, Infiniti, and other luxury car owners).
Even my snobby insurance agent drooled all over it and jumped right in to check it out. He had nothing but praise for it.
Any questions - post and I'll do my best to provide answers...
JC
ps - It is Platinum Graphite - the car is stunning in this color.
I have never sat in a harder seat than that in the Optima - never.
BUT I LOVE THE LOOKS!!
I am not an Optima owner, but you are clearly comparing apples and oranges. I am sure the TSX is a more refined car (my sister owns an 09) but you are paying a lot more for that.
Which is the whole point here. Kia is giving you a lot of car for the money. I don't see how anyone can dispute that.
Which drivetrain/trim/color did you get?
There are 5 Sonatas that are '02s that have between 110K and 150K miles. There is one '03 Sonata that has 169K miles.
I refuse to believe that Hyundai now makes sub par cars. In addition, since we all know that the best warranty is ONE THAT YOU DON'T USE, Hyundai is not dumb enough to offer a 100K warranty to lose money. I am sure they have done plenty of testing/design study on their cars.
Back to topic, since Optima is based on Hyundai platforms, one can expect improved reliability. Those hard front seats are another matter.......
They'd have a hard time losing money on their warranty under any circustances. From most of the posts I've read, it appears they fight you tooth and nail over everything or just plain ignore you. Why would people have to lemon law their 2011 sonatas if it's such a great warranty... :confuse:
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Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
I bought a 2011 Sonata LTD 2.0T and I'm not thrilled over its seats. However, I rode in my brothers 2010 vette and like his even less.
Mine has the left pull, that entails a small percentage, yet I've faith that it'll be addressed to my satisfaction.
New models can have issues crop up that need tending.
I bought the car due to the great reviews, price point value, warranty, MPG and the powertrain.
I encourage you to do the same. The field is crowded and competitive, so you should have no problem mixing, matching and comparing trims.
I would embrace the alliance of Hyundai-Kia similar strengths and appreciate the diversity among them as more options from whence to choose...
I was able to download the Regal manual with no issues. Come on KIA what gives!!!
Thanks for any info
Also check out the instruction videos at https://www.kia.com/#/ownervideos/ You don't have to register to watch the videos.
Regards,
JC
Timing chain or timing belt?
Thanks
Thanks for the information. I'll take a look later today.
My wife and I test drove the SX yesterday as I test drove it on Friday and reading all the post about hard seats I wanted to have my wife and myself check this out before we make our final decision.
Well the seats are not hard they are pretty comfy we took the car for a test drive without a sales person most likely because they know us as we had test drove an EX 3 weeks back. We took it down a gravel road, twisting, a 200' - 300' assent and descent twisting road. Using the paddle shifters through this area was excellent!!!. It was way above what I expected for the performance and road handling. Then we did a test that the Buick dealer had me do to test the stability control. We went down a gravel road with a decent descent and driving 30 MPH jammed on the brakes at the same time turning the wheel left and right. The car stood straight, right on track. EXCELLENT!!
Through this test drive we found the seats comfy and supportive. The regal seats are a bit more comfy but the optima has way more to offer at 5k less then the Regal.
JB
Unfortunately, I can't remember exactly where or find a link to verify that.
JC
I too preferred (and bought) the Optima over the Buick and several others.
I got the fully loaded EX in Platinum Graphite a week ago. I'm lovin' it!
The seats feel pretty good to me. Not to hard and not too soft either. Nice and comfy for my hind quarters.
I'm glad I didn't drive a Turbo version - it would have cost me more.
Regards,
JC
I have NOT experienced any pull in any direction other than straight ahead.
My car tracks extremely wheel and seems to stay centered on the road very well.
JC
The Optima uses coil springs instead.
The suspensions are different in that regard.
When I test drove the Sonata and Optima back-to-back, I was astonished by how completely different the two cars drove.
The Optima was sportier feeling and the Sonata was more luxury car-like. This was true for both the suspension and transmission feel.
Hope this helps, but I suggest doing your own back-to-back test drives.
After-all, we all have different opinions and sensory experiences. What feels good to me may feel bad to you.
Regards,
JC
How is the seat comfort? Lots of mention from auto reviewers about how hard the drivers seat is. I sat in at the auto show(5 mins) and didn't seem much different than my present vehicle which admittedly has firm seats. I'm thinking it's a real personal thing and some people just are used to or like very firm seats and some don't.
That said, i have seen it characterized as simply a "drift" on the Optima. It's not sharply pulling so you'd have to pay attention and specifically try to reproduce it to notice it. At least that's my understanding from reading various accounts. Some of the Sonata video's I've seen it's a full out 1 inch drop on the steering wheel and a very sharp pull to the left. Does not appear to be that severe.
EDIT: I should have said 'a similar issue" so I fixed it.
BTW seats felt fine when I sat in one. Have not had a chance to test an SX yet.
I remember the good old days when you could drive down the freeway and hold your hands an inch from the wheel and go for a long ways before any kind of adjustment was necessary. Course they probably didn't do a good job of crowning the roads then either and you had more hydroplaning too. Everything is a tradeoff I guess.
As for the Optima, I really would just like to get some seat time in an SX and take it for a ride. I've been following this darn car so long I'm almost burned out on it already and starting to re-consider entry level lux class cars. No SX's in my area still.
I have not noticed any of the issues that some are talking about. My experiences so far are:
- No drift
- No problem with steering on crowned roads
- No problem with taking hands off the wheel
- My car tracks dead straight at cruise, acceleration, and braking
- No hard seats
Now for something not mentioned before...
I have noticed that on really cold days and when I have the climate controls set to auto and at 75 degrees, the blower is on and set in the medium fan speed. That causes cold air to blow under the dash vents and onto my legs. IF I set the temp down to around 72, the blower slows to low and it is not as uncomfortable.
I have a 2007 Hyundai Santa Fe with Auto climate controls and it does not do this. When it is cold (and no matter what temp it is set to) the blower comes on at the lowest speed and adjusts accordingly as the car warms up. It also automatically sets to front Defrost as well.
So far my Optima's automatic climate controls are behaving differently.
Any one else seeing the same thing as me on their Optima?
Thanks,
JC
LOL. I've been there several times as well on many different cars/trucks/suvs.....you name it. Data overload almost. I've drifted away from the Optima at times but still follow it closely.
I'm looking at the EX35 also. For me it fits. No kids, rarely carry passengers, like a little room to haul some boxes now and them, sporty, luxurious, lots of tech, awd for the snow, dependable and big discounts given off MSRP. It has drawbacks too but so does every vehicle out there. I usually keep vehicles 7-8 years so I will probably only buy another 3-4 new cars in my life. So I'm kind of leaning towards luxury cause I won't go around again.
Now, the engineers have crowned the roads and with better tires and steering it's a completely different ballgame.
The Optima uses coil springs instead.
---------------
If you ever had ridden in a car with just coil springs you'd never consider buying one. Both of these vehicles use a strut spring assembly just like most FWD cars.
These must be the good old days as I can do that with my 10 yo camry. As for the crown in the road, the alignment of the vehicle is set up to compensate for that, and that has been the case for a long time.
Why would the production location matter? I think all modern factories do a good job with quality control...or correct an issue once its identified.
I don't think there are specialized craftsman working in factories where you can have a local pool of resources that have years of experience.
I could be wrong...but I think it's all automated...push this button...screw that bolt here.
I think after a certain number of years you're an expert...which is why they pay to layoff older (higher paid) workers. If it takes you 5 years to be an expert...then the guy with 25 years experience is just an overpaid expert.
of course, I'm just making this all up...
According to TrueDelta, the 2011 Sonata has above avg. reliability which is good for a 1st year model.
And gee, I wonder which manufacturer had an issue w/ engine sludge?
Funny, according to the JD Power CSI survey - which evaluates customer satisfaction for service and warranty work, Hyundai scores ahead of Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda and pretty much all of the non-luxury Japanese makes.
Nice, try, but once again, you are debunked.
Anyway, yeah, there have been complaints about the Optima's "hard" seats, but personally, I had no issue with it.
But then again, I like my seats on the firm side.
http://www.kiatechinfo.com/
Is the ride measurably better with the larger tires? I think the car looks better with the larger tires, but that is not enough to pay extra.
I have not started negotiating. Here are the prices given. These prices do not include DMV or taxes. Supposedly, all other fees are included. I think I am supposed to get a $500. rebate for owning a Honda Civic.
LX MSRP $21,285 Quote $20,080
EX MSRP $23,190 Quote $22,025.
Price is pretty go compared to Edmunds market value.
Look forward to hearing your opinions
Let us know the final price.
Good luck!
While I do not have a signed deal, I think I can get the LX for $19,580 before taxes and DMV or the EX for $21525. before taxes and DMV
Should I roll the dice?
The advantage of the larger tire is mostly a styling preference and then maybe a bit better handling and braking.
Larger tires like 18's usually also have much lower treadlife and cost much more money to purchase.
You are going to be spending a lot of money frequently replacing very expensive tires, so you better really **LOVE*** the way they look for it to be worth it.
Check the estimated tread life and replacement cost of both tires.
However, since you mention you don't really need/want leather or fancier wheels, the other simple stuff you get on the EX (fogs, push button, some trim pieces) probably aren't worth the cost difference. Honestly, the leather is OK, but it isn't that high a quality.
Stick with the LX auto. Add the convenience package if you want a power seat and homelink.
I did go to that site this week and when I clicked on the agreement link it brought up a blank, empty page. Nowhere to click I agree. I'm using Firefox then tried Safari nothing. I did read on these forums that most of the KIA sites will only work with IE. So I tried IE and that worked.
What happened was I wrote KIA consumer affairs and they called me and then sent me an email to the same link. They also told me that many more SX's will be available in June as I mention I would be look at purchasing around August / September.
I did go to the site and downloaded all 6 SX's manuals.
Thanks.