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Comments
1999 Protege DX: MSRP ~$15,000 at the time
2001 Protege ES: MSRP ~$18,545 at the time
1988 Dodge Aries K: paid $400 for it
1993 Bonneville SSE: bought used for $6700
Will NOT accept a car with an MSRP of $24,675 that is going to rattle. I am so sorry, but I just will not accept that.
which one you choose it up to you. but, while you keep trying to fix the unfixable, you are in fact, accepting it.
don't you get tired of it all?
and bring up other cars doesn't prove anything. you got rid of them. they weren't perfect either, obviously.
We should aim for mediocrity in our purchases? Noble.
>>again, VOCUS put his car in the shop for rattles. the reason he doesn't have his car to drive is because it is in the shop. he put it there. more than once. i understand his emotions. he is mad and frustrated. i would be too, and i have been in the past. it has nothing to do with the car itself now. <<
There was a problem with the car, he took it in. By your view he should endure annoyances and suck it up. Strange that you'd pay for a product that doesn't perform to your expectations and then just accept it as a fact of life. A manufacturer's dream come true.
>>what i have learned through much experience is that life is far from perfect, cars included. <<
Shouldn't we aim for that? Guess not.
>>there are cars that cost $100k, and cars that cost $25k. how and why people think that a $25k car should be 100% silent is beyond me.<<
Because we KNOW they can be. Because we've all experienced those cars.
>>there is ONE solution. it is called - GET OVER IT!
Wow, you'd be an excellent spokesperson for equal rights. Don't like Jim Crow laws? Don't like riding in the back of the bus? sick of the glass ceiling? Do you want to get equal pay for equal work? Too bad, Justin wants you to just accept that the world's inequities and never grumble or attempt to change them. Ralph Nader and all you safety nuts, shuddup and sit down, as Justin wants us to ride in cars without crumple zones, seatbelts, airbags and efficient/safe exahaust systems.
and settling for mediocrity is not an option either. but a car that has a rattle, along with 8 airbags, abs/traction control, etc. standard is mediocre? what is the alternative? please tell me. i don't think Vocus know what the alternative is either, because for $25k, there is nothing better than a Jetta.
You may be able to deal with rattles, I can not. They will fix the car right, or it will go back until it is fixed right. It goes back enough, they can replace it.
I will definitely be one of those people who hangs lemons all over the car and writes on the windows about how bad it is, parking it in front of the dealership. They don't want me to do that, so they best fix the damn thing.
You missed the important part of this. The bushing is NOT attached in any way to the strut or even near it. The bushing is in the arm which comes forward under the rear doors. It is maybe 2-3 inches in diameter if I remember right. The struts come with new bushings of their own.
quote-
I really loved my Jetta until it BURNED TO THE GROUND.
I parked my car on the street in front of our condo at about 11:30pm on May 18th. At 5:30am the next morning we heard loud pops and bangs. Looking out the window we discovered my 2002 Volkswagen Jetta wagon engulfed in a massive ball of flames. My neighbor was able to catch the tail end ofthis on video which you can see at http://homepage.mac.com/jettafire/.
A few days later I received a recall letter from VW for the ABS control unit which can short out and start a fire when the car has been sitting idle. It is all still under investigation, but what seems to have happened was the ABS control unit shorted out starting an engine fire that ruptured the fuel line and melted the radiator sending gas and antifreeze down the gutter towards my rear tire which was sitting right in front of the drain. This lit the rear tire, bumper and then the plastic nozzle to the gas tank, which then resulted in a burning fuel tank.
The recall effects 2001-2002 Beetles, Jettas and Golfs. You can find out more at the NHTSA website http://www.nhtsa.gov/. The campaign ID is 02V031000. If this car had been parked in an attached garage, this could have been a very bad situation. Anyone with one of these cars should get it checked right away. Also, if anyone knows of anyone else who this has happened to I would like to know. You can email me at jetta@chrisbrandt.com.
Any suggestions for a replacement would be welcomed.
-end quote
>>but a car that has a rattle, along with 8 airbags, abs/traction control, etc. standard is mediocre?<<
If a car sounds like it's falling apart whenever you hit a road irregularity, then it's actually below mediocre, it's downright pathetic. This is why I detested my Jetta for many months. Then for no reason the rattles and humming disappeared. Shoddy engineering is unpredictable.
>> what is the alternative?<<
Good grief, pick up a car mag and you can pretty much pick out a gaggle of new cars that will be error free.
>>i don't think Vocus know what the alternative is either, because for $25k, there is nothing better than a Jetta.
Better in the sense of a feeling of luxury on the inside? Hmm, maybe. For the 19.5k I paid it wins hands down. For 25k I can pop into a far superior Max SE that bests the Jetta in every possible way - roomier, better build quality, better manufacturer, better interior (subjective), faster, better handling. There is no choice, the 1.8T's cute, but it's outclassed by a 6 everytime and it isn't half as nice as a Max IMHO. I'll take 255 HP and Xenons anyday over the Jetta's...um...traction control (the most useless and annoying thing in the world)?
go get a maxima.
oh wait, you can't. that's right. and, lets be honest here, the reason is because you KNOW that while the max is faster, roomier, it is NOT better built by a better manufacturer. if that were true, you would have one. no arguing with that. if the max were better, you would have one. you bought the jetta instead. and though you just hate it to death, you still keep it. i mean, that is like saying, "i thought the S40 was better, so i bought a jetta." or, "i have a jetta now, but i think the S40 is better now, so i will keep my jetta." do you understand how ridiculous that is? i don't know about you, but i personally only buy and drive the best. why should you not buy and drive the best? and if the max is better, WHY DIDN'T YOU BUY ONE? and, please, don't get into the $$$ stuff. neither car is $30k....
how can i feel bad for anyone that whines so much, says there are so many other alternatives to the horrendous Jetta, but takes no action?
seriously blueguy, do you re-read your posts? not being a smart#@$ here, but:
"Good grief, pick up a car mag and you can pretty much pick out a gaggle of new cars that will be error free."
i don't even know how to respond to something like that. a car magazine will tell you that a car is "error free?" where is this car mag? please, seriously, show me a car mag that only has positive things to say about a car. i mean, sure BMW's monthly mag says BMW is the best, and my VW mag just gushes about how lovely VW is. Acura has a mag like that too. But in the real world, no car is perfect. i can't believe you actually think that any car can be "error free."
sometimes i wonder how people can be so different in the way they see the world and life in general. boggles the mind.
The tread is starting to get down a little, and I want to replace soon with 195/60R14 (optional size is 185/60R14) or larger. Is there a 205/55R14 tire available?
Either which way, what tires do people recommend for a 1996 Jetta GL 4 cylinder automatic? I have dedicated snow tires for NE winter driving, so summer tires are desired to avoid the all season compromises.
Price is always a consideration, as is road noise and ride. Ultimate grip on this car is not quite as important as it was to me on the Civic.
Let's give that a try -- we've been around this particular block a number of times, and it seems clear that all are certain of their own beliefs -- as you each are entitled to be.
If someone believes something different than you do, there is no requirement to keep telling that person s/he is wrong. Honest!!
;-)
Pat
Sedans Host
Perhaps most people look at $20K and $25K, see a difference of $5K, would pause and really think it over (and sometimes make the "wrong" decision). Not many people see them as both under $30K and say "who cares about the price. They're practically the same".
"i don't know about you, but i personally only buy and drive the best. why should you not buy and drive the best? "
Maybe you believe it in your heart, but do you really think that the Jetta is the best car on the planet? Does it really not matter about a $5k difference?
For me, my car is not perfect, but it is flawless. Let me explain. I want more out of my car, more doors, more room, more luxury. That is why I am getting a jetta. But, that is not to say that something is wrong with my car, or that the Jetta is better than my Civic. My Civic has never had a problem. It runs flawlessly, it gets better gas mileage than all the Jettas except the TDI. It was faster until the 2002 1.8t came out. Brakes are still fine at 50900 miles, clutch is same as day one. I have replaced the tires, but at 50k miles you can expect that. I have replaced the oil every 7500 miles just like the manual says and my engine has seen the fuel cut off a few times so you know it has see the made side of the tachometer. All in all, I don't a single problem with my car. It is flawless. BUT, it is not perfect. The reason I say it is not perfect is because I WANT 4 doors now. When I bought the car is was perfect. I only wanted 2 doors. In fact, I hate to say it, but if they made a 2 door Jetta, I would be the first to have one. I think that would be as attractive to me as a 3-series coupe.
Justin, I see you love your car, and you did make an extremely good point. Some people don't get bothered by rattles, I know some people who are just oblivious to them. Then I know others who hear things that I question are even audible to the human ear. All people are different, you are right, it all depends are what you will put up with. I think someone who had a Lexus for 10 years would have a hard time going to a Chevette. I have been fortunate to have had some nice cars. My Civic to this day is the second best car I have ever had. The first was my 1980 white rusty Mazda RX-7, my first car ever. It was perfect. Sheep skin seat covers, pop out sun room, 5-sp with a rotary engine that would spin for eternity, great brakes because the car was so light, cheap tires because back then they were all 14". Those were the good old days. I was 16 and it was 1988, and cars were still built like tanks. I guess what I am trying to say it, you can't necessarily discount how Vocus feels about the rattles in his car, he may be acute hearing, he may have a car built 2 mins before the break time. You never know, his car could be the same as millions out there who are just oblivious to the rattles. Obviously something was there if a VoA rep ordered some special rubber treatment. Maybe a pin is fastener is broke that they can't see unless they take the dash off. Who knows, but right now he is not too happy with his car. For whatever reason, we all should respect that, give sympathy for someone who has had a car in the shop for 7 weeks, for what ever reason. I have never heard Vocus say he hated all VW's and they should be burnt at the stake. He is just not happy with his situation right now and is trying to find a solution. I am sure if you ask him, he would say he just wants them to fix the rattle.
i know that the Jetta is not the BEST car for everyone. but what i get so sick of is hearing people keep complaining about it. because, the fact is, those same people obviously thought the car was the best choice, or they would not have bought it, right? is that wrong of me to think? like i said, if you thought the Jetta was not the best choice, then why did you buy it? if you bought the Jetta, but liked another car better, then what does that say about you? it's like, you see a head of lettuce that is fresh, and a head of lettuce that is moldy and wilted. if you still buy the old lettuce, and you get sick, how can you blame the lettuce grower for your sickness? you had the opportunity to buy the good lettuce, but you didn't. everyone that bought the Jetta knew that they were NOT known for the best reliability. how can it be the car's fault?
i also wonder how a car can go from perfect when it is purchased to awful so fast?
PS. I saw the wheels on a new Jetta today. they are like 7 or 8 spokes. very nice! not silvery or chrome-ish. very understated, but sporty too. i want them.
Just Kidding.
AS
kidding.
The wheels you are talking about are on the new 24V GLX models. They do look pretty cool. I have seen them a couple different times, considering all the visits to the dealership in the last month or so.
Since then, all I've seen is some sort of online argument(s).
A final question: Does anyone know if there is a VW Jetta BBS anywhere on the internet which is helpful for these kind of questions?
You should be able to find an answer there.
Good luck.
For example, how do you check the transmission fluid?
This is really simple, mumenchanz, at 19-20k the Jetta's the best option for me. I said it in the previous post but you chose to ignore it. At 25k the Jetta is not the best choice IMHO - then it goes to the WRX or Maxima. Clear enough?
BTW, I'm not bagging on my Jetta as I don't currently have any problems with it. The rattles are gone, the swaybar's great and it swallows a prodigious amount of random household goods (I've been moving carloads of stuff for a week). Would I be upset if it burned to the ground or was stolen? No. It's just a car. I'd feel that way if it were a Ferrari F40 too. Things can be replaced and that's why I pay for insurance.
Addendum: car mags was incorrect as I meant consumer buying guides...yes, I know you hate CR. Tough, I trust empirical evidence far more than my best friend's anecdotes.
Think of this, maybe someone likes the looks of the Jetta, the feel of the Jetta and the ride of the Jetta. They are enamored by all the standard features, the safety and solid feel. It is the perfect car for them they think. Then BAM!! it is in the shop because of mechanical failure. for weeks on end. All in all, the stuff that made the car perfect for them doesn't matter, why you ask? Because, when broken down to the pure purpose of the car, it fails. Car are bought for transportation, not looks, not feel, not ride. If you car look perfect, feels perfect, has ABS, TCS, ASR, TTS, or any other acronyms out there but doesn't run, it doesn't matter. Now I am not saying this is the case with Vocus. I was simply pointing out that it is possible to feel a car is perfect for you then get it and find out that it is far from perfect.
The bushing is in an arm which comes forward to attach to the body under the rear doors. It is maybe an inch and a half to two inches. He said he could take the whole arm off, but doesn't have a press to do that bushing. I really hate our VW dealer. The salesman asked my wife what color underwear she had on, I kid you not!
again, i agree totally. if the car was in the shop for over a month because it wouldn't start, i would be LIVID.
blue -
so, i know that you like CR and the other consumer mags. but, you obviously don't like them enough to actually take the advice in them, do you? as you put it, CR says there a many other infinitely better cars than the Jetta. yet, you, a total CR fan, bought a Jetta. WHY?
and, since you obviously didn't follow your own advice, and you knew the Jetta was crap compared to all of the other wonderful cars out there, how can you be upset at anyone other than yourself if it breaks? same for anyone else. i personally would never dare complain about my Jetta. how can i complain in good faith?
good point, huh? i should be a freaking supreme court judge!
vocus: how big are those wheels that i like? are they 16 or 17?
Once more, I'll write this very slowly...for. . . under. . . 20k. . . the. . . Jetta. . . was. . . only. . . car. . . I. . . liked. I took the chance, got the extended warranty and drove away in my little blue car. It was a roll of the dice. Ayn Rand, not all human action is governed by logic, some of us follow our hearts. I bought with my heart and not common sense. Am I sorry I did that? No. Has the car been a headache, yep. A simple learning experience. Will I still buy cars with my heart in the future...yep. I'd rather love or loathe my car than view it as an appliance (Corolla, Accord, CL, etc).
>>and, since you obviously didn't follow your own advice, and you knew the Jetta was crap compared to all of the other wonderful cars out there, how can you be upset at anyone other than yourself if it breaks?<<
Who said I was upset? You're reading a lot into this. I took a chance, bought a car I figured would be trouble, it has been, and I probably won't buy a VW again - but of course, I can't say never.
>>good point, huh? i should be a freaking supreme court judge!<<
Ah sure...an SC Justice who drives a Jetta. LOL
This happened before we were married. I hadn't even met her yet in 1996.
Funny, the women's underwear gets a response, but the questions on suspension, tires, and transmission all fell through with everyone's childish bickering.
lets all just get along and make this thread enjoyable to read.
Your BANTER is annoying!!!
Thanks in advance.
seriously - we bicker here sometimes. just the way it is. i would totally help you out with suspension questions, but i am an idiot when it comes to suspensions. ask anyone here. i think my suspension is fine
I thought they made that same style for at least 3-5 years.
Are people here driving newer or older ones?
I have on there now Borbet Type C wheels with 195/55R14 Bridgestone tires which were formerly on my 1992 Civic.
The tread is starting to get down a little, and I want to replace soon with 195/60R14 (optional size is 185/60R14) or larger. Is there a 205/55R14 tire available? This would give me the same height with a little more width.
Either which way, what tires do people recommend for a 1996 Jetta GL 4 cylinder automatic? I have dedicated snow tires for NE winter driving, so summer tires are desired to avoid the all season compromises.
Price is always a consideration, as is road noise and ride. Ultimate grip on this car is not quite as important as it was to me on the Civic.
www.vwvortex.com
a few post back Anakin also suggested you check there. that site has extensive information about VWs, and tons of forums you can search for information. you're probably better off checking there than repeating your questions here.
My wife has a 1996 Jetta GL 4 cylinder.
We brought it to the local tire/repair shop for new rear struts. The garage fixed those, but he said there was another issue which needed addressing.
He said there is an arm coming forward from the axle which attaches to the unibody under rear doors, which has a worn bushing. He said the bushing is probably around $12 or so, but he does not have the means (the correct press) to remove old one and replace with new one. Is there a special tool required for this? What is this piece called? Do you know who carries it? Do you have special instructions for doing it? Or does the whole assembly have to come off?
I applied to join that site, but it hasn't come through with a password for me. I submitted it this morning some time right after the original post about the vortex site.
Thanks again.
Gen I was before my time, I think Gen II was 1988 (?)-93. Gen III is the 1994-99 models. We are in Gen IV right now, 1999.5-present.
I am not sure if that tire size is made, but if you are looking for a brand I would recommend Michelin. My Jetta came with Michelin Pilots and I love them. They were also standard on my '98 Accord.
What tires came on your Jetta's? This question is for everyone. I thought most Jetta's came with Goodyears.
checking transmission fluid on any car should be in the owners manual, right?