Volkswagen Jetta 2005 and earlier

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Comments

  • tripicchiotripicchio Member Posts: 10
    I am the owner of an 02 Jetta GLS...I have two different (annoying) glove-box sounds. The first is a rattle that comes from the glove-box door handle, if you touch the handle, the rattle stops, does anyone know how to tighten the handle?..also, the door itself squeaks...if you press anywhere on the door while it is squeaking, it will stop. It appears something behind the door is rubbing. has anyone else experienced either of these problems? any help would be greatly appreciated!
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Member Posts: 4,085
    (shortyjlg) You are absolutely correct.... but I beleive that the seatcovers that anakin refers to are "approved" for the in-seat airbags.

    You wont beleive how many Jettas I have seen in parkinglots that HAVE seatcovers right over the inseat-airbags. This could be dangerous!! It may break somones back if the airbag 'deploys' and the seatcover diverts the airbag to ones sholder-area from behind.
  • AnakinAnakin Member Posts: 410
    Wet Okole covers have openings on the sides to allow the airbags to deploy. :)
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    If it's so horrible, sell it and get something else.

    Anakin, if it were that simple, i would. Two obstacles stand in the way. 1. At this moment I could get maybe 12-13k for my Jetta and VW still wants over 14k for it. I attempted to negotiate a new buyout (considering they're not gonna get 12-13k for it wholesale in another year) but 4 calls and about 2 hours on hold have kept that conversation from even taking place. The hit isn't unbearable, it's just annoying.

    2. My search for a replacement isn't bearing much fruit...just as it was miserable settling on the Jetta last time.

    BMW, Mini = unreliable, though a 3 series euro-delivery always seems enticing as one can resell the car for at least cost.
    Lexus, Toyota = nothing worth owning.
    MB = not too big on the styling, lack of non-AMG performance or the association with Mopar.
    Jag = bland, overpriced
    Honda = Accord coupe V6 is smooth but needs major suspension work and ideally a better body.
    Nissan = only the Z roadster raises my eyebrow but that's impractical.
    Mazda = Miata is the same as the Z Roadster for practicality, plus half the performance. Mazda6 is fun to drive but way underpowered.
    Subaru = WRX is fun but too unrefined.
    Mitsu = lol
    Audi = A4's a sweet looking and feeling ride, too bad it's a VW.
    American car companies = ROFLMFAO (every rental I touch reminds me why american car companies should go out of business).
    Acura = nothing I find enjoyable or attractive.
    VW = Jetta's fun, just not reliable.
    Infiniti = G35

    I've only seen one G35 at a price I found reasonable, unfortunately it was located in AZ, I was leaving for a business trip and by the time I returned that G was long gone. If I can scoop up a used G35 for a price I believe is fair i'll jump on it. But for now people are asking ridiculous sums for year old Gs and I believe buying a luxury car new is an incredible waste of money. 3 years the car drops to 55-60% of its value, so buying a brand new 34k car means taking a massive hit. No thanks.

    So, until I see Gs going for prices I agree with or my lease runs out, it appears I'm stuck with my miserable, unreliable little blue car.
  • chmeeeechmeeee Member Posts: 327
    It seems like you just don't like ANY cars. Maybe you should just build your own, then you wouldnt have anybody to complain to.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    It seems like you just don't like ANY cars. Maybe you should just build your own, then you wouldnt have anybody to complain to.

    I like a handful of cars and I admit that freely. Money no object I can think of several I'd like to own. Strangely, all are German (M3, 911, M5, E-Class).

    Cars to me are like movies...you have an idea of what perfection is and very, very few attempts will ever come close to that zenith. most fall into that middle ground of the 40th-80th percentile, which is in my view failing.
  • AnakinAnakin Member Posts: 410
    I'm gonna have to agree with you on that.

    Some people are just never happy.
  • fish8fish8 Member Posts: 2,282
    How many on this board actually go 10K miles between oil changes per owners manual? The reason I am asking is that my Jetta is leased and I will hand it back in at 36K miles. I am wondering if I should just go by the service manual since I will not own the car past 3 yrs.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    If you're returning the lease to VW, it's a really good idea to follow the manual to a tee. If you don't there's a good possibility VW will attempt to extort more cash out of you for not properly caring for what is really their car. You're renting it for 3 years and part of your agreement is that you'll handle upkeep on the vehicle.

    You don't need to take it to VW though as ANY ASE certified mechanic can perform the maintenance and possibly at a lower cost. Just make sure you keep the receipts and mark off the service in your manual.

    BTW, all the VW dealers in my area offer a 10% off coupon for scheduled service. My last trip cost me less than $60. I can deal with that as most places would charge me $40 just for the synthetic oil change.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Member Posts: 4,421
  • 8u6hfd8u6hfd Member Posts: 1,391
    I do.

    vocus has a 1.8T, so he has 5k oil changes.
  • fish8fish8 Member Posts: 2,282
    So, since I have the 2.0 and the owners manual says to change the oil every 10K miles after the 10K service...you are saying that I should just wait until 20K mile mark? I currently have 14,100 miles. I just can't imagine going 10K miles between oil changes....but that what VW recommends.
  • chmeeeechmeeee Member Posts: 327
    I do (with the TDI), and if anything, I would guess that what they tell you to do in the manual is conservative, because why would they want an artifically long interval? It doesn't benifit them at all. I have heard of people going as far as 20,000 miles, with an oil analysis proving that it is safe to do so.

    I definitely agree that it is very different, I was used to going 3,000-4,000 miles in my previous car, so 2.5 times as long almost begins to feel like you aren't taking care of it anymore.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    Follow the manual and if you have records to prove it then you've got nothing to worry about. VW's not going to put you on a path that will destroy their car. They want it back in good condition. ;)
  • fish8fish8 Member Posts: 2,282
    That is true.....
  • adg44adg44 Member Posts: 385
    "It seems like you just don't like ANY cars. Maybe you should just build your own, then you wouldnt have anybody to complain to."

    When I read his first post, I was about to say "We need to build a blueguy car." ;)

    ....If that is even possible.

    No point on being here just to bash the car, it's a losing battle and not worth your time. Trust me on that.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    I bash so others can have one more POV of the Jetta that isn't shiny happy like 99.99% of the views in here. Bash a Jetta, go to jail kinda mentality in here. And that's with Justin (the king of Jetta defenders and now defectors) gone!

    Does anyone know if he did buy his Miata?
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Ohhkay, let's move on now please.

    We are not here to talk about each OTHER, we are here to talk about the Jetta. There is no rule that says "only positive comments are allowed."

    All are welcome to share their experiences with the subject vehicle - good bad or indifferent - as long as the messages conform to the terms of the Membership Agreement.

    If you don't like what someone else has to say, just skip it - it's really that easy.

    Thanks.
  • justinjustin Member Posts: 1,918
    took forever to read these posts. nope, didn't buy the Miata. i really need heated seats and more room in the trunk. this is my only car. bought a used 2002 CABRIO. yep, i am part of the 2 slow crew now. one thing is for sure, i forgot how superior VW's base 4 speed adaptive auto tranny is to the 5 speed Tip. i don't miss the gear hunting in my Tip Jetta at all. this Cabrio drives like my old Jetta VR6. press the gas, it does what it is supposed to do, right away. of course 115 hp compared to the Jettas 180 is noticable, but in an automatic, not as much as i would have thought. miss the turbo whistle though, would sound great with the top down...

    have had great weather - love how easy it is to take the top down, and love that, seriously, it is as quiet with the top up as my Jetta was. no rattles in this car! and i was going to tolerate rattles in a convertible. they will come, for sure.

    anyway, loving the Cabrio so far. of course, every girl i see loves it, and even some guys at work have privately told me they like it, though in a group in the kitchen, no one admits it, haha. it IS a girly car....haha.

    it now was 8700 miles on it - was built in June 02, in service date of 9/02. it must have been the last one built!

    anyway, good luck with the Jettas.

    BLUE - hang in there. a friend just bought a G sedan with nav and sport package. sweet. decent lease deals here on the East Coast. the leather is so soft, though i hate the green/yellow interior gauge lighting - so 1993 Camry. i don't see how you live in SoCal and don't have a droptop though....:)

    interestingly enough, i read an article that said that for about a year, RWD has been the "new" trend, and that Nissan and others have all these cars in development on RWD platforms, and now the RWD sales are already on the decline. so, just like the mid 90's say bye to the Z and RX-8 in a few years probably....
  • adg44adg44 Member Posts: 385
    Constructive critism is always welcome, but just bashing a car is pointless. You say you come here to give a POV on the car, but if you are always bashing it, that's not an accurate POV, just like someone who always praises the car and says it's the best thing on earth isn't a correct POV.

    And talking about each other is part of talking about a car, since the car doesn't drive itself. I mean it will be hard to hold a conversation with a car. ;)

    - Anthony
  • adg44adg44 Member Posts: 385
    You bought a 02 cabrio? A car that is built on a dated platform and has had one of the worst reliabilty records of all VWs?

    And you like the 2.0? You have gone mad, my friend!

    Good luck though... I know a hot girl with a cabrio!
  • AnakinAnakin Member Posts: 410
    *points at justin*

    Girly car! Girly car!

    oh wait, I have a girly car too.

    *walks away quickly*
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Justin: Congrats on the convertible.

    Anakin: Congrats on the seat covers. You must be estatic over them.

    Meade: I have been busy working and I don't have 'net access at my new job.

    Everyone: All VWs are girly cars. But I have used this 'girly' car to whip many unsuspecting peoples' butts...
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    Everyone: All VWs are girly cars. But I have used this 'girly' car to whip many unsuspecting peoples' butts...

    Oh yeah the infamous list. sigh...it could be worse the Jetta could come with rainbow decals too.

    Anakin, i do praise my car. I continually return from rentals and praise my Jetta's sturdy feel, spritely engine and tossability. It's a fun, safe, luxurious ride. I often consider crossing my fingers and trying again for a new one with some of the features missing on my Wolfsburg (180 hp, leather, in-dash CD, a long warranty). You have no idea how sad it makes me that my comfy, shiny, fun little car causes me so much concern. If I had as much confidence in VW as did in my Stanza (what a trooper that beast was) I'd never own anything but VWs. Oh well...

    Justin, miata to cabrio. cabrio to miata. whoa, chief you really lost me there. It's a convertible...so it's got that big element of fun. Can't blame ya.

    As for me and convertibles...don't remind me. I dearly loved zipping around in my sister's miata; still enjoy visiting my parents and taking out the only convertible I'm allowed to touch (the 2000 miata, not my dad's 55 T-bird). My dad was just in town and he kept mentioning I should go buy a 350z roadster. When I was in high school the last gen Z car launched. I lusted after the Z like you wouldn't believe. He still remembers how much I'd go on and on about the Z cars. I actually enjoyed driving the ZTT more than a 95 RX-7. I was hopelessly in love with those cars (still find them sexy over 13 years later). Every few hours he'd say, "So have you called the Nissan dealer to reserve a Z roadster?" Personally, I think he just wants to drive it. :)

    Justin, enjoy the heck out of that cabrio.
  • 8u6hfd8u6hfd Member Posts: 1,391
    Keep in mind, we're using Delvac 1 or something in our TDI's.

    It may be a different story for fish, where he's not using a synthetic 5w40, but perhaps a conventional 5w30. Then I see his concern for the 10k interval. An oil analysis will tell the tale
  • justinjustin Member Posts: 1,918
    Cabrio has a worse reliability record than my Jettas did? not possible, believe me. yep, the Cabrio is DATED as heck. the interior is so old school. but, coupled with the boxy exterior, it has charm to me. i mean, really, the Cabrio goes back to what, 1993? and even in that redesign, it didn't really look different from the A1 and A2 Rabbit ragtops. i guess i like that. the New Beetle convertibles are nice with that chrome strip, but i can't go THAT trendy, ya know? in my mind, the Cabrio is less "trendy" than a Beetle convertible.

    and yep, all VW's are "girly" cars. but, i would rather dress up in drag and drive my feminine Cabrio than drive a "butch" convertible! a Firebird? Mustang? kill me now....:) the 350Z and TT ragtops are not very "masculine" either...not that i could afford either one.

    car is getting a 6 disk changer put in it today, and a washer jet adjustment, so i am driving a beat down 03 Jetta GL as a loaner. still fits me like a glove.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Member Posts: 4,421
    Did you get all those mods done to your car last weekend? C'mon man, you build us up with details and get us all excited, and you don't come through with pics and reviews? What gives?

    Meade
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I only planned to put a new bumper on the car and have it chipped. I haven't gotten anything done yet actually. I have been too busy working lately to do anything.
  • drumm01drumm01 Member Posts: 97
    My wife’s 2002 Jetta (2.0 Auto) is reaching 30,000 miles and I am wondering if this is a good time to have some routine maintenance done to it. The car hasn’t had anything done other than oil and filter changes, and the car runs beautifully…

    What maintenance do you folks recommend I use now that it has reached 30K?? Plug wires changes, tune-up? I much rather have the advice of other Jetta drivers rather than my VW dealer.

    Thanks,
    Drumm
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    Do the 30k service listed in your manual. mine cost 50-60 bucks (but that included $15 to fix a tire).
  • chmeeeechmeeee Member Posts: 327
    If you check out your manual, they list out in good detail exactly what needs to be done for each maintenance, I don't believe that the 30k one is all that bad, its the 40k service that you will start having to take care of some more things.
  • kuselerkuseler Member Posts: 6
    Greetings!
    Brought my US spec VW Jetta to Germany, and will be in Germany for two more years before returning stateside. But my radio is set up for US FM radio broadcasts. The tuner only hits stations with the last digit (after the decimal) as odd numbers only, ie. 89.5, 95.9 and so forth. Many German Radio stations broadcast with even last digits, ie. 89.4, 101.8 and so forth.

    Is there a way to set a US Spec VW radios to pick up European FM radio, or is it permanent.

    Thanks-
  • chmeeeechmeeee Member Posts: 327
    I would suggest finding a dealer over there, I am sure its something that could be done using a VAG-COM. If not, you might just want to install an aftermarket radio of some sort thats really cheap, and just take it out when you come back to the US.
  • jettamaybejettamaybe Member Posts: 1
    Hello, glad to be here.

    Well, I had been considering buying a Jetta--great features, great safety for the money--until I started reading reviews, the vast majority of which are neagtive. Can it really be that bad? Would I be foolish to buy one after what I have read? Is it likely it will spend more time at the repair shop than on the road or in my driveway? Or will I not have a driveway because I'll have to sell my house to pay for all the repairs? Is it worth the risk?

    Thanks for hearing me and for any input.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    4/50k warranty means you won't pay for repairs until much later. my car even with its issues runs. most of what sidelines a jetta can be termed non-essential to operation. the cars run, they just have weird bugaboos.

    if you want safety, some measure of luxury, a little bit of sport and you're willing to maybe put up with weird problems, the jetta's perfect.

    if you're more interested in reliability and don't give a hoot about luxury or performance, I'd suggest looking elsewhere in the 25k and under segment.
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Member Posts: 4,085
    If you are looking for turn-key transportation that gets you where you want to go with no frills nor thrills, perhaps VW is not the vehicle for you.

    If you are a DRIVER that likes the feel of the road and some excitement while getting to your destination. Then Honda and Toyota must be crossed off of your list of prospective vehicles.

    For me, it is the 12-year UNLIMITED MILEAGE warantee of the VW that really caught my eye. I dont mind an occasional repair... I do mind if the body rusts so badly that it fails state inspection.

    Oh... the 52 MPG on my new Jetta TDI is nice too!!
  • adg44adg44 Member Posts: 385
    Someone lied to you buddy. The only 12 year unlimited mileage warranty is for rust issues. If that is what you were saying (I couldn't exactly tell), it's a safe bet on VWs part because all the panels are zinc coated so they won't rust.

    And not all honda's and toyota's are boring... the S2000 is awesome, and the Supra's and even the new Celica's are fun to drive.
  • japs52japs52 Member Posts: 4
    I can pick up a 1.8t auto loaded, or a 1.8t stick loaded....is the sports package worth the extra cheese?....also, any advise as to how to keep the black exterior looking decent without swirl marks?....thanks for your help!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I am sure that you know the pros and cons of a stick vs auto. Personally, I would get the stick.

    In regard to the sports package if you DO NOT plan on doing any spring and shock change for 50-100k and are ok with an in between rated spring and shock combination then the sport package to me is slightly pricey for what you get, but a lot less hassle. If you ARE going to switch. I WOULD NOT bother with it. Then it is PRICEY and you are going to switch it out ANYWAY. I have a 2003 VW Jetta TDI GL.(for what that is worth)

    To keep the Black paint swirl free. The real secret is to touch the paint as little as humanly possible AND as lightly as possible. The tools and detailing products are possibly as important as how you use them. So my drill is:

    100% cotton (quality USA brands) wash towels and or sheepskin mitts. (I use sheepskin mitts) with a separate wash towel or sheepskin mitt for wheels, tires, bright work,

    While you are at it it is better to have a two to three buck of water system. If I am doing more than one car I actually use a 4 bucket system.

    100% cotton drying towels or synthetic "absorber" materials (I use 4 "absorbers") I know this sounds wacky but you may want to give serious consideration to a high speed (CFM) leaf blower. (The theory here is that you are not touching the paint.)

    Zaino polish in my opinion lets me give a very high gloss polish and lets me touch the paint job AS lightly as any product out there. Also when you apply and take away ANY polish that you chose, if you do not know what light pressure is use a foam pad wrapped by the 100% cotton applicator or get a 100% cotton applicator with foam already in it. Also, with the polish removal towel, double up on the layers so you dont have hand pressure on the towel against the paint surface and shake out and switch toweling surface positions frequently.

    I have a garage and between washings I use the CA duster and on my Z06 Corvette I sometimes go up to three months without washing just by garaging it and using the CA duster in between.

    The care of the washing mitts and towels is equally as important. Do not use powdered soap!!!! When you dry in the dryer DO NOT use fabric softener!

    If you have specific questions fire away.
  • japs52japs52 Member Posts: 4
    thanks for the reply to my question...my decision on auto vs stick should be an easy one but its not because there are benefits to both. I am not a car person, but to this person it seems that the OTL speed is much better, but after 3rd gear it seems about the same once its on the highway. The fun to me is the intial burst of speed. As far as the upkeep, i probably wont have as much patience as you....I dont have a garage or a place to wash this other than to take it to a regular car wash and do it myself...the 4 bucket theory sounds great, but wouldnt be fesable to me. What would you use for the black interior, upkeep on wheels and tires?....thanks for the knowledge....Is yours black???/
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    In your case of leaving the car out, the adjustment would be to wash more. I would hazard a guess that a car cover would be onerous for you. I would also wax the horizontal surfaces more, your car probably need to be wax at the very least every 3 mo and once a month being ideal. There is roughly a 3-5 to one degradation of the horizontal surfaces vs the vertical surfaces. The best thing you can do for your black interior is to keep the sun off the surfaces. (sunshade) I would vacuum a lot!

    Upkeep on wheels and tires should be more often than even the body. Since most wheels are clear coated, I personally treat the wheels like body paint.

    I have one midnight blue vehicle (moon glow pearl) one reflex silver and the rest WHITE.
  • japs52japs52 Member Posts: 4
    does vw offer sun shades, and what type of tire shine should I use...I thought all that stuff cracked the rubber?...additionally, what would be a good price for outside detailing/....thanks again....jim
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I am sure that VW offers sun shades, but I got mine for like 6-9 bucks at Wally Mart. I also saw a real killer sun shade at Costco (like sams club)a longish accordian number (I think 10-12 bucks) . I got a longish wide ish one for the Z06 because the windshield is extra long and extra wide but it is a PITA to R/R and store, so I tend to prefer the fold up numbers.

    You have to be careful with the tire rubber products. I personally like as little "gloss" as possible. I use one or both products Zaino Z16 (I think) and Meguiar's Mirror Glaze Vinyl & Rubber Cleaner/Conditioner. The Zaino product seems to last longer than most. I particularly dislike the products that spin off onto the body paint, which you have just spent serious time cleaning and Zaino for some reason does not tend to do that. Outside detailing can range from 50-150, obviously done by someone who will do a fantastic job but the problem is FINDING a shop that does a fantastic job.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    I would also wax the horizontal surfaces more, your car probably need to be wax at the very least every 3 mo and once a month being ideal.

    wow, 1-3 months! A friend of mine is fanatical about his Infiniti and Lexus cars and I don't thinki he does it even that much. That's an insane amount of time to spend buffing a car. I've never waxed my car in the two years I've owned it. don't see much point - partly because it's a lease, partly because I won't do it out of shere laziness and a bit because it's obnoxiously shiny after a wash anyway. Even if I did like my car, once a year seems like more than enough...
  • japs52japs52 Member Posts: 4
    I could use your opinion also on my original question...Jetta 1.8 auto or stick?....and is the performance package worth the extra cheese...thanks.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    I'd say the first answer on the auto or stick and sports package is right on the money. if you're going to change your suspension on your own, then don't bother with the performance package. if not, I'd definitely for it but I drive my car harder than most people.

    as for auto v. stick...again it's all personal preference. VW sells a crazy number of sticks, so their market definitely will want a 5 speed used - thus deflating that silly salesmen angle of "it's harder to resell a manual." if you want off the line performance, the stick's gonna give you more than the automatic. the tiptronic is nice and sometimes in traffic i wish i had it, but most of the time when I'm cruising around the stick engages me far more in my driving. i've waffled on stick v. auto but my heart still lies with total engine control. in fact, today I'm probably going to test drive a manual G35 sedan.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I have a TDI Jetta and fully intend to go 300k or in excess of the 12 year rust through warranty and beyond to 15-16 years... . So for me it pays to keep up the maintenance for I have a much different time horizon. If you lease 2,3,4 even 5 years, I can see where it doesn't make much sense. Even with regular maintenance, the projected per mile operating costs are (fuel, maintenance: scheduled and unscheduled and depreciation) like .0581 cents per mile. There are guys who have run TDI Jettas in excess of 600k and actual operating costs have been .0721 cents a mile.
  • shark13shark13 Member Posts: 9
    do 1.8's, as well as other jetta levels, come with a different brand of coils these days? i've looked under the edmunds vw topic specifically on coils, as well as vortex, but can't really find a straight answer. the closest answer i find is that only early production 2003 models should need these replaced.

    also, besides turbo lag, what, if any, are the drawbacks to a turbo engine compared to say the 2.0? thanks.
  • blueguydotcomblueguydotcom Member Posts: 6,249
    While VW used to offer a 100k powertrain warranty on the 1.8t, that changed as of 2002. not sure what it is but it's not nearly that robust.

    Some people contend even a light boost turbo like the 1.8Ts is much harder on an engine and thus requires more maintenance. could be. you have to wonder about the decision to cut the warranty.

    As for turbo lag...um, compared to the anemic 2.0, there is no lag. Keep the RPMs over 2k and the engine pulls like a V6.

    BTW, i think for 2002 they also changed the gas requirement now stating it's suggested you use premium (so the engine will run at peak levels) but not required (ie, the engine retards itself, giving you less power).

    don't worry about coils in 2k3 models. that was a 2002 and earlier issue.

    Know this, if you buy a 2k3 Jetta in May/June, you've got maybe 15-16 months before the 2k5 models hit. If that's not a new version i'll be shocked considering the current model is now 5 model years old (6 when the 2k4s hit in August/September) - 99, 00, 01, 02, 03.
  • fish8fish8 Member Posts: 2,282
    Believe it or not some individuals like (love) to wash and wax their cars. Me for example, I love to spend time outside, by myself, and wash/wax my Jetta. I also like to drive a clean car. You call your car obnoxiously shiny after you wash it?????? Your kidding right? Would you agree that you are a tad cynacle? Being lazy and not washing your car is one thing, but actually thinking a car is "obnoxiously shiny" after a wash is a little out there.

    I just don't get your mind set.....I think that is a good thing!!!!!
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