Mercedes-Benz E-Class Sedans

tendons1

what are the "direct injection " engines? How do they differ from regular fuel injection?

tony107

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/firstdrive/51599/article.html

tony107

Listen, I just think that when you buy a car for 50K (2003 E class) and it looks almost exactly like a 30k car (2002 C class) it is just pathetic. Just look at these pictures and you can see that they are almost identical. Click on a picture that is from the back and compare

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/firstdrive/51599/article.html

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/48643/article.html

w210

I find the current C and W211 E quite different looking. I like them both.

shipo

Maybe it's just my "Eye", however, other than a "Family Resemblance", I personally think that the two cars look quite different, especially on the road.

Best Regards,
Shipo

mbnut1

Hows it going. How is the E55? I believe the driect inject is when the fuel is injected directly into the combustion chamber as was done with the legendary 300SL. Todays gas fuel injection systems are port injection ie injected into the air before it goes past the intake valve and into the combustion chamber.

tendons1

the e55 was always grand with acceleration but I was bitching for some time about what i felt was a floating or not tacked down sensation at speeds over 70-80. So, after a year or so, based on input from this board I put in hr springs and bilstein sport shocks. The car is wonderful now, really tight, and I find getting up to 100 or so occurs with a great sense of solidity.It's on a lease and I do have a deposit down for the next one, but this is the first time that I thought I might keep this car.
'

mbnut1

good news about the suspension changes. Did they make the ride harsh?

popkwizz

When I first got my '86 300E (first MB) I felt a bit of a float at 60 - 70 mph on modest freeway curves. I dumped the old hard 205 Michs and put on stock 195s (different brand). Much better, especially on grooved curves that are wet.

benznut

... seems to be even more of a "monster" than the newly developed SL55. Rumors circulate that the SL55 has been recalled slightly after the deliveries began in Europe, in order to be tuned up to 500 hp. Reason? The new E55 is proving faster and quicker in the testings, due to the lighter weight and the lower drag coefficient! Now, keep in mind that the SL was tested at 4.4s from 0-100kmh, and with a top speed of 208mph. And, who knows, they may be able to make tires for the weight of the new E, so that it can perform in these speeds when unlimited.

merc1

Thats what everyone is doing today. Look at Audi, Jaguar. BMW has been doing it for years. The 745i is their FIRST attempt at breaking this trend. Naturally I find the new E just right. It now "fits" in with the rest of the family. The current E, while handsome is a little on the blocky side. I think overally the E-Class has been my favorite Benz 4-door through the years. It's just the right size, now it'll have the S-Class features too. No wonder the 2003 S is being upgraded.

M

tendons1

The ride may be 5-10% harsher, but well worth it for the handling. Also, in new orleans one learns to go slowly over the convoluted streets. Expansion strips ont he highway don't feel any different, but a slightly more angled approach to the driveway has become necessary.

wishnhigh1

I think the current C class is the best looking Benz of all time. I dont care that it costs less, it looks good.

I think mimicing the styling is a good idea, because the E class has always been much better of a car. Higher quality, better engineering, more reliable, etc. Now it looks good too.

However, I am afraid much of the public wont see it the same way. They will be like "hmm a 35,000 dollar benz, or a 55,000 dollar benz. They look the same. I'll take the 35,000 dollar one."

pat

The following 9 messages were posted in a separate discussion that I am folding into this one.

Carry on! ;-)

Pat
Sedans Host

tony107

On a contrary, the C class was made before E class. And it is really odd that both cars have very similar looks, especially the back. Thats the problem with todays manufacturers, they never can make more than one original design. What I liked about the old E class design is that it did not resemble any of the other models, now it does.

turquoise_e

My 2000 E320 sedan has 23K miles and the original Michelin MXV4 is running thin on the side wall.

I read some of you have tried the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S. Wonder if they want to share their experience?

If you had the OEM MXV4 before that, can you compare the two?

My wife drives the car more often than me; she probably prefers the quiet ride more than anything else. So, any comments on Pilot Sport A/S's noise and ride quality will be appreciated?

shipo

Hmmm, 23K on MXV4s? That seems a little on the low side.

I am turning in my 328i tomorrow at the end of a 39 month lease, said 328i has MXV4 Plus tires, and I have fairly good things to say about them (long life, quiet, adequate grip). In my case, the MXV4s have 40,000 miles on them, and per BMWs recommendations, they have NOT ever been rotated. As such, the rears are a little more worn than the fronts, with approximately 5,000 miles remaining on the rear tires and 15,000 remaining on the front set. Given my experience, you can see why I am surprised that your tires are looking a little long in the tooth at only 23,000 miles.

My brother just mounted a set of Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires on his Audi TT, and his initial report is that they are very noisy and do not have the same grip, when compared to the Bridgestone Potenza S-03 tires that came on the TT from the factory.

In your case, I might be inclined to have the alignment checked out on your car, and then get another set of MXV4s.

Best Regards,
Shipo

linard

I love the new E-Class's styling, I think it's very classic and is distinctive from the other models in the range. Have any of you read the full reviews and comparisons on it in Top Gear and Car Magazine? They're both from England and from what I've read, it's supposed to be a leap from the old car and better than the 5 series in terms of refinement and quality. Top Gear stated that the E class marks the return of "hewn from granite quality, the type of quality that journalists get turned on by." They also felt, after comparing it to the 530, that it feels as though it can be driven around the world without a hint of rattling.

BTW, it got first place...

valueguy

I really like the Pilot Sport A/S's on my E430.
The grip is much better than the stock Continental tires. These tires are also quieter and have better wet traction. Most "E" drivers will be quite happy with these Michelin tires.
I would definitely purchase them again.

I am skeptical about the new "E" quality considering all the electronic updates. M-B had been manufacturing my "E" for 4 years before I purchased my '00E430. Yet, I have had 2 replacement radios, a new instrument cluster, a new CD changer, a ESP fuse replaced and new dash.
Think real hard before you spend $50,000 plus on the FIRST year of a new model. Remember, the new
"C" had a lot of problems in early production.
I believe with the '02 model year M-B has worked
most of the bugs out of the new "C".

Unfortunately, I believe the new "E" will have just as many, if not more, problems than the new "C" had. Most car manufacturers have problems with new models and M-B is no exception.

wniel

I would agree with Shipo that you need to have your alignment checked to determine if that is adding to the wear of your tires. You mentioned one other thing that got my attention and that is the edge of the tred is showing the most of the wear. That is an indication that you have been running the tires under inflated. On MXV4's, in my opinion should have no less than 32# of air in them. You give up very little in ride quality and gain a great deal in handling and minimize wear. I have a 2000 E430 with 17" wheels and keep 36# of air in the tires. This also was recommended by the tire store when I bought new wheels for the car. Low profile high performance tires on 17" & 18" wheels are notorious for getting poor mileage, but it can be improved by keeping a minimum of 36# in them.
Wally

Edsoto

Will it not have already been built for at least 6 months? The car is already selling in Europe, would that not mean any of the major kinks/bugs are already taken care of?

valueguy

The new E is featured in this upcoming movie: Men in Black II. Will Smith's character drives a '03 E Class sedan in Black. The prevues show bits of the car.

The '03 will be out for about 6 months time before it hits our showroom floors. M-B is trying to make sure the new "E" represents the marque in a positive way. Our market is the most competitive in the world and we demand perfection from our cars. Will M-B deliver the goods with the new E? I sure hope this will be the case but their last two new releases (C and S) needed 6-18 months to work out all the glitches. Do you want to take a chance with your money? I prefer to wait until the '04 model year when all the major issues will be resolved.

livetodrive

I would hope the initial quality of the W-211 E Class will be outstanding. Mercedes Benz has a lot at stake with the introduction of this important model. They know their reputation for quality is on the line, so they will probably work harder to avoid initial quality problems that existed with other recent introductions, such as with the ML and C classes.

With the C-class introduction, Mercedes had many electronic problems, such as with the smart-key and rear view mirrors not holding their setting. Rather than introducing new features, the new E appears to incorporate systems that have been already introduced on other models. The drive-by-wire brakes, ABC (active body control), and Distronic cruise control, for example, are already in production on the new SL.

There should be no problems with the engines, which come from the existing stable. So Mercedes has every opportunity to "get it right the first time". Time will tell.

rolands

Has anyone heard of ball joints wearing out on a 97 E320 with 60K miles? I just got my car back from the dealership for an oil change and was told that they are worn out. They also said it would cost $1200 to replace and realign. This is freaking ridiculous.

Kirstie_H

A television reporter is interested in hearing from folks who have driven long distances to get good prices when buying new cars or trucks. If you have a story to tell, please drop a line including your contact info and city/state of residence to jfallon@edmunds.com.

Thanks,

Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com

jean7of9

Last week, my dealer replaced under warranty the front passenger ball-joint during my regular tire rotation. My odometer was around 24k miles (39k km). According to him this a common problem with the E's. There was no need for a wheel alinement.
My E is 99 4matic.
Jean

valueguy

I am a satisfied Mercedes-Benz owner. My earlier posts mentioned some minor problems with my '00E430 but they all have been fixed to my satisfaction. My car is extremely well-built, the paint quality is outstanding, the ride and handling is firm yet luxurious and the V-8 with 5 speed auto is quick and smooth.

Overall, I would purchase another E. But, I will also consider Lexus, BMW and Jaguar (cheap lease deals on the Jag) when I decide to get a new sedan. Lexus GS owners think their car is the most reliable in this segment. Perhaps, but I have no rattles or squeaks in my M-B. Many on the Lexus GS board have reported sunroof rattles,
suspension problems, etc. The GS and E seem close in terms of owner reported problems. In comparison, the LS 430 is considerably better in terms of reported problems.

My local service department is the number one reason I would purchase another M-B. They have fixed or replaced everything with no hassles whatsoever. With the extended warranty in place I sometimes feel they would replace the entire car if necessary. I hope the new "E" does not suffer from same electrical gremlins
that I have personally experienced with my car. With all those new electronics (brakes, suspension, seats, cooling systems, key-less go, etc) in place this would be quite an accomplishment. Realistically, I recommend the '03 owner make sure he/she has a really good service department or wait for the '04.

jamesr88

just replaced the stock continentals on my e 00430sport with michelin sport a/s . what a difference in ride, handling and noise. bottom line just pay extra and get them. I also agree with caution on the purchase of the new e in first year. i have gone through 2 batteries, 2 phones, one replaced instrument cluster and dash due to loss of seal on passenger air bag , new fuel sensor will get new ash tray as lighter is stuck(never used). still love the car but am glad i purchased extended warranty (lisa lehrbaum in CA)

dunninla

I just installed new Pirelli P Zero Rosso, 235/45/17 in replacement of my Dunlop SP 8000, which got 20k miles, on my 2001 E-320 with Eibach springs.

Based upon this board, the mercedes.org board, and the Tirerack performance tests, I narrowed my choice down to the Bridgestone S-03 Pole Position, Michelin Pilot Sport, Dunlop SP 9000 and the Pirelli. I live in SoCal, not much rain, otherwise the Bridgestone is a no brainer...the best dry and wet tire bar none...none. But it is noisier than the Pirelli, and the dry performance was very close.
Seems the Micheline Pilot Sport A/S is another choise that is nice, but it was around $40 more per tire, and I didn't notice any tests showing it was in the same dry performance category as the others. The regular Michelin Pilot sport, like the Bridgestone, tested out as noisier and less comfortable than the Pirelli, with almost the same performance. I eliminated the Dunlop 9000 based upon user reviews. Then chose the Pirelli because of the road ride and noise being considerably better than the others.

So far, it is so much quieter and comfortable on the road than my Dunlop 8000s that I cannot believe it corners on rails as the performance tests indicate. Next week I'll give it a good try on the twisties.

Now if I can just figure out how to get rid of those awful looking little red letters....

toddj1

I'm looking at a 1996 E-class diesel with 90,000 miles. I know nothing about diesel engines and want opinions on what problems/concerns would anyone have in buying a diesel and is 90,000 miles alot for a diesel engine. The dealership tells me that's not high mileage and that a diesel Mercedes can go 200-300,000 miles on a diesel. Can anyone offer me advise. Thanks

mbnut1

I can't offer a whole lot other that if the diesel was properly maintained the dealership is correct.

magnetophone

If the diesel is in top working order and has full maintenance records, go for it. A Mercedes diesel with 90K miles is in its infancy! I'd expect 250-300K definitely, more if you're willing to baby it and put money into it.

john01

FWIW, in Germany most taxis are MB diessels, and most I see have over 300,000 miles and sometimes 400,000 miles.

bmms8

i know noting about diessel engins but is it true that diessels last longer than the normal gas egines. i am planning for a new e500, and im wndering how long will the engine last if i keep it in good shape.

charles62

Has anyone had a problem with the interior lights flickering on a 1997 E320? The car has been into the dealer 4 times for this problem and they can't seem to determine what's wrong. Last September when I first noticed the problem we replaced the altinator and battery which appeared to correct the problem. However over the past couple of weeks it has started again. I had to car in for service on last week and the dealer could not find any problem the battery and altinator tested fine. Any suggestions????

wniel

Yes, diesels do last longer. I have owned two diesels, the last one being a S300 turbodiesel. I sold it and it had 195k on it and the last time I checked with the person that bought it, it had nearly 300K on it and still running well. I have another friend that has well over 300K on his. With good maintenance these diesels seem to go forever. With regard to the MB gas engine, they do last longer than the typical gasoline engine, but one must take care and service the engine regularly. That means that one should change the oil more frequently than what the FSS system says. I have a 2000 E430 in which I run Mobil 1 oil in it and I still change the oil every 5K miles. I also have a 1998 ML 320 and do the same with it. I previously had a 300E and sold it to my son-in-law and he now has 125K on it and it still runs like a top with no oil burning. I know many MBZ gas powered engines that have had good maintenance and have over 200K on the engine with no oil burning. I hope that this helps.
Wally

neicey59

With the introduction of the new E class, how much should I pay for the current model? Has anyone recently purchased an E320? I would think there would be some great incentives for the dealers to move the current year's models before the 03 arrives.

Edsoto

Hi:

About a month ago, I paid 48K for an E320, Silver/Black, Heated Seats, K2A Cellphone package, CD Player. I got this from MercedesBenz Greenwich and was treated very nice.

As we get nearer and nearer to the new E, the price probably gets lower and lower

ppatterson

I was visiting an area MB dealer. When I closed the door of the new S-class sedan, the door didn't have the characteristic "thunk" of past MB sedans. In fact, the door closing didn't sound as solid as my "99 Accord. When I asked him about the robustness of succeeding generations of their products he indicated that MB has de-contented their cars to meet market demand at lower price points. So, imagine what the new E will be like in comparison to the current generation E.

Also, I asked the salesperson about the provisions made in the event that the battery dies on the "smart-key." He indicated that the owner can still start the car with a dead battery in the key. Sounds like a "tall-tale." Anyone know the truth to the question?

hocky1

Charles62 - From my own experience with my Merc C180, it appeared that sometimes, the bulbs are due for replacement and the coils are broken, but sometimes still connect and light up due to movement vibrations. This was in my tail light and are ok now after replacing them. However, if its flickering continuously sometimes, it could be that somewhere in your car, there is some heavy drain in the 12v current into things like security alarm, CD player, central locks, something electrical which is due to faulty connections, etc.

w210

No way the 99 Accord door is more solid or even feels more solid than the S-class. Strongly disagree.

bigrobnh

According to my owners manual, he speaks the truth. You use the emergency key in the fob to get in the car, then use the key as normal. I believe that the key can obtain power from the ignition.

BigRob.

leo23

My 2001 MB320 which I have now driven 10.000 has developed a slight whiney noise that appears when I accelerate the engine to about 20MPH. I noticed it right after my first oil/lube and tire rotation last week. Hany ideas as to cause, before I take it back to the dealer??

LeotheLion

l943973

Does anyone know if the Heated Seats in the Mercedes E-Class cover only the seat bottom or the bottom and back.

Also if you purchase the ventilated seats, do you need the heated seat option?

thanks,

jsalemi

On my 2002 E320, it feels like the heat only comes up from the bottom on the seats, not the back. So I'd say that only the seat bottom is heated (though around here, in Northern Virginia, it rarely gets cold enought for it to make much difference that only the bottom is heated).

I believe the ventilated seats include heating. In any case, if you order them, you can't also order the heated seats (at least according to the MB USA web site).

---joe

tendons1

on the 01 e55 there are both heated and ventilated seats. The back also heats up on this model. The ventilation I think is almost a real waste of money because while there is a suggestion of some lack of sticking to the seat,easily noted in new orleans, if the seat ever gets cool, it's not a nice feeling. Man is not made for a cool [non-permissible content removed].

bigrobnh

My 2001 E320 4Matic has the heated/ventilated seats. The back and seat are heated.

I'm extremely satisfied with them. In the past I've found leather seats to be a tad sweaty. The fans don't actually provide a cooling effect.

This man prefers a cool dry [non-permissible content removed] to a sweaty sticky one any day of the week...for the same reason I wouldn't buy a car without air conditioning.

kylew1

My father-in-law recently passed away and had a '99 E300DT with 19,000 miles on a lease with Mercedes credit. The car is in very good shape. The buyout on the lease is $30,900. I have not been able to find the car for sale anywhere on the used market. What is it worth? Someone told me the cars are scarce and I should ask $40,000?

minter1

My 00 E--320 has a squeaky drivers seat. Noticable when cornering, and the harder you corner, the more noise. Mucho annoying. Had same problem when car was new, and dealer took it apart and did something that worked for 2 years. Now it's back. Have not seen this problem mention on this board - anybody have any thoughts/experinece? I'm thinking it's time to ask for a new seat mechanism...

joeadp

I had this and used WD40.

Spray it under the seat once a year seems to do the job.