Chevy/GMC c/k 2500 crew cabs (2000)

cspaulding

I see I missed the discussion back in October on the CC Chevys. You all have had a chance to break them in by now, I hope. I've posted on some of the other boards, but can't get any replies, guess none of them quite address this catagory!

I have a 2000 K2500 cc, 454, 3.73s. I think it's a lemon, but Chevy denies there is anything wrong with it.

Anyone having problems with the 454? Ours is knocking...Zone manager has told us: 1) it has a radical roller cam (tried that with me because I'm a woman); 2) the valves are actually hitting, but that is normal (told my husband that after my first argument with him [manager]); 3) this is normal for the 454s.

We haven't had one in years, but we're not buying into this. Also, has blamed the loss of power on the 373s. We can't even turn the tires -- never seen a 454 with so little power. This is just the start of the problems, but wondered if anyone else is having similar problems and/or how other 454s are performing.

Thanks,
chris

mgdvhman

the 2001 HD CC with a 6.0 could turn the tires I drove...as could the 2001 ex.cab with the 496...

Keep hounding them.......the squeeky wheel gets the oil!

- Tim

cspaulding

We're trying, but wanted to see if others are having problems...still trying to decide what to do with it...we [I] love the truck, just wish it didn't have the problems. Also have too many accessories on it to go after lemon law at this point...can't afford another 5 to 6 grand for accessories right now.

Thanks again.

mgdvhman

no?

- Tim

hunter98

Make mother GM reimburse you with the cost of the accesories or replace them with identical ones on the new truck. And get the use of lemon law and such. The squeaky wheel gets the grease and the quiet one just drys out, so you had better squeak. Tell them how you feel and that you want to remain a GM truck owner but may have to go to a V10.

Best of Luck

Hunter

hunter98

You have to have had the truck fixed three times for the same problem or been out of service for 30+ days to get Lemon. But I know that GM changes engines on their trucks. Had a friends with 5.3L that made a noise similar to that, really wasn't very bad and they changed the whole engine out. Runs great now. Turns out a factory employee installed a piston or something 90 or 180 degrees off which caused the noise.

Best of luck

Hunter

cspaulding

Thanks, I'm definitely open to ideas. The accessories won't transfer to the new trucks (change of body style), and one of the accessories is a power rear slider. Lemon law, at least in Wisconsin, doesn't allow for reimbursement for accessories.

Hunter,
Thanks, GM keeps telling us there's no problem because their computer doesn't show anything. We were pushing for a new motor, but there is also more wrong with the truck. The motor's just the "major" thing. Also, the differential does't always seem to lock; the 4wd lever (we have the floor shift) won't move at times; etc., but the GM rep says this is all "normal" for these trucks. We'll just keep pushing. (hopefully we can just blow the engine and let them fix it then.)

Chris

mgdvhman

....I'd go for a new engine too.....

6K of lost access. is hard to swallow...

- Tim

obyone

I would recommend using the services of the BBB. If you have had the truck in for the same problem at least 3 times or the truck has been in the service department for 30+ BUSINESS days, you will qualify for a buyback. This is not to say that you want the buyback. A GM rep will be assigned to handle your case once the BBB contacts them. From the time you file electronically, it is a matter of 3-5 days where the GM rep responsible for buybacks contacts you. He will review the case with you and make some suggestions like trying another dealer's service department or a general statement like "it's a truck for goodness sake." Once pass the melodrama, it is in this reps best interest not to go to arbitration as in my case, there was no way for him to win. Another 5 days before a phone conference with the BBB rep assigned to your case to review. One thing good about the BBB arbitration. It is binding on the manufacturer but not on the owner as if you are unsatisfied with the result, you can always pursue lemon law.

What resulted was,

-Major Guard 6/100 bumper to bumper no deductible warranty

-Local GM rep notified of the situation with my truck with instructions on problems needing to be corrected

-Dealer notified of results of my complaint with BBB against GM and that every option on resolving my complaints must be used.

All in all, dealer has been responsive and I don't worry about any major expenses until 6 years or 100,000 miles. I think that this should be the minimum you should settle for peace of mind since you don't want to pursue buyback or lemon law.

A good place for detailed info is Clay's site:

http://agmlemon.freeservers.com/

He breaks down the exact details of what you need to do with examples of the forms you have to fill out and what to expect.

Good luck!!

Dean

cspaulding

My confusion with the BBB is...Doesn't a Chevy service dept. have to admit there is something wrong with the truck. Our "zone" is so tight that they are all covering each others butts! I keep hearing..."this is normal for the 454, this is normal for the floor shift 4wd, ...". That's where I'm stuck. The motor is the major problem, but having a 4wd that won't lock in when you need it (lever will not budge at times) is a close second.

Thanks,
Chris

obyone

BBB has an independent tech to test drive the vehicle to substantiate your claim. The tech submits the results of his analysis directly to BBB. BBB then contacts you with the results and whether arbitration is required. If the dealer and the GM rep are in a state of denial, this usually wakes them up. Because they know it exists, they will usually settle before it goes to arbitration by offering the Major Guard.

obyone

You are not the first and won't be the last to have a dealer in the state of denial.

Good luck!!

cspaulding

That answers my question/problem with this deal.

Thanks,
Chris

sspaulding

hi c spaulding (nice last name -related?)
I have 2000 crew cab w/350 automatic w/floor 4wd lever and mine works flawlessly.
I test drove both the 454 and 350 w/3.73 gears
and was unimpressed with the 454 overall in comparison to the 350, so I opted for 350 for fuel economy.
If I were you I would look on the dealers lots for another truck to compare to (454/3.73 gears).

Ilove mine . I pull a 14ft enclosed trailer all the time for work and it drives like a dream!

cspaulding

Thanks. Where are you from? We're in Wisconsin.

We did try to find another 454 w 373s to try, but no one in a 50 mile radius has any. We did try a 454 w/ 410s and there was no comparison.

What type of fuel mileage are you getting? We were getting around 15, until we started having trouble with the motor. Now we're down to about 12.

About how heavy is the trailer you are pulling. I was looking at pulling a horse trailer and a tandem trailer with a skid loader and/or pulling truck, that's why we opted for the 454.

bowhuntwi2

A couple of months ago I used the BBB after hasseling with the dealer for months with a problem with my tires on my Ford. ( I also live in Wisc. ) After I went to the BBB and filed a complaint, which I did online. The attitude at the dealer was like night & day on trying to fix my situation. Once you go to the BBB, their dealership will be listed as having a complaint against them. All dealerships don't want to be listed on that list. Try it, what do you have to lose.......

cspaulding

Thanks, I guess we will be getting everything together for the BBB. I am contemplating sending a letter to Chevy besides re: the ridiculous zone manager they had (he is now in Michigan, I guess, so look out over there).

Chris

sspaulding

I live 30 miles north of green bay WI.
You were doing good if you were getting 15mpg.
my brother has a 1ton chev 454/410s and he gets 10-12mpg. I get 12-14 empty -loaded.
I also pull a pulling truck in the summer for my buddy. where do you pull at? He's a member of WUMPA.
As for my truck it pulls a 14' enclosed trailer total weight loaded is about 3000lbs empty to 5000lbs loaded so it should pull it easily.
MY brother and I both pulled the pulling truck W/trailer and they pull about the same.
I did buy a computer programmer (about the same as a chip) which seems to help a little w/HP.
If you get to green bay try gandrud chev. they have treated me great in past on warranty items.

Have you tried to put bigger tires on your truck?
I put 265/16 BFG ATs on mine and when I turn the tires rub on the fender flares, so I had to notch them out.

cspaulding

We're in Wautoma. I don't let my hubby pull with this truck. We're in the process (5 year plan, I think - year 4 now) of putting together our '84 Chev. with a 400 Small Block, putting out over 600hp. That can be his toy.

The 2000 we're leaving the 245s on, I have old parents and they can get into the truck to take trips with, so, until they're gone we have to have one lower truck.

You only get 12-14 empty/loaded with the 350? Is that pulling the trailer? I pulled a load of hay home from up north, a 20 foot trailer & about 100 bales on it, also have pulled 4wheelers, boats, etc., and still averaged around 12.

Will write more later, as this is getting long.

cspaulding

on the last 2 or 3 mornings, this problem has become worse. On startup (it is cold out) the truck idles fine for a minute, then starts a cycle of idling down to 300 RPMs, shuddering (like it's going to die, too bad it doesn't), then jumps up to 1000 RPM, then idles back down to 300 and does it again...this morning I let it do this and it did it for 10 minutes, before I gave up and headed to work... any ideas?

We think the intake is leaking...we had Chevy look at it as it has about a 1 1/2" discoloration around the intake manifold, but, of course, they say there is nothing wrong with it. Any other ideas?
Thanks again,
Chris

obyone

the intake manifold. Description of varying idle speed fits exactly. Like the manifold gasket is leaking.

cspaulding

Thanks, that's what we think, too...but, we hear from Chevy that they "don't know why we have a problem with this truck, we've got a really nice truck here" [Zone Manager]...yeah, right!

We'll add it to the list for Spring!

gsiefken

I have a 2000 crew cab Z-71 3/4 ton silverado pickup with a vortec 454 engine and 3:71 gears. What kind of mileage can i expect? Live in central Ia. The truck only has 10,000 miles on it now. Will use primarly to pull a 28 foot 5th wheel camper. Beautiful red color and pulls like a dream, but concerned about local driving when not pulling fuel economy. Do computer programmers help that engine with fuel economy?

gsiefken

cspaulding from gsiefken

I haven't had one problem with our 2000 chevy truck. However, we can't spin the tires either. I figured that was because of the limited slip rear end. I'm afraid my fuel mileage will be in the 10 to 12 mpg range empty. Hopefully will get better with more miles. Truck has 9500 miles on it now.

cspaulding

Our 2000 cc 454 w 373 gears gets between 12-15 mpg steady...pulling trailers we tend to keep the same mileage, that was before the problems started. We now have 14,000 miles on ours. Our problems started showing up about 8500 miles. Please keep me posted, should any problems develop. Good luck
chris

gsiefken

What was the name of the company that sold programers for trucks you found in a camper magazine? Also what are your thoughts on programers to hopefully help fuel economy in the "macho" 454? I agree with your thoughts and others on the vibration or shaking motor when it idles its a vacum leak somewhere. I've had a number of chevy cars and trucks before and whenever it was not idling right generally it was a leaky vacum hose.

cspaulding

was in a recent horse magazine...it's by Banks. Looks like it contains...valve covers, headers, etc., just from looking at the picture. bankspower.com or 18004387693 for more info. Is this what you're looking for? Guess I don't know what you mean by 'programmers' (hubby is stumped too).

Chris

obyone

nerds who work for Bill Gates or....

http://www.superchips.com/

http://www.hypertech-inc.com/

cspaulding

all your chips do is increase the hp. They can bring your fuel mileage up about 1 mpg, but for the money, it's probably not worth it if all you want it for is fuel mileage. They, alone, don't give you much more power either.

Just our opinion. We have one in our '92 and had to do a lot more to get the power & fuel mileage desired.

Chris & Scott

cspaulding

our 2000 cc is now also idling at about 1000 rpms, at times...it's really noticeable with the icy conditions we've had. As soon as you step on the breaks the back end starts coming around...anyone else having problems with this? I end up putting it in neutral to stop. It doesn't do it all the time, but seems like it would possibly cause an accident. Any ideas?

I have decided to give Chevy one more chance to cure before going to BBB. We are going to write a letter to Corp. stating all problems with the truck and dealership's and zone manager's attitude with each item..."everything is normal", along with the fact that BBB is the next place to hear from us. Does this sound like a good idea? or a waste of time?

obyone

If you didn't understand by the last visits to the dealer, let me make it perfectly clear. GM DOESN'T CARE. Only way to get their attention is through BBB. Plus get a free extended warranty. If pursuing buyback, one of the prerequisites is to have the dealer work on the truck one last time. With the arbitrator looking on you can bet that the dealer's effort will be greater than the one you're about to attempt on your own. My $.25

cspaulding

I am a person who likes to stay clear of lawsuits or BBB. Working for an attorney does that.

cspaulding

and finding out about someone who is the service manager at the Chevy dealer here in town, we have decided to give them one chance. After telling her some of our problems, she asked us to bring it in, and was able to name off a few of the items wrong with it.

I did contact Chevy to get their fax # though, they don't have one for customer use, but I went through my 3 page letter of things wrong & told him this is Chevy's last chance before BBB. They seem willing to help, the first glimmer of caring in a long while. We'll see what happens...I will post how we are coming along for others.

chris

cspaulding

Our truck went in yesterday to the local dealership. It needs new lifters on one side. There is definitely a problem with the transfer case. They feel there is a problem with the electrical system/computer. The dealer is contacting Chevy to see what they "want" to do. Dealer was also surprised we hadn't been offered a buyback on this one. We will post when we know more.

gsiefken

My wife and I took the Big Red 454 out last Saturday for a spin to Des Moines, Ia. While at a stoplight I told my wife to hang on I was going to see if the tires would spin on dry pavement. Wow! It was scratching and the tires were hollowing until I let up on it.

cspaulding

Glad to hear yours has the power; that's about what we thought ours should have, even with the 373s in it. Chevy kept telling us no. We can't even come close to turning the tires on dry pavement. My husband tested a 454 w/410s in it and had it sideways for about 1/2 block from a standstill on dry pavement.

Ours goes in Friday for more looking over/starting work. Hopefully something will finally be done. It gets kind of frustrating when you order a new truck, figuring that you won't have these problems and, if you do, that they will be taken care of.

We'll keep you posted.
chris&scott

gsiefken

I want to sell our 454 with 10,000 miles on it and order one of those new Duramax Diesels. If you know anyone interested have them leave us a note. I know they cost a lotta, but I just got to have one of those diesels!!

cspaulding

That's what my hubby is pushing for; but after putting out the $$ for this one, I can't see taking the loss on a trade in. According to the local Chev. dealer (no, not the one we bought the 2000 from), they can't seem to get the diesels in.

Well, they ordered lifters for our 2000, as a start. At least they admitted something was wrong with it. They also told us we could probably go buy back on it. Like I said, with the extras I can't see doing that.

Good luck on getting a diesel. Keep in touch.
Chris

philmelmy

I just got rid of my crew cab short bed with your exact drivetrain config. It had no power and had the same problems yours is having. If you would like me to give you my story and synopsis of what I think is wrong just post a response and I will type accordingly.

cspaulding

Please, give us the details. As I said, after the 3rd dealership, we finally found one willing to try to do "something" about it. Also, did you trade yours in or do buyback? What did you get to replace it? Any info is appreciated.

Thanks.

Chris

philmelmy

Where do I begin! This is long, so go ahead and put the kids to bed...ha ha ha. I spent a long time mulling over what kind of drivetrain to put in my crew cab short bed before I ordered it. The 350 did not have enough power and the 454 gobbled gas like the cookie monster does cookies. I love power and power with the least amount of gas...who doesn't. I opted for the 454 w/ a 3.73 gear and floor 4x4 shifter. I knew the gas milage would be around 9-14 city/hwy stock, and with the 3.73 gear and with a few modifications maybe more. The mods that I made were: gibson cat-back exhaust, hypertech power programmer, and a volant cool air intake. Stock I got 10 mpg 1/2 city 1/2 hwy. With all the mods I got the same exact milage and no real notice in power gains. Boy was I disappointed. The truck got 10 mpg loaded or unloaded, uphill or downhill, wind in front or in back. The only time the milage got above 10 was when I would take a long road trip unloaded and maintain 65mph, then it got 12. Unloaded the truck's power was ok once you got the rpm's up to 2000. That means running in 3rd gear at 50 mph or overdrive at 70 mph. But once I hooked a trailer of any size to it the truck seemed very weak. I have driven 1/2 ton z71's with 350 motors in them that had more power than this truck did pulling. That tells me that part of the "lack of power problem" is due to the combination of 3.73 gears with the 4L80E transmission. The 1/2 ton transmission is the 4L60E which has lower gear ratios than the 4L80E found in 3/4 and 1 tons. Ex. 1st gear in the 4L80E is 2.48?? and 1st gear in the 4L60E is 3.04 or something similar. If you have ever noticed most trucks with the 4L80E tranny have 4.10 rearends to make up the difference.
Now for the chatter/clicking noise under the hood. Before I owned this truck I ordered a '99 Tahoe with a 350 in it. After putting a few thousand miles on it I noticed clicking noise coming from the valve area. Upon taking it to the dealer they said the motor needed to be pulled and a new crank, bearings,lifters, and a couple of rods needed to be replaced. I thought "this truck is brand new, what is up man?". The mechanic that did the repairs explained that the machines that make the parts for these motors (305,350,454) have been doing it for so long that they have gotten slightly out of tolerance over time...meaning "not as tight as they used to be. This produces parts that are not as tight on specs as they need to be. They replaced these parts and I never had or heard the noise again. I sold the Tahoe to a friend of mine and bought my dream truck...the one that you own right now. My friend still has the Tahoe and it has had no more problems what so ever. Well, the same thing started happening to the 454. When I got rid of it a couple of weeks ago it had 30,000 miles on it and the clicking under the valve covers was bad on cold morning starts. Also, the truck would do the same thing yours did; idle really low, run rough, and almost stall out upon first starting. It only did this rough idle thing a few times. I did not complain nor do anything about it because I had decided to get rid of it anyway. As a stock motor the 454 is not that great of a motor. Think about it...454 cubic inches and only 290 horsepower...can you say "minimal hp out of maximum displacement" or "all take and no give". I was pretty shure they were not going to buy back the truck. The floor shifter had no problems and I figured they would end up doing the same thing they did to my Tahoe, which would have been fine with me. I just did not like the "no bang for the buck" the 454 and 3.73 gear gave me. I ordered my 3rd truck from the same dealership and got rid of the "gutless pig". I took delivery two weeks ago of a 2001 2500HD ext. cab short bed w/ a 6.0L motor and 4.10 gears. It does not have great gas milage but will it ever haul booty when I put the foot to it. At 364ci, it is way more powerful than the 454. That is all for now. I hope this helps you out. I have spent a lot of time and money on Chevy trucks so hopefully somebody out there will benefit from me trudging through the trenches. This truck is going to be my last for a looooong time...at least that is what my wife says!

cspaulding

That's exactly what I told my hubby when we ordered the 2000. The truck does pull good, I hauled a 20' trailer w/ 100 bales of hay on it, and it pulled like there was nothing back there, gas mileage stayed at 14. Also have pulled trailers with four-wheelers and heavy equip. (Kabodas, etc.), no problem. We just have no power off the line. If they are able to give us a decent motor (or get our to work) we'd be happy with the truck. I just can't see sticking out 35-40K and having a real piece of #$(%. We've got 2 other trucks for play.

Thanks for the info.
Chris

gsiefken

TO THOSE WHO KNOW!!

I keep asking my dealer every time I take my vehicle in for an oil change if there are any recall items on the 2000 old style crew cab 454's and the service manager assures me that there are not many problems with these trucks. We really like ours but wish it would do better on fuel. I know we could trade or sell it but surely there is someone out there working on fuel improvement methods for that model truck without having to use high grade premium fuel. HELP!!

cspaulding

no there are not any recalls on the 454. If you don't feel it's running right or burning too much fuel, maybe you can push the subject and have the service dept. check it out, under warranty of course? What gears did you have and how much are you getting for mileage? Ours has the 373s and we're getting between 12 and 15. 12 in town when I drive 1 1/2 miles to work each day, 15 on the highway and our average is usually 14 over two weeks (before our problems). It didn't seem to matter if we were towing or in 4wd, it was all pretty much the same. Good luck.

On another note, our parts are finally all here and the truck goes in Monday for new lifters, and whatever else they decided to do. Today on our driveway (glare ice with an inch of new snow), I put it in 4wd and it made some god awful sounds. The shifter actually moved correctly, but the 4wd was whining and clunking for a few minutes. ???

Chris

cspaulding

Our truck went in Monday for service...they put in new lifters and "other parts". The truck now runs quiet again and actually has the get up and go it should. Guess there are solutions, if they are willing to accept there is a problem.

gsiefken

I,m going to take my K&N air filter out of my 2000 2500 cc 454 chevy truck. I was getting better fuel mileage with the regular factory air filter. I was reading that the K&N filter improves power by admitting more air. If that is true the truck computer will probably compensate the additional air intake with the equivalent amount of fuel, therefore more power less fuel mileage. Comments welcome!

cspaulding

It went back in today for an exhaust gasket (leaking) and a serpentine belt (worn and cracked after almost 1 year).

After the last fixes, which we just got a computer printout of and included a new valve and lifters on one side, the truck has power, we can turn the tires at least. Also fixed was the manifold gasket leak, looks like a new rear brake drum, new molding on interior, and the rest they couldn't duplicate. At least the power is there...4wd will have to wait until next winter (hopefully).

Chris

cspaulding

We finally found a used '99 with the 454 & 3.73 gears to test drive and compare. That truck had 39,000 miles on it and put ours to shame. You could take off and it would set you back in your seat; we stopped to see if they would turn over on a straight take off, yep they sure did, without any problem, we can't even get a squak out of ours. Enough to make a person sick. We have more problems to address this time too:

1. Engine, of course.
2. The transmission does not downshift when you take your foot off, I've taken the cruise off (60mph) 1/2 mile before a stopsign and get to the stopsign doing 58.
3. Brakes (probably due to the above) do not stop the truck. You now have to slam them on to stop completely, otherwise they just slow you down some.
4. Tires. These General tires we didn't like to begin with are now just about bald, all the way around, with 17,000 miles on the truck.

We were considering buyback, but don't/can't put more money in towards a new truck at this point. I guess $35,000 goes no where now-a-days.

Will update with solutions, if they come up with any.

cspaulding

"can't find anything wrong". Chevy says comparison to '99 is like apples to oranges & that we have to find a 2000 set up like ours to compare engines. Same old game...ready to get rid of it and get the '84 out, at least then Chevy made trucks (and actually stood behind them).