Mazda Protege5

cbmorton

Yes, I'm an ex-Jetta driver. Loved the Jetta, didn't love the price I'd have to pay to get into a similarly-equipped new one (my lease was up on the 2000). I don't drive much so I decided to get something cheaper this time and do something else with the difference.

Re the P5's ride, I find it perfectly acceptable on smooth or smooth-ish roads. It's only when the road turns a little bumpy that the ride becomes a little stiffer than I'd prefer. Just another matter of taste, I think.

bpi

It seems to me the P5 and the Jetta was a toss-up in your opinion. If you really wanted to save money, why didn't you just buy the '00 Jetta at the end of the lease? Maybe you needed the cargo space of the P5? Or maybe you wanted to save money but still wanted a new car every two years? But if you still want to trade in a car every two years, a Mazda should not save you any money over a VW, unless the P5 keeps its value better than a regular ES.

vocus

I would not think the P5 would hold more value than the Jetta would. I traded my 2001 ES in after 8 months of ownership and 20K miles. The car MSRPed for $18,445 (I paid $17,141 for it). I got $11,500 for it on trade, and the KBB/NADA value was $10,700 or so. They don't hold their value well. Nothing except a Honda holds its value well in the compact car class. I found out the hard way.

jim_loves_cars

I should be purchasing a new car in the next few weeks and the P5's high on my list (at the top, actually).

I'm wondering if any owners can tell me how the car handles in the snow. And I mean the nasty, deep, blowing, bone chilling stuff.

One of the things that attracts me the the VW GTI is the traction control, which I'm sure makes it sure footed when things get fluffy.

What repells me is the price, quality questions and the lack of back doors.

Any thoughts?

-jim

shrique

Factory tires aren't bad but personally I'm going to be getting a set of snows. Even with TC small cars still have a hard time in the snow just because of the lack of weight.

protege_fan

I've got the Pro sedan and we get harsh winters up here in Calgary. My car did fine on the Potenza's (P195 55 R15) and I don't think the difference in size (15 vs 16) b/n the Sedan and P5 would make that much a difference. However, I will definitely be getting snow tires for the next winter.

vocus

I drove my 2001 Pro ES in the snow once I think, and it was pretty good. But it was only a very light snow, so I can't really comment on its snow performance. It was pretty good in the rain though.

The Jetta I have now is excellent in bad weather, with its ASR. It has cut in a couple times to keep me from spinning in rain, no matter what speed. Also, I started on a frozen parking lot once (a PURE sheet of ice) and did not spin once. So I know the GTI would be good in snow.

vocus

The Potenzas you have are pretty different from the Dunlops on the ES models though. They say the Potenzas have bad traction, so the Dunlops must be really good then, I would think.

cbmorton

I lease. The higher the price of the leased car the higher the payments tend to be. The P5 is a much cheaper car than the Jetta I had my eye on, so the lease payments on the P5 are much lower. Simple. And Vocus is right, the only car I've ever had that was worth buying at the end of the lease (due to its retained value) was a Honda.

cbmorton

My Jetta also had ASR (traction control) and it was very, very good in the snow. The P5 with Dunlops is acceptable, but if you plan to do much winter driving I'd highly recommend a set of winter tires. They make a big difference.

protege_fan

I don't think ASR would do much on pure ice...it would be all about your traction from the tires themselves, wouldn't it?

cbmorton

Right, because traction control systems don't create traction, they just help the car make better use of what traction there is. Systems like ASR reduce engine power to the wheels when the amount of power being applied by the driver has overcome the traction available and the tires start to slip.

bpi

Since the Jetta has a higher resale value than a Mazda, it should help lower the lease payment.

An example (hypothetical and in US$):
A Jetta costing $20K new and worth $14K in two years.
A Protege ES costing $15K new and worth $9K in two years.

The difference ($6K) is the same. The Jetta costs $5K more new. Should that only raise the monthly lease payment by $20? What's a normal, non-subsidized lease rate nowaday?

sharonf

No....I really don't think I want to plus size to 17's....especially given what everyone here has said....I'll just stick with the 16's....if I can find any that fit!
Thanks for the input
Sharon

mustang87

my friend has an mp3. she just installed 18's on it. she took me for a ride. surprisingly on smooth roads it didn't even feel that bad. don't know how it will be on rought roads but i think its going to be hell. and she works in miami so its going to be a hard ride, trust me. i like the balance of ride/handling in p5 with stock rims and tires but it does let itself known on bad roads. the car rides hard. if you do most of your driving on smoother roads, 17 should not be a problem. but if you think that p5 is allready hard, do not get 17s.

mdaffron

... the third-annual Mid-Atlantic Protege Picnic (MAPP III), which is being held on Saturday, May 18 at Shenandoah River State Park in the mountains of Virginia.

So far we have about 20 Proteges (including about a half-dozen Protege5s) and about 30 people signed up to attend.

For more information, please visit the MazdaProtege group on Yahoo!:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mazdaprotege

Meade

Event Coordinator

Sporin

I put a TireRack ordered set of 195/55-15 Michelin Arctic Alpins on 15" steel wheels on my P5 this winter and it was FANTASTIC.

shrique

know if you can get older rims that fit on the P5? I was hoping that old rims off a 626 or maybe a Probe would fit. That way I could swing down to a junk yard pick up some older alloys and put the snows on them. That way I wouldn't have to deal with rust or hubcaps.

cbmorton

I only wish your example reflected the way it really works! Then I'd be driving a VW now. You've given the Protege a lease-end residual value of 60% ($9k of $15k) but the Jetta a value of 70%. In reality, regardless of the car, the residual percentages tend to be much the same no matter what car it is you're leasing--just because one is more expensive initially doesn't mean it holds a greater percentage of its value for the purposes of the lease. And to further complicate things, the lease-end value is not necessarily a reflection of the car's true market or resale value. The two should not be confused.

Residuals on a two-year lease tend to be around 67%; on a three-year lease around 59%. That means for the purposes of the lease, the car loses 33% and 41% of its value, respectively, during the lease term, and it's that depreciation that you're making payments on. Obviously, 33% of $20,000 is more than 33% of $15,000, and that's why a higher-priced car generally costs more to lease--the dollar value of its depreciation is greater. Higher-priced cars often tend to have a higher interest rate applied to the lease, making even more of a difference on the bottom line. There was a spread of about 1.2% between the Mazda lease rate and the VW lease rate. It adds up.

sharonf

Well....my P5 has arrived and I've arranged to pick it up tomorrow after work....finally!! Hopefully all goes well

jim_loves_cars

Enjoy the new P5!

If it's the updated model, please post about what upgrades are on the car so we can put an end to our speculation.

I think you're going to have a good weekend! ZOOM ZOOM!

-jim

protege_fan

Congrats on the new P5!!! Have fun!

limpyboy

Hey, I hope everyone can help me out.

I've had my blue P5 for two weeks now and I've noticed that the steering wheel is slightly off-center. That is, when driving straight, the wheel looks like it is turned a few degrees clockwise from being perfectly "straight" when you look at it.

I have two questions: Would this bother anyone else/am I being too Anal? And what would have to be done to fix it? I'm sure I could get it done as a warranty thing. Just don't know if it's worth the trouble.

Thanks to anyone who can help. The users of this board rock.

--Chris

protege_fan

How many miles are on your P5? If it's really bothering you, I'd take it in. I think they should do it under warranty. I don't think you're being too anal...I would get it fixed if it were me.

chicagopro

Could that be an alignment issue? It should definitely be looked into.

chicagopro

Good morning, Mike.

chicagopro

...one of those Matrix dealies.

Why anyone would consider that thing when they could have a perfectly nice P5 is beyond me. Danged thing looked like a Focus on steroids.

(And of course, no offense to anyone here who has a Matrix, or a Focus, or is on steroids...)

protege_fan

Morning! Sorry about the abrupt departure last night. Bad weather up here...power lines were swinging into each other and shorting each other out. Not to mention the danged ice all over the roads...sniff sniff

chicagopro

...sorry about the weather, but glad it was that and not me.

I was afraid I had finally managed to offend you.

I'll have to try harder next time... :-)

protege_fan

LOL! Well I'm on my way to a dealership to get my car looked at...see the Sedans board for the sorted details
$76/hour for labour!!!!! Arrgghhh!!!
$80 for alignment!!!!!!!
What's next???

limpyboy

Thanks. I've only put 702 miles on it. I'll definitely get it looked at. Thanks much for the advice.
--Chris

bluong1

do you dare to drive home in the car with this ugly unpolished stock wheels?! ;-)

Have fun anyway!

Bruno

the_big_h

yeah with the car so new, might as well let the dealer realign for you, free of charge too!

silver_bullet

The NHTSA web site mentions the crooked steering wheel under Protege TSBs. Crooked wheels drive me nuts, and I'd for sure have the dealer realign the front end to center it.

riopelle

Mine was slightly off when I got it too. They fixed it for free - aligments are free for the first 12 months under the warranty. I'm having my alignment checked again at 11 mos (wow, that's next month!) just to maximize this freebee. My service advisor suggested it.

I drove over the Berkshires on rt 2. this weekend. Any fellow New Englanders should know this is the perfect drive for a P5 - it's a 1hr rollercaster ride! This car is amazing. An SUV actually pulled out of the way to let me pass as I was zooming around turns it could barely putt through.

mnkyboy

When you mean "off center" steering wheel, do you mean the steering column itself, or the 360 degree turn of the wheel? I think you mean that the steering wheel is not level, as the its not on 0 degrees (if you think of it at angles).

Is this what you mean? I want to make sure I dont have the same problem. Thanks

mnkyboy

I want to replace my stock 16" wheels for my P5 with some Enkei RS6 wheels, 16". Is there some specs that I need to follow when replacing wheels? Ive never bought wheels before, but ive heard of terms like "offset", but what does that mean exactly? Does anyone know if the Enkei RS6 wheels will work fine of the P5?

protege_fan

Are they still free if you hit a curb??? I wish

protege_fan

Ok, what they are talking about is if you sit in your car with your front wheels pointed straight, the steering wheel itself is turned slightly (when it should be straight).

maltb

This is a case of why a little info can be dangerous. Mazda issues bulletins that are just an FYI for any of their vehicles. NHTSA picks this up and puts it down as applying to specific vehicles. When people go to NHTSA they assume that everything that is posted there will go wrong on their car when in fact service bulletins are to address common problems or to provide helpful hints in correcting certain issues.

silver_bullet

I'm aware that the NHTSA site is full of TSBs that are often no more than "FYI" messages to the dealers. I wasn't trying to make a point that all P5s have crooked steering wheels, so relax. FWIW, I demo'ed three different P5s at my dealership, and all three had a steering wheel that was slightly off-center while driving down a straight, uncrowned road. A simple toe adjustment by a competent alignment person will take care of it.

Re: offset - it is the measure of how much the flat mounting plane of the wheel is inboard (negative offset) or outboard (positive offset) of the exact midpoint of the wheel's width. For example, a 16x6 wheel is 6 inches wide, so the midpoint is 3 inches from the front or back faces of the wheel. If this wheel has a positive offset of 40mm, the mounting surface of the wheel would be 40mm closer to the outside of the wheel than the inside - does this help?

mazdafun

My sedan's steering whell was off by about 10 degrees. I think all they do is loosen the steering wheel and rotate it back into position and tighten it down. No big deal. Covered under the 12-month adjustment period.

It was annoying, but easily fixed.

maltb

so relax.

ummm, ok

riopelle

maybe 5 degrees, similar to Mazdafuns.

Hmm, if you hit a curb, and the car is pulling slightly one way, maybe you'll stil get it for free. But if it's obviously something you did...

seminole_kev

to let someone know of a TSB that corrects an issue? That's why these forums are great. It's easier to walk in and say "I've got this problem and TSB abc123 addresses it" than have them dork around because they haven't found the problem before.

maltb

It's dangerous when people start counting TSBs like recalls and assuming that because NHTSA has it published, it affect their vehicle.

The dealer is the intended audience for TSBs. There is nothing wrong with being aware of them, but it also helps to understand what it is in fact that you are looking at. Not only that, but NHTSA provides incomplete information(ie. no VIN ranges, etc.).

vocus

My 2001 Protege ES's steering wheel was a little off-center too. I had them check the alignment like 3 times, and it was ok. They finally fuond the TSB for the steering wheel being crooked and fixed it for me. They just have to remove the steering wheel and reapply it. Also, the airbag cover seems pretty easy to scratch (I did it with a fingernail when I had mine), so check for that when picking the car back up.

limpyboy

set off such a storm of posts re: steering wheel misalignment or, as mnkyboy says, not being "level" with the wheels pointed straight.

I've already skedded an appointment to have it taken care of. Service advisor certainly didn't seem surprised or defensive about it. It'll be taken care of next week.

Thanks again, everybody

--Chris

chicagopro

...look, dude, I'm not even supposed to be in here, what with my Protege just having a measly 4 doors and all.

But somehow everywhere you go, group hugs are required in your wake. How do you always manage to start stuff?

{{{{{{{{}}}}}}}

protege_fan

If my bloody steel rim cost $187.08 to replace, anybody know what an alloy from a P5 costs????? My advice: don't hit a curb!!