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Comments
http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/0220.htm
Accord driver's stay below the speed limit? Maybe where you are but here in Atlanta it's always a Honda/Acura/BMW flying past you. My Honda/Acura is usually the one right behind the fastest car because us Honda owners are a practical lot. You get better gas mileage and less speeding tickets when you are drafting.
I never compared the 02 Altima to the 93-97. I just said that the 93-97 was the best all-around Altima made. For it's time it had good power, a nice interior, and a "substantial" feel. The design when shown in a clean version still looks modern. I don't think the new Altima will stand that test of time. It's already looking trendy. Those clear lights may be nice now .. but they probably won't be in a couple of years. Laughable is saying the Altima has a nice interior.
And as far as women only caring about cupholders and interior design .. that may be true and I do love my cupholders and a nice interior. But if you try to race me please don't think I am just a girl or you might get embarrassed.
They should've just put the Maxima interior in the Altima. Then the Altima would be a serious competitor in my book or just put the Altima suspension on the Maxima.
But styling is purely subjective so this argument is pointless, so let's deal in facts the Altima is hot looking and the Accord looks cheesy.(Ha Ha). You may have alot of people who can't stand the interior but I don't 1 person who likes the Accord's exterior so there's your tradeoff. The Altima has nice cupholders as well so nah nah nah.
If you want to race an Altima with that bubble car, trust me you'll lose. God forbid if we have to make a turn before we finish.
Cupholders you say? "If there's an area where the Accord stomps the competition, it has to be in cupholder design. For 2003 the Accord offers a total of eight, including one in each lower door panel." From Edmunds test of the 2003 Accord.
In which version would the Accord actually lose? Automatic to automatic V6 0-60 times are tied. By the 1/4 mile they are still tied but the Accord is gaining speed. The Altima with 17" wheels and tires only outdoes the Accord by 1 MPH so if I am that worried about losing to an Altima in the corners I can take some of the money I saved with the Accord and upgrade. If you want to talk about the 5-speed Altima vs. the automatic Accord then go ahead but then you have to deal with the 6-speed Accord coupe.
Let's make a deal, I'm from Toronto and you're in Atlanta, let's meet in say Lexington KY (sounds like halfway to me, I was never any good in geography) tomorrow and race. Just make sure those 8 cupholders are empty because I don't want you to make excuses that the car was weighed down. By the way since you have so many cupholders can you pick up a coffee on the way for me(double cream, no sugar, large please don't be cheap you have all that extra cash form buying the Accord). Thanx.
Please don't laugh at my classless car when you see it and I promise not to laugh at yout cupholders.
Actually we don't have the Accord yet. It was supposed to be built yesterday and at the dealer by the 20th.
Sure I'll pick up the coffee, Starbucks no less, although the interior in your Altima might get jealous at all the nice materials Starbucks uses on their cups so you might want to give it a little pep talk beforehand.
Number of times a month I use the Cupholder ..... 58
; )
Also, I don't know if it really matters that the Accord has 8 cupholders. How many do you really need? Sure it may be come to good use, especially if you like to have multiple beverages and/or if you're a pig and can't throw away your old Starbucks coffee cup.
All in all, these comparisons are just pissing contests. I bought the 2002 Altima 3.5 SE because that's what I could afford. I don't think I have ever aspired to buy cars like Accord, Altima, Camry. Just buy the one that fits you the best but none of these will be considered a "desirable item". They are all just a regular cars on the road, whether they have 2 cupholders or 4 or 8.
Why wouldn't you let the S2000 driver rev to it's redline since that is what the car was designed to do? And IF there is a time of 5.9 seconds for the Altima how do you think they got it? Or even the 6.3 seconds for that matter. Do you think that they changed gears at 3500 RPM? And with the S2000's 0-60 time of 5.2 seconds and a 1/4 mile time of 13.8 @ 100.5 MPH (December 2002 MT) and slalom speed of 70.1 MPH the only thing the Altima would be hanging on to is the S2000's tailwind.
An S2000 transmission dead after a race? I'm sure if our Civic SI's can handle full-throttle starts the S2000 won't have any problem with it.
If the 240HP Accord is "too slow," then does it really make any difference if an Altima is slightly quicker, if at all? For a real noticable difference, you will need to be looking at cars that can do 0-60 in the low 5's.
If the Altima would beef up its interior decor, I would consider one in a second. Just have to change the taillamps or paint them or something...
http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2105.shtml
But the other reason is that because of the higher fixed cost (overhead) in building the Altima vs. say a Honda Accord it needs to trim some of it's variable cost (interior material) to achieve the same profit margins.
This may be the reason that the best Nissan Altima they could make at the time had the inferior interior. But with Nissan back in the black and more importantly the Altima achieving a successful sales run, they can make cars in the future with higher quality interior materials due to lower fixed costs. Still I feel like I got screwed, so this is my last Nissan. Hope it lasts me until 2005.
Honda transmissions are already breaking down and if you keep on launching any transimission it's gonna go sooner or later.
If people are finding the new Accord ugly now why would it age well? Thats like saying the Aztek will look beter in the future, maybe a distant future! I happen to find the Accord ugly. The car does not go together well. It kind of has a creepiness to it. Like edmunds said it even looks like a model below the civic. The Altima on the other hand looks elegant any body who doesn't think so better say the same thing about a bunch of other cars too. I think Altima will age well.
Sorry, but that is just flat out false. To get better gas mileage drafting you would need to be about 2 feet from the guy's rear bumper. And as for speeding tickets, maybe in your state but here in florida if a cop sees one person speeding and another in tail he will pull you both over, period.
Ppower
Ppower
Ppower
implicit: There is also no 5-speed Accord so if people compare the 5-speed Altima to an automatic Accord why not compare the 6-speed Accord to the 5-speed Altima?
And what Honda transmissions are breaking down? Do you think car magazines get the 5.9 and 6.2 second runs by gently launching the cars and slowly running it up to it's redline?
You find the Accord ugly .. I find the Altima's interior to be hideous .. let's call it even.
The new 2004 Maxima will likely be around 30K MSRP with options added since a fully loaded Altima with the cheap plastic interior is already around 29K at full sticker.
How cheap the interior looks will also depend on what you are used to. If you drive a Pontiac with the Fisher Price grey plastic interior trim, the Altima might not seem so cheap inside.
Even if the coupe got 6.2 with a 6 speed manual. I have not seen times of 5.9 from any Accord. Altima has done this with a 5 speed. How aout that? You should read more Honda forums and quit whinning in the Altima ones. Read around and you'll find that 26,000+ (I'm probably underestimating)Accord, Acura owners and other models have had failed transmisson (not reved). You probably haven't heard about it cause your Honda "God" will refuse to do a recall, I guess extending the warranty extension was less money. The problem should be fixed with the new Accord though (I hope). Theres Honda reliability for you.
I find the Altima interior to be interesting. Thats the reason I don't have a Camry or an Accord. I think I'll take a creative interior with average materials than a boring interior.
Edmunds even compared the Passat to the Altima interior in their long-term tests.
http://vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=39434
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/central2.cfm
Problems with V6 Accords, TL's, and Odyssey's transmissions are also irrelevant when considering the S2000. Only V6 automatic transmissions were affected, the S2000 is a 4 cylinder with a 6-speed manual the only available transmission.
I already know S2000 supposedly isn't under the recall. I was implying how the trannies will fail with continuous launches.
aromas, I live in Boston and have an Altima 3.5. The car drives pretty well in the snow on the all-season tires. It has snowed here several times this year, and I haven't had any problems getting around.
Another note. Motorweek report on Accord is not even close to perfromance numbers presented on SE. http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2201.shtml
Here are a few quotes for those of you who obviously didn't take time to read the article.
"Torrance, CA 09/20/2002 -- American Honda Motor Co., Inc. announced today it will provide extended warranties on approximately 1.2 million Honda and Acura models equipped with automatic transmissions due to problems that may result in premature wear or failure. The extended warranty will cover affected transmissions for seven years or 100,000 miles."
"While only two percent of these vehicles have experienced these transmission problems, American Honda will provide extended transmission warranties on all potentially affected vehicles."
"There is usually plenty of warning to the driver that the transmission is not operating properly, such as slow or erratic shifting, giving them ample time to take the vehicle in for service."
Never heard of S2000 transmissions failing. Is it safe to say that the 350ZX tranny will fail? It is a sports car and alot of people might launch hard .. same with the Altima V6 and the Maxima 6-speed for that matter. Fact is there is no record of any of these transmissions having problems so your point is moot.
That 8.0 second run for the Accord was the slowest I've seen. All other V6 tests have been around 6.6-7.0 seconds. But regardless they still loved it. "The 7th generation Accord is simply more mid-size car for the money than you will find from any other brand."
Even the old Accord with 200 vs 240 HP and the 4-speed vs 5-speed automatic was regularly getting 0-60 in the 7's in road tests.
It's also strange that they tested a Honda Pilot at a faster time to 60 (7.8) than the Accord. And if you look at their best picks page it's easy to see why they aren't a major publication. Best Convertible: Thunderbird? Best SUV: Saturn Vue?
I think I did have blinders on not noticing the key flaws that would have been deal breakers if I was in my normal state of mind.
I do not think the Altima is a terrible car, it's actually a very good car. But the fact that I could have waited and bought the Accord EXV6 and could have had leather w/ heated seats, dual-zone climate control, 5-speed auto tranny, 6-disc CD changer, homelink transmitter, and most importantly side curtain airbags, traction control and ABS for the same price, I feel like I got shortchanged.
It sucks that being a big supporter of Nissan gets the shaft. Especially now that I hear that for the 2004, Nissan is going to greatly improve the Altima's interior. I am certain that my car is going to have a very low resale value.
I still like Nissan but they won't see another dime from me.
That is unlikely since it will just make the more expensive Maxima look less desireable.
Basically what happened was that when the IIHS did their collision testing on the Altima, the results didn't match up with what Nissan expected. They looked over the test results and noticed that the airbags were deploying late. They issued a safety campaign to replace the airbag sensors and had the IIHS retest the Altima. The NHTSA was not involved in this.
Again, I consider this a much smaller issue than even a 2% transmission failure rate (if you believe Honda's press release numbers). I have never needed the airbags in any of my cars, yet I use the transmission every day.
Motor Trend chose the Thunderbird as Car of the Year last year. Does that mean they are also not a "major publication"?
COTY is far from calling the Thunderbird the best convertible. I don't really think the Thunderbird is better than a BMW M3 convertible or a CLK convertible etc. And those weren't the only 2 strange choices but it doesn't really matter. The Accord is a 10 Best .. the Altima isn't and in the other major magazines the new Altima couldn't even beat the old Accord much less the new one.
Speaking of safety and trannies. Have you seen the stopping distances for the new accord? HORRIBLE does not even began to describe it. The 133ft Motorweek got is one of the better times I have seen and with options like side curtain airbags only available on the V6 safety seems to be a non priority for Honda. I have read those articles why would I read them again? I don't see anything there that I have not mentioned. Have you read the article about the honda owner who was in the situation with a failed tranny and almost lost his life? IF the transmission gives you a warning as Honda says what are you going to do about it? What can you really do but pray for your life? Especially going at 50mph. Honda claims 2% only to not make it seem like a big deal there are and will probably be far more. Like I said instead of recalling they are extanding the warranty. So when the trans failies you have a 50/50 chance. You either walk away from the accident or you don't. It's really your problem until something happens as far as Honda is concerned. Why didn't Nissan extend the warranty for the air bags and wait until we banged our heads on the steering wheel unitl they replace it? An Altima, 350z, Maxima etc would be less likely to have tranny failures cause you don't have to rev the car to get the power, It is already there to use.
In Hondas attempt to get back at the Altima and design an eloquent car they have failed miserably. The car looks cheaper then a civic for goodness sake.
http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/cecompoutc.asp
Looks are subjective. Some people like the Altima's interior and some like the Accord's exterior. It seems that both are more polarizing than the cars that preceded them.
Edmunds is a great place to talk about our passion for cars, so let's all move on now!
Happy Holidays to all my fellow Edmundites!
The Sandman :-)