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Comments
;~}
Patti
I have been debating this purchase for a while now, and finally I've come to realize that I have only 2 decisions left: wagon or sedan, and auto or MT. Like the styling of the sedan a tiny bit better, but after seeing what Stephen has done with his wagon that is no longer a big deal.
The real sticky question is auto v. stick. I realize that the auto has a different AWD system (thanks to AH), but I don't think it's worth the extra $. I do drive in Houston, which at times has some monster traffic on some of the highways (read: avoid I-10 like the plague). An auto might be easier on those roads, but I really don't have many traffic problems driving to work. No, the real concern I am facing right now is that I am fairly new to driving a stick (occasionally in the last 2 years). My big question is, is this a tough transmission to get experienced with? Secondly (and easily as important), is this a tough transmission? I just know that I'll probably grind the gears enough to make the Soobie mechanic wince in pain.
Thanks in advance for any help,
Seth
The WRX was my first stick, and so far I have no complaints. Occasionally I will hit traffic comming into work, but have gotten used to it. Once broken in, the stick is easy to use and shift. Reverse can be a pain though. It will take a couple weeks to get used to it though. Driving manual is a great deal of fun.
I learned stick on my dads Triumph Spitfire and aunts MB diesel (the city bus was quicker than this thing plus the handbrake is in the wrong place!). The first time I drove a Civic or Corolla, it was like, now why the heck would anyone ever buy a manual transmission made by a European company!
Good Luck at your appointment and let us know how it goes!
Patti
Ray
If you aren't in bumper-to-bumper traffic everyday and don't need to multitask while driving, then I'd say go with the manual. Don't worry about being green to driving a manual -- you'll learn quickly once it's an everyday necessity.
There's really nothing quite like the feeling of rowing through your own gears while blasting through some twisties.
One other thought -- if you ever browse through i-club, every now and then you'll read about an auto owner wanting to convert to stick. I don't believe I've seen the reverse case yet.
Ken
I think Seth should be allowed to make his own decision. What works for you may not work for him and vice-versa.
If my Auto-WRX were totalled today, I would go right back and buy another Auto-WRX. No manual for me. Don't need it and never miss it.
The only exception to my re-buying my Auto-WRX would be if the Mitsubishi Lancer EVO VII came in a wagon format. It comes with a Torsen differential in the front, Active differentials in the center (like the Auto-WRX) and rear, to ensure superb handling. I would buy it in the blink of an eye. But since it does not, I will stick to the Auto-WRX Wagon, which is useful to blast along curvy mountainous roads while functioning wonderfully in gridlock traffic. Never miss the Stick-shift and don't even want it.
Later...AH
I take exception w/your comment though: "I think Seth should be allowed to make his own decision. What works for you may not work for him and vice-versa" Nobody was suggesting otherwise in the proceeding posts. Methinks you're a bit touchy on the auto/manual subject. Let it go... :-)
Stephen
I completely agree with you that it's Seth's choice. I was only providing him with my opinion, not an ultimatum! As a MT Subaru owner, I can only give opinions of what I know, right? ;-)
Actually, my comment about auto-to-manual conversions weren't just about the WRX, but Subarus in general. While you're probably right that we haven't seen any conversions with the WRX, my guess is that the relative newness of the WRX in the US is the constraint. I don't believe it would make sense to perform such major surgery on a vehicle that's only a year old! However, I do believe that it's just a matter of time until we do hear of an ambitous WRX owner wanting to do a tranny swap.
In fact, I think you'll recall one owner asking about it not too long ago:
http://forums.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=177200
So, am I wrong? Has anyone heard of a MT to AT swap on a Subie? Just curious.
Ken
Having said that, I'm sure AH is a driving enthusiast, and respect his preference for the Auto WRX. I don't even look at cars that don't have a manual for myself, because I enjoy the control of the manual.
I know of at least one poster to these forums that's considering it.
Ed
There are tons of people in i-club who complain about the weakness of the Manual transmission in the WRX, some of whom have already ditched the WRX and are moving onto other brands, specifically due to this weakness. There was even a poster who completely stripped his 1st, 2nd and 3rd gears after doing an aggressive launch on a Manual Transmissioned WRX. Unfortunately, this guy's "knee will never be what it used to be" every time he drives this car ever again !! He was never seen at the drag-strip for a long time after that "launch". He replaced his transmission and has since sold his Manual-WRX.
There was only one recorded case of a person with an Auto trans WRX reporting a failure. This person RACED his Auto-WRX, indulged in all kinds of abuse (including regular drag-racing) did a lot of power enhancing mods (350hp +), Nitrous, brake-torque launched his car from every stoplight, and finally after almost 50,000 miles (well after his warranty period in his 2002 WRX !!), the tranny called it a day. A rarest of the rare case. All other Auto-WRX owners including RiftsWRX, padre, igotwrxed etc., who indulge in extreme power mods and races their WRX everytime (street racing, track racing, drag racing, auto-crossing) have not reported anything un-toward even after well over a year of extreme abuse. This transmission is bullet-proof, if that is a criteria for a purchase.
Later...AH
I'll tell you why. It isn't necessarily because the AT is tougher. A larger percetage of those that own a MT-WRX are gonna soup up their cars and race them than those that own the AT-WRX. Therefore there is going to be a larger # of MT drivers that wreck there trannies than of AT drivers. Does that mean that the MT is junk? Absolutely not. If the AT responded as well to mods as the MT did, AND if there were as many AT-WRXs as the other kind, then you would see the numbers would be more similar.
JMO
Seth
Aparently this kid bought a MT WRX, did not break it in (was racing it from the get-go). Modified it significantly, was drag racing it. Finally ended up blowing out his MT after doing one too many 5000 RPM clutch drops!
This is why, even though there have been many failures of the MT WRX, I am not worried about it. As many MT failures there are with the WRX, there are a significant percentage more kids abusing the hell out of the car (face it, a great deal of teenagers do buy this car!).
I currently do not plan to upgrade the power on the car, and do not race it. Just use it for the occasional fun and commuting. This is why I am not worried about my MT. :-)
Ed-
Chalk one more to the list.
Guys-
Should I buy a WRX today or whenever down the road, it's going to be an AT. And,... it is because it has to be.
Let some poor soul enjoy the WRX with the AT (not by choice) without having to hear the MT has a bigger gun vis-a-versa debate
-Dave
There has been ONLY ONE...repeat ONLY ONE person who has ever wrecked his Auto Transmission in his WRX..that too after 50,000 miles of pure un-adulterated abuse with power raised upto 350+ hp along with an inordinately high amount of brake-torqued launches AND excessive use of Nitrous AND drag-racing with (and winning against) Corvettes/CamaroV8s/Mustang Cobras. After such extreme abuse over such a large number of miles, something has to give. Hell, even race-prepped cars won't take that much abuse over 10s of thousands of miles. There are quite a few other big powered Auto-WRXs (300+ wheel HP) running around with regular and extreme abuse, but none of them have failed yet...some have even crossed the 50K mile marker.
Hope this clears up the confusion my previous post may have caused.
Later...AH
TWRX
http://forums.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=0ec5abc58bf3b888e3c12f29fac77073&threadid=224828
I don't even want to try to list the huge numbers of WRX MT failures that have preceded this. This guy has titled his account as "Another Blown Tranny" and the thing that I find strange is that nowadays such posts don't even raise any eyebrows. It is almost as if everyone EXPECTS it to happen.
Later...AH
Chuckling softly in Seattle,
Stephen
Some like strawberry ice cream, some like chocolate, one isn't better than the other. They are just different. Every person to their own taste!
People who post on iclub or here can hardly be considered representative of anything!
On the other hand, may recommend an auto WRX to my brother, especially if they put in the auto-stick. It seems once you have slammed down on the gas a few times, the car really livens up! ;-)
John-
I drive an AT and I don't have an inferior complex.
If my (abused) knees can hold up and I can get my coordination coordinated at driving LHD MT from RHD MT, I certainly would.
When I got my license in the US, signed up for some lessons with the MT. After 'bout 5 hours of Samba, the instructor pleaded "Drive an AT pleeeeeze". :-)
-Dave
Later...AH
Though if you are driving in traffic, you might want the AT. Either way the WRX is a great car.
-mike
Stephen
Ken
The AT may benefit even more than the MT from the Vishnu upgrades, given the extra low end torque.
-juice
http://www.mbusa.com/brand/index.jsp
Ken
Later...AH
-juice
It's not because anyone is trouncing the AT, because no one here is or means to (usually). I'll just finish Kevin's thought from post 2272: let's try finding an example of MT failure that is not attributed to 300-400hp 5k rpm clutch drops. If you're going to have that kind of power, upgrade to the STi 6-speed.
I'll shut up now, thanks for the rant
Seth
-mike
Stephen
Sorry just trying to lighten it up.
TWRX
In either case I'd get the WRX with the MT cause you NEED an MT in it in order to keep in the rev band.
-mike
But never mind that, the failures we're talking about are heavily modified cars that were raced and abused. If you're making 350hp you should not expect a stock tranny to withstand it.
Generally, though, Subaru's automatics are very robust and have a very low rate of failure. Manual trannys are also good, it's the clutch that people complain about.
-juice
In post 2287 - Please replace Manual with Automatic. The Manual WRX sells about 6 to 1 compared with Automatic WRXs sold.
sorry but paisan is correct. the 5MT's case is the same from the pushrod 1.8L days...
there's only so much you can do to increase the strength of a gearbox on the inside before physically larger gears and a correspondingly larger case is the only result.
-Colin
it's your money, and I wouldn't disagree that at stock power levels and driven reasonably the transmission is unsuited for the task. it isn't "robust" though, far from it.
-Colin
From the way you guys describe the MT, it sounds like that if you normally do any type of agressive driving, the MT will go on you. This is simply not the case.