Beware the Rip Off Sticker

Edmunds.com

Beware the Rip Off Sticker

Republished: 07/31/2013  (Original Date: 10/17/2001)  - by Philip Reed, Senior Consumer Advice Editor Ronald Montoya, Consumer Advice Editor

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jbcrzn

I have been aware of the dealer added costs and over the last ten years, had seen the costs associated with those services range from a total of $300 to $800. I was surprised to notice the nearly $2,500 in dealer services affixed next to the typical window sticker at a local dealer.

bdechent

"Rip-off sticker" is a very degrading term to use. Its bad enough that the car sales industry has an extremely nasty stigma around it. However, due to the resources available to consumers these days, its important to understand that there are many dealerships out there who are trying to maintain a positive reputation. The term for these extra's is best described as "Dealer Installed Services". Every dealership has them. It is something that you as a consumer should be openminded to hearing about. I agree, they should not be forced upon a customer, But have an open mind when hearing about them. Many of these services actually offer protection on a new vehicle purchase. Cars are not getting any cheaper, with the economy as it is, most people tend to keep their vehicles longer than 3-4 yrs. Many Dealer Installed Services are there in order to maintain the vehicles value and longevity. There are some extra's out there that simply do not have much value (i.e. pinstripping, window etching..etc.) but be open minded to thouroughly discussing the benefit that you may recieve from having the dealer installed services. If you can purchase and brand new vehicle WITH genuine protection extras, while still fitting all of that into YOUR budget; would that be a bad thing? Also, if you say "no" and your salesperson makes an attempt to help you understand the benefit, you shouldnt see that as "Forcing it down my throat!!" He is doing his job. Now telling you that they are on there and not going to come could very easily be false. But if you see value in the extra's then it wouldnt hurt to negotiate on those as well. Car Salesman like everyone else have their own families to feed, as long as you are treated respectfully and truthfully then give your salesman a chance to earn a decent living. He invests his time with you discussing options, test driving vehicles, and helping you make a selection. He has earned the right to negotiate with you and you shouldnt be upset with him/her for that. Bottom line..Shop around, find the right dealer/sales person, and be open minded! Yes, I speak on behalf of the industry and not all of us are out to rip people off.

larryw47

I see these markup at most dealers. On a C-max there was a $1200 ADP (added dealer profit) as well as other unecessay add ons. The $27K sticker price was marked up to $32K.

I then looked at a Ford Focus which has an $800 "dealer fee". After my trade-in deduction $5K the sales tax was added on on the gross price vs the net price (a $400 difference). They had a few other extras. The original $22 sticker price was down to $17K and I started walking and the out the door price was reduced to $14-$15K. Of course, the dealer wouldn't give me the paper work on the deal. Any dealer can beat any other dealer, you just have to be ready to walk. Easy for me as my trade in, although seven years old, still runs great and a new car is not in the need to be replaced.

zodosh

Most Car dealers are ripoffs. Cars drop in value just driving it off the lot. I like a car or truck with a nice sound system and AC and a standard transmission, roll up windows. All the power accessory options break and cost a lot to fix.

daninga

"Rip Off Sticker" or additional dealer profit is an appropriate term because the cost of these unnecessary items to the consumer is many times the cost to the dealer. On top of this, many dealers charge "doc fees" that can go as high as $600.00. That is like charging you a checkout fee to get out of Wal-Mart. Not all dealers do that, and some in my area actually advertise "No Doc Fees." Shop around and you can avoid both of these add-ons, unless you just like throwing money away. If you do, please let me know and I will accommodate you.

shatner

Remember if a car salesman says "follow me" then walk the other way. If they say do you want literature say sure, then they try to make you wait. Get up, find the guy talking to his buddies and tell him since he is not interested in helping you that you will wind another place to spend your money and walk. These guys try and control you, but you have all the money and the power.

shatner

If a salesman says he needs to keep checking with his manager, tell him that if he has no authority then you want to talk to the manager, what good is he to you?

powderkeg

Commenter bdechent above is clearly an automobile salesman who makes substantial income from his dealership's 'rip-off' sticker.

I decline your suggestion to be 'open-minded' to overpriced options that did not come with my vehicle, and are many times what they'd cost elsewhere.

I decline your argument that once I've clearly said 'No', further attempts to 'help me see the benefit' should be acceptable.

I decline your insistence that the salesperson has 'earned the right to negotiate' and that the rip-off sticker is a fundamental part of 'feeding his family'. I'm buying a $30K car, and the part that's critical to feeding your family is your right to negotiate with me regarding over-priced Scotch-gard I've already refused?

Honestly, 'rip-off sticker' is the gentlest available term for this set of sales-practices.

By and large, I'd avoid any dealership that sells this way like the plague. If this is how they treat you up-front, when they're eager for your cash and have powerful incentives to make a sale, how are they going to treat you once the deal is complete?

72467

bdechent...stop, stop, you're killing me. Wooo, need a good laugh like that once in a while, thanks. The products are simply high-profit markups that, in some case, dealers won't negotiate on. Look it up in the dictionary, and that's the picture next to "forced." Yes, I can walk away, and I would, but why put our negotiations in that position? Is it really worth the few hundred dollars additional profit versus losing the sale altogether? It does reveal their intent to not explain the functionality up front, prior to application. If I want to hear about it, I'll say so. If it sounds so great of a deal for the ultimate protection of my car, then I'll buy it. Anything short of that is an attempt at extorting additional money from me for the local dealership. "Dealer Installed Services" is just a euphemism for a bad practice. I didn't ask the dealer to install ANYTHING on my car. That's why I also won't buy a car with the dealer's "Bob's Ford" sticker or other identification on the trunk lid that would make me a permanent mobile billboard for them. I'm buying a car, from a manufacturer. Not providing charity to dealerships barely able to make a living and barely eking out a living wage that can barely feed their family. My heart bleeds. Heartless? No. This is not an emotional negotiation, it's business. I'm equally interested in getting minimum price as the dealer is in maximizing profit. Where's the limit? They already get a destination and prepping (?) fee. That became the new normal outside the invoice or sticker price. Now they're moving on to the next level. Anyone dumb enough to not insist on removing these uber-profitable mark-ups deserve to pay them. And dealers know some people will just pay the additional 500 or 600 or more dollars with a new car gleam in their eye (since they're financing anyway). Please don't portray them as working in my best interest. The sales floor is about moving maximum vehicles at the highest possible profit. The reputations are earned. That's why I'll go back to a dealer I trust, and walk away from those that pressure or refuse to negotiate. If the dealership doesn't sell because of their practices, they should go bankrupt and out of business. If the salesman can't make a living in that career, he should have or still can change careers. It's simply not my problem. Please don't' try to make it so.

jammerman

I read "bdechent" comments with some amusement. It is not degrading to call it a "rip-off sticker" because that's exactly what it is. The nasty stigma associated with the car sales industry is well-deserved, in my opinion.

I feed my own family, not the car salesman's family. There is absolutely no value is "paint sealants" "interior protection", "VIN etching", etc., ... none whatsoever. "Dealer extras" are nothing more than over-priced items that add little or no value to the vehicle.

When I see the rip-off stickers on cars in a dealer's lot, I know what I'm in for: a difficult sales process. I might haggle, but I only let the salesperson go once to the "Manager". After that, I walk if I don't get the deal I want.

Considering I buy a new car every 3-5 years I'm pretty good at haggling for a new car, because of this simple fact: I'm a lot smarter than they are.

upsdrvr

C'mon BD, get real.

These "services" are there for one reason, to complicate the game and increase dealer profit.

I really don't have a problem w/ someone trying to make a buck. Once I am ready to buy a vehicle if the dealer wants to send someone in and try to upsell me on "services" I'll politely listen.

But to install the "services" and add the price to the vehicle up front by adding an additional sticker isn't right.

I don't call the pizza place, order my pie and then get told I have to have pepperoni, because every pizza that goes out the door has to have pepperoni.

I've bought more new cars than I care to admit, and each time right before I'm ready to close the deal the salesman sends in some gorgeous woman to push the "services".

I've been begged, prodded, and even threatened that not accepting the services will affect the warranty. It's all BS.

I had one woman really pushing hard for the clear coat. She kept rambling on and on about how it protects the paint from chips and scratches and how important it is to keep the paint intact because a puncture to the paint service can lead to rust.

When I asked why, if keeping the paint intact is SO important, does her boss insist on drilling 2 holes on the back of every car he sells and installing a dealer nameplate? She shut up after that.

albanypark

When looking for a small Honda in Bloomington, Ind., years ago I was told that I had to purchase dealer-installed "undercoating" because they all came in like that. After-market undercoating was known to induce rust, not the other way around, by trapping moisture on the car's body. I asked how much they would charge to remove the undercoating, and a another salesman was called over, and I and my wife were told to leave. This was during the days of high-demand small Japanese cars. Prior to that Subaru dealers were notorious for adding vinyl roofs prior to sale (this was an era when an importer simply bought Subaru cars in bulk and resold them; it wasn't a true manufacturer-owned dealer network at the time). We walked from the Subaru at that time. Can you imagine buying furniture, or home appliances, and the seller installs add-ons and demands you pay an outrageous price? Even the extended warranties everyone offers these days can be easily declined. Part of the problem is that there is no fixed price on new cars, but part of the problem is the dealership model, which is very different than most other retail.

bicbickel

Bdenchant: I'm in the business and I think adendum stickers, as we call them, shuold be reserved for hard items like leather seats, heaters, light racks, running boards, etc.

These soft adds should be sold on their own merits by sales people that aren't afraid of what they sell, and don't use coercive tricks. Sell the value to the buyer!

I would advise you not to buy from dealers that use tricks to sell after market. Selling is an art, not a scheme.


The consumer doesn't and shouuldn't care how you make your living, that's your responsibility, man up dude!

bicbickel

Shatner: If you owned a dealership, would you want 25 employees giving away your money? Non you'd have three, maybe four people with that authority.

If you're asking for a pretty common discount, that's one thing, but most likely you were trying to get something like retail for your 2005 Chevy Cobalt.

How would you feel, if you were selling you used car out of driveway, and the neighbor told his buddy he could get it form you for $3000 less than you were asking?

I'd think you'd want him, to maybe ask you first?

demortes

@bdechent No offense, but I read the first few sentences of your comment, pegged you "Speaking for the industry" as you put it, and counted your comment null. Just because a guilty person has a lawyer and calls them a rose doesn't mean their inn

shawnwilson575

For a company that profits heavily on our industry you guys really like to bash it. A little Hypocritic if you ask me. Maybe a few writers are former sales people that couldnt make it. Please remember that there are honest family orientated people in the auto sales industry and profit is not an evil thing.

thanks

robertkt

bdechent,

So in other words, I should accept a $495 add on that I didn't want and which cost the dealer $75, so the car salesman can 'feed his family?'
I think not. If the salesman is depending on overcharging in this way he/she should look for another way to feed the family. Overcharging through use of deception is not the way to do it and I refuse to participate in that game. This is why car salesman continue to be one of the least respected around (next to lawyers).

There is always another car dealer out there who is more interested in a sale rather than last minute deception. I love a free market!

vinnyram

In response to bdechent, most car shoppers appreciate a good value and want the best car available for their funds. A good many shoppers are young and have very limited funds. They also may have families to feed and needs that must be met, in addition to shopping for reliable transportation. bdechent missed the point of this forum, is that folks are seeking the ideal method to buy a vehicle. If a rip-off sticker is another method for the dealer(s) to siphon more cash from a car purchase, then it is just what it means, a 'rip-off'. Some shoppers have available funds and to them it may not matter if they pay extra because of these stickers. But, many, especially those who do their research, are seeking the best method to save cash. They invest their time to research and try to obtain the best value for their money. Degrading or not, folks appreciate the insight that Edmunds provide.

kal53

I agree that the term of Rip Off Sticker is appropriate. Yes, they need to make a profit with all the overhead they contend. With- in a 15 mi. radius there may be, for example, two Ford dealerships competing with one another plus compete with the competition. I strongly agree that the Sales Mgr. whether Domestic or Foreign have lost the advantage of negotiating with someone not up to date on autos. Cars.com, Edmunds.com and many more auto webpages to choose from

In 2005, I was in Ontario, Canada with my nephew looking at new Acuras. Canadian model they sell is Acura EL. Differences between the Acura EL and Honda Civic EX fake wood trim, leather seats and electric seat warmers. Exterior was limited to badge I.D and taillights were larger just like the 2013 Civics. Same HP. I point these changes out to my nephew. Their salesperson was speechless. The VP of the dealership was listening to me the whole time. He offered me a job to train the staff new and used cars in all the dealerships which he owns.

There are many other ways the dealership, back end which is Finance and Insurance.

roadscholar1

I thought "rip-off sticker" is a euphemism for the more commonly used industry term of "chump charges".

dbj828

Here is another dealer rip off I ran into. It didn't take long for them to remove my post from their FB page. I took advantage of a coupon for an oil change at a local Ford dealer. When I got the bill there was a $2 "document storage fee" When I asked what that was I was told that it covered the cost of keeping my records. I told them that I didn't care if they kept my records or not and if they wanted to do so it was up to them to cover the cost not me and please remove the charge. I was told it was already "in the system" and could not be removed. I told them I was not paying for it will not pay until it is removed. The guy got pissy and threw 2 $1 bills at me.